# Pushing Diameter Limit on a ShopFox 1758



## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

I met a guy who had an elm tree taken down so I traded him some pecan BBQ wood for a few logs. I spit a fork down the middle with my chain saw and turned a bowl this weekend. I turned it down to about 1/2-inch thickness and am air-drying it in a 40% humidity environment. So far it has negligible warping and hasn't offered to crack. I'll try to share an update of a fatally cracked bowl or a final sanding/finishing later.


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Hey, nice work pushing those limits! I like the colors of the bowl where the left side is darker the middle light and the right is medium. It looks very nice.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I don't believe I would have had the nerve to turn that on. Yikes that's a lot of wood. Bowl looks good though.


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

Thanks, I was certainly nervous turning on the lathe. It runs at 400RPM with a brand new belt but runs closer to 600 when the belt wears just a little and sinks into the banjo pulley a little deeper.

Update on the bowl drying: So far so good. It's no longer cool and clammy to the touch and is a LOT lighter. I mounted it back on the lathe and sanded it down to 800 grit. I want to do some final shaping to the base and maybe the rim. It's amazing how little the rim moves after this much drying time. I have little-to-no experience with elm but I'm about ready to call my friend and ask if he still has logs from his tree.


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## hwebb99 (Nov 27, 2012)

I would have had the tail stock on it. How do you move your lathe outside?


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

My tail stock has a base that extends partially under the work piece. I'm glad you mentioned the topic because some friends and I were looking at it the other day and wondering if the tail stock and its moving parts were installed backward. I need to check on that.

I mounted the lathe on two furniture dollies (bottom left of second photo above) so I can roll it in and out of the garage. The caster points on the lathe base were way too narrow so I got some extra base width to boot. I really need to increase the base width a little more if I keep turning big pieces.


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## hwebb99 (Nov 27, 2012)

Can you pots a picture of the tailstock?


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

Here is a photo that shows the furniture dollies I have my lathe mounted on. They need to have even wider wheel bases. It's pretty stable at rest but prone to tipping if the wheels hang while moving. It's crazy top heavy.

You can also see the foot on the tail piece extends well beyond the part that contacts the work piece. I went and looked at a stock photo of the lathe and mine appears to be installed correctly but I just don't understand why it's built that way. Should be able to turn it around if the guts of the adjustable tailpiece can be reversed.


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## hwebb99 (Nov 27, 2012)

I don't know why they would build the tailstock like that. It looks like a poor design. If you do many turnings like this you should buy a oneway live center. The oneway live center is longer than the factory, and should reach past the base.


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

The lockdown clamp for the screw adjustment is forward of center so the guts of the screw adjustment may not come out and switch around. I'll try to look at that this weekend. I generally like the lathe but some parts you just have to shake your head at. The tool rest lock down handles strip out soon and I have resorted to Vice Grips. It would be nice to have a reverse option for sanding...amazing that couldn't be cheaply included for an electric motor setup. I think I could install a longer belt and twist it once during installation (belt would look like a figure 8 around the pulleys) so it would reverse but that would be pretty time intensive. Wonder if anyone knows enough about this type motor to know if a reverse can be wired into the circuitry. I hope I can buy a different tool rest that will fit. Recommendations are appreciated!


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## Bill Boehme (Feb 9, 2014)

Very nice bowl, John. What is the final diameter?

Somehow, I have missed out on turning elm until just recently. I rough turned an elm bowl that is just under 13 inches diameter a month ago. Not knowing how much warp to expect, I left the walls a bit over an inch thick. So far there has been no warping, but it has a few more months of drying to go before it will be ready for final turning. The weight started out at 3021 grams and today it is 2738 grams.

I generally plot the weight of drying bowls to extrapolate when they should be ready for final turning. Here is a plot of the drying data for an 18 inch diameter box elder bowl about midway through the drying process.










And, it looks like we are sharing the same shop, John. :laughing: I'm in the DFW wing of the shop and assume that you're in the Piney Woods wing. Here I am in my shop roughing the box elder bowl that I mentioned above.


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## Bill Boehme (Feb 9, 2014)

JohnInTexas said:


> ... You can also see the foot on the tail piece extends well beyond the part that contacts the work piece. I went and looked at a stock photo of the lathe and mine appears to be installed correctly but I just don't understand why it's built that way. Should be able to turn it around if the guts of the adjustable tailpiece can be reversed.


It is pretty clear why they did that. They were more interested in bragging about distance between centers than they were in real world usability. Even if turning baseball bats, you don't need that much distance between centers. You won't be able to turn it around because it isn't a straight through hole. However, a machinist could rework it so that it could be reversed.

The motor can be modified to run in either direction. Sometimes it is simple and other times it is a real pain. However, I would like to mention from personal experience of modifying the motor on a similar lathe that sanding in reverse is way over hyped. It is handy if your lathe already has the ability, but hardly worth the effort of modifying the motor. I find that it is far better to get a turned finish that only needs very little sanding and I generally do most of my sanding off the lathe.


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

Yeah, Bill, I'm down in the soggy southeast coastal wing near Beaumont. I'm trying to install a temporary, easy-up, easy-down overhang so I can turn in inclement weather.

It will be interesting to se how your elm dries. I have seen no wood yet that will dry as far as this piece without having some serious warp. It was slinging sap last Saturday when I turned it and has been air drying for five days and is still so true it doesn't rock turned upside down on a flat surface. The physics of wood shrinking more in one direction than the other shouldn't allow that. Warp can be attractive on some pieces, especially if it's symmetrical, but it will sure keep you from doing any additional turning on a piece that wasn't let really thick. I may be dreaming but I feel like I have less splitting if I turn wet wood down to around 1/2-inch rather than leaving it considerably thicker. I have tried several of the tricks to slow drying time and I have experimented with microwave drying. Ultimately, I think it has a LOT more to do with the type of wood and the characteristics of the particular piece of wood than the method I use to dry it. I air dried a relatively thin rough turning of a pecan "Y" limb with three heartwood areas and then did minor finishing when it was dry. It's one of my best pieces. I'm currently air drying a rough turning from the same pecan tree and it looks like it will be fire wood. Obviously, some woods, fruit woods for example, usually require special treatment. I'm wondering if elm is more forgiving.


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## Bill Boehme (Feb 9, 2014)

I'm originally from Houston, so I know about humidity.

This piece of elm is really pretty so I am hoping to find some more. As far as stable wood is concerned, nothing can touch mesquite for being the perfect wood.

With mesquite, you never need to mess with rough turning and then letting it dry before final turning unless making something with a snug fitting lid. Green mesquite turns wonderfully. When dry it is hard and dusty, but still workable with sharp tools. Either way, the wood is always spectacular. There is no such thing as a plain piece of mesquite.

Whenever possible, I try to turn mesquite to final size in a single session. Generally, it will be dry anyway by the time that it gets to final size. Spinning it on the lathe helps it dry fast and the high summer temperatures and dryer humidity also contribute to the fast drying.


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

I haven't had the pleasure of turning mesquite. Planning to work with another piece of elm this weekend...and maybe pick up more wood. His tree was quite a big one.

You asked for measurements of the bowl above....14 1/2" X 3 1/4". 16" is max for my lathe so I got pretty close. The other half of the log has some nice grain that filled in between a fork. I want to try to capture it in a shallow platter.


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## firehawkmph (Apr 26, 2008)

John,
Nice bowl.
Please don't leave the chuck wrench in the chuck, bad habit to get into. 
Mike Hawkins


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## hwebb99 (Nov 27, 2012)

firehawkmph said:


> John,
> Nice bowl.
> Please don't leave the chuck wrench in the chuck, bad habit to get into.
> Mike Hawkins


Yes, it is a bad idea. I can't say from experience what a wood lathe will do, but I can say from experience a metal lathe will toss one clear across a large room.


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

LOL! I saw that in a photo after the fact and wondered if someone would comment. I catch myself leaving that in there...when I'm removing the bowl I forget the chuck wrench and focus on getting the bowl to a safe place. Good reminder


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## JohnInTexas (Apr 1, 2014)

Here is an update photo on the finished bowl. It has a few coats of butcher block oil rubbed into it. It finally warped quite a lot but didn't offer to crack. Here is that bowl (back right) with some others I turned from the three logs my friend gave me. The front, center bowl is unfinished.


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## Horatio (Apr 4, 2012)

Great looking assortment of items. Not had the chance to work with elm but I second what others have said above about mesquite. Very forgiving on moisture and always been the easiest wood for me to turn despite being pretty hard.


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## firehawkmph (Apr 26, 2008)

Nice assortment John. They turned out nice. When you get the fresh cut logs like that, you might want to consider rough turning them. I generally leave them about an inch thick than throw them in a paper shopping bag, one per bag. Put the bag in a cool place in your shop, date the bag and type of wood and then let it sit. Usually in 4-6 months, they're dry enough to finish turn. They will warp a little, but they will true up when you turn them the second time.
Mike Hawkins


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