# Advice on expandable dining table



## swtnix (Feb 8, 2010)

Hello,
I'm new to woodworking except for a couple of years wood shop, a few years framing houses, and a couple years general contracting.
I've been lucky enough to come into a little money and was able to get some decent tools to fill my shop. For one of my first projects I would like to make a dining table that expands from 4' to 8' by using 2-24" leafs.
First, which extension slides?
http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=765
I imagine the 36" with 64" opening(steel)?
Second, I've read that the grains should go width instead of length when doing leaf tables to hide the seam. It seems to me it would be sturdier going length wise with a longer table.

I'm truly eager to learn, so any advice is appreciated.
the more I do the more I can justify the expense..lol


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## johnv51 (Oct 27, 2008)

If your going from 4' to 8' I don't recommend making it a pedestal table. I'm in the middle of a commission for a counter height table that opens from 5 to 8 feet and will be using 4 wood slides for added strength. As for grain, if your overhang remains the same then grain direction isn't that critical. Just make sure you take wood movement into consideration with your design.


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## swtnix (Feb 8, 2010)

I thought I might have to use more than 2. Would you go with the steel over the wood slides? I know they don't look as nice, but hopefully they won't be seen.
When you say wood movement what do you mean? expansion and contraction from humidity?
Thanks for your time.


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## wletson (Jan 11, 2010)

I'd think you would be more apt to have a two foot leaf become warped or something as time goes by. You also have to take into account that you're going to have to have a larger space to store the leaves when they aren't in use.

A dining room extending table seems like a pretty ambitious attempt for a beginning project.

Keep us up to date!


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## swtnix (Feb 8, 2010)

The storage for the leaves won't be a problem. In fact they won't take up anymore space than the folding card table we use now when we need more table space. 
As for the 2ft. leaves, I was basing my idea/plan on this article from finewoodworking.com
http://www.finewoodworking.com/ProjectsAndDesign/ProjectsAndDesignPDF.aspx?id=25257

They only difference is they only use one leaf. Which only allows for a 2 person expansion. My thinking was, with 2 leaves you could go from 4 to 6 to 8.

In the article he has the grain running width wise. He said it was to hide seams but do you think it helps with warping?


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## merc (Feb 6, 2010)

You should not have an isue with strength if each of your expansion your leaves are 24 inches wide. It looks like you will have a couple of splines under the leaf so that will surely add add enough of strength.
As far as grain direction most wooden tables run the grain length wise to give a pleasing aesthetic. But if the table opens and you insert a leaf or 2 you will distrupt the flow of the the grain. So orientating the wood so the grain is width wise is just so that inserting a leaf will help the grain to blend more easily.
Storing could be an issue unless you have a place that you can store them flat. I would recommend something like an attic or crawl space out of the way. Too many people that stand the extra leaf up behind a door find that the leaf has twisted, warp, or bowed when they take it out for Thanksgiving guests after sitting on edge fo a whole year.


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## frankp (Oct 29, 2007)

merc said:


> Too many people that stand the extra leaf up behind a door find that the leaf has twisted, warp, or bowed when they take it out for Thanksgiving guests after sitting on edge fo a whole year.


Our table looks exactly like the one the OP mentioned, but has a storage area built under the table for storing the leaves when they aren't being used. Works great and doesn't really get in the way of your legs. I was skeptical at first but I've never bumped my legs against the leaves when they are stored there.


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## mmwood_1 (Oct 24, 2007)

I just built a maple table this past Fall that was 64" long and expanded to 108" long with 2 leaves. It was 4 legs in the corners, no pedestal. I ran the grain cross-wise rather than lengthwise for several reasons. First off, I felt that running the grain length wise meant running the length of the grain across the SHORT span of the leaves. My experience with wood makes me think that this would be more susceptible to warping than if I ran it side to side on the leaves, since cupping seems to be the most common warpage I see. I used a 3" apron around the perimeter of the table, including on the leaves. This helps to stabilize the cupping factor. 
Another reason, was the fact that it was hard to find enough maple boards in 10' lengths which were sound the entire length. If I was going to run them length wise, I would want the grain to continue the full length when the leaves are in. Personal aesthetic.
I also felt that cupping could be a factor in all the boards because they would not be secured in the center area of the table. I believe that running them cross wise from apron to apron and securing them all along their widths would be much more likely to discourage cupping.
As for slides, you want to use the longest slide that will fit under the table when it's closed. The more of its full length that gets run out when fully extended, the less overlap of the channels you will have to support the center area. I have used wood slides in the past for shorter tables, but for this table, due to its length, I chose Watertown steel slides, the heaviest duty ones. They were spendy, just under $300 if I recall correctly. But they seemed to be okay and when assembled, worked fine. No detectable sag in the center. They also would open about 10 more inches than I needed, so that extra 10" was additional overlap of the channels, adding to the center support.


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## steveatkins (Feb 11, 2010)

great to see your getting involved in woodworking junior woodchuck, i also was a contractor for many years, but my focus is now woodworking from home, it is a great hobby!


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## swtnix (Feb 8, 2010)

Thanks for the advice, its nice to hear someone has already done it and I'm not trying something radical. I definitely plan on running the grain width-wise. I subscribed to finewoodworking website and they had a good article about making an expandable table. Here is what they said about grain:
"Run the grain widthwise—Most solid-wood tabletops are
made with the wood grain running lengthwise. On the top of
an extension table, however, the grain must run widthwise. That
way, when the top halves expand and contract with changes in
moisture content, the slides are less likely to become misaligned.
Plus, the seam is less visible. When edge-gluing stock for the
halves and the leaf, try to make sure that the face surfaces are
flush. Later, when flatness and uniform thickness really matter, you
won’t spend as much time getting the top and the leaf level."

I think it will definitely take more work to get the grains lined up and looking good. I purchased a few books like, "the complete illustrated guide to furniture/cabinet making" and "the complete guide to woodworking". Hopefully between that and advice from here I'll be on my way.
Projects in the chute:
bunk beds(Full size mat.)
Cabinet doors
Dining room table

Thanks folks for the help.


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## Daddy's Cool (Jul 12, 2010)

I have really enjoyed the little bit from this thread. Just joined the forum today.

We have wanted a new dining room table for a couple of years now, and the one that we have settled on is this one:

http://www.potterybarn.com/products/montego-turned-leg-square-table/?pkey=csquare-rectangular-tables

If you notice the price, it is definitely something to save up for. We started talking, and she is convinced that I can build us a table, for a whole lot less.

I built a high chair and a cradle when our first child was born back in 2006, along with some other little things along the way. I found plans for a dining room table that is similar in appearance to the one that we like, except that it is the traditional rectangle.

Is there anything special that I would need to consider in trying to convert the plans from a 30"x60" table to a 60"x60" table? 

The ambitious side of me is now thinking that I can make it an extension table as well, and basically have the table that we want, built by me, and hopefully for less money.

The link to the table at Fine Woodworking is great, because I love the idea of the custom made wood slides.

Anyway, any tips or advice that you can throw out there is much appreciated.

Upcoming projects:
Dining Room Table
Book case for toys and books in the play area
Potentially, bunk beds a couple of years down the road


Matthew


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## Daddy's Cool (Jul 12, 2010)

frankp said:


> Our table looks exactly like the one the OP mentioned, but has a storage area built under the table for storing the leaves when they aren't being used. Works great and doesn't really get in the way of your legs. I was skeptical at first but I've never bumped my legs against the leaves when they are stored there.


Can you further explain, or show pictures, of how this under table storage works?


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## Huba (Oct 22, 2010)

Hi,
I have a dining room table with a butterfly leaf that has been "closed" without the leaf in use for three years. Now despite several attempts by several strong men, we can't get it to open more than a couple of inches. I know that there are several things I can use to lubricate it once I get it open so that this won't happen again, but none of those solutions help with the current issue of not being able to get it open. My husband wants to use a spreading tool, but I am concerned that will damage the table top.


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