# Alternative Challenge - 3 tier in-box



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

*Alternative Methods Challenge - 3 tier in-box*

Maybe I'm bending the challenge rules a bit too far here, but I'm leaving that to the Challenge Supervisor to decide.

Anyway, when I looked at the picture of the 3 tier in-box I started to think if it would be possible to make the frame by bending the wood. That means that the lower corners of the frame would be bent instead of mitered.

The corners have to be very tight and I realized that steambending a 1/2" board to such a small radius would be very difficult if even possible. An other alternative would be to laminate the frame from several thin stripes. I decided to do both. I will make the frame from three 4 mm boards that will be steam bent to shape and the glued together to a total thickness of 12 mm (approx 1/2").

I decided to make the frame from birch. Birch bends very well, almost as well as beech. One problem though can be that it sometimes have a kind of wavy grain. You must avoid that, otherwise loose fiber ends will pop up.

I starded with finding a piece of birch that was as straightfibered as possible and resawed it to six 6 mm boards. I planed them to 4 mm thickness and cut them to width. I cut them a bit wider than necessary so I can trim the glued pieces later.









Then I made a form to bend the boards around. I made the corners with a 4 cm radius, which I thought would be realistic.









I put the pieces in the steam box, a simple wooden box. The steamer is from a wallpaper stripper. The old rule say to steam one hour for every inch of wood thickness, so 4 mm boards would require 10 minutes. I gave them 15 to be sure.









When the boards are ready it's a real hurry to get them clamped. They are bendable for only a few minutes.
My pieces bent nice and easy with no problems.









I let them dry for a couple of hours and then unclamped them. As you can see they have bent back a little but that will not cause any problem when gluing them together.


----------



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

Next thing was to glue the stripes together. I applied the glue quite generously and clamped them to the form again.









When the glue was cured I unclamped them and found that they have bent back a little again. However, it will be easy to bend them in place when all pieces are assembled.









While the glue-ups were curing I picked out some alder stock I will use for the trays. I resawed and planed the blanks to 12 mm thickness.

That's all I've done so far, will be back soon with the rest.


----------



## Kenbo (Sep 16, 2008)

Holy crap in handbasket that's cool!! Who's showing off now buddy? I am totally impressed with this one and I will be glued to its progress. This is freaking awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## johnnie52 (Feb 16, 2009)

What can be said except WOW! I never would have considered bending the wood... You are taking this to the next level for sure!


----------



## NIXILPLIXIN (Dec 5, 2010)

this is a really cool project. I definitly want to try a project like this... eventually:thumbsup:


----------



## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

Very nicely done, looking forward to seeing the finish project.

~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...


----------



## frankp (Oct 29, 2007)

Alright, it's official-- you're just showing off now! :yes:

That said, very cool way to take this project and make it your own. It isn't exactly within the original concept of the challenge but this is your third challenge project, if I remember correctly, so I'll give you some latitude on this one.

Excellent start and I'm looking forward to seeing the rest of this.


----------



## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

Kenbo said:


> Holy crap in handbasket that's cool!!


+1 (...and good thing it isn't Easter. )

This is the alternate methods challenge paying off big time! Count me as glued to the screen too. Hope you don't have something else to distract you Longknife! :laughing:


----------



## lawrence (Nov 14, 2009)

I was gonna do this one next but how in the h--- do you hold a candle to that??????? Might as well go take your place at the overachievers table with Kenbo...lol

GREAT BUILD.....watching intently


----------



## Texas Sawduster (Apr 27, 2009)

*Wow !!!*

Very nice project.


I had been off of the map so to speak for a couple of month's so I am trying to catch up on all the Challenge Projects that are going on.

Great job to all who are able to participate.


----------



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

Thanks for the nice comments, guys. I'm also glad that Frank is giving me some latitude on this.



frankp said:


> Alright, it's official-- you're just showing off now!....
> ......so I'll give you some latitude on this one.


I can assure you that I'm not trying to show off anything. Wouldn't have a chance with that on this forum with all the talented woodworkers I can only admire.
I'm doing this for the fun of it and I've always been interested in trying new methods and different ways of doing things.



Shop Dad said:


> ... Hope you don't have something else to distract you Longknife! :laughing:


Well, there is a long list hanging on the refrigerator my wife keep reminding me of.....

Now, enough of that and back to work.

I made the vertical parts of the frames longer than required to make it easier to bend the pieces. Next thing to do was to cut them to the correct length with a miter for the horisontal part.









Then I made a simple jig to hold the frame parts when I cut the slots for the splines.









I also made the horisontal parts and planed them to the same thickness as the bent part, mitered them and cut spline slots.
I also ripped the splines from rowan stock I think will contrast to the birch. With all the parts done I was ready for assemble. This turned out to be a very frustrating job. This is a situation where you wish you had at least two more hands. The splines, even if I made them with a loose fit, also have a strange ability to swell up when the glue is applied. Well, after some struggling and a few  I managed to get it all together.
As the bent part are not perfectly square due to bending back a little after being glued together I installed the cauls you see in the picture to square everthing up when glued. They will of course be removed and the upper tray will keep everything in place later.









I trimmed off the spline ends, rounded the corners and gave the whole thing a first sanding to 120.









While the glue was curing I cut the tray sides, mitered them and cut the groove for the bottoms.









That's what I've accomplished so far. Now I hear somebody talking about a back door that have swelled in the rain. And that's not even on the list.....


----------



## johnnie52 (Feb 16, 2009)

I know how it goes. While I was trying to get my project done I kept hearing about a gate that had swollen in the rain and would not close!

I'm liking this more as it goes along. Hopefully the top box will be strong enough to hold the bend and keep it from spreading everything apart.


----------



## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

Awesome, really great lamination!

~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...


----------



## frankp (Oct 29, 2007)

Excellent, as usual. Between you and Kenbo it's a wonder anyone else shows pictures of their stuff. You guys are awesome.


----------



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

With the frame done it's time to make the trays. I laid out the shape of the handle recesses on the front sides and drilled 15 mm holes in the lower corners.









I cut out the rest on the band saw and rounded the upper corners.









With all the tray pieces done I laid them out along a straight edge and butted the ends tightly together and taped the joints with masking tape.









I then flipped the whole assembly upside down and applied glue in all the joints.









I installed the bottom in it's grooves, folded the pieces together and taped the last joint. Then I clamped the tray with a band clamp and checked it for square.


----------



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

When all the trays were glued and cured I made a jig to cut the slots for the splines in the corners. I cut the lower slots first, then flipped the trays and cut the upper. I then mowed the TS fence to cut the remaining slot in the same way.









I ripped the splines, cut them to length and glued them in the slots.









I cut off the splines on the band saw as close to the side as I could without marring the sides. I trimmed off the remaing with a chisel and sanded them flush with the sides.


----------



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

Then I installed a 1/2" round over bit in the router table and routed the corners.









Then I sanded the trays to P240.









Hopefully I will be able to continue the building tomorrow. Thanks for watching so far.


----------



## johnnie52 (Feb 16, 2009)

Another excellent piece of work. I see I'm not alone in using masking tape on mitered boxes. That system works great! Before I started doing it I never got a square box. Now its a breeze getting nice square boxes every time!

I'm waiting to see how you pull the tops of the laminate sides together without having it come apart from the wood trying to revert to its relaxed state.


----------



## hands made for wood (Nov 2, 2007)

LOVING this project already! I am so impressed with you taking on the steam bending, something I'm sure many would try to avoid! Can't wait to see the finished product. Keep it up!


----------



## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

Well, it IS an "alternative methods" challenge. I'd say you're following right along with the spirit of the challenge. You may be bending wood but, personally, I'd have a hard time saying you're bending the "rules". I see others agree. It's coming along very well so far. This is a perfect addition and compliment to the challenge, I'd say. Awesome work!


----------



## Kenbo (Sep 16, 2008)

I'm blown away. Fantastic work.


----------



## Texas Sawduster (Apr 27, 2009)

*Holy Steam Bender Batman !!!!*

WOW!!! That is some great work there.

Now that it's cooling off here in Texas, I can get back to the shop.
If the continuing house remodel does not get in the way. :laughing:


----------



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

With the difficult parts made on this project there is only some uncomplicated assembly to do. That's what I thought anyway. Was I mistaking......

The first thing I did was to screw the upper tray to the sides. I decided to do it this way to square up the frame and to get a reference point from wich I could measure the distance to the other trays. This caused no problem, there was only a couple of mm's left to bend.










Happy with that I moved on to the runners for the lower trays. I ripped and planed the blanks and cut the rabbets on the ends on the table saw. I first made two cuts in the inner corner....









..... and then I drew the blank across the blade in several light passes to hog out the rest and complete the rabbet.









On one of the pieces I made my first mistake. It was flipped the wrong way :furious:. Do it again, do it right.









When all the runners were cut correctly I rounded the front end to fit in the rounded end of the groove in the tray sides.


----------



## Longknife (Oct 25, 2010)

There is no way to do a dry fit on this assembly and that's where my problems started. To get everything right the whole thing also have to be square in three dimensions and with the rounded corners that is difficult to check. What I did was to use the upper tray as reference and measure the distance for the runners from that and glue them in place.









I used spacers to get equal distances between the trays.









When all the runners were attached and the trays in place I noticed that I hadn't got it all right. It doesn't show so much in the picture but the trays are significantly lower in the left corner. :furious: (and a few ).
I decided to call it a day and think about what to do over night.









Next day I had decided to redo the assembly. The mistake was to obvious to be left unattended.
What I did was to relocate the upper tray and cut away the runners on one side. This was a quite awkward job as I had to remove the glue joints and don't leave any marks on the frame. After I made new runners I glued them in new positions.









This time the result was better and I could move on to finishing. I applied two coats of BLO with a wetsanding to P600.









This was quite a fun project after all and I also learned a few things. It's often said that wood have mind of it's own and that is even more true when you start to bend it.
Good thing is that I now have one more christmas gift ready. This will go to my daughter who is a school teacher.


----------



## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*nicely done!*

What mistake? :laughing: Good catch and save, looks Great from here.
That's a perfect gift for a teacher also. I don't see Longknife Woodworks anywhere..... time to make a branding tool maybe?  bill

BTW 3 drawers...Passed, failed and Time will Tell.


----------



## Kenbo (Sep 16, 2008)

An absolutely gorgeous project with some fantastic alternative methods. I may have gotten the speed award, but you definitely got the alternative methods award. Between this one, and the slanted box, I am blown away by your work and attention to detail. Thanks so very much for thinking outside of the box and showing those of us involved in the challenge that there is more than one way to skin a cat. I really enjoyed this build and I thank you for taking the time to post it.
Awesome work once again.


----------



## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

Kenbo said:


> An absolutely gorgeous project with some fantastic alternative methods. I may have gotten the speed award, but you definitely got the alternative methods award. Between this one, and the slanted box, I am blown away by your work and attention to detail. Thanks so very much for thinking outside of the box and showing those of us involved in the challenge that there is more than one way to skin a cat. I really enjoyed this build and I thank you for taking the time to post it.
> Awesome work once again.


I almost have to say +2 on that. You really did a fantastic job with this one. I love how drastically different your fundamental method was. That demonstrates more than anyone the true spirit of "alternative methods". Bravo. Beautiful work.


----------



## johnnie52 (Feb 16, 2009)

I ... well, I'm just speechless! A beautiful piece and a real testimony to alternative methods....

Thanks for sharing this with us.


----------



## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

Damn that turned out nice... Very well done. Can I say you won without offending anyone?

~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...


----------



## aaronhl (Jun 2, 2011)

This is my favorite forum on the site!!!!


----------



## GWEE (Aug 30, 2009)

Kenbo said:


> I'm blown away. Fantastic work.


x2:thumbsup:


----------



## Texas Sawduster (Apr 27, 2009)

*Wow !!!!!!!!!!!*



GWEE said:


> x2:thumbsup:


x3:thumbsup:


----------



## frankp (Oct 29, 2007)

Excellent final product, Longknife. Let me agree with Ken in saying you've definitely taken the "alternative methods" to heart and I very much appreciate it. Looks like I'll have a heck of a set of write-ups to show off to the magazines how things can really be done.


----------



## lawrence (Nov 14, 2009)

this was just a totally awsome build....I dont even know what to say....wow wow wow wow wow wow


----------



## Brink (Nov 22, 2010)

That really turned out great. Nice fix on the uneven drawer.


----------



## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*I thought I would bump this thread*

Longknife did a great job on this 3 tier box! :yes:


----------



## johnnie52 (Feb 16, 2009)

Yeah. This one was really great especially considering his method.

Man was it really that long ago when we took on Frank's alternative method challenge? Did Frank ever finish the tool box that he was making for this?


----------



## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*here's the thread*



johnnie52 said:


> Yeah. This one was really great especially considering his method.
> 
> Man was it really that long ago when we took on Frank's alternative method challenge? Did Frank ever finish the tool box that he was making for this?


This is frankp thread on the challenge:
http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f13/alternative-methods-challenge-machinists-chest-30864/


----------



## frankp (Oct 29, 2007)

In answer to the question, Johnnie, no I didn't finish. It's still in parts on top of my bench, getting moved from side to side whenever I'm working on something more urgent.


----------

