# Glueing formica to formica



## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Can you glue formica to formica, and if so does it need to be preped with a cleaner and scuffed with sandpaper?


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## mics_54 (Oct 28, 2008)

Forget the cleaner, 50-60 grit , remove the shine, vac and wipe it down with damp cloth ( lacquer thinner or plain water depending on what glue you will use.)


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Mics,
I will be using contact cement. I got ya on the 50 60 grit SP. I found a store called construction junction, it is a store that sells all kinds of left over construction material. I found a table top big enough to make my extention for my TS 27"x28", it is 1-1/4" thick but has gray formica and i wanted white. off topic--i also found the snap together metal duct 4" for my DC. OMT--Did you know they made formica in 12' lengths? they got that too and dirt cheap.


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## jraksdhs (Oct 19, 2008)

*no need to scuff*

I laminate melamine all the time when doing casework and i never scuff the melamine. Just usually wipe it down with laquer thinner before i spray my contact on it. Of course this is JMO.

jraks


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## Sundance (Jan 8, 2010)

*Formica to Formica*



garryswf said:


> Can you glue formica to formica, and if so does it need to be preped with a cleaner and scuffed with sandpaper?


 I've done it. Clean and power sand with 80 grit to roughen up the surface.


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## mics_54 (Oct 28, 2008)

> Did you know they made formica in 12' lengths? they got that too and dirt cheap.


Yes some p-lam products are available in 12' but not all.

I assumed contact cement...but there are water base low voc contact cements.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Thanks*

Thanks everyone for the advice, from the response to my question i can get the new formica to adhere to the old, terrific. But don't get to relaxed i'm sure before this little project is finished i'll have another lamebrain question that will need answered :yes:


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

garryswf said:


> Thanks everyone for the advice, from the response to my question i can get the new formica to adhere to the old, terrific. But don't get to relaxed i'm sure before this little project is finished i'll have another lamebrain question that will need answered :yes:



When you do the gluing of the two surfaces, check before you glue and before you stick the other piece that there's no debris of any kind on either surface. A itsy bitsy piece of fairly dense material will create a bubble, that can't be pressed out.

The debris is usually a small particle that may have come from the edges of the laminate. 

There are several ways to apply the glue. You can brush it on, or use a spreader, or a roller (there are special adhesive roller pads), or spray. You can spray it out of an ordinary siphon gun, but then you gotta clean the heck out of the gun to use it for anything else.

If you roll it or brush it, don't "work" the glue other than laying down a smooth layer one time. If you continually brush or re-roll the same area, the glue will tack up and lift off the previous glue.

You can use a slip sheet of formica or wood dowels long enough to stick out both sides. I use 1/2" dowels. Lay them about a foot apart. Once the piece has been positioned (so there's overhang all around, slowly pull out the center dowel and touch the mica down. 

Then sequentially, pull out the dowels and press down from the center out to get out all the air. Use a J-roller (with the rubber roller), or you can use the edge of a block of wood, or a block of wood and a hammer to get a tight lamination.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Thanks cabinetman, i probably won't be putting the formica on for a few days, temperature to cold in my garage, not for the formica for me. But thanks for the heads-up on the glue application it's been awhile since i have done any formica work.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

garryswf said:


> Thanks cabinetman, i probably won't be putting the formica on for a few days, temperature to cold in my garage, not for the formica for me. But thanks for the heads-up on the glue application it's been awhile since i have done any formica work.



Check the label on your glue. Most CC's have to be applied at 65 degrees or better.


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## Jim Tank (Apr 28, 2009)

You guys are in Florida and can't do laminate work because it's too cold??? Want to borrow a kerosene heater? Maybe if you spray diluted used motor oil on top surface, and touch it off after laying the laminate, it would heat the glue enough to cure without damaging the laminate finish. Oh well, put some more hot coffee in your wool socks for comfort when facing the harsh elements!


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Hey Jim*

It is supposed to warm up next week----------in the 70's :tt2::tt2::tt2::tt2:


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## Jim Tank (Apr 28, 2009)

Yeah here too! clear up into the mid 20's. We are so excited to see glimpses of spring........


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Got the extention done*

View attachment 12839


Got the formica on, the mitre groove done, and going to rip the 3/4" plywood today for the cabinet that will go under the extention to help with dust collection. There will be a drawer on the bottom of the cabinet for router bit storage. The top itself is 1-3/8" thick, it used to be some part of a computer station, it cost me $5.00. OMT--Jim, the weather finally got warm enough to put down the formica, barely.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Garry*

Don't forget, unless I'm completely off the reservation, that the router table feed direction will be from the rear of your table edge toward the front rail. IE from Right to Left. Router rotation is not reversible so far as I know, unlike a shaper. The miter gauge you are showing will be reversed in the slot when you are using it. Access to the cabinet can be on any of the 3 sides. Dust collection probably should be off the side up against the saw, so you're not tripping over the hose. On mine I just mount a small shop vac on the shelf right under the router. I have a table top port behind the fence down to the vac. Maybe I can find a photo. bill


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Bill,
My brother-in-law put the mitre gauge in there just to see if it worked. As far as dust collection there will be a 4" port in the back of the cabinet, plus another a 2-1/2" port on top of the fence also. This may sound alittle silly but when the cabinet is put together it will be covered with gray formica, don't ask why i just decided i didn't want any wood showing on the outside of the cabinet when it was done. The fence i have in mind for the router will be incorporated onto the TS fence. That means the wood covering the fence at this time will soon be gone.
OMT--I bit the bullet and went to the woodcraft store and bought the template for the Jessum router lift plate, i know i could have made the template but all i had to do with the one i bought was line it up and start routing.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

That top came out real well...looks good. If the laminating was done when it's too cold, the mica just won't stick. DAMHIKT. If you are particular, you can get a color match with paint to go with mica colors. That works out to be a nice touch.

I usually put a very slight chamfer on the mica edge along the miter slot. It will keep the edges from chipping when inserting/removing the gauge.

Give the laminated top a few days and check the filed edge for additional overhang. When the glue completely dries out behind the edge mica, it will pull that piece in a bit, leaving some feathered edge on the top piece. As cool as it's been, that may or may not happen in your area.


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

Nice job on the extension Garry. Looks very professional.

Gerry


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## gregL (Feb 1, 2009)

Excellent job on the router table top. Reading the posts about the laminate has been good because I am getting ready to build a extension table/cabinet for my table saw.
You made a good move buying the Jessem router lift plate. It is so nice (not to mention accurate) being able to adjust the router height from above the table. Jessem makes a top notch router lift.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Thanks*

Thanks guys,
All of the guys on here are so very helpful, again thanks. I still have alot of work to do on the cabinet underneath the top but i'm getting there.

Greg,
I haven't purchased the router or lift yet but the combo i mentioned in this thread i feel is the best quality for the money. Understand, i am only gonna do this "ONCE" :thumbsup:. Greg if you are wanting to build a table top router station i will suggest this, 3/4" cabinet grade plywood was my first chioce but after shopping around i found a good table top at a used construction material store that was used for some kind of computer statoin, 1-3/8" thick and big enough to make the TS extention for five bucks and very solid. I also reenforced it on the undersides by the rails with 1/8x1-1/2" angle just to make sure it stayed true.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

cabinetman said:


> That top came out real well...looks good. If the laminating was done when it's too cold, the mica just won't stick. DAMHIKT. If you are particular, you can get a color match with paint to go with mica colors. That works out to be a nice touch.
> 
> I usually put a very slight chamfer on the mica edge along the miter slot. It will keep the edges from chipping when inserting/removing the gauge.
> 
> Give the laminated top a few days and check the filed edge for additional overhang. When the glue completely dries out behind the edge mica, it will pull that piece in a bit, leaving some feathered edge on the top piece. As cool as it's been, that may or may not happen in your area.


 
Cabinetman.
I don't disagree with you very often, but if your laminate will not stick in cold weather you might want to find another cc. I have been applying laminate on all kind of surfaces for many years and have tried many types of cc with good and bad results. The cc that I am currently using will stick even to other laminate surfaces in temperatures as low as 28 degrees and have not had any problems.
The only thing you have to be aware of is the final edge filing should be done once it is in its final installation point and has acclimated.
Thank you for your contributions, I have learned alot from your advice.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Getting there*

View attachment 12968



Got a ways to go but i'm getting there.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

woodman42 said:


> Cabinetman.
> I don't disagree with you very often, but if your laminate will not stick in cold weather you might want to find another cc. The cc that I am currently using will stick even to other laminate surfaces in temperatures as low as 28 degrees and have not had any problems.



That's interesting...what brand are you using?


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

cabinetman said:


> That's interesting...what brand are you using?


 
Wilsonart 500. I have tried several other brands with bad results but the Wilsonart seems to be superior in holding power.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

woodman42 said:


> Wilsonart 500. I have tried several other brands with bad results but the Wilsonart seems to be superior in holding power.



I've tried cements from most of the distributors. They could be all made in the same factory. Every one has directions to use in temps above 65 degrees.

From Wilson Art's own site, the specs for '500' under "General Use Instructions" specifies 65 degrees (for 48 hrs) before application, and common directions is 48-72 hrs after.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

cabinetman said:


> I've tried cements from most of the distributors. They could be all made in the same factory. Every one has directions to use in temps above 65 degrees.
> 
> From Wilson Art's own site, the specs for '500' under "General Use Instructions" specifies 65 degrees (for 48 hrs) before application, and common directions is 48-72 hrs after.


 Cabinetman
I am not trying to get into a technical argument, I am just letting you know that if you do it right the Wilsonart 500 will stick to other laminates in cold weather. I have been building laminate counter tops and mill work for about 20yrs. The only time that I have had trouble getting the adhesive to stick, was when the existing laminate did not get sanded properly.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

woodman42 said:


> Cabinetman
> I am not trying to get into a technical argument, I am just letting you know that if you do it right the Wilsonart 500 will stick to other laminates in cold weather.



I'm not trying to feed an argument either, or saying you are wrong. There are many members here on time restraints and limited budgets. I wouldn't recommend a procedure that may fail or become problematic by not following the directions for the use of the product. If I do proceed with a project in a manner that is not recommended in the directions, I assume the results, and suffer any consequences.

I will say that the chemical companies have chemists and lab experts that do extensive testing under all possible conditions and have formulated their conclusions to the proper use of their product. I agree with their advice (by trying it out for myself) and heed the instructions so my work won't fail immediately, or down the road. I hate call backs.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Just a couple of pictures*

View attachment 13026


View attachment 13027


View attachment 13028


Thought i would update you on the progress. Gluing laminate to laminate went very well. Probably should have posted this elsewere, but here it is anyway. This contraption is what will enclose the router for dust collection. The laminate to laminate gluing was for the top. There will be a drawer in the bottom for router bits, and a 4" port in the rear for dust collection. Lowe's nor Home Depot had a full extention drawer slide 12" long so i put a cheapo on till i get the one i want. Got a little more to do to it but coming along ok.

OMT--For Cabinetman and Woodman42, i have no idea how low of temperature cc will work. I can tell you it works at 55 degrees.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Looks great. Can you still get to tilt wheel?


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Yep*

Woodman,
Looks are a little deceiving, there is actually 7" between the saw cabinet and the new cabinet i built.

Sorry everyone for posting project on this thread, just seemed more logical than starting a new one.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

garryswf said:


> Woodman,........Sorry everyone for posting project on this thread, just seemed more logical than starting a new one.


I agree 100% and I'm sure most others do also.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Yup!*

I might be the only one that thinks this way but the OP can post anything they want.....it's "their" thread as much as it's possible to own anything on a forum. 
BTW NIce job on the whole package, saw fence, router table, dust collection. Well done!:thumbsup: bill


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## Yeorwned (Jan 9, 2010)

I use a special formica glue which requires no prep at all and works wonders. I don't see it for sale anymore but it is called RooGlue and is made for nothing but formica.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Pretty much done*

This project is pretty much done. The dust collection is hooked up and ready to go, and the Jessum Master Lift is on its' way. Although this thread was intended for the purpose of a specific question i figured i would let ya'll know how it turned out. 
Cabinetman and Woodman42----I did enjoy the discussion you fellas had.
OMT-- I think i'm done hanging stuff off the TS cause if i hang anything else off of it i will need helper springs and bigger wheels.


View attachment 13123


View attachment 13124


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## Texas Sawduster (Apr 27, 2009)

*Nice Job*

Very nice work garryswf.

One thing to keep in mind in the future if you use any adhesive in cold weather.
Take a hair dryer and warm up the glue after it's appied to the surface and before joining to the mating surface. When the glue is warmed up, then apply the piece to the other.

Even though the air temp may be "cold" when you laminate two surfaces together the glue will retain some of the warmth and actually adhear to the surface alittle more than normal.

I learned this by Vulcanizing different raw rubber compounds to steel as well as using epoxy mixes to stick stainless steel sheets to aluminum plate.

Same principle applies just a different media being glued together.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*It finally got here*

The Masterlift finally got here:thumbsup:. 


View attachment 13396


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