# Old School Milling...



## 35015 (Nov 24, 2012)

Hello All,

Having done this in several styles back in the day, I was intrigued getting to read these again recently and thought sharing these links here from The Lost Art Press's Jeff Burks would be enjoyable for some members...

Sawing Lumber in India

Sawing Lumber in China

Sawing Lumber in Japan


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

Sawing in America LOL


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

The old ways are good but I am old and looking for something younger LOL


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## 35015 (Nov 24, 2012)

Catpower...I like these old methods...(at least to understand them and to have done them)...but I'm with you on most days...Give me a Swing Blade or Band Saw Mill any day to going back to eating sawdust falling into my face...ha, ha...For some projects, like historic work, it's good to know this can still be done...


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Jay C. White Cloud said:


> Hello All,
> 
> Having done this in several styles back in the day, I was intrigued getting to read these again recently and thought sharing these links here from The Lost Art Press's Jeff Burks would be enjoyable for some members...
> 
> ...


My guess is if you ever milled wood like that you would find a way to loose the method too.


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## Larry42 (Jan 10, 2014)

Caution, younger ones cause heart attacks for us oldies.


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## Larry42 (Jan 10, 2014)

JCWC nice illustrations of sawing in the "good ol' days." 
I was in Japan in '64,5 &6 and there were still some elements of the good old days being used. But the transition was obviously happening to modern methods. Great country.


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## 35015 (Nov 24, 2012)

It is harder for actually on the up stroke man than the down (gravity helps) and the speed of this system is actually rather remarkable when it is seen (or done) for the first time. With a sharp saw (even a large single man system) it can give greater control and speed than expected. 

I still will use a single man system to cut small quantities and stay "tuned up" for how it all works. There are even some manufacturers and Blade Smiths making contemporary blades, so we no longer have to search out just vintage saws and retune.

For large tenon, I still employ a 700 mm bow saw that can virtually split a line, and when using the large Nokogiri with ripping teeth it is only really the weight of the saw that does the work on a pull stroke...quite quickly compared to even power tools, if setup is taken into consideration...


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*The "pull stroke" saws....*



Jay C. White Cloud said:


> It is harder for actually on the up stroke man than the down (gravity helps) and the speed of this system is actually rather remarkable when it is seen (or done) for the first time. With a sharp saw (even a large single man system) it can give greater control and speed than expected.
> 
> I still will use a single man system to cut small quantities and stay "tuned up" for how it all works. There are even some manufacturers and Blade Smiths making contemporary blades, so we no longer have to search out just vintage saws and retune.
> 
> For large tenon, I still employ a 700 mm bow saw that can virtually split a line, and when using the large Nokogiri with ripping teeth it is only* really the weight of the saw that does the work on a pull stroke...quite quickly compared to even power tools*, if setup is taken into consideration...


Hello Jay, when I first discovered the Japanese type of pull saws by Vaughn, sold at Home Depot years ago, I was impressed. Thgen I really thought about the physics of how a thin blade like they use would work. It's like pushing vs pulling on a rope. A rope or thin steel blade under tension will straighten right out. The English or USA versions of hand saws are the push type and will bow out under excessive pressure making for a more difficult cut control. It all makes such "stupid" sense I wonder where we have been for all these years. 

FYI, I haven't thrown out my old Stanley and Disston saws just yet ....


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## 35015 (Nov 24, 2012)

> FYI, I haven't thrown out my old Stanley and Disston saws just yet ....


Gosh...don't you ever throw them out!!!...They are grand and excellent tools. A dear friend and one of the finest students I have ever had (Mr. Chickadee of Youtube) uses various push saw almost exclusively, and does all his own tuning and sharpening...He loves his Disston...

The very first historical saws know are over 7000 years plus, and are...of course...pull saws. Most cultures with the oldest and unbroken woodworking histories all use pull saws, usually in the Bow Frame format.

It is as you say..."makes such "stupid" sense..." I love that one, and shall keep it!

Much Thanks!

j


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

Jay C. White Cloud said:


> Gosh...don't you ever throw them out!!!...They are grand and excellent tools. A dear friend and one of the finest students I have ever had (Mr. Chickadee of Youtube) uses various push saw almost exclusively, and does all his own tuning and sharpening...He loves his Disston...
> 
> The very first historical saws know are over 7000 years plus, and are...of course...pull saws. Most cultures with the oldest and unbroken woodworking histories all use pull saws, usually in the Bow Frame format.
> 
> ...




And if nothing else you can show the grand kids how to make Hawaiian music whit a saw LOL


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## WoodAddict (Jun 7, 2017)

Haha, but he is right. Those instruments are historical pieces, that are still very useful. Don't throw them out by the garbage. Keep them in your storage or if you are sure you will never use them again sell them to a store or something.


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## Toolman50 (Mar 22, 2015)

One thing for certain, early sawmillers did not need to go to a gym for exercise!
Did you notice the Japanese were sawing with no pants? Ha. 
If you could live a few years as a sawmiller, I think you would look like Conan.


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## WeebyWoodWorker (Jun 11, 2017)

Personally if your going to do a lot of this kind of work you should do it the old way at least once. Then after your arms no longer feel like jell-o carry on with power tools. Just so that you can appreciate what is was like without them. Just me though, and I like traditional methods anyway especially Japanese ones because ya know, I'm a weeb.


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

Toolman50 said:


> One thing for certain, early sawmillers did not need to go to a gym for exercise!
> Did you notice the Japanese were sawing with no pants? Ha.
> If you could live a few years as a sawmiller, I think you would look like Conan.


Gym memberships..lol
Few years ago my son and I ran a business cleaning out foreclosed properties which is quite a bit of work in itself. We were always looking for reliable help. Most guys were only interested in the job for whatever junk they could take home then quit the next day so my son had the great idea of going by the local gyms and offering a good workout to people and actually pay them for their sweat instead of them paying to sweat. 
I've never understood why people would go into debt just to sweat and use muscles when there is plenty of free work to be done. 
Just think of the business opportunities out there..just about any hard, physical labor could be resold as a great workout. Come to think about it, most every job I ever had required some degree of hard physical labor. The day you see me joining a gym to sweat and use muscles is the day you'll see hundred dollar bills floating down out of the sky non-stop..It's just not something that'll ever happen in my life.. 
Maybe the people sell planes and handsaws should repackage them as exercise equipment.


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## WoodAddict (Jun 7, 2017)

allpurpose said:


> Gym memberships..lol
> Few years ago my son and I ran a business cleaning out foreclosed properties which is quite a bit of work in itself. We were always looking for reliable help. Most guys were only interested in the job for whatever junk they could take home then quit the next day so my son had the great idea of going by the local gyms and offering a good workout to people and actually pay them for their sweat instead of them paying to sweat.
> I've never understood why people would go into debt just to sweat and use muscles when there is plenty of free work to be done.
> Just think of the business opportunities out there..just about any hard, physical labor could be resold as a great workout. Come to think about it, most every job I ever had required some degree of hard physical labor. The day you see me joining a gym to sweat and use muscles is the day you'll see hundred dollar bills floating down out of the sky non-stop..It's just not something that'll ever happen in my life..
> Maybe the people sell planes and handsaws should repackage them as exercise equipment.


Haha very nice tactic. By paying them to sweat I bet more people would exercise.


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