# Square Drive Vs. Torx Drive



## Merkava_4 (Nov 22, 2012)

You guys have a preference between square drive and Torx drive for construction screws? I'm getting a little tired of Phillips. I gotta put a lot of downward pressure on the screw or the bit will slip out. I'm thinking about getting some wood screws that are a little more high tech.


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## RogerInColorado (Jan 16, 2013)

I love both Torx and square drive. I wish I could find 6 inch long torx bits as easy as I can find 6 inch long Robertsons.


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## Merkava_4 (Nov 22, 2012)

RogerInColorado said:


> I wish I could find 6 inch long torx bits as easy as I can find 6 inch long Robertsons.


I'll give you a part number and a link if you tell me which size. T15, T20, T25... ?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I vote that the world pick one screw head design and everybody stick with it as long as it isn't slotted.


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## Gene Howe (Feb 28, 2009)

I like Torx screws. But won't buy any til my supply of Phillips and square drives are exhausted. I guess I won't be getting any Torx screws.


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## Fred Hargis (Apr 28, 2012)

I've long thought there should be a federal law mandating all screws be square drive :laughing: (except the ones used in drywall). 2 sizes of drivers fit like 70% of the screws, and 4 or 5 (can't remember) fit 100%. Much better than the 20 sizes of slotted/phillips/clutch/torx/square/whatever I currently have to keep on hand. That said, I really like Torx, and would actually prefer them if there were fewer driver sizes...I'm more in favor of the minimalist approach.


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## jschaben (Apr 1, 2010)

Phillips are designed to cam out at a certain point, thank you Henry Ford.. I really have no preference of torx over square drive. I like the Robertson drive the best. They have sort of a morse taper so they won't fall off the bit. I have found some dual drive that will take either a phillips or a square drive. As far as Torx drivers go, a T-15, T-20 and T-25 will get most anything done until you get into automotive work. S1 and S2 will do most square drive and P1, P2 and P3 will handle phillips. :smile:


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## Oakwerks (Mar 24, 2013)

I use 4 inch square drive screws frequently, and don't have slipping issues.... Nothing worse than having a Phillips
Strip 3 inches in....


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

Reminds me of this thread.









 







.


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## Troyscustom (Jan 7, 2013)

I prefer torx screw over any of the others. Being a carpenter I have driven in thousands if not millions the way it seems any way of every type and by far I like the torx the best.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Nov 25, 2008)

GRK makes the best screws. They make a screw for everything. All Torx drive.


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## rrich (Jun 24, 2009)

Just two cents here...

There are two types of Philips driver bits. One is for normal screws while the other is for hardened screws. I would suggest using the driver bit in a extension that is intended for the hardened screws. This bit will last much longer than the other style bit. I've seen these bits for hardened screws at both HD and Lowes. BTW - Galvanized screws seem to require about a zillion times more torque to drive the screws.

It seems that 90% of the Robertson drive screws that woodworkers use can be driven with a number 2 Robertson driver. BTW - When the Robertson screw won't stay on the drive bit un aided, it is time to change the driver bit. It seems that the Robertson driver bits that have a separate square piece of metal imbedded into the shaft last longer than a completely machined driver bit.

As for the Torx drive screws, just too many numbers. The numbers indicate size but have no "real" meaning to me. I have a full set of Torx driver bits but use them only when necessary.

IMHO, the Robertson drive system is probably the most adaptable available. The Robertson drive is very easy to seat the driver without seeing the screw head.


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## TomC (Oct 27, 2008)

If I had to choose I would go with Torx over square. I have also found that its easier to drive screws (even square) with an impact driver when working on a ladder driving screws in a horizontal direction. Using a regular drill driver I stripped several square head screws but did not have a problem with an impact driver.
Tom


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## RogerInColorado (Jan 16, 2013)

Merkava_4 said:


> I'll give you a part number and a link if you tell me which size. T15, T20, T25... ?


 

Both T-20 and T-25. What I'd really like to be able to do is walk into Ace or HD or Lowes or WC and just pick up one (or some) when I need one because I just lost the last one of the last six I bought.


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## Merkava_4 (Nov 22, 2012)

RogerInColorado said:


> Both T-20 and T-25. What I'd really like to be able to do is walk into Ace or HD or Lowes or WC and just pick up one (or some) when I need one because I just lost the last one of the last six I bought.


Ah, but the good stuff is not at Home Depot or Lowes. You 
gotta go to a good industrial supply store for the good stuff. :smile:

T20 = APEX 49-C-TX-20
T25 = APEX 49-C-TX-25

http://mrotools.com/49-c-tx-20-apex-1-4-torx-power-drive-bits.aspx

http://mrotools.com/49-c-tx-25-apex-Torx-1-4-hex-power-drive-shank-bits.aspx


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## Brian T. (Dec 19, 2012)

Some time ago, I read that the Phillips lobby was stronger than the Robertson lobby in the US marketplace. That's why it has turned out that way. For wood working in Canada, I see that the Robertson is a far more common and readily available design. Not long ago, I read that the Chinese have settled on the Robertson design and built a number of mfg plants to make them.
I used to use Robertson #6 but switched to a dozen(?) sizes of #8.
Think that I have a 2lb can of #8 x 1 1/2 in the shop. For outdoor fencing, etc, give me a few pounds of #12 or #14.
I think the Torx design, another socket head, is good but they are really hard to find.


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## jschaben (Apr 1, 2010)

Here's a pretty interesting read on screws and screw drives.... Well, I think it's interesting anyway:smile:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives


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## RogerInColorado (Jan 16, 2013)

Merkava_4 said:


> Ah, but the good stuff is not at Home Depot or Lowes. You
> gotta go to a good industrial supply store for the good stuff. :smile:
> 
> T20 = APEX 49-C-TX-20
> ...


Thanks. It's about 900 miles out of the way for me, but I do appreciate you providing a source.


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## Merkava_4 (Nov 22, 2012)

RogerInColorado said:


> Thanks. It's about 900 miles out of the way for me, but I do appreciate you providing a source.


Well, you can always mail order from that place, or find another source by Googling the part numbers...

That's why I gave you the part numbers; in case you didn't like the links I provided.


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## wcurle (2 mo ago)

TomC said:


> If I had to choose I would go with Torx over square. I have also found that its easier to drive screws (even square) with an impact driver when working on a ladder driving screws in a horizontal direction. Using a regular drill driver I stripped several square head screws but did not have a problem with an impact driver. Tom


 I’ve driven thousands of torx exterior screws. The only size drive I’ve come across are T20 and T25. You really don’t need the rest unless you are building some specialized project. Some of the bits wear out pretty fast. I’ve yet to find the longer lasting brand.


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## yomanbill (Jul 7, 2020)

TomC said:


> If I had to choose I would go with Torx over square. I have also found that its easier to drive screws (even square) with an impact driver when working on a ladder driving screws in a horizontal direction. Using a regular drill driver I stripped several square head screws but did not have a problem with an impact driver.
> Tom


I'm with you. I have also found that all screw types work better with and impact driver. I have a lot of philips head screws and almost never have problems with them if I use the impact driver. 
Like Steve, I wish they would standardize on one type


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## B Coll (Nov 2, 2019)

For general construction I tend to use torx screws. In the shop I like the square drive. Been keeping a wide assortment for years and like to use McFeely's Screws. I find them consistent and I can keep a variety of finishes including SS, dry lube, unplated, statutory bronze. They work well, make any size I need, and look good in my cabs and furniture.


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## DrRobert (Apr 27, 2015)

Torx? Really? They suck! At least the brands I use.

Square drives are superior. They don’t strip out nearly as easy and the biggie — the screw sticks to the bit. Y’all don’t think it’s aggravating to have a bit wobble around in the head?

I’m talking about Spax. GRK is not quite a bad.

Years ago all I ever used were square drives but got away, I guess b/c it’s too easy to pick up a box. I know I should bite the bullet and stock up on McFeeleys.


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## kiwi_outdoors (Jan 15, 2020)

Torx is the best, the square drive drivers round over too quickly


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

I prefer either to Philips, but I have tried to standardize on T25 drive heads in my shop. The bits seem to last longer and rarely strip out. The rounded driver bits are less likely to snag or gouge into things.


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

I am glad someone else likes to read about screws etc. I am happy to read a catalogue of tools etc. 
johnep


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## _Ogre (Feb 1, 2013)

i use all philips in my shop, impact drivers made a big difference in camming out with a philips
3" & 4" screws are no problem
i cam out with square drives, cammed out of a pocket hole screw just this week
that said, i haven't built a deck in years, i'd probably use torx on a deck


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

In my local stores, Torx has all but replaced Phillips except for drywall screws. I don't see any square drives.
A screw will "hang onto" a square drive, but may fall off a Torx and certainly will not stay on a Phillips, unless the magnet is very strong.


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## timothyrsnider (4 mo ago)

I like & use Robertson seems to be the bits are easier to find than the torx, I always have to search for the right size of bit.


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## DrRobert (Apr 27, 2015)

kiwi_outdoors said:


> Torx is the best, the square drive drivers round over too quickly


Naw…..


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## Rebelwork (Jan 15, 2012)

kiwi_outdoors said:


> Torx is the best, the square drive drivers round over too quickly


I've used many of these screws for installation. Bad bits/driver vs good bits/driver. You can get bad screws, but most of the time it's the driver that performed poorly.. Get better bits for installation.


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

DrRobert said:


> Naw…..


I have family members that can round over a 1/2" hardened hex bolt...

Phillip's round over sometimes even when you are careful.

With either torx or square drive, you need to do something wrong to round it over...for me, the easiest way to round over an S1 bit is to use it to unscrew an s2 screw. I've done that twice now, and I no longer buy the bits with two sizes on either end of the shank


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