# Old Powermatic info



## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

hoping that one of you silverbacks can shed some light on a Powermatic Artisan 63 tablesaw. Just looked at it, and outside of needing a new blade and minor surface rust removed, it looks good. If anyone knows of anything about this particular model that I should be aware of, your helpwould be most appreciated. I have had great stisfacton with this brand before, but havent been able to find out anything about this model. Thank you Widekerf


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## gregL (Feb 1, 2009)

What's a silverback?


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

*gregL*

When male mountain gorillas get REALLY old, the black hair on thier backs turn very white. In the sun the white hair appears to be a streak of silver tht differentiates the experienced, mature males from thier younger counterparts. hence the name silverback. My wife claims to see little differenc between mant of my woodworker friends and gorillas. All of that was to say that it would probably take an older more mature woodworker to be familiar with this older relic of a table saw.Sorry for the obscure descriptive reference. widekerf


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## Clouseau (Mar 22, 2009)

Never heard of a PM 63, but the guys at OWWM.org can probably help.


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

Thank you for the old woodworking machine site. Actually, the 63 isn't that old, It is the predecessor to ttodays Artisan 64, Powermatics current contractor saw. The saws look very similar. Instead of the polished C/I extention wings, the 63 has old webbed ones ( hate them).The 63 also has an old Vega aluminum fence that I cant seem to find anywhere.The saw runs great, almost as quiet,if not as smooth as my old 66. The rust really is just surface. I know that a Forrest WW II will fit. The blade isn't parallel to the miter slot, but that only appears to be a matter of four bolts. After owning a 66 for a few years, I can't imagine a company like Powermatic putting thier name on anything (even thier entry level machine ) that is total junk. For about the same price as a cheap benchtop saw I guess I just have to jump in the pool. Thanks for the help gang. will keep you posted.


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## Clouseau (Mar 22, 2009)

Vega is located between Springfield, IL and Decatur, IL. Good people to work with.


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

Thanks clouseau, but do they make a good fence? Thier new ones are pretty highly reviewed, just wonder how they were 15 - 20 years ago. The thing looks like a battleship, seems to lock up pretty square, no rear deflection. Ought to be hell for stout Doesn't exactly glide along the front rail. Sort of spits and sputters along. Moving the fence is absolutely a 2 handed operation at this time. Oh well, I guess it's time I got a new hobby project. I have ordered a new (out of print reproduction) manual for it. After just playing with it for the last couple of days, I decided I like the saw well enough to try and restore it to its former glory. The CI table is cleaning up pretty well with sandpaper. Table is still flat----+.002 just right of the right miter slot. That will come out pretty easy, and I will probably polish it down to 2000 grit sandpaper just to make it pretty. disassemble the whole thing and clean, lube, and repair anything I can find wrong underneath. If it is a good tool, it feels better (more satisfying) to bring it back to life than just go get a new one.


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## hancockj (Jul 2, 2009)

widekerf

I have the model 63 artisans saw. It belonged to my father when he was a carpenter. He did go wayyyyyy out of his way to find a good saw for the money(very unlike him). Motor is stamped 1989. He has since retired(semi) and moved down south and handed the saw down to me. The saw itself is great, I absolutely love it. My Vega fence (even after my attepts to repair) is crap. I hate it. My father was a rough carpenter and framer for years. If he didn't care for one particular feature he would toss is or create a work around. My fence is missing the micro-adjust because of that. Like you said, a two-handed operations to move it. I have been looking at aftermarket fences for a while and still have no idea what to do. Beismeyer may fit? Accufence? I built a cabinet and large table for the saw(64" across) to do away with the PM extentions and incorperate a router table with drawers and doors. I can post pics this weekend if you would like? I did find this link for Vega parts on thier fences.

http://www.vegawoodworking.com/Vega Price list Aug. 2008.pdf


jack


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

hancokj---Thanks for the help. The ve aattatchment was very helpful, as I am not the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to finding things in the digital world. I have a micro adjust on my fence that actually works, and after recieving pw's manual, the fence was easy to make square. The parts list was helpful because the measureing scale has come off the front rail and I am able to order one from them. Nice to know these parts are still available. Had I not been able to make the fence work to my satisfaction, I would have used the Incra fence from my router table. I used it on an old Delta contractor saw onc, and aside from the Bmier fence on the old 66, it was the best fence I ever used (and by far THE most accurate and repeatable I ever used). I would have to buy another one though as it is inconvenient to switch the fence between router and saw. Also, it is hard enough to put a $110 blade on a $120 saw, much less a $300+ fence. Seems to ALMOST defeat the purpose of the exercise---------------Then again???????????


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## hancockj (Jul 2, 2009)

widekerf, I would think $120 is a great price for that saw. It is a contractor style saw, but it does have the PM quality. Like I said before, I love this saw. I allready have alot of time, and only a few bucks invested in the saw so for me a fence upgrade is justifiable.


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## hancockj (Jul 2, 2009)

one more....



Jack


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

hancockj--------GREAT pictures. One of these days mine will look that(after a whole lot of elbow grease), and I will have my son help me post some pics ( I'm too ignorant and still use that stuff they used to make called film) What kind of problems are you having with your fence? I couldn't see any way that the micro-adjust would prevent it from SQing. I assume you have tried it. I had to do it three or four times before I finally hit the magic position. The picture from behind the fence shows the 3 shiney allen bolts underneath needed to do it. Remove the fence, turn it upside down, and just loosen those 4 bolts. Carefully put the fence back on the rails and line it up EXACTLY with the miter slot. Reach underneath and tighten the 2 rear bolts. Gently slide the fence off again and tighten the two front bolts. Put the fence back on and check to make sure it didn't slip out like mine did the first two or three times. Hope this helps. Great looking cabinets and add-ons


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## hancockj (Jul 2, 2009)

Thank you widekerf. I think it is the whole design of the fence. It doesn't help that I needed new guide rails to fit the cabinet. The front was a 2" chrome pipe. I could only come up with 1 7/8". It is a little sloppy. The rear was just regular 1 1/2" square tubing. I have messed with that rear bracket so much and just cant get it to tighten up with out it binding when moving it. I cant find that happy place in the middle. I had to change those spacers on the rear of the fence. I just need to spend some time messing with it.


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

Jack-- I may see part of the problem. If you take the fence off and look at the workings underneath, I think you will find the fence locks on a single point on the front rail. Connected to the locking lever is a cam. As the lever is pushed down, the cam,pushing on the front rail, pulls the whole fence rearward. Opposite the cam you will see an adjustable bolthead scewed into the fence frame extrusion. As the fence is pulled backward, it pulls this bolthead into the front of the front rail, squeezing the front rail between the cam and the bolt. The farther down the lever is pushed, the harder the front rail is pinched. One this point is locked, the 4 adjustable bots w talked about yesterday (tying the actual fence to the rail extrusion) keep the fence from shifting side to side and aligning the fence to the miter slot. When you changed the diameter of the rail, I doubt the bolt is even reaching the front of the front rail. As the cam pulls the fence forward, you are squeezing between the cam on the front rail and the stop on the rear rail, 3' apart. If your front and rear rails and the cam and rear stop aren't in PERFECT alignment in EVERY plane (highly unlikely), you have almost no chance of ever SQing the fence. You might want to try a longer bolt with a larger head(more stable?) in order to get it back into reaching that smaller front rail. Hope this helps.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*This might take the slop out of the front tube*

Can you sleeve the inside of the fence with a thinwall copper pipe to take up the difference. I've had to do this to make bushings fit. The copper will slide on the chrome with no problem. Just a thought.
You might have to cut the copper pipe lengthwise to make it fit or even remove a strip down the length.:huh: bill


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

Very nice job on combining the saw and router hancockj.

Gerry


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## hancockj (Jul 2, 2009)

Thank you Gerry. Widekerf, How did you make out with bringing that PM back? I did order the proper front guide rail from Vega this morning. When I replaced that bar with a smaller alum one it was sloppy like I said. That one bolt that works with the cam lock was able to be adjusted so that it did reach the new bar and was tight, not square and not able to get square once it was tightened once. We will see what happens when I get the new rail.


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## curdy (Aug 13, 2009)

Hi guys, brand new here. I've lurked here several times before, and again came back while looking for some info on the Vega fence mentioned. 

widekerf, I actually have that Vega fence. I bought it with plans to put it on my saw. I think I'm going to pass on that now and just save up for a new saw. Let me know if you'd be interested in it.


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

curdy: sorry to take so long to get back to you on that. Between all the cleaning, sanding, not to mention 2 trips to the hospital-- I juaven't had time to check the forums. I doubt I need it, as mine has SQd just fine now. All I really need is a $20 tape from the parts department and I should be back in business. You'd be a lot better off finding someone who really NEEDS a fence. I would only buy it for spare parts. You never know when they won't be available anymore. With the new WW2 blade and a SQd fence, the old girl cuts great. Now all I have to do is make it beautiful---paint, lots of sandpaper, and probably more elbow grease than I can still muster.


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## hancockj (Jul 2, 2009)

Widekerf, Still need that tape? I have one I could send out to you.


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

*thanks Jack*

Thank you for your generosity Jack. I ordered the new one last week and checked with the bank today, and wouldn't you know they already hit the credit card. Sure appreciate the offer though. Just proves again that this really is a pretty special forum. I also wanted to ask if you had tried to use those 4 adjustment screws to SQ the thing after you installed the longer bolt ? Thanks again for the offer, will keep you posted as I progress.


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## hancockj (Jul 2, 2009)

I ended up ordering the proper front guide rail. Now that I have the right bar on, it squared up nicely. That is why I have the extra tape. I ordered it becuase the saw came with the shorter bar. Needed the longer one and had to remove the old tape and relocate it about 13" to the left. I was able to re-use the one on the bar. Only thing left for me to do with the saw is to figure out why the blade drops on its own. Took a quick peek at it and I cant see under there too well. The lock knob on the front of the wheel may just need a washer under it. :confused1:


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## widekerf (Aug 9, 2008)

This is good Jack. You are so far ahead of me in the process (restoration) that you get to flush out all the bugs first. Makes it handy to know what to keep an eye out for and allows you to flush out all the fixes. When you find what allows the blade to drop, be sure to post the fix. I'll keep an eye out as I start to re-assemble. Don't recall the blade lowering before the tear-down, but it could probably have been held in place by years and years of accumulated and impacted sawdust and grease. It took both hands and a come-along to move the blade in either direction. Previous owner obviously had an aversion to dust collection, not to mention basic maintenance. I know I will give it a much better home.


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## John in Tennessee (Jun 11, 2008)

*It means*

Ole Fart





gregL said:


> What's a silverback?


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## Robb (5 mo ago)

Old thread for an old saw. But if anyone is still interested, I've owned the 1-1/2 hp Powermatic 63A since I purchased it new in the early 1990s, 30 years ago. It lives in my basement workshop, never moved, with a right side extension table I built for the 52" Vega fence & support I bought with it. Altogether about $800 new I think. 
On assembly, fence & blade were both perfectly parallel to the miter slots and nothing has ever required adjustment. The fence hairline indicator, once set, is all I ever need to look at in order to know the exact width of a cut. The under table dust collection hood folds around the blade and is remarkably effective. 
I'm about to drill a SawStop cast iron extension to replace the webbed cast iron on the saw's left side, which I've always disliked because of dust and finger ouches. It would be nice to have a left tilt saw, but back then they were almost all right tilt, which can still do anything with the right setup. 
So I remain a big fan. I'd enjoy having a new, more powerful, fancier equipped table saw, but I will never go to the trouble. This one works superbly, including the fence, and there's nothing I can't do with it. If you run across one in good condition, you may appreciate it just as much.


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