# Dedicated woodcarving bench



## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

I am looking at purchasing the lee valley carving bench but before I pull the trigger on it I was wondering if anyone has any knowledge or has used it? If someone has a better suggestion it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=31153&cat=1,41637


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## STAR (Jan 1, 2008)

While I am not an experienced carver I like to dabble in it and do as much research as I can.

The number one thing I have learned is, for me, what I thought I would like to do and concentrate on is now a bit different to where I am at the moment.

I see you have 16 posts, so I will go with the fact that your are just learning this game or you could be a very experienced carver. For my answer I will assume you are the former.

I would hold off for awhile until you are sure where your carving is heading. The cost of the Lee Valley vices are extremly high, not saying they are not worth it but you would want to know that it would do the job you require.

I have a very small table top carvers Vice which does the job nicely for small things. For larger carvings like the near life size Christmas Nutcracker Toy soldier I did I found that an old heavy duty Black and Decker Workmate with some adaptions did a fantastic job.

Here is a photo of the life size Nutcracker Soldier.


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## STAR (Jan 1, 2008)

Sorry here is the photo. As you can see the torso is nearly a man's size and the Workmate with simple adaptions handled it well.

Go the cheap way first until you are sure what you want unless your name is Warren Buffet and not only buy the Lee Valley product, buy the Company as well.


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## tcleve4911 (Dec 16, 2006)

Wow ....

That's a big investment.
I agree with Star.
Are you sure you need it?

But it IS very nice......


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I think that bench is too expensive and way too small. If you are making little small things out of soft wood it might work. The work I do, I would have it walking all over my shop when using a large gouge and a mallet. I think a woodworking vise is most important in woodcarving and on that bench there is no place to put one. I use this table for carving. It has a 2" thick ash and 3'-6" x 6' top.


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## STAR (Jan 1, 2008)

I agree with Steve. In fact it looks like an upmarket Workmate. Anything it can handle I dare say my Workmate can too.

What Steve says is factual.

Pete


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Wow, that is one high dollar table, why don't you build one yourself. Check out some of the tables on this wood carving site.
http://www.woodcarvingillustrated.com/forum/


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

STAR said:


> I agree with Steve. In fact it looks like an upmarket Workmate. Anything it can handle I dare say my Workmate can too.
> 
> What Steve says is factual.
> 
> Pete


Thanks fellas and yes I agree it is quite the investment. I enjoy creating pieces from the18th century early american period. I love the relief carving. What my body is not liking is being hunched over for hours on end. I thought that the idea of having the piece at an angle at a height that I could sit on my stool would be a little more comfortable. The fact that you can spin the work is great for adjusting the piece to grain direction without unclamping the piece. I have searched high and low for alternatives but to no avail this is the only dedicated bench I could find.


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

jiju1943 said:


> Wow, that is one high dollar table, why don't you build one yourself. Check out some of the tables on this wood carving site.
> http://www.woodcarvingillustrated.com/forum/


Thanks for the link. There are a lot of vices that can hold three dimensional carvings but none dedicated to flat relief carving such as back splats or crest rails. I am looking at building it myself but I have not been able to figure out a way to make the piece spin and lock into the position I want. I have the tilting mechanism figured out but not the spinning piece. Maybe rotating the piece manually just might be the solution, not supposed to be in a rush anyway right. Any ideas in how to rotate the piece once it is locked to the table would be appreciated. 
Cheers
Kevin


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

STAR said:


> Sorry here is the photo. As you can see the torso is nearly a man's size and the Workmate with simple adaptions handled it well.
> 
> Go the cheap way first until you are sure what you want unless your name is Warren Buffet and not only buy the Lee Valley product, buy the Company as well.


Nice work, that is quite the piece.
I like your second comment. I should have bought the store as I probably own half of what's in it anyway. Their store is a 10 minute drive from my house and let me tell you my wife is totally aware that it is my favorite place to shop.


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## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Those carving tables are defiantly nice. I'm sure you could build your own like that or similar. 
Using the pics as a guide I'm sure you could pull it off. Maybe do a search online for a plan.


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

Dominick said:


> Those carving tables are defiantly nice. I'm sure you could build your own like that or similar.
> Using the pics as a guide I'm sure you could pull it off. Maybe do a search online for a plan.


I went down to the store to play with the bench for a while. The part I'm having difficulty with is the rotating top. I thought of using a lazy Susan bearing set rated for 1000 lbs but I don't think the will handle the constant impact of the mallet. There is not much online with respect to bench design for carvers, I'm sure I'll figure it out.
Cheers
Kevin


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## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

KevinGe said:


> I went down to the store to play with the bench for a while. The part I'm having difficulty with is the rotating top. I thought of using a lazy Susan bearing set rated for 1000 lbs but I don't think the will handle the constant impact of the mallet. There is not much online with respect to bench design for carvers, I'm sure I'll figure it out.
> Cheers
> Kevin


Maybe you could use casters mounted underneath somehow. I don't know just throwing it out there. Depending on your skills and tools. Maybe you can make the mechanism out of wood. Or if you know someone that can weld.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Building the tilting table will be easy and maybe with a locking boat seat swivel like the one below and a pipe you or something similar you would be good to go.


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## STAR (Jan 1, 2008)

I have seen at least two options. 

1. The rotating and tilting mechanism was built around a trailer tow bar ball. It wouls handle your relief carving.

2. A much sturdier contraption called ' Jaw Balls " it was made from a cut in half bowling ball but while you could use a sledge hammer with it , it is much to big for releif carving.

Try a Google and see if you can find Option No 1. I will later, too busy at the moment, got some appointments on at the moment..

Pete


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

Thanks, that is an outstanding idea. That will most defiantly work. Not to mention it will stand up to the punishment. Now to the drawing board.
Cheers
Kevin


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

KevinGe said:


> Thanks fellas and yes I agree it is quite the investment. I enjoy creating pieces from the18th century early american period. I love the relief carving. What my body is not liking is being hunched over for hours on end. I thought that the idea of having the piece at an angle at a height that I could sit on my stool would be a little more comfortable. The fact that you can spin the work is great for adjusting the piece to grain direction without unclamping the piece. I have searched high and low for alternatives but to no avail this is the only dedicated bench I could find.


It sounds like the work you are doing is more similar to what I do. Most of the carving work I've done is antique reproductions. I prefer to have the panels on a heavy solid surface, especially if it's oak. When you carve relief panels the chisels tend to bounce and make light cuts when it's not on a solid surface. I don't like working bent over either. I bought a cheap bar stool and cut off the legs to the height I like. The vice I have has a metal tab in the center of it that raises up. Then I use a T shaped pin in the table to tighten the vise against so the work can be quickly turned around.


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

Steve Neul said:


> It sounds like the work you are doing is more similar to what I do. Most of the carving work I've done is antique reproductions. I prefer to have the panels on a heavy solid surface, especially if it's oak. When you carve relief panels the chisels tend to bounce and make light cuts when it's not on a solid surface. I don't like working bent over either. I bought a cheap bar stool and cut off the legs to the height I like. The vice I have has a metal tab in the center of it that raises up. Then I use a T shaped pin in the table to tighten the vise against so the work can be quickly turned around.


Beautiful work Steve, do you happen to have a picture of the vice. I agree in that you need to work against a solid surface. This is one of the reasons I thought I would ask others who carve as well on their processes, better to seek advice than spend a grand on a workbench and not be satisfied. Not a lot of woodworkers in my area to get input from that is why I like the forums.
Cheers


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## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Are you serious Steve? 
That's some sick carvings you've done there. 
Nice job. :thumbsup:


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I've had that vice for nearly 40 years so I had forgotten where I got it from. It turns out it is a Sears Craftsman. Right now there is no wood in the vice. It should have a board screwed to each side of the jaws. The picture with the pin down, the pin will go farther down, it's just filled with sawdust. I can't locate the pin for the table this evening. It was just a piece of flat steel about 3/8" thick 3/4" to 1" wide and 3" long. Then it has a round rod 5/8" or 3/4" in diameter that I welded to make a tee. 

Whatever you do don't take on a project like that table. I got to hating it before I got through with it. I worked on it off and on for three years.


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> It sounds like the work you are doing is more similar to what I do. Most of the carving work I've done is antique reproductions. I prefer to have the panels on a heavy solid surface, especially if it's oak. When you carve relief panels the chisels tend to bounce and make light cuts when it's not on a solid surface. I don't like working bent over either. I bought a cheap bar stool and cut off the legs to the height I like. The vice I have has a metal tab in the center of it that raises up. Then I use a T shaped pin in the table to tighten the vise against so the work can be quickly turned around.


Awesome work!


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

Nothing like old tools doing the job. I think that table is a little to ambitious for me at this point in time, is it mahogany? At the moment I am hoping to be building a set of six chipindale chairs carved top to bottom with the hairy paw feet instead of the ball and claw. Just waiting on the customer to give me the go ahead. This is why I was looking at the bench, hoping to make my life a little easier. I think I have found a solution to my orriginal question, at least it will be less expensive. The link below is pretty much what I was looking for in a carving bench, I will order the plans and probabley save enough money to buy some more wood.
http://www.wwwoodcarver.com/Home/Carvers_Bench_Plans.html


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

The top of my table is ash. At the time I made it I was working for a custom cabinet manufacturer making faceframes for cabinets. Some of the wood had mineral streaks or knots in it to where it was too unsightly to use in the cabinets and the owner of the company let me have it. When I accumulated enough I just laminated it together.


I looked at the bench plans. The biggest problem I see is it is top heavy. If you could come up with a way to add weight the bottom I believe it would help.


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## bigcouger (Jan 4, 2012)

+1 on Steve an Star I do some carving I like a big bench if the tilt is important to ya make one it cheaper
Roy


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

Yes I agree, I think some weight needs t be added to the base and that's not a difficult problem to solve. I am going to begin the project this weekend and i am going to make the top a little wider. I plan on modifying the dimension of the base slightly in order to compensate for the weight of the top moving forward. I will keep you posted on the build. Back to your table, how did you find the ash for detailed carving?

Cheers
Kevin


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

KevinGe said:


> Yes I agree, I think some weight needs t be added to the base and that's not a difficult problem to solve. I am going to begin the project this weekend and i am going to make the top a little wider. I plan on modifying the dimension of the base slightly in order to compensate for the weight of the top moving forward. I will keep you posted on the build. Back to your table, how did you find the ash for detailed carving?
> 
> Cheers
> Kevin


Well the bench top was made out of ash. I've never tried to carve ash before. I would assume it would be similar but easier to carve than oak if you picked out the right boards. I have done some work in oak. I hate it. You spend more time sharpening chisels than carving. Most oak trees grow in areas where the soil is sandy and the trees pick up the sand in the grain. The picture is the last piece I made in oak. I made it a couple of years ago for a regular customer that I built her a new kitchen. She wanted a corner china cabinet to go with an antique dining room suite. I don't have any close pictures of the details.


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

Nice work. I have done a lot of casework with oak but not carving. I have carved in black walnut, probably the hardest wood I have carved to date. Not too bad until you hit the unrelenting grain, other than that not too bad. I prefer mahogany, if I have the choice.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I like carving in mahogany also. The carved table in the above post was done in Honduras mahogany. I started on that table when I was taking carving classes and wanted to make it out of walnut. The teacher said he didn't think I would ever finish the table done in walnut and was pushing me to use basswood. He liked basswood but I didn't so I compromised on mahogany. 

Although I started carving on my own when I was 17, I took classes from Ludwig Kieninger in about 1977 to try to get better at it. I never did get fast enough at it to make a career at it. Ludwig could carve a human figure about 12" tall in two to three hours completely done. The same thing would take me all day. It appears the link is about 5 years old but then he was still teaching classes. He would be 87 now. http://www.turningaround.org/Ludwig.htm


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

I have to agree about the walnut. When I have to carve that wood I try to keep the patterns simple with minor details, it just too hard for any fine detail, I find it chips a lot, or I find myself carving so slow in order to prevent any mishaps that I feel the piece will never be finished. I love basswood to practice on before I start digging into more expensive woods. Thanks for the link, that is some amazing stuff. Way above my skill level. I am still trying to perfect the relief carvings of the 18 century pieces like the Chippendale chairs. I find that the varied carvings in these pieces are probably enough to challenge me for the remainder of my days without trying a three dimensional piece. That said I do enjoy intarsia, not carving in the traditional sense but I do enjoy it all the same. 
Purchased the lumber for the carving bench today so tomorrow the planer should be singing.
Cheers


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Have you tried carving Butternut wood, it is a nice wood to carve also.


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

No I have not tried butternut, how does it take finish?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I don't believe I've ever seen any butternut. I looked it up and it's suppose to work similar to basswood but would be better for detail work. Looking at google images the wood has the appearance similar to ash.


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

KevinGe said:


> No I have not tried butternut, how does it take finish?


I've worked with butternut. It carves very well. The only finish I've used on mine was clear lacquer. Works great.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Butternut does kinda look like ash but is nowhere as hard to work with. When you cut butternut with a sharp knife it leaves a nice shiny slick appearance. It does kinda feel like cutting butter when you carve with it. It has a little more resistance than basswood but is really nice to carve.


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

In my experience, butternut carves much like anagrie or mahogany. It takes a little effort but it holds nice clean lines. I've carved all three with a knife without much trouble. All three require more time and effort than pine, basswood, cedar or something like that. But the effort is well worth it.

Butternut is one of my favorite woods to carve. I love the stuff.


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## KevinGe (Mar 16, 2012)

I was able to get the carving bench base completed today and have the top glued up. So far so good. I am trying to work in a tool tray into the design. Not a large one but big enough to hold a couple of gouges. It seemed that every design i looked at was a rotating tilt top with no place to set Your tools down. Tomorrow I will start on the stretchers for the tilt top. I have abandoned the idea of being able to rotate the top for one that is a little larger. I think I may even be able to incorporate a wood toolbox within the base frame to hold all the carving tools. This would also add a little weight to the entire workbench.


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