# Table saw blade won't raise or lower????!



## Burnt_Blade

Don't know what the trouble is, for worked fine last time I used it. Now its totally bound up, like something is stuck somewhere jamming the mechanism, but have looked...can't see anything. Used compressed air to blow out dust as best I could and put several shots of graphite onto the threads of the shaft...get a little movement both ways (1/4 turn of the shaft each way) then it seizes right up and don't budge....

It don't seem to be a complicated mechanism and when there is nothing jamming the arbor from moving along its path....what could seize it up suddenly like that?

Its an old early 80's Craftsman contractor style.


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## knotscott

IIRC there's a blade lock mechanism on the front of those saws...any chance the mechanism is engaged in the lock position?


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## Burnt_Blade

There is a lock for the angle adjustment and although I didn't think it would interfere...since it hasn't in the past, I did loosen it, just to cover all bases.


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## Burnt_Blade

Well, I have tried as many things I can think of...even putting a pipe wrench on the shaft after dosing everything with liquid wrench, wd40, graphite spray and the pipe wrench slips, even with its good bite into the shaft.

Just a pile of scrap metal now...woodworking is gonna be on hold for quite a while until can get cash for another TS....


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## woodnthings

*Don't give up yet*

I had a similar saw and any build up of chips at the intersection of the acme and the sector gear would lock it up. Make sure with a small wire and compressed air that there is nothing there. Also look for a sliver of wood cutoff, wedged against it somewhere, it's an obvious thing, but it's possible. Things don't just lock up for no reason. Unless it's your arthritic knee....:laughing: See if you can rotate the shaft at all using the wrench, with moderate force. You may need to twist it CCW a little then CW a little to free it up. Good Luck, but if you just want to ditch it and get a new saw, more power to Ya!


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## Burnt_Blade

Ya...I did try to wiggle it back and forth and used air as best I could. Thats the maddening thing, when there is no obvious reason for it to lock up out of the blue like that....different if you were feeling a binding in the mechanism over a period of days.

Ah well, she is an old gal...cut more than her share of wood I guess. Time to retire. I have a Ryobi portable type TS, but don't really care to use it for anything needing any degree of accuracy. Only keep it around in the far off chance we end getting a property out of town and I can use it to in the construction of things at a place like that.

The old Craftsman was far from the best TS, but it was fairly accurate and stable...so I know I wouldn't have the patience to work with that Ryobi...:no:

Time to start collecting bottles at the sides of the road and building up the piggy bank!


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## woodnthings

*My car horn wouldn't work*

The mechanic was holding it in his hand..."This horn don't honk, it's busted"
I said "Fine, drop it on the ground then. It can't be anymore busted than "don't work" So he dropped it.I said " Now hook it up."
It worked fine!
You could just start bangin' on stuff, since it's "busted" anyway and see what happens.... :huh::blink: bill


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## knotscott

If all else fails, it shouldn't be hard to find a similar or identcal saw of around that era on the cheap to swap parts from. I see them often around here in the $50-$100 range. All that needs to work is the guts...you can sell the fence, wings, leg stand, switch, miter, etc. to offset the cost of the guts, which could end up free. I've bought and sold off the parts of many of this type of saw, and many of the parts are interchangeable ....the inner guts often get kicked to the curb after I strip all the other stuff off.


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## Burnt_Blade

Well I had success! I managed to pry the arbor housing up enough to clear the threads of the shaft, then was able to drive the shaft out. Both the shaft and the arbor housing were binding, even when moved separately. (these shafts really need grease nipples of something) There was deep pitted grooves on one spot of the adjustment shaft with a build up of crud. There were two O rings that kept any dirt from getting too far into the shaft housing so the damaged area is just before the O ring.

The pivot pin that the arbor housing rotates on had corrosion on the shaft, so no wonder it didn't rotate smoothly.

I cleaned all the parts off and then applied a thin layer of white litheum grease to the shafts and reassembled. What a difference! The arbor quadrant now just flops around on the pivot. Same with the adjustment shaft...nice and smooth.

Now just have to re assemble everything...when I had the TS upside down on my Workmate, I noticed a magnet that had fallen unnoticed from some part on the TS...no idea where it came from though...its about 1" in diameter and about 1.5" long...and rounded and polished. Not really super strong magnet but fair strong...any idea where this puppy fell out of, anyone?


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## pjfox23

*Help*

Bumping this thread in hopes that someone can help me with a similar issue.

I have a Ridged 4512. Saw will not raise or lower. I do not know the terminology for this stuff, but I will try. 

The shaft attached to the raise and lower handle spins freely, but it's almost as if the teeth are not meeting the the saw body.

See pics. Any ideas? I don't see how I can raise the entire saw assembly - it weighs a lot and is connect to the table top.


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## woodnthings

*is the handle firmly attached*

to the shaft? When you turn the handle the shaft should turn accordingly.
Next the sector gear should mesh with the teeth on the shaft and rotate as the shaft is turned, raising and lowering the carriage.
If the two are meshing properly the carriage will raise/lower.
A build up of crud in the shaft and in the sector teeth will cause the two not to mesh if they are worn. If the shaft won't turn then crud could be the culprit there also.
Give it a shot of cleaner and a wire brush and see what happens.  bill


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## cabinetman

Just a suggestion...blow out the area before spraying any lubricant. Wet debris can be a gummy thing.:yes:












 







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## pjfox23

Thanks for the quick replies everyone.

The shaft spins without a problem. In fact, that is the problem: spin, spin, spin, no raising. 

Looking at the 4512 parts diagram is looks as if "retaining rings" have fallen off (I found some horse-shoe like washer on the floor). 

Does this mean the shaft has to come in further? I'm thinking that is what needs to happen. But, I don't know how I can make that happen; I've tried pushing, soft taps with mallet/hammer, etc.

Also, I thoroughly cleaned it. Even forced a small pick between each tooth on the gears.

I'll see if I can post a video tomorrow. I'm exhausted tonight. Just wanted to do some woodworking, and it's turned into equipment issues.


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## woodnthings

*REtaining rings fell off*

probably the issue. probably as simple as that. are they circ clips or do they require a "spanner" to compress or expand? like these:
http://saeproducts.com/retaining-rings.html


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## troyd1976

If all else fails break in the LSA, depending how far you are away from a service center?


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## cabinetman

pjfox23 said:


> The shaft spins without a problem. In fact, that is the problem: spin, spin, spin, no raising.
> 
> Looking at the 4512 parts diagram is looks as if "retaining rings" have fallen off (I found some horse-shoe like washer on the floor).
> 
> Does this mean the shaft has to come in further? I'm thinking that is what needs to happen. But, I don't know how I can make that happen; I've tried pushing, soft taps with mallet/hammer, etc.


Retaining rings, circlips, snap rings, and e rings, lock a shaft or bearing in place so the shaft doesn't move in a certain direction. In this case it sounds like that's the problem, as the ring is supposed to keep the threads in position for contact. If you don't have the necessary tool, you may be able to install the ring if you are innovative, or just pick up the correct tool, like this. Some are available with interchangeable ends.












 







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## pjfox23

Well, problem finally solved. Thanks for all of the advice on the board. 

As you can see from the attached photo, the shaft needed to be replaced to its original position. To do that, I had to remove the motor from the assembly, drive the shaft in farther, and replace the motor. This took a looongg time to get right.


Then, I had to repair the bent washers and retaining clips and re-install them.


I got to say, I don’t think this is the greatest design ever, especially since a pot metal washer is the only thing preventing the motor from coming off the shaft and not moving.


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## briantrrnv

Burnt_Blade said:


> Don't know what the trouble is, for worked fine last time I used it. Now its totally bound up, like something is stuck somewhere jamming the mechanism, but have looked...can't see anything. Used compressed air to blow out dust as best I could and put several shots of graphite onto the threads of the shaft...get a little movement both ways (1/4 turn of the shaft each way) then it seizes right up and don't budge....
> 
> It don't seem to be a complicated mechanism and when there is nothing jamming the arbor from moving along its path....what could seize it up suddenly like that?
> 
> Its an old early 80's Craftsman contractor style.


I have a bosch 4000 with the same problem- it would not budge. I greased the shafts that the motor raises and lowers on. This worked! WD40 makes the problem worse. Use an automotive grease or similar.


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## woodnthings

*I donno about grease?*



briantrrnv said:


> I have a bosch 4000 with the same problem- it would not budge. I greased the shafts that the motor raises and lowers on. This worked! WD40 makes the problem worse. Use an automotive grease or similar.



I wouldn't use any grease as it will eventually collect sawdust and gum up the threads. A dry lubricant has always been recommended like graphite or Teflon. WD 40 attracts sawdust as well. Woods with a lot of sap like Pine, will adhere to metal or plastic making the parts seize up, so cleaning is required more often.


https://www.finewoodworking.com/forum/lubricant-for-table-saw-gears


https://www.finewoodworking.com/forum/ideal-dry-lubricant-for-table-saw-use


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