# I'd like your suggestions on how to improve



## rmmeira (Jun 3, 2018)

Hi guys
I've been practicing some dovetails.
I'm posting the pictures of the 3rd try.
And the tools I'm using.

All inputs are welcome
Thanks!












































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## Roybrew (Nov 2, 2016)

I think it looks good so far. If you get it to perfect it'll look machine cut. I haven't really tried dove tail joints yet. Sometimes the little imperfections are the art work of hand wood working.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Your work isn't bad at all and will improve with more practice. Hand cutting dovetail joints has always been difficult for everyone. The difficulty is the main reason the dovetail joint became popular. Back before machinery when a customer was choosing a cabinetmaker they looked at their dovetail work to see the quality of the dovetail work to evaluate the craftsman. Today with the machinery they have you could almost teach a monkey to do dovetail work and the machine made dovetail isn't near the quality. In fact the joint is inferior to just a butt joint. When I had a furniture repair shop 9 out of 10 drawers that needed repair had a machine made dovetail and usually the pins were broken off where you couldn't just glue the drawer back together, the box needed replacing. Then people are still looking at the dovetail joint as quality.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

Accurate joints require accurate layout lines and accurate measuring tools including dovetail marking gauges:









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Then you will need to cut by sawing and leaving the lines and paring to them carefully with razor sharp chisels.


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## rmmeira (Jun 3, 2018)

Steve Neul said:


> Your work isn't bad at all and will improve with more practice. Hand cutting dovetail joints has always been difficult for everyone. The difficulty is the main reason the dovetail joint became popular. Back before machinery when a customer was choosing a cabinetmaker they looked at their dovetail work to see the quality of the dovetail work to evaluate the craftsman. Today with the machinery they have you could almost teach a monkey to do dovetail work and the machine made dovetail isn't near the quality. In fact the joint is inferior to just a butt joint. When I had a furniture repair shop 9 out of 10 drawers that needed repair had a machine made dovetail and usually the pins were broken off where you couldn't just glue the drawer back together, the box needed replacing. Then people are still looking at the dovetail joint as quality.


Thanks, my goal is to make them by hand. Since it will be done just occasionally

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## rmmeira (Jun 3, 2018)

woodnthings said:


> Accurate joints require accurate layout lines and accurate measuring tools including dovetail marking gauges:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Actually I got one of these markers, but I found easier to use the jigs with magnets, that I made by myself. I made the jigs w with a 7 degree angle... Think it is about 1:6 ratio.
Thanks for your suggestion !

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## Rebelwork (Jan 15, 2012)

There's a guy on a forum that cuts his by hand. He does everything the hard way. His dovetails aren't that great. He has been doing them forever. Nobody says anything but great work..there awful in my book Yours are pretty consistant, much better. Practice and correct tooling ...


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## DrRobert (Apr 27, 2015)

You're getting there, you're just over sawing.

Gaps are caused by sawing too much on the waste side. If marking with a pencil you want to leave all the line. If you mark with a knife, then you saw right to the line. 

Likewise, when using a coping saw stay 1/8" above the line and chisel the baseline.


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## rmmeira (Jun 3, 2018)

Rebelwork said:


> There's a guy on a forum that cuts his by hand. He does everything the hard way. His dovetails aren't that great. He has been doing them forever. Nobody says anything but great work..there awful in my book Yours are pretty consistant, much better. Practice and correct tooling ...


Hmmm .... Paul Sellers?

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## Mike Stevens (Apr 22, 2021)

Yikes! I wouldn't wear sandals in the shop! Hopefully you were only there to take pictures!


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## kiwi_outdoors (Jan 15, 2020)

Please wear closed toed shoes when using sharp tools


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## rmmeira (Jun 3, 2018)

Mike Stevens said:


> Yikes! I wouldn't wear sandals in the shop! Hopefully you were only there to take pictures!


Great advice 
I was just taking the pictures lol

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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

You are taking too big of a cut with the chisel. It is driving the chisel past your baseline. 

Take half the waste at a time until you have less than 1/32 left. 

Your saw isn't the best. The oak also isn't helping.

Not bad for a third try.


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

Poplar goes together pretty easily compared to oak...

You actually have the opposite issue where you can bruise the wood during assembly.


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## rmmeira (Jun 3, 2018)

BigCountry79 said:


> You are taking too big of a cut with the chisel. It is driving the chisel past your baseline.
> 
> Take half the waste at a time until you have less than 1/32 left.
> 
> ...


I'll try your suggestions on taking off the waste.
Regarding the saw you mean the regular hand saw or the coping saw?

The wood in fact is eucalyptus... At least is how we call it here inn Brazil. Not sure how you call it in US, anyway is just another kind of pine tree...

Thank you

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## rmmeira (Jun 3, 2018)

BigCountry79 said:


> View attachment 430294
> 
> 
> Poplar goes together pretty easily compared to oak...
> ...


I'll have another try with regular pine wood, which is softer.

Great job by the way

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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

I don't know why, but I just gave up on dovetails a long time ago. It's been quite some time ago. Maybe I've gotten a bit of experience working with wood since then. Ya never know.. 
I don't go anywhere outside the house without shoes on. I stepped on too many sharp and stinging things as a kid. I'm the reason honey bees are nearly gone. I stepped on all of them between the ages of 2 and 30..


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

rmmeira said:


> I'll have another try with regular pine wood, which is softer.
> 
> Great job by the way
> 
> Sent from my M2007J22G using Tapatalk


We call it eucalyptus here too... we don't see it much though. 

The saws with a barrel handle are harder to "feel" vertical, so they tend to be harder to use.

Cheaper/ disposable saws also tend to have a pretty large degree of set.

It looks like yours is sort of in between a gent style grip and a pistol grip. Also in between on the quality.

Basically, when I did get a nice saw, the results were instantly better... this isn't advice to go get a nice saw, but I am saying you are probably going to have to fill in the gap with skill... you will challenge yourself more.


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## Tool Agnostic (Aug 13, 2017)

Stating the obvious: 
These are hand-cut dovetails. I admire the people who make great hand-cut dovetails. 

There are many other ways to make dovetails. I have a friend who makes superb hand-cut dovetails. These days, for expediency, he uses his table saw and a tilted dovetail blade for some of the steps.

Many people use a router and a dovetail jig, including me.


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

Tool Agnostic said:


> Stating the obvious:
> These are hand-cut dovetails. I admire the people who make great hand-cut dovetails.
> 
> There are many other ways to make dovetails. I have a friend who makes superb hand-cut dovetails. These days, for expediency, he uses his table saw and a tilted dovetail blade for some of the steps.
> ...


A dovetail jig appeals to me too. If I ever dovetail another carcass I might invest in one...the trouble is the 24" models are super expensive.


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## AwesomeOpossum74 (Jan 27, 2017)

Old thread, I know. But my two cents ...
Those are fair dovetails and will hold with some glue. There are two ways you can hide the gaps. 1. (my favorite method) Shove some shavings into the gaps with glue, and plane smooth when dry. 2. Mix some sawdust and glue and shove it in.

Considering the rough crosscut saw I see on your bench, you did a great job cutting. You'll want a saw more suited to dovetailing, fine tooth (14pt or higher), rip cut, thin blade, which will get you much more accurate results.

You can go with an expensive dovetail jig. But you can also just make your own from scrap wood. Paul Sellers has a tutorial to make a nice one. You can also just cut a 1:7 angle piece of wood and clamp it to your work. Eventually, you'll likely be able to free-cut dovetail angles without jigs.

Good luck and happy dovetailing!


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