# Birch Ply and dark stain



## audiokat (Aug 6, 2008)

I am using a Birch ply from home depot. I have a feeling I sanded with too light of a sandpaper. I purchased an ebony colored Minwax Oil based stain and was not able to get it to take very well. I then purchased Minwax Pre-Wood Conditioner. Although the stain is now taking better it is getting to the point of diminishing returns. On a test piece of wood I am now on 5 coats. The color is nowhere near as dark as the examples on the can or board. It's been a while since I have done any woodwork and I'm not sure where to go from here. I let the stain stand for about 15 minutes before wiping on each coat but at 5 coats it's not darkening much more.

Suggestions would be highly appreciated.

Thanks,

Steve


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## firehawkmph (Apr 26, 2008)

Steve,
I have use the birch and maple veneered plywood from HD and had good luck with it. Personally, I don't like minwax stains. I have much better luck with Sherwin williams own stains. If I remember right their interior stain line is called woodscapes or something close to that. They will mix up whatever color you want. Especially for a darker color it is a much thicker base than minwax. You can brush it on, let it set for awhile and get tacky, then lightly wipe it. A second or third coat normally keeps getting darker. Give it a shot, I think you'll like it. 
Mike Hawkins:smile:


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## nailgunner7 (Jun 1, 2007)

Audiokat, 
I have had this same situation before, when I have combined different face materials with birch carcass sides. First off, Minwax would not be my first choice. I feel it lacks the penitration power. But since your there already, I'd use a gelstain on the surface to darken your project. You can manipulate the degree of coloring by the amount you apply. I have done projects using gelstain to simulate burl finishes, marble, etc. 
Hope this helps

Scott A. Mordecki/Nailgunner7
http://fallentimber.mysite.com


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## audiokat (Aug 6, 2008)

nailgunner7 said:


> Audiokat,
> I have had this same situation before, when I have combined different face materials with birch carcass sides. First off, Minwax would not be my first choice. I feel it lacks the penitration power. But since your there already, I'd use a gelstain on the surface to darken your project. You can manipulate the degree of coloring by the amount you apply. I have done projects using gelstain to simulate burl finishes, marble, etc.
> Hope this helps
> 
> ...



So are you saying after a few coats of the ebony to use a gelstain to darken? Or use a gelstain and then coat it with the ebony? 

Lastly what is a gelstain and are you speaking of particular product that is meant for darkening of just a dark shade of gelstain.

Thanks for the explanation. Great stuff on your page by the way.

Steve


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## nailgunner7 (Jun 1, 2007)

Steve,
Gelstain sits on the surface, if you have already stained your piece and it is not dark enough then apply the gel (ebony flavored) an rub it on to create an even and shade to your liking. It doesn't dry fast so you have time to apply and manipulate it. You have to try this to get the feel for it. 

Thanks for the site review. More coming soon!

Scott.


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## audiokat (Aug 6, 2008)

nailgunner7 said:


> Steve,
> Gelstain sits on the surface, if you have already stained your piece and it is not dark enough then apply the gel (ebony flavored) an rub it on to create an even and shade to your liking. It doesn't dry fast so you have time to apply and manipulate it. You have to try this to get the feel for it.
> 
> Thanks for the site review. More coming soon!
> ...


I haven't started on the piece yet. For the first time I was smart enough to start on a scrap piece of wood. I do however like the idea of using the materials I have because of budget reasons. Since I haven't started the yet should I use the gel first or the oil based first? How long can I let the gel set in for?

Thanks again

Steve


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

You might experiment with aniline dye powders. They can be mixed in alcohol (methanol) or water. You can create your own levels of concentration. 

You also might try not sanding with too smooth of a grit. Experiment with 220x then 180x or maybe 150x. Try the dye after each grit, and allow to dry. For your samples, you should also apply your final finish whatever it is as it will also change the looks of the sample.


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## audiokat (Aug 6, 2008)

As a conclusion to the epic stain saga I endured I went to Sherwin Williams. I basically threw away al the crap Minwax stain and started over. Sherwin Williams has a product called BAC Wiping stains that are specially formulated for this kind of thing. Brought it home and one coat later I was done. Can't say enough about how pro the guys at Sherwin Williams were. I brought a sample piece of wood with me and they worked with me for 30 minutes to tine the color will we had it right. 

Thanks for everyones help

Steve


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## johnjf0622 (Feb 8, 2008)

I have to agree, Minwax doesn't have the penetrating power it used to. i am sure they have changed the formula from 25 years ago. I remember that was all we used in high school shop class. And there was never an issue on how it colored.


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## audiokat (Aug 6, 2008)

Thanks for everyone's help! Although I made a ton of mistakes I'm happy with the results of the desk. I just posted some pics in my photo's if anyone is interested.

Steve


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## johnjf0622 (Feb 8, 2008)

Desk looks good. Did you mont it to the floor with flanges? Or is it fastened to the wall? The pics don't show a purple hue at all. Most important it is how you like it. Good Work..


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## audiokat (Aug 6, 2008)

johnjf0622 said:


> Desk looks good. Did you mont it to the floor with flanges? Or is it fastened to the wall? The pics don't show a purple hue at all. Most important it is how you like it. Good Work..



Thanks John, I'm very excited about it. It's been ages since did any woodworking projects and it's just as fun as I remember. Plus way cheaper!!!. The rear of the desk is supported the whole way around by a cheap pine trim grade 1x4". It's painted with the same paint as the wall so even when looking underneath you barely notice it. There are two large L brackets that I painted black. One supports the middle of the left desk the other the union in the wood pieces on the right desk. The pipes are electrical conduit. I purchased large oak closet rod hangers and painted them black. The top ones are fastened but not the bottom ones. I wanted the entire thing to be able to disappear without harming the HDWD's so the base that holds the pole is just staying there via double stick tape. The weight of the items on the desk keeps the poles pretty straight also. I doubt it will go anywhere since there is no pressure pushing any way but down.


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## motherbishop (Sep 18, 2008)

*staining birch plywood*

I am so lucky to have found this conversation. Am staining new cabinet doors and having no luck in getting them dark enough. I'm using Old Master's semi-transparent oil wiping stain, which has worked great on trim in the past. Now it's too light. Love the purple-y black of the desks on Steve's post. Can I apply this stain on top of what I've already done? Figures, the one time I don't visit my favorite Sherwin Williams Store.
Thanks. Becky


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## jillinbrooklyn (Jan 21, 2009)

Hi Steve - I'm looking for ebony stained birch. At the end of the day did you get tghe ebony like minwax color on the birch? What was the color you used...or was it custoM? Thanks - Jill


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## audiokat (Aug 6, 2008)

jillinbrooklyn said:


> Hi Steve - I'm looking for ebony stained birch. At the end of the day did you get tghe ebony like minwax color on the birch? What was the color you used...or was it custoM? Thanks - Jill


With the strongest possible caution I advise against minwax stain. I am a novice and maybe I was missing something but minwax would simply not take to the birch ply. Maybe it would be great on other woods but I'll never know becuase I won't waste my money on there products. 

Advise was given to go to Sherwin Williams and it was perfect advise. They have a special stain called a BAC wiping stain that worked perfectly. One coat and done. I must have done 7 with the minwax and it wouldn't get nearly dark enough. 

Plus Sherwin Williams can alter the color of the stain to fit your needs. You will notice there is a purple hue to the office table I did. It was an accident but when I saw it on the test piece I loved it. 

I brought a test piece with me there and he worked with me coloring the piece for about a half hour.

Great company as far as I'm concerned. 

Good Luck!!


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## JulieinDenver (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi there - don't know if anyone is still out there - but love the stain. What did you use to finish the wood? Thanks!


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