# Coping crown molding



## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

I have little experience doing crown molding and do not have a lot of extra molding for this job. I have done coping before and was happy with it.

Most of what I have done was simple profiles in soft material and was being painted, so a bit of caulk was used.

I have a good miter saw, with a nice sharp blade and do ok with measuring the angles. This is a 60 degree corner, so the cope will be 30 degrees, if that makes a difference.

I am looking at this molding and thinking it may be difficult to work with? For inside corners might I be better to just miter them?? I only have 2 inside corners.

I have a friend who is a real trim carpenter but do not know the next time he will be in FL? May be a long wait.

Thanks JIm Master mistaker


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

I wouldn't worry about the angle if you are coping. It doesn't matter. If you feel more comfortable with mitering it, and can get a good fit, do that.








 







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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

Thanks Cabinetman, I am surprised you are the only responder! If you were doing this for yourself would you miter or cope?? This is in the kitchen at the top of the wall cabinets.
JIm


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

jjrbus said:


> Thanks Cabinetman, I am surprised you are the only responder! If you were doing this for yourself would you miter or cope?? This is in the kitchen at the top of the wall cabinets.
> JIm


Here's what I'm thinking. Using a coping saw or a jig saw, that profile is fairly intricate. I would likely cope it, as I've done that many times and am comfortable with the handwork.

But, if you can get a good measure, use a miter saw, that would be quick and clean. Here's a little tip that I use to get an exact measure. On a sample, I cut the miter off on one end...lets say the right end, and I measure back a number that's easy to remember...like 10", and cut it off square. Then, when I want to get a measure for the overall length to the miter, I place my little jig and make a mark where it ends on the wall. I then measure from the other end and add 10" to the length...a hair heavy...and that will be the cut. The most it might need is just a skim pass for a fit.

Here's another little tip. I don't usually cut crown flat on the miter saw table. Keeping track which side is up or down takes too much time. And then figuring for spring angles is for the birds. What I do is set my miter for 45°. Then I stand the moulding up just like it would be on a cabinet...bottom on the table, the top tipped towards me so the back bottom touches the fence, like it was the cabinet. I insert a wedge behind to keep the moulding from moving, and just cut the 45. Here's another way...
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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

Thanks for the response Cabinetman. I will try to cope it, I was not even sure it was copable. Copable is that a word?? 

JIm


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## mako1 (Jan 25, 2014)

That will be a chore the cope in oak unless you have some experience.Before you cope,take a pencil and darken the edge you will cope.Gives you a better line to go by.
I do most of my coping with a jigsaw these days but it's a very smooth high end jigsaw.


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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

Thanks for the input on this. I misread something and did the first cut wrong. I just can't cope with it. I am using some closeout stock and do not have much room for error or I wood try again. 

Very few errors would send me off to buy new molding, so will stick with what I have a better idea of doing. As long as I take my time and pay attention I can do the miters.
Thanks JIm


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## Tite-n-Right (Jul 4, 2014)

jjrbus, you did not specify if you were putting the crown tight against the ceiling. If it is hanging from the top of the cabinet you can miter then glue and put a brad in the back side to hold it together. If you are not able to get behind it I would recommend coping every time. If you are unsure of your steady hand you could cope close but not right on the edge and then get out your files to finish it. Make sure you cope beyond the 30 degrees though. I always cope past the actual angle to make sure it will not get in the way, there is no good reason not to.


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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

I have the bulk of my crown molding done with no mistakes. The pressure is off on running out of my close out molding, so can experiment coping the last inside corner.

My first attempt at coping this molding came out well for a 90° corner. A bit of filing and it would have been very good.

My corner is an inside 60°. I have searched the web a bit and most instructions are for a 90° inside corner.

This molding is at the top of the cabinets, with no space available behind it.

What would be the right angle to miter the molding for coping??

Thanks JIm


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

jjrbus said:


> I have the bulk of my crown molding done with no mistakes. The pressure is off on running out of my close out molding, so can experiment coping the last inside corner.
> 
> My first attempt at coping this molding came out well for a 90° corner. A bit of filing and it would have been very good.
> 
> ...


How did you wind up with a 60° inside corner? What was the layout? Actually when backcutting, it's only the front edge touching the other moulding, so, as long as there is no bulk behind the coped cut, it will fit.




















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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

Thanks for the response. It is difficult to get a good picture with such a small piece. It fits a 90° corner but opens up on the 60°?

My wife is very short, so I made the cabinet so she could reach some of the shelves.


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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

The door is off as I try to repair the bubbles! JIm


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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

I was up and down the ladder, my legs were starting to hurt. As usual after some hand work my hands were cramping up. So I said the heck with it. As much as I would have liked to cope it. I mitered it! Gitter done!! Thanks for the input. JIm


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## terjod19 (Jul 16, 2014)

I had a similar circumstance when doing my kitchen and found the 22.5 degree cut worked wonderfully in those spots. Then again, with a little caulk. With natural wood (that looks great by the way), I'm glad you were able to figure it out.


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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

No reason to cope that. Coping is generally when you are dealing with sheetrock. When you nail crown up on sheetrock it is possible for the SR to pull in. With a miter that is bad news. With a cope the movement won't matter if you are nailing in the proper sequence. With absolute corners such as you have on cabinets and woodwork there is no need to worry about movement and therefore no need to cope.


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## jjrbus (Dec 6, 2009)

Thanks for the replies. A cope, like a dovetail seems to be held in higher regard. I liked the challenge and wanted the experience of coping it. But at some point I had to cry uncle and move on. JIm


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## 9poundhammer (May 6, 2013)

Here's a source I found a few years ago. I saved the links on my phone so I can refer to them if I ever run into trouble in the field. 

http://www.altereagle.com/Crown_molding.html

And

http://www.altereagle.com/2_Crown_moldin.html

I've found that coping almost always turns out the best results. Take a run to a local lumber yard and buy some practice material to master the method. Good luck


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

9pound, your links didn't work, thanks for trying.


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## 9poundhammer (May 6, 2013)

Copy and paste them into your phone (or computer's) browser. I checked the links before I posted them. They are still good. Try these:

http://www.altereagle.com/Crown_molding.html

And

http://www.altereagle.com/2_Crown_moldin.html

Hopefully they will work now.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

BigJim said:


> 9pound, your links didn't work, thanks for trying.


Both links work for me.


















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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

Me too. I put the word document for the second chart in my phone.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Still didn't work for me, but when I copy and paste in a new tab it works. Must be this blame computer that is just about on it's last leg. :smile:


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

9poundhammer said:


> Copy and paste them into your phone (or computer's) browser. I checked the links before I posted them. They are still good. Try these:
> 
> http://www.altereagle.com/Crown_molding.html
> 
> ...


I tried again and they do work, thanks for the link, it should help many of the folks who need to understand how to cut ceiling mold.


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## 9poundhammer (May 6, 2013)

Anytime guys. Work safe out there!


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## Tite-n-Right (Jul 4, 2014)

jjrbus said:


> Thanks for the replies. A cope, like a dovetail seems to be held in higher regard. I liked the challenge and wanted the experience of coping it. But at some point I had to cry uncle and move on. JIm


Don't worry about it. As was said earlier, when applying crown to cabinets, miters are just fine (as long as they are perfectly accurate). Just remember to glue all your miters and apply brads wherever possible (both help to keep your pieces in place).


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## JackFlack (Aug 24, 2014)

*Large MDF Coping*

Question... we are looking to use six and a quarter inch MDF MOLDING to crown a ceiling.. is it better to cope the inside corners.. or will mitering work just as well?
Just wondering if the size of the molding determines when to cope and when to miter ?


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

For me it depended on the profile of the trim, there was one ceiling mold that took for ever to cope so we just mitered it. For me the advantage of coping was the tightness of the joint and less chance the joint would open up when heat was applied. Also with a cope, you can be a little long and it will look like it grew there, with a miter joint you have to be dead on. As matter fact you want the trim to be just a little long so it will crowd in, with a cope cut.


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## JackFlack (Aug 24, 2014)

*To Backer Board or Not?*

Thank you BigJim... second question... when using the large, 6.25 inch, crown molding... I am prepping to add Backer Board... 2X4 ripped to match the spring angle... leaving a 1/4 inch gap between backer and crown.

From what I have read this is the best idea if we want no future shifting to cause cracks in joints... would you agree or what is your advice?

Much aligned, - Jack F.


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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

Shoot the lower section of the crown into the stud and the upper into the backer. I've never used a backer and never had a problem.


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## Road rider (Jan 29, 2012)

JackFlack said:


> Thank you BigJim... second question... when using the large, 6.25 inch, crown molding... I am prepping to add Backer Board... 2X4 ripped to match the spring angle... leaving a 1/4 inch gap between backer and crown. From what I have read this is the best idea if we want no future shifting to cause cracks in joints... would you agree or what is your advice? Much aligned, - Jack F.


I've used the backer before ... Cut the angle on the 2x4 then cut 6" lengths and nailed them 16" on center ...


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Leo G said:


> Shoot the lower section of the crown into the stud and the upper into the backer. I've never used a backer and never had a problem.


+1...


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