# Dust collector in unheated area.



## minerfarmer (Nov 4, 2014)

To save space in my shop and lower the noise level I plan on putting my dust collector on the other side of an inside wall of my heated shop and running duct for intake and the return through the wall. Is this a good plan?


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## UnisawGuy (Jul 20, 2014)

Yes. 
The only down side to this would be if there is a temperature difference between the shop and the area where the collector is located. Then you would need to build an insulated enclosure around the collector.


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

UnisawGuy said:


> Yes.
> The only down side to this would be if there is a temperature difference between the shop and the area where the collector is located. Then you would need to build an insulated enclosure around the collector.


Can you give some details on the issue with the temp difference?


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*depends ...*

Is the other side of the inside wall of a heated shop.... is also heated space? Then no issue. 

The DC is a giant air pump and sucks the dust into the intake and blows out the "clean" air through the filter. So the space where the filter is located becomes a positive pressure area and will have the same temperature as the air that is entering the space. 

There are 2 issues. Heat loss from the shop space and pressure from the exhausted air. You should have a means to equalize the air pressure, either a hole in the adjoining wall or leave a door open to allow the air to circulate. As long as you recycle the heated air then that's no longer an issue.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I would think as much air as a dust collector displaces you would have a difficult time heating your shop with the dust collector drawing the heat out.


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

I understand now that the heat loss is the issue, I thought there was some other reason.

Odd though as I pass large commercial buildings, with monstrous collection systems outside of them, that they are somehow heating their workspace without any issues. Do they have some way they are recycling the filtered air back into the workspace?


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## WarnerConstInc. (Nov 25, 2008)

shoot summ said:


> I understand now that the heat loss is the issue, I thought there was some other reason.
> 
> Odd though as I pass large commercial buildings, with monstrous collection systems outside of them, that they are somehow heating their workspace without any issues. Do they have some way they are recycling the filtered air back into the workspace?


Yeah, it goes through filters and then back into the building. You can't remove that amount of air without returning it.


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## Trav (May 30, 2011)

It is possible to heat the space with the dust collector exhaust outside, as long as the HVAC capacity is greater than the loss from the dust collector. This is what I usually see in my area. We have very mild winters though usually only need to have a difference of 30 degrees or so to make it comfortable to work. 

This is obviously not efficient.


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## FaithWoodcraft (Nov 19, 2014)

If the inside/outside temperature differential is much at all, you will have condensation issues on the collector side.


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## Oneal-Woodworking (Apr 14, 2013)

shoot summ said:


> I understand now that the heat loss is the issue, I thought there was some other reason.
> 
> Odd though as I pass large commercial buildings, with monstrous collection systems outside of them, that they are somehow heating their workspace without any issues. Do they have some way they are recycling the filtered air back into the workspace?


Many do not. Especially exhaust systems used in paint rooms / booths. You don't really want THAT air (and fumes) coming back in your shop. 

The cleanest shop I ever worked in had what you describe above. Big ass dust collector OUTSIDE the building that deposited all the dust and chips into its own dumpster. It literally ran 'all day long' every day. The only real noise you heard inside the shop from the DC was from the suction. That particular shop had high ceilings and the heaters were mounted up there. All the dust collection ports were installed down relatively low near the actual tools or mounted on the floor. Hot air tends to rise and if only a few machines were running and USING the DC system this worked really well in the winter. It was pulling the colder air from the bottom first. 

If a bunch of guys FAILED to close their DC blast gates on the tools they were using after they got done with task at hand or if things were just very busy and darn near all the blast gates stayed open all day long things got COLD quickly.

Sucked really bad when we got a big delivery and a few shop doors got opened for a good while.

To have that same kind of DC power inside a shop would require a LOT more time spent in maintenance dumping bags / cans and such and the machine would be loud. :yes:


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## minerfarmer (Nov 4, 2014)

Here is some more information. I built a 36X40 polebarn and built a wall down the middle, so I have a 36X20 shop and a 36X20 parking and storage area. It gets cold here in central ill. So I super insulated the shop and heat and cool it with a mini-split. There is no heat in the parking and storage area. To save space I want to put the dust collector in the unheated area and suck thru the wall then return the air thru the wall to the shop. The air would only be in the cold or hot in the summer the time it takes it to go thru the collector. Would this cause condensation problems?


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## FaithWoodcraft (Nov 19, 2014)

minerfarmer said:


> Here is some more information. I built a 36X40 polebarn and built a wall down the middle, so I have a 36X20 shop and a 36X20 parking and storage area. It gets cold here in central ill. So I super insulated the shop and heat and cool it with a mini-split. There is no heat in the parking and storage area. To save space I want to put the dust collector in the unheated area and suck thru the wall then return the air thru the wall to the shop. The air would only be in the cold or hot in the summer the time it takes it to go thru the collector. Would this cause condensation problems?


Condensation is caused by due point and relative humidity. Thanks for the additional information but other than the sq ft of your area, there are no numbers at all. Saying it is "cold in Illinois" is not very valuable information. You see, to someone from Mexico, Illinois can get cold. To someone from Canada, Illinois is nearly the tropics. IMO, if you're heating anything with a mini-split, your outside ambient temperature is not what I'd call cold. Therefore, based on the non-specific information on the environmental conditions, I can't say if you'd have condensation issues with what you're proposing. Where I am, I certainly would.

To get an idea of the answer to your question, take the outside air temp, the inside air temp and the inside relative humidity and calculate the outside due point...will the inside humidity condense in the outside air temp? I don't know how to calculate this but those are the factors you would use. Google it perhaps.

I've wanted to do something similar to what you suggest but I'm certain I'd have major condensation issues in the winter...summer would be a completely different story.


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## TMA Woodworks (Apr 23, 2010)

Hi guys,
My shop is inside a 2 stalled insulated garage. It is heated with a 45000 BTU Modine hanging heater. The LOML has the 3rd stall that we added and is attached to the shop. It it not heated. In the Nebraska winters it is not unusual for it to get down to zero in her garage. I also have a window air unit that is installed for cooling. My DC in located in unheated garage and is vented to the outside. I have found no problems with any type of condensation on my unit. I have had my unit going for several years. I did add in the farthest corner from the heater a vent for make up air. As I was using gas heat I was worried about CO2 buildup because I would be creating a negative pressure from sucking out air. I have noticed that my heater does not run any more when I am using the dust collector or just working in the shop. Now I do need to prefix that with the statement that I don't leave my DC on. I will only run it while I'm at a particular station. My vent pulls in unconditioned air. It's just a 6x12 grate that has a hole through the wall. The only drawback that I had was that the collector was out of site so it would fill up and then I wouldn't notice until it plugged and I had a loss of power. I had to come up with a indicator light to warn me the bin was full. With a home system I think it would be hard to get yourself into a lot of problems. If it were an industrial unit you would have a whole different story.


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## jdonhowe (Jul 25, 2014)

I doubt that condensation would be a significant problem, because you're not creating nearly as much water vapor in the shop as occurs inside a typical home. Also, my guess is that your pole barn is not absolutely air tight, anyway.

As an example, one person exhales about 1 pint of water vapor in 8 hours. One meal of cooking and dishwashing creates one pint, as does 10 minutes of showering.

That said, to conserve heat on the shop side, you'd have to build an enclosure around the DC on the unheated side, and the enclosure needs to be insulated. That way, only heated air is returned to the shop side after being filtered. 

BTW, you didn't say specifically how the return air would get back- I presume through a cold air return grate (or just a hole in the wall!). If so, make sure it's large enough not to restrict flow- at least as large as your duct size, so as not to impair DC performance, and increase air pressure (and leakage of heated air) in the enclosure.

Having grown up in the upper Midwest myself (Madison, WI), I can appreciate how cold it can get in the winter, even in the slightly warmer regions of central Ill. Go Badgers! :smile:


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