# Hand Saw Restoration and Use



## BigBadBuford (Jan 13, 2012)

Reading this forum for a while has got me wanting to expand my hand tool arsenal, so lately I've been going to a few estate sales trying to get some deals on tools. I recently picked up lot of 8 saws at a local sale for $12 - it included a small hand made looking saw (handle looks like it was whittled with a pocket knife), an Atkins keyhole saw, and six panel saws. From doing some research on the web it looks like one is an 1896-1917 vintage Disston No. 7, two Disston D-8s (one 1896-1917, one 1940-1953 vintage), two Warranted Superior, and one no-name saw. 

I've read about a few techniques for cleaning up the saws and first tried using a razor blade to scrape the worst of the rust off, followed by 220 grit sandpaper and mineral spirits to finish cleaning up the blade. I tried this on most of the saws - mostly to see if any had blade etchings left - but it was taking forever so I decided to try evaporust on the blades. My first attempt was on the older Disstons - they came out looking pretty good - very black but looked decent after a light sanding - but unfortunately the very light etching one the one is now totally gone. Is there any way to preserve the etching on the blade while still using evaporust? Or is going with sandpaper the only way? I'd like to try to preserve the other two if possible. 

Also - from my untrained eye it looks like all of the saws are ground for crosscutting. My original plan was to get two of them sharpened (probably the two older Disstons) - keep one for crosscutting and have one reset as a rip saw - and possibly sell the others to try to finance some more tools. For the casual hand tool user would it be worthwhile to have multiple panel saws for different materials, or would one rip saw and one cross-cut saw typically be sufficient? I typically only work with stock in the 3/4 to 5/4 range. It looks like all of the saws are either 8 or 9 tpi - should I stick with this setup or go for more or less TPI? 

Thanks!
-John


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## EastexToolJunky (Mar 25, 2013)

Some nice ones. U can never have too many saws. Get them clean and sharp. Whatever u don't want, just send to me.


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## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

Even of you are ripping that thinner stock less TPI means quicker work. 5 tpi seems yo be a nice balance or smooth and aggressive for ripping. In general you want 2-3 teeth in the stock at all times so for 1" stock 2-3 tpi is good but tough to operate.

I've gotten away from using panel style saws for any real ripping. I prefer a frame saw because the thinner plate equates to less work and less waste.

As for different saws for different lumber, it's not really needed. A higher fleam angle does better in soft woods but unless you work with hand saws all day every day it's not worth worrying about.


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## MasterSplinter (Jan 12, 2013)

Nice haul!!!! Great looking saws..


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## BigBadBuford (Jan 13, 2012)

Thanks for the suggestions. I took the older No. 7 and D-8 to get sharpened - the No. 7 was kept as a cross-cut saw - I believe 8 tpi. The D-8 was reset as a rip saw. The guy who sharpened them for me said it didn't look like this one was sharpened right in the past and the teeth weren't straight which is why he reground this one. He set it up as a 6 tpi rip. 

Hopefully in the next few days I'll get a chance to try them out. I may take some of the others to him and have them set up differently - possibly a finer cross-cut or a rougher rip cut, but it depends on how much I end up using them. 

Thanks!
John


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## BigBadBuford (Jan 13, 2012)

I recently picked up a few back saws to add to the arsenal - an old Jackson dovetail saw and the other is either a No. 4 or No. 7 Disston. 

I've been wanting to pick up a dovetail saw for a while so I had to pick it up when I saw it at a recent auction. At first glance it looked pretty good, but when I got it home I noticed some flaws. First - the teeth are very uneven - I don't know if this was supposed to be some type of progressive pitch setup on the teeth or a very poor sharpening job. It seems to cut ok though. I was planning on taking it out to get sharpened but not sure if I should stick with the current setup or have it re-toothed to something more conventional. Secondly - the handle has a pretty bad crack and is loose. In operation it doesn't really seem to detract from use too much but I would eventually like to make a new one for it.. probably from some walnut I have laying around. However - the medallion has a crack in it - so I'm worried if I try to take it apart or tighten it when I put on a new handle it will tear apart. With these flaws - do you think this saw is better to be put up as a decoration or fixed and put back into use? Either way I only paid $12 for this and another nice panel saw so isn't much of a loss if it isn't a user.

The other saw is in nice shape - I'm planning on just having it sharpened with the current cross-cut setup. I would eventually like to be able to do a majority of joinery by hand - if so would be worthwhile to look for another to set up as a rip saw?

Thanks!
John


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## tc65 (Jan 9, 2012)

That is the most messed up saw I think I have ever seen:laughing::laughing:

If the saw plate is flat and straight, I would consider doing a complete rehab on it - what have you got to loose?

You'd need to file off those abominations masquerading as teeth, re-cut them and proceed with filing and setting. It will be a challenge, but the skills you'll learn along the way will be invaluable.

Here is a link to many different articles on rehabbing old saws. 

The handle is probably salvageable with some work, and if the nut needs to be replaced, there are sources for replacements.


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Nice saws, hope you can save the "progressively-ish" filed one. There's plenty of plate there, so you should be able to get her up and running again.


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## MasterSplinter (Jan 12, 2013)

Wow.. nice progressive pitch saw. Lol. I think i have one with an even more screwed up fileing.


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## Azur Jahić (May 17, 2013)

Guys what is difference betwen rip saw and cross cut saw i mean on teeth


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Rip teeth are filed straight across the saw, perpendicular. They have usually have a more positive rake. The crosscut teeth are filed at an angle which is called fleam. The common fleam angle is 15 degrees. The teeth are filed every other one. Basically the rip teeth work like a chisel cutting with the grain and crosscut teeth act like knives slicing across the grain. This link is to the Woodwright's shop and Roy Underhill explains it pretty well. 
http://video.pbs.org/video/2365021491/


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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

BigBadBuford;525743 I was planning on taking it out to get sharpened but not sure if I should stick with the current setup or have it re-toothed to something more conventional.
...
The other saw is in nice shape - I'm planning on just having it sharpened with the current cross-cut setup. [/QUOTE said:


> I highly recommend learning to sharpen saws. I was terrified the first time I tried, and I was amazed how easy it is. These teeth might be a little smaller than is ideal (and the one with wonky teeth is definitely not ideal!) for your first saw, but you might want to give it a try. I've done a big rip saw (5 1/2 TPI), and a much smaller crosscut (about 12tpi), and now I've reset the teeth on a 12TPI backsaw. I can't sharpen the backsaw, because I can't figure out where I put my file. :laughing:
> 
> Rip saws are easy, but cross-cut aren't very hard. The important thing to remember is that it doesn't have to be perfect, just pretty good. A couple degrees of fleam on a ripsaw won't hurt anything, and if the teeth aren't all exactly the same height the saw will still cut. They should be close, but if one or two are a little shorter it's not going to hurt anything.
> 
> Pick a handsaw and give it a try. It can't hurt, and you might be surprised how easy it is. As a note: setting the teeth on the 12TPI backsaw took about 15 minutes. I expect sharpening it to take about the same, or maybe a little less, time. The saw I expect to take longest to sharpen is an 11 TPI panel saw, which has about 20 inches of blade. I'll be surprised if it takes more than 20 minutes to sharpen, and the same again to set.


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## nbo10 (Jan 26, 2011)

The teeth on the dovetail saw look like they came from a horror movie. 

So when teeth are re-cut, are they filed, or punched to form the shape?


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

nbo10 said:


> The teeth on the dovetail saw look like they came from a horror movie.
> 
> So when teeth are re-cut, are they filed, or punched to form the shape?


Either way depending on what you have. I file down then refile the new teeth if I have to go that far.


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## Azur Jahić (May 17, 2013)

Horor movie dont explai anything you can have chain saw on horor movie and than what kind of saw is chain saw .NOw we have a lo's of question.


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## Rob Brown (Jul 7, 2009)

*handsaws*

Just wondering what brand name saws are the most desirable for collecting.


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

The best thing that I have found about old handsaws is that they are still inexpensive enough that a person can collect them. Most people are still throwing them away, giving them away, or selling them at garage sales at very reasonable prices.

Gerry


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## Azur Jahić (May 17, 2013)

That is true but one is true again they are rustty and need to be cleaned polished if the saw is a realy clan as miror you can use it like squere miror i saw that at woodwright. Its like reflection and you can see other side of wood and then cut it without square. Can somebodey help me to figure out what is difference between rip and crosscut saw i am european and i use Bow saw at all woodworking parts. ANd this wooden hand grip saw look like the same to me.


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## Gilgaron (Mar 16, 2012)

Azur,

This link has some good explanations and pictures:

http://www.vintagesaws.com/library/primer/sharp.html

I've read that bow saws are most common in continental Europe and that back saws were an English and American thing for a while.


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## nbo10 (Jan 26, 2011)

Rob Brown said:


> Just wondering what brand name saws are the most desirable for collecting.


lets not encourage collecting. There is no reason to drive up the price of usable tools, just so that they call hang from a wall or sit on a shelf.


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## BigBadBuford (Jan 13, 2012)

Gerry KIERNAN said:


> The best thing that I have found about old handsaws is that they are still inexpensive enough that a person can collect them. Most people are still throwing them away, giving them away, or selling them at garage sales at very reasonable prices. Gerry


I ended up with an unintentional handsaw collection - I was trying to find a few decent users but at the sales around here they are always sold in lots but rarely bring big money. In trying to get two decent panels saws, a back saw and a dovetail saw I ended up with about 10 panel saws, half a dozen keyhole saws, a hacksaw and some other misc items. I think total outlay was less than $40. Most of them were Disstons or similar quality saws - so at least in this area (central PA) it is pretty easy to start a collection of good quality saws for not much money.


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