# Plane restore round 4



## Dave Paine

Today I received my recent EBay purchases, an incomplete No 5 and a No 7.

Earlier I purchases a No 5C with broken casting as a parts plane, so I will be using parts for this to complete the latest smooth bottom No 5.

These are pictures straight after unpacking.

Front view.









Rear view. Large size adjustment wheel, frog adjuster. Most hardware missing, except for the toe screw. Handy, the other No 5 parts plane was missing its toe screw. :icon_smile:









Bottom view. Some pitting on the side about 3/4 the way to the right at the location of the tote.

The bottom looks like it has been used to plane painted wood.









I am not sure how much of the jappaning remains. Only time will tell after the rust removal step.

Saving this since I need another post so I can add the pictures of the No 7.


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## Phaedrus

I am standing by to watch the transformation. If I had cable TV, I would have already canceled it. Watching Dave restore planes is the only entertainment I need!

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Woodworking Talk


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## Dave Paine

*The No 7*

The pictures of the No. 7.

I hope there is a special place in Hedes for the folks who drill holes in the soles of planes. This person deserves to be sent TWICE for drilling holes in either end. :furious:

The red knob reminds me of a clowns nose. I am thinking this is not original and likely came off a plane where the knob was painted red.

The red has to go. The tote is loose, but does not appear cracked. Only time will tell if it can be cleaned up and used.

Overall looks like superficial rust, not as bad as my other restored planes.

Front view.









Rear view. I note the rubber adjustment wheel. If original, this would infer WWII model.

For the hand plane experts, would you leave the rubber adjustment wheel, or replace with brass? Just curious.









The components, no surprises so far.









The bottom. Other than the holes, not in bad shape.









The blade and cap iron. The blade looks to have been sharpened a long time ago. This may just be wear over the decades.









I am glad EricD posted about oxalic acid. This puppy needs a big bath. :laughing:

Thanks for looking.

Stay tuned for updates.


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## Dave Paine

Phaedrus said:


> I am standing by to watch the transformation. If I had cable TV, I would have already canceled it. Watching Dave restore planes is the only entertainment I need!
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Woodworking Talk


LOL. Thanks. :laughing::laughing:


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## Dave Paine

*First update*

I cleaned up the sole of the No. 5 with hand cleaner and wet-dry paper. The crud/paint/whatever came off easily.

I was able to get the hardware unscrewed, except for the screw for the adjustment wheel and the pin for the Y lever. Going to see if I can get these out after the soak in Evapo-Rust.

The frog support in the casting has the "Y" pattern so a later design.

All the No. 5 steel pieces are now sitting in the Evapo-Rust.

The No. 7 was easily dis-assembled. I have not tried to remove the adjustment wheel screw of the pin for the Y lever.

Looks like the frog and casting were painted in a dull dark blue colour, so this will need to be removed.

I answered my question about the rubber wheel. The wheel is kaput. The rubber part has dried over the years and just spins. I was able to easily remove the metal sleeve. So looks like a brass wheel will need to be used.

I wondered if the blade was the correct length. Turns out this puppy has been sharpened A LOT. I happened to pick up rusty a 2 3/8in blade and cap iron at my local flea market. Planning ahead in case I purchased another No. 6 or No. 7. The rust cleaned up without problems. This blade is at least 1in longer than the one in the plane, so looks like I will be using it.

The screws for the knob and the tote were single piece steel. I expect this was WWII style due to brass being in short supply due to the war effort.

Now I need to find or make a container which will hold the No. 7 casting for the rust removal step.

Thanks for looking.

Stay tuned for more updates.


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## bigg081

Great thread Dave. Im learning alot about the restoration process. Keep it coming.


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## Dominick

Yea thanks Dave. I'm excited to see the outcome.


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## nbo10

Dave, you are a machine. Looking forward to the pics that follow.


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## timetestedtools

nice work Dave. I've never seen one of the rubber adjusters that went bad before. They usually clean up well.


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## Joeb41

Thanks for your inspiration Dave. I have an E Bay # 5 that's been on the shelf for about a year. Time to start on it.


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## Dave Paine

Thanks for the replies. I am pleased if the thread assists others, and especially if it inspires someone to work on a restore. :thumbsup:


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## Shop Dad

Good work on these planes Dave. You know though that now we will expect to see some hand tool projects!


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## Dave Paine

Shop Dad said:


> Good work on these planes Dave. You know though that now we will expect to see some hand tool projects!


Well, this is a hand tool, and I can attest that the restoration is a project, and involves a lot of elbow grease, so I am claiming this for my class credit. :laughing::laughing:


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## Dave Paine

*Latest update*

I am feeling the pressure to provide new content to keep Phaedrus awake. :laughing:

Today I removed the No 5 casting and frog from the Evapo-Rust.

As I expected the jappaning was shot. What remained easily came off with just a screw driver.

I do not have a sand blaster at home - yet, so for the moment it is a combination of paint remover, wire brush, hand sanding, more scraping etc.

The picture at this angle does not show how good the detail in the words "BAILEY", "MADE IN U.S.A." and "No 5" looks. These will stand out after painting.









A view of the bottom. The sole has not been lapped at this time. I have just used wet-dry paper by hand to remove the patina from the oxalic acid. A number of marks from the rust, but these will not detract from using the plane once the restoration is completed.









A view of the bottom and right side. The pitting does not show up as much in the picture, but it is still present.









This is the first restoration where I have not been able to remove the pin for the Y lever or the screw for the adjustment wheel. I prefer to remove if possible to confirm all hardware can be removed.

This will not affect future use, just a dent in my pride. 

I am presently working on the new knob. This plane had no knob or tote, so both will be new.

I have a piece of walnut on the lathe. I like to have the same species for knob and tote, so looking like both will be walnut.

The knob piece had some nice grain, but also a knot and a crack. I was hoping to be able to salvage. So far, fingers crossed, I may be able to get a decent knob.

On the No. 7 front, the components are soaking in oxalic acid. I was able to find a container of sufficient size to fit the casting.

The rust is very light.

I have not yet tried to remove the awful red paint on the knob. So I do not yet know if this will be a cleanup or a new knob.

Thanks for looking.

Stay tuned for updates.


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## timetestedtools

chuck that baby in the drill press and sand away.


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## Chris Curl

dave, sorry, but i have to ask ... are you retired?

i mean, you seem to have so much more time than i do for these fun things! how do you do it?

i got my rust bucket planes weeks ago and they are STILL just sitting there. in the meantime, you have restored 2 planes.

your ability to stay focused on this stuff is an inspiration.

like mr shop dad, i'd love to see you do a project where the task involves USING them to make something.

but i understand how the focus on the tools (not using them to make stuff) can be an easy trap to tall into ... :thumbsup:


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## Dave Paine

Chris Curl said:


> dave, sorry, but i have to ask ... are you retired?
> 
> i mean, you seem to have so much more time than i do for these fun things! how do you do it?


Shhh! Some things need to be kept secret. 

I have a lot of unfinished projects, but at present I am feeling energized to get these puppies restored for a second life.

In another forum Paul posted about being in a shop slump. I know the feeling.

The mallet swap was a big motivator for me, and at present the plane restorations are a big motivator, so just going with where my energy wants to go. :icon_smile:


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## Dave Paine

*Check your blades*

The No. 7 components are out of the oxalic acid. Cleaned up as expected.

The No. 7 casting and frog appear to have been painted. Since this may be a WW II unit, not sure if this was factory or a later event.

I am going to need to remove the existing paint and re-apply.

For others who are restoring or plan to restore, the No. 7 had a very short blade. I mentioned earlier, but now have a comparison picture.

The Stanley vintage plane blades had a piece of hardened steel pressed into the blade. This would have been removed a long time ago in the short blade, which would mean the blade would not stay sharp, and so would need to be sharpened often.

I am feeling happy I picked up the blade and cap iron at my local flea market.

Lesson is that if you see parts in a flea market, grab them. The price of parts on EBay is outrageous.









This was my first plane with a rubber adjustment wheel. I put the steel insert in the oxalic acid just to see what it looked like.

You can see the serrations on the insert. Very fine. The rubber lost its mating serrations and so it was just spinning. Also looks to have warped over time.

Looking at the insert, the internal threads stop about 2/3 just before the serrated section. I am thinking about turning a wooden replacement. May be good for a back-up wheel.









Now back to working on the knob and tote for the No. 5.

Thanks for looking.


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## bigg081

Dave its looking absolutely awesome. This thread will be my go to when I get to restore my first plane. You must be able to read minds....walnut is one of my favorite woods!!!


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## Dave Paine

bigg081 said:


> Dave its looking absolutely awesome. This thread will be my go to when I get to restore my first plane. You must be able to read minds....walnut is one of my favorite woods!!!


I am following in the footsteps of many others.

Adding some more links for the folks who are or will be doing a restore.

Timetestedtools (Don) has a blog on hand plane restoration. Well worth reading. Don has done a lot more restorations.

here is my complete restoration blog. http://timetestedtools.wordpress.com...re-the-dw-way/

EricD has a thread about using oxalic acid, aka wood bleach instead of Evapo-Rust. It is less expensive and does a good job.

Oxalic Acid Rust Removal for old Plane Restoration

Dominick has a good thread on using electrolysis. Within the thread is a useful video. Only consider this for parts where you want to remove the jappaning, the paint coating. Also only for iron or steel.

Removing rust with electrolysis.


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## MasterSplinter

Love seeing your work. You have motivated me on restoring my lot.


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## Dave Paine

MasterSplinter said:


> Love seeing your work. You have motivated me on restoring my lot.


Thanks, this is my desire, to inspire someone to either pick up a plane they would have thought was beyond saving, or to have someone get the planes they own back in working order. :thumbsup:

I was able to inspire a local friend who is not a forum member to give me his fathers Stanley No. 4 to tune up. The plane had been well maintained over the decades, just needed to lap the sole and sharpen the blade, it was dull from use.

My friend is a woodworker, but this is his only plane. I am hoping that once he starts using this he will "see the light" and get more planes. I know they can help in his wood working projects.


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## timetestedtools

I believe it is a gene mutation that drives the desire to restore old to new. If your restores don't stir any desire, the mutation just is not present.


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## Dave Paine

timetestedtools said:


> I believe it is a gene mutation that drives the desire to restore old to new. If your restores don't stir any desire, the mutation just is not present.


LOL. Well said. :laughing:


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## Dave Paine

No more pictures today. Woodworking was interrupted by "life" as in the wife waking up thinking today was Valentine's Day and insisting we go out for lunch today since she has plans for tomorrow.

So the afternoon was not a woodwork time slot today.

I did pick up some new paint remover. It is winter in Eastern PA so not warm enough to plan on working outside with nasty paint remover fumes.

Picked up a low fume semi-paste and tried it on the No. 7 frog.

This material turns white when is has finished its action. The paint can be removed, but needs elbow grease. The rough surface of the castings do not help.

Tomorrow I will try this on the main casting of the No. 7. If this does not remove all the paint, I will have to ask a friend to take this into work for sand blasting.

Tomorrow will be completing the knob for the No. 5 and making the new tote and perhaps painting the casting and frog.

Thanks for looking and stay tuned for the next update.


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## Dave Paine

*Character ir defect?*

Not much progress on the No. 5 today. I was distracted by working on another plane.

I did get to finish a knob, but now I need to get feedback on the piece.

This is a question mostly for big081 since I promised he had first refusal on this No. 5.

The piece of walnut I used for the knob had a knot. This is a mixed blessing since it can add character, but also have cracks.

I tried to position the crack so that it would be removed as I turned, but the crack was deeper than I expected.

I added CA glue to the crack to try and make this stable, but as I expected, the CA become a dark line.

So big0801, do you feel this is character, or a defect?

Honest question, no problem either way. If you feel a defect, I just make another knob and find a home for this one.









The knob has not had a finish at this time, just sanded to a fine grit.


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## Phaedrus

I am of the mind that the crack, if stable, is just one of those magical cosmetic details that the wood can give. I would keep it as long as it isn't going to negatively impact the integrity of the knob.

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Woodworking Talk


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## bigg081

I agree with Phaedrus. Its absolutely character. If there is no worry of the knob failing then I say leave it. I love the flaws in wood, even highlight them.


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## Shop Dad

All I have to say is if it looks that good without a finish that will be an awesome knob. Total score bigg! :thumbsup:


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## Dave Paine

Shop Dad said:


> All I have to say is if it looks that good without a finish that will be an awesome knob. Total score bigg! :thumbsup:


The pen folks use micro mesh in fine grits.

I like the EEE-UltraShine. This applied by hand/finger, then buffed off on the lathe. It does improve the surface of the piece prior to the finish.

http://www.packardwoodworks.com/Mer...ct_Code=124904&Category_Code=finish-shellawax


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## bigg081

Shop Dad said:


> All I have to say is if it looks that good without a finish that will be an awesome knob. Total score bigg! :thumbsup:


Oh yes:thumbsup:. Im only worried about his hourly rate!!! So much work goes into the restoration. Ive never done a restoration of my own so Im in awe of the process and time consumption. 

Dave....dont make it TOO perfect. I want to use it!!!


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## Dave Paine

bigg081 said:


> Dave....dont make it TOO perfect. I want to use it!!!


No worries, the sole will show the "heritage" of this puppy. :laughing:

I can always switch to using one of the broken totes and tape the pieces together with duct tape, then paint the sole with fluorescent paint. Do you prefer lime green or putrid purple? :laughing:


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## bigg081

Dave Paine said:


> No worries, the sole will show the "heritage" of this puppy. :laughing:
> 
> I can always switch to using one of the broken totes and tape the pieces together with duct tape, then paint the sole with fluorescent paint. Do you prefer lime green or putrid purple? :laughing:


Uhhhh.....Ill go with super awesome nice. LOL


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## Dave Paine

*Blue man group time*

This is only the second time I needed to paint a plane, but already know that I have to do this for the No. 7

For the folks looking to understand the details, I am providing the pictures of how I prepare the frog and casting for paint.

In this case the jappaning easily came off with a screwdriver, brass brush, a bit of sanding.

I then wipe down all the surfaces with acetone to remove dust and any oil residues from my hands.

Then the fun part - Blue Man Group time. Protecting all the surfaces which I do not want to be painted. I expect Stanley painted first then machined. I do not have the luxury.

I use a piece of 2in masking tape along each side, then carefully fold over, cut off against the casting.

For the machined areas I cut small pieces then cut off excess with Xacto knife.

I happen to like the blue masking tape for my general woodwork. This stuff can take being clamped and still come off without tearing or leaving residue. More expensive than the crappy beige stuff, but worth it for my needs.









All holes are plugged with small pieces of paper towel twisted and then pushed into place with a small screwdriver.









I am presently on the second coat of the paint.

Timetestedtools (Don) recommended Dupli-Color Semi-Gloss Engine Enamel, Ford Black. A very good recommendation.

This goes on bare metal, several coats each about 12 minutes apart to get a nice thick finish. Relative low odor.

Stay tuned for the later "after" pictures.


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## bigg081

WOW blood is pumping!!! These planes must be a labor of love for you. I really enjoy doing tedious projects....I just tend to do them trial and error. Thus woodworking is great for me.


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## Phaedrus

I see you opted against the lime green and purple

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Woodworking Talk


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## Dave Paine

bigg081 said:


> WOW blood is pumping!!! These planes must be a labor of love for you. I really enjoy doing tedious projects....I just tend to do them trial and error. Thus woodworking is great for me.


What gave away my secret.


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## bigg081

It's clear that your obsessed. Way clear! Nothing wrong with that. That feeling we all get is why we do this craft. Obsession is a good thing...well sometimes.


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## Dave Paine

*After painting*

The after painting and removal of the masking tape and clearing the holes pictures. 

I like to remove the tape after the paint is dry to the touch but while the edge is still flexible.

Nice new paint. Right side.









Front. I did run the paint side to side, but somehow the darned hollow in the "Y" of the frog support managed to not get fully painted. I did not notice when the paint was wet. Drat. First time painting a "Y" frog support. Lesson learned.









The lettering stands out better than it shows in the pictures, likely due to using flash. I pushed the levels in this zoomed in portion of the picture to highlight the lettering.









The left side, just to remind you this is a user. The scar from rust pitting. The rust has been removed, but the scar of the pitting remains. This is something we have to accept with restorations and view as part of the history of the tool.









Thanks for looking.

Now to apply finish to the knob and start on the tote.


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## timetestedtools

Dave, your detail is great. A a word to the wise. If you're using Dupli-color, you *never* want to touch up a spot like Dave missed for 7 days. It will make the rest bubble, and it is a bitch to remove. I've never personally done it, but I've received numerous "What do I do now" emails. That's what prompted the warning in my blog.


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## Shop Dad

Nice and shiny! Looks great Dave. It's always amazing to see what's underneath an old rust bucket just waiting to be released. Excellent job.


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## Dave Paine

timetestedtools said:


> Dave, your detail is great. A a word to the wise. If you're using Dupli-color, you *never* want to touch up a spot like Dave missed for 7 days. It will make the rest bubble, and it is a bitch to remove. I've never personally done it, but I've received numerous "What do I do now" emails. That's what prompted the warning in my blog.


Thanks for the reminder, I had intended to mention this, but then obviously forgot. :thumbsup:

The paint instructions also mention this, but too easy to either not see due to the very fine print, or forget.

The paint coats bond together in what is called cross-linking. The manufacturer states this takes 7 days to complete.

So I either will need to wait 7 days, or figure out a plan "B" for the small spot I missed.


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## MasterSplinter

Fantastic job.


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## timetestedtools

I know Dave. 7 days is a Looonnnggg time to watch paint dry when you just want to finish it.


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## gadabout

I'm still trying to figure out where the missed spot is.

I like the way that black paint came out. I'm thinking about using this to refinish an old Mitchell spinning reel.


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## Dave Paine

gadabout said:


> I'm still trying to figure out where the missed spot is.
> 
> I like the way that black paint came out. I'm thinking about using this to refinish an old Mitchell spinning reel.


I have a closeup of the missed spot. It is the middle of the frog support.

Even though I sprayed end to end with 4 coats, it seems this depression managed to avoid getting painted. I needed to spray directly into the depression. Drat.









This is a very nice paint to apply. Goes on easily, just read the directions about 10 minutes between coats and no more coats than you can apply in 1 hour, then wait 7 days if you need further coats.

Many colours so you should be able to find one you like.

Available on-line or at auto-parts stores like AdvanceAuto.


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## bigg081

Dave you have yet again impressed. Each step is so meticulous and precise. Great job.


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## Dave Paine

*Working on the tote*

I posted about finding the Stanley handle template drawings last year.

Timetestedtools added a link to his blog where he has comprehensive pictures and steps.

http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f11/stanley-plane-handle-template-42492/

If you have an existing tote, it may be better to use this since there was a lot more variation in tote sizes and hole angles than you may realize.

In this case I have cut off a piece of a board and I am trying to get most of the grain pattern into the tote, so not as easy as laying the existing tote parallel to an edge.

I have cut this piece so the left and right edges are parallel.

I like the green masking tape for drawing lines since it is much easier to see the lines than my blue tape.

Since I am using an existing tote from another similar plane, I place this in the area I have established as the best grain pattern for the tote. Draw around the tote.

The detail you may not appreciate, is that you should also mark where the hole starts and stops.









I then draw in the lines for the screw hole. Taking the pictures after the work was done so I have already done the next step.









Next step is to use an engineering square to draw lines at right angles to the screw hole. I will then be using my mitre gauge on the table saw to determine the cut angle so that I am able to place the piece flat on the table saw and the hole lines and starting point should be vertical.









This is actually my second attempt. A detail I overlooked the first time was to double check my screw hardware.

I was going to use a screw and nut from a No. 5 parts plane which had a broken casting, and tote. I did not appreciate, this was a bit of a hack job and someone had used a No. 4 screw in the No. 5 tote. You may not appreciate, but a No. 4 screw is about 1/2in shorter than a No. 5. They had drilled a deeper hole in the tote. Being in two pieces I was not going to use it and shame on me for not paying attention.

This time using the correct screw and nut for a No. 5. Double checking that the outline will fit the hardware.









Now off to cut the sides for drilling and then drill the hole.

I have a long enough drill bit, but I do not have sufficient quill travel to be able to drill in one pass. So I either need to move the table, or flip the piece.

Timetestedtools flips the piece. If you do this, ensure the same side is facing you for both drilling passes.

Thanks for looking.


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## timetestedtools

There is another advantage to flipping the piece. You can ensure the hole goes in and comes out in the correct spot. Its pretty easy to get off just a little drilling straight through. A 1/4" hole has enough spare room so if your off slightly in the center of the tote, nobody will ever know, maybe not even you. If your off at either end though, its not so good.


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## bigg081

Dave This is going to be my go to for restoring planes in the future. I think you are putting so much detail that I may not even have to ask questions. LOL Who am I kidding! I ask questions like a kindergartener....why why why...how how how!?!?!


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## Dave Paine

Several steps to get to this picture, but trying to summarize.

I cut the top and bottom per my layout lines on the mitre saw.

I then clamped to the drill table fence. I did drill and then flip as Timetestedtools mentioned. I then drilled the 7/16in hole for the screw.

Finally I drilled 1in holes for the two curves. Timetestedtools uses the bandsaw. My blade does not make this turn so I drilled. I found it saves me time on the sanding phase.

Not shown is my confirming that the screw and nut fit in the tote and have enough protrusion at the bottom.









Next step is to cut out on the bandsaw. I leave the lines so that I can later sand to the lines. This ensures I am able to remove any bandsaw blade marks.









I sanded with a 1in spindle roll on the drill press. I have a Rigid Oscillating Spindle/Belt sander, but found the drill press works.

I have pictures, but no room in this post.

Next step is pucker-up time. Routing the sides. This is the step I am most concerned, since it has the biggest potential for "Murphy" to cause a hiccup and perhaps loose the piece.

Murphy did not interrupt today, happy to say. :thumbsup:

The roughed out shape.









Next steps is sanding. I hate sanding. A combination of hand sanding, a "mop" sander on the drill press.

Finally a coat of EEE-Ultra-Shine which is intended for lathes, since I could not mount on the lathe I buffed out on the drill press.

Drum roll please. Note these are not finished, just nice and shiny from the EEE-Ultra-Shine. The EEE-Ultra-Shine did a great job in popping the grain in the tote. I am pleasantly surprised. In the original board I was trying to find a nice grain pattern, but in the rough state, I did not know it would look this nice. Maybe time for me to change my mind. :laughing:

The grain on the knob looks better than the picture.

One side. Tiny spot of sap showing on the foot in this side.









The other side.









*Bigg081*, I think I will leave the knob and tote for you to apply the finish. You can decide hard vs soft finish, wax, oil or poly, etc.

It takes me longer to make a tote than to turn a knob. It is easy to see why folks who are trying to "flip" vintage hand planes on EBay want to leave existing broken knobs and totes as-is. Doing justice to the tool takes time, patience, and small but pretty pieces of wood.

Now onto sharpening a blade.

Thanks for looking.


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## Dominick

Very nice Dave. Looks like the same piece that came from my mallet. Nice figure to it.


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## Dave Paine

Dominick said:


> Very nice Dave. Looks like the same piece that came from my mallet. Nice figure to it.


Hello Dominick, glad to see you back on the threads. :thumbsup:

Good eye. Different board, but the same tree. A section of the board from the main trunk close to branches.

I pulled out 4 boards to find one which had the potential for some interesting grain. Another board looked better, but I was not going to cut a 10ft board in two to get a 6in piece.

This piece was at the end of the last piece I pulled out of my storage rack. I was happy I did not need to continue. Other pieces were more buried.


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## Dominick

Yea it is good to be back on. I feel like I missed a lot when I was gone. I like the way you shaped the handle. Nice touch!!!


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## preacherman

Looking great! Thanks for that visual on the handle. I needed that. I have to get to work on my No 4 that I questioned you about. I still have not found the time to get it cleaned up.
Also how thick is the stock for that tote?


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## Dave Paine

preacherman said:


> Looking great! Thanks for that visual on the handle. I needed that. I have to get to work on my No 4 that I questioned you about. I still have not found the time to get it cleaned up.
> Also how thick is the stock for that tote?


I am happy if this gets you working on your plane. :thumbsup:

The tote was made from 4/4 rough stock and ended up at 7/8in thick. The stock tote is more curved on the side, max width is 15/16in.


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## bigg081

Finishing is easy. I think a poly would be best but I really don't know. Shellac is to brittle I would think. What are your recommendations? 
Again this thread is amazing!


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## Chris Curl

dave, how thick a piece do you start with for the tote?


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## timetestedtools

Chris, I won't answer for Dave, but I like 1" to start, but 15/16" is about the minimum.


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## Chris Curl

bigg081 said:


> Finishing is easy. I think a poly would be best but I really don't know. Shellac is to brittle I would think. What are your recommendations?
> Again this thread is amazing!


i am thinking something like a oil/varnish mix would be good ... equal parts BLO, satin poly, and turp ... 3-4 coats ... ?


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## Dave Paine

timetestedtools said:


> Chris, I won't answer for Dave, but I like 1" to start, but 15/16" is about the minimum.


I would have preferred to be at 15/16in. In this case I was going for the grain. The section of board was not flat, so I lost some thickness getting it flat. Since it was rough sawn, then I had saw marks on the other side.

So by the time I removed the marks and got the piece looking as desired, I was down to 7/8in. A bit of a trade off for some nice figure.

In other cases I have used thicker stock and was able to end up with 1in thick.

I looked at one of my 5/4 walnut boards, but this was a board where the only good figure was in the middle of a 10ft board and I was not wanting to cut this puppy in two for a few inch section.


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## Dave Paine

bigg081 said:


> Finishing is easy. I think a poly would be best but I really don't know. Shellac is to brittle I would think. What are your recommendations?


Finishing small pieces like this is easy. It can just take time to allow coats to set before applying the next coat, especially for Boiled Linseed Oil.

I do not feel shellac is too brittle. I feel it is good for applications where the piece will not be exposed to standing water.

You need to decide
a) Hard finish - one which will need to be re-sanded if scratched and need to re-apply.
Examples. Poly, Lacquer, Boiled Linseed Oil, Tru-Oil

b) Soft finish - one which can be re-applied without sanding.
Examples. Shellac, oil, wax.

Take a look in the Woodturning forum. Most of the turnings posted have comments on the type of finish which was used.


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## timetestedtools

> I think a poly would be best but I really don't know. Shellac is to brittle I would think. What are your recommendations?


For rosewood (and similar), I like straight wax, I've used straight blo a lot. I probably use BLO/Wax the most. For my users I tend to stick with oil, but if you're looking for a more shiny look, Chris's 3-2-1 mix is probably the best. For the NY tools #4 I used the 3-2-1 mix.


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## bigg081

I didn't think about the 3-2-1. I always thin my poly 50/50. Just goes on so much smoother. Maybe takes a extra coat or two but its worth it.


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## Dave Paine

bigg081 said:


> I didn't think about the 3-2-1. I always thin my poly 50/50. Just goes on so much smoother. Maybe takes a extra coat or two but its worth it.


Sound good. :thumbsup:

If you want to see how it looked on Don's New York Toolworks No. 4, scroll down to post #20 in my earlier restore thread.

http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f11/plane-restore-round-3-a-47883/


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## timetestedtools

I personally don't care for poly on my totes. It seems to take away from the wood feel. I also like using oil on totes like cherry and other lighter woods because it starts to take on a "used" look. Its all personal preference so go with what you like.


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## Chris Curl

timetestedtools said:


> For rosewood (and similar), I like straight wax, I've used straight blo a lot. I probably use BLO/Wax the most. For my users I tend to stick with oil, but if you're looking for a more shiny look, Chris's 3-2-1 mix is probably the best. For the NY tools #4 I used the 3-2-1 mix.


3-2-1 ... i know it is oil, thinner and varnish, but ...

3 parts what, 2 parts what, and 1 part what?

3 oil, 2 thinner, 1 varnish?

and which thinner and varnish do you prefer?


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## timetestedtools

there is no hard fast rule, and its best to play with the mixture to get it as you like, but generally its 3-mineral spirits or turpentine, 2- polyurethane and 1- linseed oil.

I like a little more oil myself.


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## bigg081

Ugh I know you are getting close to done...getting anxious!


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## Dave Paine

bigg081 said:


> Ugh I know you are getting close to done...getting anxious!


Yes, sharpened a blade, lapped the sole, some final cleanup touches such as cleaning the adjustment wheel, removing the oxalic acid white patina from the screws.

This is the sharpened blade from another rust bucket.
A "victim" of someone's bad sharpening. The edge is curved and askew - not right angle to the side of the blade. This would be so off the lateral adjustment lever would have been unable to get the blade parallel to the sole.

I have sharpened to remove small dents due to pitting at the back side. The edge looks odd, since the eye is fooled by the earlier bad sharpening.

I did not want to remove too much metal. The hardened edge metal does not extend far. I can see the hardened edge line, but not easy to make out in the picture.









I will take the final set of pictures later this evening.

I did test the blade, and it does make nice fluffy shavings. We have a user No. 5. :thumbsup:


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## bigg081

I'll def have to learn to sharpen. Lol I'll have to learn everything. YouTube is a savior.


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## Dave Paine

*The finale*

Closing out the restoration of the No. 5. 

The plane is assembled. The knob and tote are polished but not finished. Leaving this for bigg081.

You wanted a user plane, well this is to remind you it is a user.

The sole bears the scars of many years of rust likely from just being ignored.









This shows the worst pitting around the edge closest to the tote. The pitting will not impact performance.









The action shot showing this is now a real user. Nice fluffy shavings.
Note the nice consistency of the shaving I taped alongside the plane.









A shot for the "after" comparison. The now restored No. 5 showing its second life best side.









I like to show a "before". Not easy in this case, since the "before" was half a plane. So only seeing the frog and casting. The rest were components from other rust buckets.









Now up to bigg081 to confirm if he will take first refusal of this plane.

It is not a collector item. Knob and tote are mine, lever cap, cap iron, blade are from other Stanley planes, the frog and casting are from the original plane. So do not accept if you feel this is a quick flip.

Only accept is this is a hand plane you want to use in your future woodworking endeavours.


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## preacherman

That cleaned up very nice. You do amazing work. I don't think anyone will refuse that one for a very nice user.:thumbsup:


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## gmiller0605

Dave, you never cease to amaze me!


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## bigg081

For anyone wondering....I will be the proud new owner of this gorgeous restoration. The Stanley #5 will be my first plane. I figure I better start off right!


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## Dave Paine

*Update on the No. 7*

Finally getting to post an update on the No. 7. I have been working on actual woodworking projects like the mallet swaps, more pizza cutters, etc.

See post #3 for the initial No. 7 pictures.

I did not take as many build thread pictures, since many of the steps are by now well understood.

The No. 7 had to be sand blasted, the casting and the frog. Too much paint lost.

Taping the front of the frog was a bit time consuming, but worthwhile. I straightened the lateral adjustment lever. The rust consumed most of the STANLEY stamping.









The flash does not show the details well, but the paint looks good. The lettering is nice and crisp.









A new aspect for me was the fact that this is a WWII era plane based on the tote and knob screw are single piece steel and the adjustment wheel was a steel post with rubber wheel. The rubber had shrunk over time and fell off the steel post. See post #18.

I cleaned up the steel post but then wondered how to maintain the history of the plane by using as much original hardware as possible. I came up with the idea to turn a piece of wood to go over the steel post. A couple of failures, and I finally figured out a process to make these without breaking. I felt the wood may be more slippy than desired, so I cut a couple of 1/16in wide grooves and installed two 1/16in wide rubber O-ring. So we still are using rubber for the main contact with the fingers. I am pleased with this. Showing the wooden wheel separate from the post in this picture. I will later glue the wooden wheel to the post for long term use.









I used paint stripper to remove the awful red paint on the knob and screw head. I then applied a dark stain, but not too thick, since I wanted the grain of the wood to show through. Finished with Tru-Oil.

Also in post #18 I had the comparison of the original rather short blade and the replacement.

Since I can only attach 5 pictures, I will jump to the chase and show the restored components assembled together.

Note the blade now covers the lateral adjustment lever as it should for a full length blade.









The as-received plane for side-by-side comparison.









The remaining steps are to lap the sole and make the final tuning for the blade and make some nice fluffy shavings for the final pictures.

Thanks for looking.


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## Phaedrus

Dave Paine said:


> Finally getting to post an update on the No. 7. I have been working on actual woodworking projects like the mallet swaps, more pizza cutters, etc.
> 
> See post #3 for the initial No. 7 pictures.
> 
> I did not take as many build thread pictures, since many of the steps are by now well understood.
> 
> The No. 7 had to be sand blasted, the casting and the frog. Too much paint lost.
> 
> Taping the front of the frog was a bit time consuming, but worthwhile. I straightened the lateral adjustment lever. The rust consumed most of the STANLEY stamping.
> 
> The flash does not show the details well, but the paint looks good. The lettering is nice and crisp.
> 
> A new aspect for me was the fact that this is a WWII era plane based on the tote and knob screw are single piece steel and the adjustment wheel was a steel post with rubber wheel. The rubber had shrunk over time and fell off the steel post. See post #18.
> 
> I cleaned up the steel post but then wondered how to maintain the history of the plane by using as much original hardware as possible. I came up with the idea to turn a piece of wood to go over the steel post. A couple of failures, and I finally figured out a process to make these without breaking. I felt the wood may be more slippy than desired, so I cut a couple of 1/16in wide grooves and installed two 1/16in wide rubber O-ring. So we still are using rubber for the main contact with the fingers. I am pleased with this. Showing the wooden wheel separate from the post in this picture. I will later glue the wooden wheel to the post for long term use.
> 
> I used paint stripper to remove the awful red paint on the knob and screw head. I then applied a dark stain, but not too thick, since I wanted the grain of the wood to show through. Finished with Tru-Oil.
> 
> Also in post #18 I had the comparison of the original rather short blade and the replacement.
> 
> Since I can only attach 5 pictures, I will jump to the chase and show the restored components assembled together.
> 
> Note the blade now covers the lateral adjustment lever as it should for a full length blade.
> 
> The as-received plane for side-by-side comparison.
> 
> The remaining steps are to lap the sole and make the final tuning for the blade and make some nice fluffy shavings for the final pictures.
> 
> Thanks for looking.


Another excellent save, Dave. That looks to be a well cleaned up used plane. I like that you made the wooden wheel to replace the rubber one. Are you keeping this one or rehoming?

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Woodworking Talk


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## Greg in Maryland

Dave Paine said:


> I was able to get the hardware unscrewed, except for the screw for the adjustment wheel and the pin for the Y lever. Going to see if I can get these out after the soak in Evapo-Rust.


How well does Evapo-Rust work on assisting with rusted/stuck screws and assemblies? 

I have a Stanley 113 that needs some help. I tired WD-40, oil and some friendly persuasion with a hammer to no avail. I was next going to try a home brewed concoction of Acetone/Automatic Transmission Fluid. If Evapo-Rust has a good chance of working, I'll give it a try first.

Thanks.

Greg


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## Dave Paine

Greg in Maryland said:


> How well does Evapo-Rust work on assisting with rusted/stuck screws and assemblies?
> 
> I have a Stanley 113 that needs some help. I tired WD-40, oil and some friendly persuasion with a hammer to no avail. I was next going to try a home brewed concoction of Acetone/Automatic Transmission Fluid. If Evapo-Rust has a good chance of working, I'll give it a try first.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Greg


The 113 is a circular plane. Interesting.

Evapo-Rust will not be able to get into the hardware easily. It will clean up the outside, but will not be able to get into the inside.

Some months ago a person commented about the best rust penetrant product is Kroil by Kanolabs. I purchased an aerosol can and it has helped me remove some very rusty hardware.

http://www.kanolabs.com/google/

If you want to send the parts to me, I will be happy to use Kroil and see what this can do for you.


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## Dave Paine

Phaedrus said:


> Another excellent save, Dave. That looks to be a well cleaned up used plane. I like that you made the wooden wheel to replace the rubber one. Are you keeping this one or rehoming?


Thanks Ben, I am happy with how it came out. I had been pondering about the adjustment wheel. It took awhile before I had the idea, but in hindsight it should have been obvious to make a replacement. I probably could have found a thick enough piece of rubber or plastic, but I like the charm of a piece of maple. The O-rings add function and visual contrast.

I already have a nice No. 7. I purchased this with the intent to rehome. I may have a person identified. 

Some of these are harder to let go than others. I still have the planes from Round 3. Trying hard not to get too attached. :icon_smile:

The next planes in progress are a No.4, and a No. 5, the oldest so far. I posted about whether to restore this one and the concensus was to restore. The casting needed to be sand blasted. Too much jappaning had been lost. The casting cleaned up well. Now ready to re-paint.


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## Dave Paine

Phaedrus said:


> Another excellent save, Dave. That looks to be a well cleaned up used plane. I like that you made the wooden wheel to replace the rubber one. Are you keeping this one or rehoming?


Thanks Ben, I am happy with how it came out. I had been pondering about the adjustment wheel. It took awhile before I had the idea, but in hindsight it should have been obvious to make a replacement. I probably could have found a thick enough piece of rubber or plastic, but I like the charm of a piece of maple. The O-rings add function and visual contrast.

I already have a nice No. 7. I purchased this with the intent to rehome. I may have a person identified. 

Some of these are harder to let go than others. I still have the planes from Round 3. Trying hard not to get too attached. :icon_smile:

The next planes in progress are a No.4, and a No. 5, the oldest so far. I posted about whether to restore this one and the concensus was to restore. The casting needed to be sand blasted. Too much jappaning had been lost. The casting cleaned up well. Now ready to re-paint.


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## Dominick

Very nice Dave. 
Looks like new. It looks like your having fun doing this and each time you do one they're getting nicer than the last. Thanks for the tutorial and progress pics. 
What's next?


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## Dave Paine

Dominick said:


> Very nice Dave.
> Looks like new. It looks like your having fun doing this and each time you do one they're getting nicer than the last. Thanks for the tutorial and progress pics.
> What's next?


Thanks, it does look all dressed up and ready for action. A lot of satisfaction for giving a tool a second life when I see the outcome. :icon_smile:

I shake my head every time I look at the picture of the knob painted red.

Next in the queue is :
a) A No. 4. Casting has been sand blasted. Another case of too much paint lost over time. In this case it does not appear to be rust, just the factory paint flaked off. The lever cap plating also did not stand up well. So this one may not look so clean when restored.
b) 3 @ No. 5. Working on the first of these, the oldest No. 5, around 1900 - 1910. No frog adjustment screw. Low, "fat" knob. The casting and frog have been sand blasted ready for re-painting. This one will need a new tote and knob. The knob has a chip and I would not want to have a nice restoration marred my using the original knob with a big chip on one side.
The cap iron has the stamp about L. Bailey patent and date. Reflects the age of the plane.
The blade has the stamp Stanley Bevel and Rule Company. Also reflects the age. The challenge is the blade has been re-sharpened many, many time, so about 1in shorter than normal, and the section with the hardened steel is long gone. So I am pondering to use the original blade, which will be softer steel and not stay sharp long, or replace. I cannot replace with a same period blade.
c) A No. 45. I broke the fixed jaw while trying to remove the rods. I found a replacement on EBay. I cleaned up the moveable jaw and fence and the hardware.

I am trying hard not to buy any more planes until I get the present "inventory" restored. A friend sent me a Craigs List posting about an auction on Wed which includes "Stanley 45 and other hand planes". Very tempting to go.


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## Dominick

That's cool. Can't wait to see them all done for a photo shoot. 
I was at an antique shop not long ago and there was a #5 1/2 I think they wanted $65 for it. But I know nothing about them. Do you?


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## Dave Paine

Dominick said:


> I was at an antique shop not long ago and there was a #5 1/2 I think they wanted $65 for it. But I know nothing about them. Do you?


I have seen such planes go for a lot more than $65 on EBay, although some of the prices on EBay are crazy.

Patrick's B&G has the information on this plane. Have to watch for the era. These days the 2 3/8in wide blade is still being made since it was used in the No 6 and No 7 planes.

If the plane has the 2/14in wide blade, which needs replacing, you would need to find one on EBay and it will not be cheap.

"*#5 1/2 Jack plane, 15"L, 2 1/4"W (2 3/8" 1939 on), 6 3/4lbs, 1898-1958.* A wider and heavier jack plane for rougher work. These make good planes for preparing broad areas such a truing panels. 
Be careful when searching for replacement irons for these planes. Take note of the change in the iron's width. The older planes have to have an old iron made prior to the change in width; you'll have to use an original, if you need a replacement, as this width of iron is unique to this plane."


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## Greg in Maryland

Hi Dave, 

Thanks for the offer to unfreeze my 113. I'll have to take another look at it to see what needs to be done-- it is in a box being ignored -- and send you a message.

What sandblaster do you use? I got a $20 sandblaster at harbor freight that waa nothing except an exercise in frustration and I would love to replace it.

Greg


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## timetestedtools

I had to put the heat to this #45. As long as its away from any wood or plastic, you shoudn't hurt anything.


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## Dave Paine

Greg in Maryland said:


> Hi Dave,
> 
> Thanks for the offer to unfreeze my 113. I'll have to take another look at it to see what needs to be done-- it is in a box being ignored -- and send you a message.
> 
> What sandblaster do you use? I got a $20 sandblaster at harbor freight that waa nothing except an exercise in frustration and I would love to replace it.
> 
> Greg


I do not know the model. I have a friend who takes it to where he works. He is a chem lab technician, but the lab has a machine shop with a sand blaster.

I have been looking at this Tractor Supply model so I can avoid the need for my friend to take to work, and I will get faster turn around.

http://www.tractorsupply.com/en/store/jobsmartreg;-vertical-abrasive-blasting-cabinet-32-lb-capacity

I just need to figure out how to create sufficient floor space. In my shop floor space is shared between the woodworking tools, the tractor, portable generator, snow blower. Likely the same problem as many of us.


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## Dave Paine

timetestedtools said:


> I had to put the heat to this #45. As long as its away from any wood or plastic, you shoudn't hurt anything.


Very nice restoration Don. :thumbsup:

Your plane looks very similar to mine.

I had the rods loosened, thanks to the Kroil. The rod diameter was larger due to the rust expanding as normal. I was aware of this and had sanded down the rods. I was just trying to same a few minutes of sanding and thought I was close enough to force the jaw free. Bad move combined with bad support.

I did have to sand so that I could remove the rods from the moveable jaw so that I could put in the oxalic acid solution.

How is your wooden handle attached? The original looks to have two pins from the left side.


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## timetestedtools

> How is your wooden handle attached? The original looks to have two pins from the left side.


The new one is epoxied on. The original had 2 pins, one from one side and one from the other, but not all the way through, so they couldn't be driven out.


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## Dave Paine

*Assembled and making nice fluffy shavings*

Today I lapped the sole. Slightly worn in the middle, which is normal wear pattern. Overall decent shape.

A little final cleanup on the sides and sole of the casting, then re-assembled.

I adjusted the blade to be parallel to the mouth, retracted the blade, then as I tweaked the adjustment wheel to begin lowering the blade, I started to get the nice fluffy shavings we all like to see.

Not the best piece of 2x4 scrap. A nail hole and small knot hole.

The plane feels to make light work of this piece of softwood, as it should.









For Phaedrus, and any Hand Plane Restoration TV readers, this concludes the programming for this restoration. :laughing:

Thanks for looking.


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## timetestedtools

sweet shavings Dave.


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