# If you had $1500 for a new table saw...



## mackman (Mar 2, 2016)

I've been fiddling with wood for about 5 years now, but only "woodworking" for the last 2-3 years. I have a potential project that will be my largest order by far (a little over $2,000), and if it goes through, I want to upgrade my saw. Right now, I have a Dewalt saw that I'm really starting to hate (the biggest problem is that the table is nowhere close to flat), and the more I think about it, the more I want to replace it. 

So: If you had $1,500 for a new table saw, what would you buy? 

Info:

- Portability is NOT important to me. I've moved my saw exactly once in the past 3 years, and I can't see a scenario which requires me to move my saw again. 

- I don't want to have to pay someone to rewire my shop, so it needs to work on standard 120v. 

- I occasionally cut 8/4 hardwood, but most of the time it's 4/4.

- EDIT: Right now I'm a stay-at-home dad building up my Etsy shop when I can, and my goal is to definitely see if I can make woodworking my full-time job once the kids are in school. So I'm looking for something that will stand up to that kind of workload.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

$1,500 is not enough for a SawStop. It is more than enough for a very good standard saw. You said that you have a saw now. I would start by visiting all of the stores in your area that carry table saws and see what meets your eye. I would probably even be tempted to look in the used saw market for a low mileage saw.



George


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

Delta 36-725 and $1,000 worth of wood. 

For a hobbiest/weekend warrior/garage shop, im pretty firmly in the camp that the Delta is all you really need, and anything above it in terms of price/features is just overkill. For the 3/4-1" thick stuff most commonly seen, the 1.5hp motor is more than enough oomph to keep the cuts going, the fence is a simple bisemeyer style and works extremely well, and the top is flat and plenty large enough. 

That said, this goes out the window for saws in a commercial environment. If youre ripping down 12/4 hardwood 8 hours a day 5 days a week, then yes, one of the beefier 5hp saws would be worth it, but short of that, well... If you do end up looking for one of those beefier saws, i agree with George, SawStop is a good place to look just for the safety tech. Personally i cant stand them as a company, good tools but i dont like how the inventor tried to get the government to make licensing his tech mandatory in new saws. Id recommend Grizzly as another good place to look, no fancy bells and whistles but probably the best bang for your buck


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## mackman (Mar 2, 2016)

epicfail48 said:


> Delta 36-725 and $1,000 worth of wood.
> 
> For a hobbiest/weekend warrior/garage shop, im pretty firmly in the camp that the Delta is all you really need, and anything above it in terms of price/features is just overkill. For the 3/4-1" thick stuff most commonly seen, the 1.5hp motor is more than enough oomph to keep the cuts going, the fence is a simple bisemeyer style and works extremely well, and the top is flat and plenty large enough.
> 
> That said, this goes out the window for saws in a commercial environment. If youre ripping down 12/4 hardwood 8 hours a day 5 days a week, then yes, one of the beefier 5hp saws would be worth it, but short of that, well... If you do end up looking for one of those beefier saws, i agree with George, SawStop is a good place to look just for the safety tech. Personally i cant stand them as a company, good tools but i dont like how the inventor tried to get the government to make licensing his tech mandatory in new saws. Id recommend Grizzly as another good place to look, no fancy bells and whistles but probably the best bang for your buck


I edited my OP to add some info. Basically, my Etsy shop and the overall scope of what I make has already grown way more than I thought it would when I started, and my goal is to continue growing it as much as I can. Would the Delta still be the go-to saw if I'm hoping to grow to basically full-time woodworking?


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## Kerrys (May 2, 2016)

You are kinda limiting things with the 120 volt requirement. Some of what has been suggested isn’t going to run on 120. 

I would look at something like this https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-10-2-HP-120V-Hybrid-Table-Saw-with-T-Shaped-Fence/G0771Z or maybe a https://www.jettools.com/us/en/p/the-jps-10-1-75-hp-115v-30-proshop-tablesaw-cast-wings/725000K


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## mackman (Mar 2, 2016)

Kerrys said:


> You are kinda limiting things with the 120 volt requirement. Some of what has been suggested isn’t going to run on 120.
> 
> I would look at something like this https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-10-2-HP-120V-Hybrid-Table-Saw-with-T-Shaped-Fence/G0771Z or maybe a https://www.jettools.com/us/en/p/the-jps-10-1-75-hp-115v-30-proshop-tablesaw-cast-wings/725000K


I know the voltage requirement is going to limit my options, but I'm no electrician and messing with wiring is the one aspect of DIY that skeeves me out. I've been looking at the Jet (saw it mentioned in a couple articles), and the Grizzly looks great too. Thanks!


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Price of the contractor Saw Stop ..*



GeorgeC said:


> $1,500 is not enough for a SawStop. It is more than enough for a very good standard saw. You said that you have a saw now. I would start by visiting all of the stores in your area that carry table saws and see what meets your eye. I would probably even be tempted to look in the used saw market for a low mileage saw.



Yes, you are correct, but you can come close:
https://www.woodcraft.com/products/...2sCbDFz4V3m3S5eYvbQtmabZoKmYH-6QaAvVHEALw_wcB


A good honest review here:


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Myself, I would try to buy a used commercial grade saw with at least 3hp. Then if it didn't already have one upgrade the fence to something like Biesemeyer.


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## Kerrys (May 2, 2016)

Steve Neul said:


> Myself, I would try to buy a used commercial grade saw with at least 3hp. Then if it didn't already have one upgrade the fence to something like Biesemeyer.


I have never seen a 3hp motor that runs on 120 volts.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

mackman said:


> I know the voltage requirement is going to limit my options, but I'm no electrician and messing with wiring is the one aspect of DIY that skeeves me out. I've been looking at the Jet (saw it mentioned in a couple articles), and the Grizzly looks great too. Thanks!



There are electricians out there who you can hire to change your wiring.


George


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## hawkeye10 (Feb 18, 2015)

mackman said:


> I've been fiddling with wood for about 5 years now, but only "woodworking" for the last 2-3 years. I have a potential project that will be my largest order by far (a little over $2,000), and if it goes through, I want to upgrade my saw. Right now, I have a Dewalt saw that I'm really starting to hate (the biggest problem is that the table is nowhere close to flat), and the more I think about it, the more I want to replace it.
> 
> So: If you had $1,500 for a new table saw, what would you buy?
> 
> ...


'' my goal is to definitely see if I can make woodworking my full-time job'''

The above statement you made tells me you need to get your house wired for 220 volts. Look around and see if you can find a really good used saw. Here is one in TN and I know it's too far for you to travel but one will pop up in your town pretty soon. Don't be in such a hurry and you will find a deal.

https://nashville.craigslist.org/tls/d/joelton-delta-unisaw-usa-made/6913040204.html


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

When I started my first shop and needed 220V, I made and extension cord for my planer that plugged into my clothes dryer outlet in the house. It worked just fine on my 5HP Foley Belsaw planer. 

$1500 is a good starting point for a table saw. It is usually the most important tool in your shop. Some of the old brands that used to be good, like Delta, are pure garbage now. 

The bigger and heavier the saw and motor, the safer it is. This is especially true if you work alone. I think a 3/4" sheet of MDF is around 90 lbs and a 3/4" sheet of cabinet grade plywood is around 70 Lbs. There are lots of times you will be slamming the boards on the table saw top (not intentionally) and then pushing it through the blade You want to know that the table saw will not roll over.


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## MaintenanceMan (Jun 25, 2010)

Before counting a simple 240v receptacle out, just get a price from an electrician or two. It might be well within your budget to have the receptacle run and have enough for a better saw. It would also affect many other possibilities down the road for other equipment you might buy. The difference being a garage full of weekend warrior grade tools for a guy trying to make full time living at woodworking vs. more power and more options down the road. Just don't assume it's too costly without getting a price. Every house is a different situation and a quote is free.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Kerrys said:


> I have never seen a 3hp motor that runs on 120 volts.


Exactly, a person should never let electricity hinder you in selecting a machine. You buy a machine that does the job and if it needs more power than what you have fix the electrical problem. I bought a machine one time that ran off three phase. When I bought the machine I had planned on replacing the motor with one that was single phase only to find out the motor was irreplaceable period. I ended up having to purchase a phase converter to make it work. Then I realized there is a lot of great machines out there which are three phase and cheap so I ended up buying three more machines which run on three phase.


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## Kerrys (May 2, 2016)

The op stated he didn’t want to rewire. I completely understand where the op is coming from. My shop is in a pole building about 100 feet from our power meter. The original owner put in a buried circuit from the meter to the pole building. He only ran a 50 amp circuit. What I need to do is install a new circuit breaker at the point of service, pull new wire from point of service to pole building, install new panel in building and basically rewire the entire building. I don’t want to go to all that trouble to have 220. Perhaps the op is in a similar situation, perhaps not. He asked for suggestions for table saws that run on 120. 

One of the reasons I don’t post much.


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

Budgeting for 220 wiring and a decent used saw will make you happier in the long run than spending the entire $1500 on a 110 volt saw.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

used 1 1/2hp unisaw


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## mackman (Mar 2, 2016)

Thanks for the advice, everyone! 

For everyone advising I just bite the bullet and get a 240-volt line put in: A super quick search gives cost estimates anywhere from $500 to $1200 or more. The place where I'd want the plug is literally on the other side of the wall from the breaker box, so it seems like the cost may be on the lower end of the spectrum? My main reason for not wanting to go this route is I don't want to shell out a thousand dollars or so now, then end up moving in the next 5-10 years and have to pay it all over again (or potentially even more!). But I will look into it. 

I'm pretty against the idea of buying a used saw, partly because I don't seem to live in a good area for used equipment. I'm in the central valley of California, and every time I check out Craigslist, I see the same stuff: Rusted, banged-up equipment that I just don't have the necessary experience to judge. The main reason I don't want used is I can't look at a used saw and see what potential issues it might have, or what I would need to replace. I'd be entirely at the mercy of the seller at this point (this is something I think lifelong woodworkers with a ton of knowledge and experience might forget!). Buying new and being able to get broken parts replaced by the manufacturer has a lot of value to me. 

If I were to get the 240-volt line put in, and were a bit more flexible on price, what are some saws I should be looking at?


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

It won't cost anything to have a licensed electrician come over and give you an estimate, from that you will be able to decide how you want to proceed. Most efficient tools are going to need 220 so you might as well plan for the future.


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

mackman said:


> I edited my OP to add some info. Basically, my Etsy shop and the overall scope of what I make has already grown way more than I thought it would when I started, and my goal is to continue growing it as much as I can. Would the Delta still be the go-to saw if I'm hoping to grow to basically full-time woodworking?


Personally, I'd say yes to that last question. Again, if all you plan on working with is 3/4-4/4 material, 1.5 HP is plenty and I can't say that I've ever found myself wishing I had more power behind my saw. Again, the story might change if you deal with thicker wood on a regular basis, but for a smaller shop, and especially on 120v, my opinion is the Delta is one of the best options

All that said, its worth mentioning that the Delta is a hobby grade machine. I have no doubts that one could hold up to commercial use in a small woodworking shop. My saw has been holding up to 4-5 years worth of pretty good use without any problems, which is why I have no qualms recommending it. 

If 120v is a dealbreaker, I feel you'll be hard pressed to go better than the delta, for the work you've described. Put the remaining money to a high quality blade, possibly a dro for the fence, and a lot of wood to work with


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## MaintenanceMan (Jun 25, 2010)

Ridgid R4512 or Delta 36-725
Grizzly 883 0r 771. 

in 220v the Grizzly 690/691 or 1023 would be close to your price range.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Horse Power is rated in mysterious ways......*



Kerrys said:


> I have never seen a 3hp motor that runs on 120 volts.



I knew that Porter Cable, and Milwaukee make routers that are 3 Hp even, 3.5 HP and run on 120 VOLTs. That is not the discussion we need to have on this thread, however. For ANY type of well equipped shop you do need several 220 volt circuits. For 3 HP induction motors which typically come on planers, sanders and table saws, yes they only run on 220 VOLTs and typically draw less than 10 AMPs running, so no. 12 wire can be used for wiring the circuits. This is a must have for any full time shop operated for profit. Hobby shops can run on 120 Volts just fine. :vs_cool:


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Horse Power is rated in mysterious ways......*



Kerrys said:


> I have never seen a 3hp motor that runs on 120 volts.



I knew that Porter Cable, and Milwaukee make routers that are 3 Hp even, 3.5 HP and run on 120 VOLTs. That is not the discussion we need to have on this thread, however. For ANY type of well equipped shop you do need several 220 volt circuits. For 3 HP induction motors which typically come on planers, sanders and table saws, yes they only run on 220 VOLTs and typically draw less than 10 AMPs running, so no. 12 wire can be used for wiring the circuits. This is a must have for any full time shop operated for profit. Hobby shops can run on 120 Volts just fine. :vs_cool:


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## Tool Agnostic (Aug 13, 2017)

GeorgeC said:


> $1,500 is not enough for a SawStop. It is more than enough for a very good standard saw. You said that you have a saw now. I would start by visiting all of the stores in your area that carry table saws and see what meets your eye. I would probably even be tempted to look in the used saw market for a low mileage saw. George


Yup. I would increase the budget or save a little longer and get a SawStop contractor saw or professional cabinet saw. You won't be disappointed. The contractor saw is only a little bit over your budget. The 36 inch fence is much superior to the 30 inch fence, so be sure to include that if you increase your budget to include a SawStop. SawStop makes very good saws as saws, plus they have the added safety feature. Some people here feel that the additional cost is not worth it; I treat it like an insurance policy. The SawStop safety brake can protect against lost fingers or shredded hands, but it won't prevent kickbacks. 

SawStop enforces the same prices everywhere. If you decide you want a SawStop, buy from someone you like; someone who will give you good service and support.


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## canarywood1 (Jun 9, 2016)

For the type of work you describe as what you want to pursue, one of these would more than fill your needs.



https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-10-2-HP-120V-Hybrid-Table-Saw-with-T-Shaped-Fence/G0771Z


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## sgcz75b (Mar 16, 2019)

canarywood1 said:


> For the type of work you describe as what you want to pursue, one of these would more than fill your needs.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-10-2-HP-120V-Hybrid-Table-Saw-with-T-Shaped-Fence/G0771Z


I'd certainly look at this Grizzly model. It's well within your budget with excellent customer service.

As to 220 electrical service for your shop, you'll eventually need it will be surprised at the possibilities it offers for other tools.

Ask around and find a retired electrician. He can do the job and will probably charge 1/3-1/2 less than a union guy. I saved almost 2 grand by doing that when I installed a new 100 amp box, 5 220 circuits, 6 110 circuits, and used 10 ga and 12 gauge wiring throughout.

Good retired electricians are out there and will be happy to do the work.


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## mackman (Mar 2, 2016)

I managed to reach someone local for a quote, and he said that from the location of the fuse box and where I wanted the outlet (literally just on the other side of the wall and over 5-10 feet), it would probably be around $200-250, which is very doable. However, he asked me how many amps it needed to be, and I had no idea what to tell him! How many amps should the outlet be? (Please be gentle, I'm an idiot when it comes to electricity!)


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## MaintenanceMan (Jun 25, 2010)

mackman said:


> I managed to reach someone local for a quote, and he said that from the location of the fuse box and where I wanted the outlet (literally just on the other side of the wall and over 5-10 feet), it would probably be around $200-250, which is very doable. However, he asked me how many amps it needed to be, and I had no idea what to tell him! How many amps should the outlet be? (Please be gentle, I'm an idiot when it comes to electricity!)



My Ridgid R4512 is a 15amp circuit at 220v.(1 1/2 hp) I'd just ask him to run a 10gauge wire and size the breaker and receptacle to the rating on the saw you get. That will handle up to 30amps.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Grizzly 3 HP table saw*



woodnthings said:


> I knew that Porter Cable, and Milwaukee make routers that are 3 Hp even, 3.5 HP and run on 120 VOLTs. That is not the discussion we need to have on this thread, however. For ANY type of well equipped shop you do need several 220 volt circuits. For 3 HP induction motors which typically come on planers, sanders and table saws, yes they only run on 220 VOLTs and typically draw less than 10 AMPs running, so no. 12 wire can be used for wiring the circuits. This is a must have for any full time shop operated for profit. Hobby shops can run on 120 Volts just fine. :vs_cool:



I must have 7 - 3 HP motors that I run on 20 AMP breakers with number 12 wire. The 5 HP Powermatic runs on a 30 AMP circuit. The specs on this Grizzly 1023R call for 14 AMPs:
https://www.grizzly.com/products/Gr...lting-Table-Saw-with-Extension-Table/G1023RLX


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

Maintenance Man said:


> My Ridgid R4512 is a 15amp circuit at 220v.(1 1/2 hp) I'd just ask him to run a 10gauge wire and size the breaker and receptacle to the rating on the saw you get. That will handle up to 30amps.



Agree with running 10 gauge wire.


Ten gauge wire is typically rated to handle 30 amps. I would make the circuit breaker and fixtures the same rating.


George


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## ScubaDoog (Oct 30, 2017)

I was in a similar situation and went with the Laguna Fusion 2 and have been very happy. I will be running a dedicated circuit into the garage soon as I do tend to pop the breaker, but that is a great to learn when the blade is getting dull . . . (chuckle)

https://www.rockler.com/laguna-f2-fusion-tablesaw-36-rip-capacity


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## DesertRatTom (Aug 14, 2012)

I have a Laguna 10 inch hybrid that I just love using. Plenty of power for the thickness you're using, American Leesom motor that will run on 120 or 240 (Clothes dryer circuit). Bought it because after considerable research, I discovered that Laguna requires the maker to age the cast iron stabilize for at least 6 months before it's ground flat. That allows most of the tension to work out so it stays flat. My top has only one small spot (out of the way, that is 15/1000 low, which most manufacturers call flat. 



Fit and finish on the saw and the mechanism itself is very clean and nice. Very good fence comes with it. I got the 36 inch model, but there is a much wider one (54 inch as I recall) that is only about $100 more. I think I paid about $1300 on sale at Rockler. 



What really convinced me was visiting the Laguna facility down on the California Coast. Got a taste of the precision when I accompanied an engineer who wanted to buy one of their larger band saws. He was amazed at the beefy and very precise structure and parts.


The saw has quite good below table dust extraction, and a door on the side so you can clean out the stray sawdust, even clean up the trunions and gearing. It is a belt drive, so you get a little more cutting depth.



The saw is heavy enough to be very stable, but light enough so one person can set the whole thing up in a few hours. The OEM miter gauge is not bad either, although I had a better one already.



I looked at a lot of saws, but the Laguna is best in class to me. I won't switch it to 220, but being able to do that is a very nice feature, and the American made Leeson motor will likely outlast me and my son in law who will inherit it. 



I am not much of a fan of SawStop. Nice saws but way over priced. I suggest you treat yourself to a Freud Glue Line industrial blade, a Grripper for feeding the beast and a Wixey Angle Gauge. That adds up to less than $200, but will keep you safe and the saw precise. 



I thought about an older saw, but I'm not really very mechanically oriented and many of those used and older saws need some TLC. My 2 cents.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*You don't need a 30 AMP circuit for 3 HP motor*



woodnthings said:


> I must have 7 - 3 HP motors that I run on 20 AMP breakers with number 12 wire. The 5 HP Powermatic runs on a 30 AMP circuit. The specs on this Grizzly 1023R call for 14 AMPs:
> https://www.grizzly.com/products/Gr...lting-Table-Saw-with-Extension-Table/G1023RLX





GeorgeC said:


> Agree with running 10 gauge wire.
> 
> Ten gauge wire is typically rated to handle 30 amps. I would make the circuit breaker and fixtures the same rating.
> 
> George



Why do you need a 30 AMP - 230 VOLT circuit? All my 3 HP motors run on 230 VOLTs and use number 12 wire and 20 AMP breakers. Don't believe me? Here's a current draw chart:
http://www.sprecherschuh.com/download/sscdn7500F/index/hp-volts-fla_chart_v206.pdf


OR use this current calculator and enter 3 HP
https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/electrical-motor-calculator-d_832.html


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## Elden Cozort (Oct 30, 2018)

You've got lots of good suggestions and possibilities, but I'll throw my 2 cents in.

It looks like you have almost decide to install 220 to your shop. Even though a 15 amp circuit is sufficient, I would install a 30 amp circuit just in case you find the need for it later.

I just got a Grizzly G1023RL and I love it. It doesn't quite fit your specifications (It is a little more expensive) but it has proven to be an excellent saw.

I talked to a rep at Grizzly for a long time and he explained the all differences between the G0690 and the 1023. The difference to me came down to the place of manufacturer. The 1023 is made in Taiwan and the 0690 in China. If you are considering Grizzly, then I strongly suggest you spend some time talking with a rep on the phone. They are quite knowledgeable about the product line.

Sometimes I wish I had spent a little more and got the next model up in the 1023 line. It might be nice to have router capabilities built into the table and more rip capacity

I did make one modification when I installed the fence system. The factory setup is only about 32 inches of rip capacity, so I drilled and tapped an additional hole on the tubing to extend the tube 10 additional inches. I also purchased a 48 inch steel tape measure that I installed in place of the 32 inch plastic tape that comes with it.


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## _Ogre (Feb 1, 2013)

epicfail48 said:


> Delta 36-725 and $1,000 worth of wood.


me personally i'd buy a used craftsman belt drive saw, $200 in upgrades and $1100 in wood :grin:
if you do a lot of dado or specialty setups, buy 2 used craftsman saws


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## mackman (Mar 2, 2016)

The big potential projects have been confirmed, so now it's more a matter of "Which saw will I get" rather than "Will I get a new saw?" Thanks to everyone's advice, I will almost certainly be getting a 220-volt outlet in my garage and a saw to match.

Right now, it seems like the saw to get is the Grizzly G1023RL, which is going for $1,475 + $120 shipping. I've seen a lot of good stuff online (including on this site) and it seems like the saw to get for this price point ($1500-$2000). It looks like few people have difficulties getting everything square and precise, which is exactly what I'm looking for; The power will be more than enough; it's big but not absolutely enormous; And reviews consistently mention Grizzly customer support as being fantastic. 

I know this isn't the "perfect" saw (after all, there's always a better option for more money, right?), but is this a _good_ saw for the money and for what I need?


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*The perfect saw?*

No, but it's all the saw you will ever need. Good power, good fence, large table, what more do you need? It's not a Saw Stop, but it's a great saw. 



I've said this many times, a proper outfeed support is vital for safety.
Never reach around a spinning blade to support, catch or retrieve anything! It need to be virtually the same height as the saw to prevent a "drop" at the end of the pass. There should be no change in the feed pressure or elevation of the workpiece as it leaves the blade. 



If space allows, a side surround would be a benefit when working sheet goods. Heavy sheets are no fun to wrestle around even when you are young and strong. 



Thinks it's a good choice and if I were in the market for a new one, It would be at the top of my list. :vs_cool:


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## mackman (Mar 2, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> No, but it's all the saw you will ever need. Good power, good fence, large table, what more do you need? It's not a Saw Stop, but it's a great saw.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is super helpful and definitely something that will help me once I get this saw in the shop! Thanks a ton.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

Laguna has a really nice table saw for around 1300. If you go around 1600, the same saw has a 52" fence. If you can find the room in your shop for the table saw with the 52" fence, you will regret not getting it
Some folks new or relatively new to woodworking find themselves getting more serious into woodworking than they originally anticipated. For most woodworking and furniture making, the table saw is the hub of it all. Think about it really hard. 
If you but a tool that is more than you need, the very worst that can happen is you overspent and you will quickly get over it. If you buy a tool that will not meet your needs in the future, you have thrown all of the money away.

Anyway, best of luck in whatever you decide.


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## Pineknot_86 (Feb 19, 2016)

If I had $1500, I would sit up all night and look at it.:laugh2: However, there are lots of options as indicated by the many replies to the original question.


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## Harleymike (Aug 21, 2019)

I think you know the answer but just don't want to admit too it. You state that you see in the near foreseeable future ( when the kids are in school-so that is 3-8 years down the road) to make this a full time source of income plus already your ETSY woodworking site/sales is flourishing above and beyond your expectations. In other words you are quickly leaving the realm of the hobbyist and entering the commercial world. Commercial woodworking demands commercial tools. Commercial tools demand power and higher voltage. You should focus on quality/dependability starting off with a hired electrician to drop a 220 line in the basement then save enough for the next chapter and purchase a minimum 3 hp or better yet 5 hp saw. Once you have made that commitment then you will be all set for a long long time and able to meet the demands that your sales will require. Take shortcuts now and save a-few bucks for sure but you will eventually pay more overall when you replace. 

AA/Bring in adequate voltage
BB/when the funds are there purchase a quality high horsepower saw that can handle commercial demands all day long

Good luck with whatever chiice you make and all the best in ETSY


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## red68mgb (Aug 21, 2019)

*Mostly a forum lurker here...*

I was in pretty much the same situation. After 20 years of fighting a Ryobi, I decided to get a real saw. I looked at Powermatic (too pricey), Laguna, and Grizzly/Shop Fox pretty closely, and a few others briefly.

I just got the Grizzly 1023 RL - the final model choice came down to the fence. No issues with shipping, an issue with one wing which was resolved to my satisfaction. Haven't even used it yet - still waiting for the 220 circuit.

A suggestion about that - my wiring "skills" stop at the panel box. But I bought a 30 amp two pole breaker and the 10/3 wire and pulled it from the shop area to the panel box, along with two runs of 12/2. An electrician friend is coming to connect those in the panel box and I can finish the outlets. 

Looking forward to making sawdust. 
Hope you find this helpful. Good luck!


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## KevinSA (Aug 21, 2019)

I went over the topic as it interests me as well. Some good insights here. I'll be sure to keep an eye out. Thanks


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## ChiknNutz (Apr 22, 2011)

What are your specific needs for said saw, table or otherwise? If it is breaking down sheet goods, consider a track saw, then you can still use your existing table saw as a table saw unless you feel it simply is inadequate for your needs. A track saw is a superior tool for breaking down sheet goods as well as cutting a true edge on rough dimensional lumber.


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## ChiknNutz (Apr 22, 2011)

red68mgb said:


> ...I just got the Grizzly 1023 RL - the final model choice came down to the fence. No issues with shipping, an issue with one wing which was resolved to my satisfaction. Haven't even used it yet - still waiting for the 220 circuit...


I have been looking hard at that or the G0690 (I don't need nor want the extension as I have a track saw). I was all but dead set on the G1023 until I started looking more at reviews on the dust collection. I have read many mixed reviews, enough bad ones to make me reconsider that model. I feel the small tube running down from the blade shroud is more of a hindrance than a benefit. I hope you find it to be good, but I remain dubious on it's effectiveness.

Regarding the fence, what is it about the G1023 that you feel it has the superior fence since that was your decision point? I have seen more comments suggest the true shop fox fence of the G0690 and others is the better choice (three points of connection as opposed to two for one thing).


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*I don't recommend a 5 HP table saw ....unless*



Harleymike said:


> I think you know the answer but just don't want to admit too it. You state that you see in the near foreseeable future ( when the kids are in school-so that is 3-8 years down the road) to make this a full time source of income plus already your ETSY woodworking site/sales is flourishing above and beyond your expectations. In other words you are quickly leaving the realm of the hobbyist and entering the commercial world. Commercial woodworking demands commercial tools. Commercial tools demand power and higher voltage. You should focus on quality/dependability starting off with a hired electrician to drop a 220 line in the basement then save enough for the next chapter and purchase a minimum 3 hp or* better yet 5 hp saw*. Once you have made that commitment then you will be all set for a long long time and able to meet the demands that your sales will require. Take shortcuts now and save a-few bucks for sure but you will eventually pay more overall when you replace.
> 
> AA/Bring in adequate voltage
> BB/when the funds are there purchase a quality high horsepower saw that can handle commercial demands all day long
> ...



I agree with much of your post but ....



Unless you have a commercial shop where ripping 3" hardwood is the SOP, you won't need a 5 HP table saw. The shops I'm aware of use a power feeder on those saws. My 3 HP saws do just fine with 2" stock and I can slow the feed rate for slightly thicker material. All my resawing is done on a bandsaw much more safely. I've had several kickbacks on the 3 HP saws and 1 on the 5 HP saw, and it was scary. If the workpiece hadn't missed me, I would have been seriously injured. I've helped out in a commercial shop where the main saw was a 3 HP with a 14" blade and it did just fine.


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

woodnthings said:


> I agree with much of your post but ....
> 
> 
> 
> Unless you have a commercial shop where ripping 3" hardwood is the SOP, you won't need a 5 HP table saw. The shops I'm aware of use a power feeder on those saws. My 3 HP saws do just fine with 2" stock and I can slow the feed rate for slightly thicker material. All my resawing is done on a bandsaw much more safely. I've had several kickbacks on the 3 HP saws and 1 on the 5 HP saw, and it was scary. If the workpiece hadn't missed me, I would have been seriously injured. I've helped out in a commercial shop where the main saw was a 3 HP with a 14" blade and it did just fine.


Ill go one higher and say that unless youre running a commercial shop ripping 2+ inch hardwood 8 hours a day, even a 3hp saw may be overkill. If all youre dealing with is 3/4-1" stock, a 1.5-2hp motor is more than enough when paired with a sharp blade, and will save a decent chunk of change


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## red68mgb (Aug 21, 2019)

ChiknNutz said:


> I have been looking hard at that or the G0690 (I don't need nor want the extension as I have a track saw). I was all but dead set on the G1023 until I started looking more at reviews on the dust collection. I have read many mixed reviews, enough bad ones to make me reconsider that model. I feel the small tube running down from the blade shroud is more of a hindrance than a benefit. I hope you find it to be good, but I remain dubious on it's effectiveness.
> 
> Regarding the fence, what is it about the G1023 that you feel it has the superior fence since that was your decision point? I have seen more comments suggest the true shop fox fence of the G0690 and others is the better choice (three points of connection as opposed to two for one thing).


Good points...

Regarding the dust collection - that was a surprise to me. I'm in a rural area and not able to see different models. I had read that about the Laguna, but didn't see anything in the many reviews of the 1023. I did notice that any dust that avoids the 2" tube is funneled toward the collection port. There may be some leaking that will require sealing. And hopefully the dust collector will provide a path of least resistance. 

Regarding the fence. I liked the smooth face and the heft of the fence. My only reference was the Ryobi fence that didn't inspire confidence.

Hope this contributes to the general knowledge and decision making of others.


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## Harleymike (Aug 21, 2019)

Bello woodnthings I myself have a standard home hobby level of woodworking and have the Rigid Table cast iron table saw which works very well for my level of expertise and demands put on it. Furthermore in seeing your rebuttal to my post I would have to agree that 5 hp would be overkill and like hunting for rabbits with an elephant gun. However I would definitely hold my ground to at least the 3 hp requirement based on what he is forecasting . With his dreams and aspirations he will not regret it for sure and even if his foray into a money making woodshop doesn’t reach the level that he hopes for, then the saw will still be there and available as certainly he will most likely continue with woodworking

Me personally I am satisfied with my Rigid but would like the Laguna just because. I like my fiat 124 abarth spider but would love a corvette. Sort of like that

I have been “wounded” in the stomach by a kick back from my kittle old saw one time and cannot imagine the damage a 3-5 hp unit would do. I was lucky with only severe bruising and slight abrasions. Your points are well taken


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## DrRobert (Apr 27, 2015)

I have both a 3HP and 1 3/4 HP table saw.


Big, big difference doing certain tasks.


The OP is limiting himself to a 1 1/2HP machine. A 220 circuit is very easy to install and opens the possibility of at least a 2HP machine.


Which leads me to recommend the hybrid 2HP saw Grizzly sells.


But if you're doing much ripping of thick stock, IMO you need 3HP machine.


Father and son ;-):


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## Tool Agnostic (Aug 13, 2017)

Of course @woodnthings "likes" the post above. It shows a "Baby Sawzilla."


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## Harleymike (Aug 21, 2019)

Wow this is an awesome home set up or is it commercial. In either. CASE. WOW. Way beyond my needs bit so aren’t most things in the Sears Christmas catalogue


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Tool Agnostic was only kiddin'.......*



Harleymike said:


> Wow this is an awesome home set up or is it commercial. In either. CASE. WOW. Way beyond my needs bit so aren’t most things in the Sears Christmas catalogue
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



At one time I had two saws connected together, but a "parts" saw came along and needed a home .... hey, if two are good, three is not a crowd:










It is a "home" shop but it only took 50 years to get it this far. I have a few other table saws, but these pretty much do it all. I don't like changing saws blades, so there's a RIp and a COMBINATION and a DADO set in this arrangement from left to right. I must also add that the full width outfeed table is a safety necessity for supporting work and it also serves as an assembly table. All these saws are direct drive 12" Craftsman made in the early '90's and run on 220 volts, about 3 HP each. :wink:


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## Harleymike (Aug 21, 2019)

Hey woodnthings I am amazed at what I am finding on this website. I have never seen two saws like the JET set up earlier today and now your threesome in your home. This is like candy to my eyes. I have and enjoy my single RIGID4512 but in comparison to your set up I am working with a handsaw. And a dull one at that mossing several teeth

Truly an awesome set up you have


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Pirate (Jul 23, 2009)

110 volts. IMHO, the perfect saw would be a 1 hp, bullet motor Unisaw. Don't let the 1 hp worry you. Research those motors.
Figure $500-$800, for a nice one.
Then take $100-$300 and buy a nice old DeWalt Ras.
Maybe a nice older Delta 14" bs for $200- $400.
Older Delta or PM jointer $200 -$600.

Can you tell I like old stuff!
..


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