# Transitional Jointer Plane Restore



## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

OK, I'm going to give this a shot and try a restore thread. This is the Sargent 3422 jointer found in my http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f11/mystery-box-projects-38882/ . It's 22" long making it the equivalent to a Bailey #7. I'm hoping to restore it as a user in my kit.

Here she is, pretty dirty and rusty.









Disassembled.









I cleaned all the parts and got the metal in Evaporust until tomorrow. I set the wooden base on it's side as I was working and something didn't look quite right. I held it up to look down it's length and dang it, it isn't straight! :wallbash:

To illustrate, I clamped one end to my jointer bed. You can see how far out this is.








Needless to say this complicates matters a bit. I had planned on lapping the sole with sand paper, but I'm wondering if I need to/can use my jointer and planer to get this thing in line. Will that compromise the set-up of the plane making it unusable? Is this just for display or can it be salvaged? Input needed! :blink:


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## Paul W Gillespie (Jul 7, 2011)

Can't answer, but looking forward to some who knows to help out. I have a few older ones like this and figured they were just decorations, but if they can be fixed, they will be added to my pile of planes to restore, someday.


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## Boss O' The Shop (Mar 21, 2012)

I've never tried this, so I'm certain that a better answer is out there from someone with more experience. It seems that you're looking at what appears to be about ½-¾" of difference over the length of the plane. I would think that if you tried to true the sole by planing it down you would affect set up in that the blade may not be able to draw up inside the body and would always remain a bit proud of the sole. 

I'm not sure what kind of wood the body of the plane is made from, but I'm wondering if you could rebuild one. Firemedic had a thread going on Making Moulding Planes...bet he could provide plenty of tips. Good luck!


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## tc65 (Jan 9, 2012)

Boss O' The Shop said:


> I've never tried this, so I'm certain that a better answer is out there from someone with more experience. It seems that you're looking at what appears to be about ½-¾" of difference over the length of the plane. I would think that if you tried to true the sole by planing it down you would affect set up in that the blade may not be able to draw up inside the body and would always remain a bit proud of the sole.


+1 I would have the same concerns about the blade adjustments, but at this point, what do you have to loose? I'd give it a try and see. It's hard to tell from the picture, but you may not have to plane off more than 1/4" or so if the "hump" is in the middle of the plane. 

Just a wild idea, but if you have to take so much off you can't retract/adjust the blade properly, why not add on a custom sole of a contrasting wood to restore the thickness of the plane? It would make it a truly one of a kind plane with a good story behind it.:smile:


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## 65BAJA (May 27, 2012)

trc65 said:


> +1 I would have the same concerns about the blade adjustments, but at this point, what do you have to loose? I'd give it a try and see. It's hard to tell from the picture, but you may not have to plane off more than 1/4" or so if the "hump" is in the middle of the plane.
> 
> Just a wild idea, but if you have to take so much off you can't retract/adjust the blade properly, why not add on a custom sole of a contrasting wood to restore the thickness of the plane? It would make it a truly one of a kind plane with a good story behind it.:smile:


I just bought "The Handplane Book". While browsing the book it mentions re-soling<sp wood body planes. I haven't read that chapter yet though.


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## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

:smile: shopdad, that's pretty bad! You can joint it though. Hopefully you won't have to remove to much of the sole. Don't bother with the planer, the sole need not be coplaner to function properly. The biggest problem you could run into is that as you remove more material from the sole the mouth will get wider... potentially a problem for fine cuts. BUT jointers don't need to make whispy curls, that's not their job.

So make some light passes with the jointer and see how it goes. The sole is made of Beech wood, btw. If you have trouble with the sole you have, just make a new one. Most any hard tight grained lumber is fine.

EDIT:
Be sure to research wood coatings prior to slapping any ole sealer on there.


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## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

Thanks for weighing in Tom. The reason I bring up jointing AND planing is by jointing the top, which is the concave surface and technically the proper choice for jointing, I can have a reference surface and hopefully take as little as possible off the bottom. Still, it's a lot to remove...

So my choices seem to be:

1. Joint (/plane) it to flat
2. Make a new one (I have some hickory that might be nice)
3. Punt - use as decoration or sell (or scrub jointer? 

Votes?


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

I would vote with trc65 add contrasting wood sole to the present body. Ideally a denser wood than the present beech.

Joint the top flat as you stated, then cut e.g., 1 in off the bottom and glue on the new sole. I would use the hardest wood you have available. 

You will need to cut out for the mouth, so take measurements before you remove the 1in.

For me that would be Jatoba (Brazilian cherry). I managed to score some drops at the local mill for $1.50 / board foot. Left overs from a custom project they recently completed.

I actually was looking at planes on ebay and saw one like this. I was contemplating on purchasing with the intent to replace the body.


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## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

You can joint just the bottom with a hand plane without much trouble but I do understand your concern. It really is too bad the cup isn't reversed as you wouldn't have to take much off of the mouth area.

Hickory could be nice, tough to work with but the blonde color would be about the same as beech. Keep in mind it's almost all hand work to wright a transition pane sole.


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## Boss O' The Shop (Mar 21, 2012)

trc65 said:


> Just a wild idea, but if you have to take so much off you can't retract/adjust the blade properly, why not add on a custom sole of a contrasting wood to restore the thickness of the plane? It would make it a truly one of a kind plane with a good story behind it.:smile:


I really like this idea...it would never have occurred to me to do this, but I think that would be an excellent way to solve the problem!

:clap:


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## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

I want to do this right. Ordered Garrett Hack's "The Handplane Book." I like his stuff for FWW.


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## 65BAJA (May 27, 2012)

Shop Dad said:


> I want to do this right. Ordered Garrett Hack's "The Handplane Book." I like his stuff for FWW.


Check page 56 when you get it. It talks about wooden sole repair.


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## ftk (May 9, 2012)

Shop Dad said:


> I want to do this right. Ordered Garrett Hack's "The Handplane Book." I like his stuff for FWW.


I recently got that book and I enjoy it very much. Well written, detailed, and lots of nice pictures of all kinds of planes.


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## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

65BAJA said:


> Check page 56 when you get it. It talks about wooden sole repair.


This page? :laughing:


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## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

Looks like a good choice! With all you guys I'll be in good company. :thumbsup:

Minor update. Time to get out of the bath! :boat:









Looks like the Evaporust has done it's stuff.









Not sure this blade can be recovered though. Maybe with lots of grinding?


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## Evilfrog (Aug 2, 2011)

Since my last thread, when someone suggested I purchase a Hock blade instead of restoring...{and then later, make my own blade...) 

I'm all in favor up tossing that blade there and buying a new one. You just have to ask yourself if it's worth spending all that time grinding when you can purchase a new one and give it a quick sharpen. Spend the time with the rest of the restore IMO.


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Wow! That is really outa whack. I vote leave it as is and use it as a coopers tool on really big barrels. Seriously though, Ill be interested to see what you do from here.


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## Paul W Gillespie (Jul 7, 2011)

The wife is picking me up The Handplane Book today from the local library. Thanks for the suggestion and I am sure it will help me in my hand plane restorations.


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## Phaedrus (Jan 18, 2012)

Not to dig up ancient history, but any progress on the transitional jointer??


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## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

Thanks for asking. I've had to set it aside for other projects. Honestly, I'm debating whether it's worth more of my time. After reading through the transitional plane section in Garrett Hack's book and not finding enough to go on for my situation I wrote him. He got back to me suggesting a similar wood for the bottom 1/2" or so rather than replace the whole thing. There are lots of cool possibilities but with everything else I have going on and want to do it's been sitting and probably will for a while.


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## Woodwart (Dec 11, 2012)

I have an older wooden plane that came to me fairly badly twisted along the sole. Having read a little, but having noone to tell me I couldn't, I cut about ½" off the bottom of the plane with my bandsaw, then applied a ½" white oak sole. I also made a front knob for it. It's back together, and works, although I haven't used it much. I've completely blown its collectible value, of course. I learned some things just by the attempt, and if this plane hadn't turned out OK, I would still have 26 others to play with.

So, yeah, try something you think should work, and if it fails completely you'll still have parts for your next plane project. :thumbsup:


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