# How to utilize this flame box elder small log



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Back in July I was lucky to have been given a couple of small log sections from a downed Flame Box Elder tree. 

I have just got around to attempting to use these.

I cut the smaller of the two in half by length, then cut the half down the middle to make a bowl blank.

I started to get the shape round and noticed a lot of cracks. I was hoping they would show in the picture, but it seems the flash is not helping. They run at almost 45 deg upper left to lower right.

Once I noticed the cracks I stopped turning.









This is the other half of the log section. Gorgeous flame patterns. This section also has cracks which are not showing in the picture.









Any suggestions on how to utilize these pieces.

I can try CA glue, but there are a lot of cracks.

I am thinking I may have to just not turn these.

I could cut slices to make rustic pot holders.

I am hoping to be able to make something which can showcase the flame pattern.

This is my first attempt to turn Flame Box Elder. Nice wood.


----------



## duncsuss (Aug 21, 2009)

"Gorgeous flame" indeed ...

I just typed up (and deleted) a whole bunch of stuff you already know, since what I'd do and what I'd tell somebody else to do are three different things :laughing:

Hope you manage to make something beautiful with this.


----------



## duncsuss (Aug 21, 2009)

Just a thought ... try slicing 2" off the end of the log, see if the checking goes deeper.

It might be possible to salvage a couple of bowl blanks from it, though not as large as you might have wanted.

If you do this, don't hang around -- get it rough turned to 1/2" - 3/4" wall thickness and into a paper bag as fast as you can to try to prevent the cracks worsening.


----------



## don716 (Mar 1, 2008)

Box Elder is a great for turning but it can have some nice cracks in it at times. For small cracks like that you can finish turning the piece and add sawdust and CA or I usually use coffee grounds and CA. Sand it smooth. It works great and adds nice character to it. Alot of times it is not even noticed. We turned one today out of Hackberry with a large 3/16 wide crack half way around the bowl. It was filled with sawdust and CA and it looked great after it was done.


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Do you turn pens Dave? 
Maybe you can cut them into smaller turning blanks? Or make handles or smaller bowls?
I'm no expert in this dept. 
looks awesome though.


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Dominick said:


> Do you turn pens Dave?
> Maybe you can cut them into smaller turning blanks? Or make handles or smaller bowls?
> I'm no expert in this dept.
> looks awesome though.


I am not yet into pens.

I think a blank the size for a pen would lose a lot of the wonderful grain.

I have to try and utilize as much of the log section as possible to do justice to the flame grain pattern.

Do you want some cookies? :yes:


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Dave Paine said:


> I am not yet into pens.
> 
> I think a blank the size for a pen would lose a lot of the wonderful grain.
> 
> ...


So if you had some pen blanks would you turn them? 
I wish I new how? Your better in that field then I am. 
Oh yea!!!! I love cookies, only with milk. Lol


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Dominick said:


> So if you had some pen blanks would you turn them?
> I wish I new how? Your better in that field then I am.
> Oh yea!!!! I love cookies, only with milk. Lol


I cut pen blanks to send to other forum members, but I have not purchased any pen kits.

The cookie reference was if you want to make some rustic large coasters/pot holders with some slices of the log. At least this would show the grain and not have a problem with the cracks.


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Dave Paine said:


> I cut pen blanks to send to other forum members, but I have not purchased any pen kits.
> 
> The cookie reference was if you want to make some rustic large coasters/pot holders with some slices of the log. At least this would show the grain and not have a problem with the cracks.


Yea that would be cool. How much? 
Why don't you make miss Paine some? Or make some more handles for chisels? Lots you could do with it. You have a lathe.


----------



## duncsuss (Aug 21, 2009)

Dave Paine said:


> I have to try and utilize as much of the log section as possible to do justice to the flame grain pattern.


Bingo ... several shallow bowls turned end-grain.

Square one end (between centers) then attach it to a faceplate; at the other end, turn a hollow in the center of that log, perhaps 2" deep at the middle, then part it off and begin again.

Kind of like an eskimo ulu chopping board ...


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

duncsuss said:


> Bingo ... several shallow bowls turned end-grain.
> 
> Square one end (between centers) then attach it to a faceplate; at the other end, turn a hollow in the center of that log, perhaps 2" deep at the middle, then part it off and begin again.
> 
> Kind of like an eskimo ulu chopping board ...



Thanks, I will give this a try. Not much to lose.


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Dominick said:


> Yea that would be cool. How much?
> Why don't you make miss Paine some? Or make some more handles for chisels? Lots you could do with it. You have a lathe.


The first test bowl shows me the flame pattern deserves to be displayed and this means using as much of the log section as possible.

I think pen blanks or handles would be too small. The flame pattern would be lost.

I will be happy to send some coasters your way. I still have your address. :laughing:

This was the smaller of my two pieces, so I still have another log section for "domestic" use.


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Thanks Dave. How big are these cookies if you were to cut them up? And how about shipping on those. Not sure if they would fit in that little box like the one you sent before?

Oh edit: about 7". Lol


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Dominick said:


> Thanks Dave. How big are these cookies if you were to cut them up? And how about shipping on those. Not sure if they would fit in that little box like the one you sent before?
> 
> Oh edit: about 7". Lol


Dominick. Do not worry, I am happy to cover shipping. These will not weigh much.

I expect the Parcel Post will be inexpensive just take a few days longer, perhaps even less $ than the small Priority Mail box for the chisel handle. :yes:


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Dave Paine said:


> Dominick. Do not worry, I am happy to cover shipping. These will not weigh much.
> 
> I expect the Parcel Post will be inexpensive just take a few days longer, perhaps even less $ than the small Priority Mail box for the chisel handle. :yes:


Yea awesome Dave. Ill be glad to accept it. 
Are you sure?


----------



## Gary Beasley (Jan 21, 2009)

If I had that log and wanted pen blanks I would cut one inch cookies then slice it into one inch blanks crossgrained. I've done the same with some spalted dogwood with wonderful effect. The blanks I cut with the grain looked okay but no wow factor. I think the same would happen with this wood.


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Gary Beasley said:


> If I had that log and wanted pen blanks I would cut one inch cookies then slice it into one inch blanks crossgrained. I've done the same with some spalted dogwood with wonderful effect. The blanks I cut with the grain looked okay but no wow factor. I think the same would happen with this wood.


Thanks for the suggestion, I will give this a try.


----------



## oldmacnut (Dec 27, 2010)

I say cut it up, dry it, and do a segmented project. However, I think you all can expect that from me. lol


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Gary Beasley said:


> If I had that log and wanted pen blanks I would cut one inch cookies then slice it into one inch blanks crossgrained. I've done the same with some spalted dogwood with wonderful effect. The blanks I cut with the grain looked okay but no wow factor. I think the same would happen with this wood.


Giving this a try using the other half of the log section I cut.

The middle two sections are rather fragile due to the cracks.

Are these useable for pen blanks? The cracks would need to be glued before drilling.









If these are usable, I may be able to get 10 or 12 more blanks from the remainder of the log section.

Perhaps time for another give-away ala Rus Demka.


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Dominick said:


> Yea awesome Dave. Ill be glad to accept it.
> Are you sure?


Yes, the box is in the mail. You should receive by next Tuesday.

I messed up the first two due to using the fence. I then found it easier to cut these without the fence.

These will need sanding to get them smooth and parallel. So sending the group in case some cannot be used. 

The section had a hole down the length, but I know this will be extra "character" for you.

The plastic is the flat twine. Trying to keep the bark intact since you will likely want to maintain. Some sections of bark are not adhered to the wood and will need to be glued. Perhaps a good idea to glue the entire circumference.









A close-up of one of the sections.









I trust you will enjoy looking at the grain pattern and especially the red flames as much as I do.


----------



## duncsuss (Aug 21, 2009)

Dave Paine said:


> Are these useable for pen blanks? The cracks would need to be glued before drilling.
> 
> ...
> 
> ...


They look usable to me -- but I'd dry them thoroughly before bothering to use any CA on them. (I have a spare microwave just for drying wood)


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Dave Paine said:


> Yes, the box is in the mail. You should receive by next Tuesday.
> 
> I messed up the first two due to using the fence. I then found it easier to cut these without the fence.
> 
> ...


Cool!!!! Can't wait. 
I'm not worried if the bark comes off, but ill figure something out with it. I'm sure they'll be fine. 
Ill let you know. 
Thanks Dave.
As far as those pen blanks, now I'm no pro in this, but I would think turning those they would fall apart due to grain orientation. 
I dunno.


----------



## duncsuss (Aug 21, 2009)

Dominick said:


> ... I would think turning those they would fall apart due to grain orientation.
> I dunno.


I've turned pens where the blanks were cut cross-grain. Once they are successfully drilled and the brass tubes glued in, they're usually no worse than burl or heavily spalted woods.

Getting them drilled, however, might be tricky ... some people have glued slats of wood (e.g. lollipop sticks) to the outsides to provide support while drilling.


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

duncsuss said:


> I've turned pens where the blanks were cut cross-grain. Once they are successfully drilled and the brass tubes glued in, they're usually no worse than burl or heavily spalted woods.
> 
> Getting them drilled, however, might be tricky ... some people have glued slats of wood (e.g. lollipop sticks) to the outsides to provide support while drilling.


Lol. I didn't realize the tubes go in before you turn them. 
Told you I don't turn. Lol


----------



## Gary Beasley (Jan 21, 2009)

Looks like you have some keepers. See if whoever you send them to will make you a pen from it. The breaks in the middle won't hurt much, most pens use no more that 2 inch pieces for each barrel and you can cut around the breaks.


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

*Some more coasters*

I have been cutting more coasters from the full diameter log section. It seems they are popular with folks who have never seen Flame Box Elder before.

Here is a before and after finishing comparison. The bark was not stable so I removed it.

About 1/4in - 3/8in thick. I did not measure, just cut free hand on the bandsaw. Diameter is about 7in

Both pieces sanded to 180 grit.

Left is the before. Right is after. First used Zinsner Seal-a-Coat then a final coat of George's Club House Wax.

The rim is coloured with a Red Mahogany felt tip finish repair pen









Thanks for looking.


----------



## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

That's pretty cool Dave. Nice way to use it and deliver a pretty full impression of the wood. Is this fully dried? Do you expect any more cracking?


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Shop Dad said:


> That's pretty cool Dave. Nice way to use it and deliver a pretty full impression of the wood. Is this fully dried? Do you expect any more cracking?


Thanks. I have measured the moisture content. The log section has been in my garage since mid July. I normally keep the garage door closed. I do not know when the tree was taken down. The sections had not been sealed. They did not seem to crack much more in my garage.

I started to cut the section just over a week ago.

I am hoping it does not crack any more, but there is a risk. If a coaster were to break, it could be glued back together. It is a display for the grain pattern more than the shape.


----------



## duncsuss (Aug 21, 2009)

Dave Paine said:


> Left is the before. Right is after. First used Zinsner Seal-a-Coat then a final coat of George's Club House Wax.


These look great -- especially the finished one.

Something to watch out for, though -- if the Zinser product you're using is the one I'm thinking of, it's shellac-based.

That would mean it's at risk if it comes in contact with alcohol -- as most coasters I've owned usually do at some point (who'da thunk it? :laughing

It would probably be a safer bet to apply another finish on top of the Sealcoat -- polyurethan or polyacrylic -- rather than just wax.


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

duncsuss said:


> These look great -- especially the finished one.
> 
> Something to watch out for, though -- if the Zinser product you're using is the one I'm thinking of, it's shellac-based.
> 
> ...


Yes the Seal-a-Coat is shellac based. I was pondering whether to use wipe on polyurethane vs wax.

I may try the wipe on poly when I finished the unfinished one. The only reason this was not finished was to be able to take a comparison picture.


----------



## duncsuss (Aug 21, 2009)

Dave Paine said:


> Yes the Seal-a-Coat is shellac based. I was pondering whether to use wipe on polyurethane vs wax.
> 
> I may try the wipe on poly when I finished the unfinished one. The only reason this was not finished was to be able to take a comparison picture.


Understood.

I've used aerosol shellac as a "primer" before applying polyurethane, it made it significantly easier on end-grain.


----------



## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

I like the way that turned out Dave. It really brings out the beauty in the flame. 
Can't wait to do something with mine. 
Thanks again buddy.


----------

