# for the Sawyers........Blades



## Marko (Feb 11, 2008)

*I am a new bandmill owner/operator so I'm somewhat unbiased as far as blades gne thing I know for sure is I chewed right through the Woodmizer Dbl.Hard that came with my mill(within 100bf).Keep in mind,1.my mill is a Hudson and 2. I may have hit a rock buried in the bark judging by the roughsawn pattern produced by the toothset being kicked outta whack secounds before the blade started smokin'.I happened to have a box of Munksforsager's on standby.I have been using these since the WM blade incident and can say this much,both blades have the same dimension's except for thickness,.006 of an inch thicker are the Monksforsager's.Unless I hit  metal,knock on wood :wallbash:I find these blades virtually unstoppable.I'm approaching 1000bf on this blade alone and for a 800-1000bf longevity and the likes of a newbie pushing the mill I think it's a decent blade.I decided I was going to push this blade until it smoked or broke too!:tank: *
*The reason I started this thread is to see and hopefully get some info on which blades with different dim's and toothset's the "Sawyer's with the bandmill's" find are better for different species of wood and different types of sawing (i.e. flitch cuts compared to quartersawing compared to cutting to grade compared to whatever...) The Munksforsager's I use are 13'-4" x .041" x 7/8".I would also like to know the value/disadvantage of going with a 3/4" toothset as well. I know some of you guy's will say if I'm getting close to a mbf with 1 blade that I should stick with that blade.Understandable since I've been cutting Poplar for the last week. But I'm mainly interested in who learned what with blade vs. species vs. conditions. I look forward to any input not from just the sawyers but anyone with the experience and especially from the sawyers.....*


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## Marko (Feb 11, 2008)

forgot to add my mill:thumbsup: ....


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

SirMarkXXX said:


> *.I happened to have a box of Munksforsager's on standby. Monksforsager's.Unless I hit  metal,knock on wood :wallbash:I find these blades virtually unstoppable.**.*


I only use Munks, I just had this discussion with another sawyer here this week. The first time I sawed through 3 small nails and then cleanly cut another 600 bft on the same blade...I never bought anything else. I had tried several other brands before that, nothing but Munks for the last 3 years (not to say something else has not come along in that time, but I am happy so why change) Being an "urban logger" and sawing 90% yard trees it is very rare my blades die of old age. It is always metal poisoning that does them in. 

As far as tooth set I am probably the last guy to take advice from. I sharpen/set my own and do some weird custom stuff for resaw (almost no set) and other uses. I only saw hard wood (rock maple/osage/ash/hickory...) walnut is about the softest hardwood I saw. I do saw cedar though. Your lesser set makes cutting really hard wood easier, but then again you have a little more motor than I do, I am only running 13 HP. Maybe some others will chime in with specific set numbers and be more helpful. I am less technical, I just have blades set and organized for what I am doing at the time.


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## Marko (Feb 11, 2008)

I am less technical, I just have blades set and organized for what I am doing at the time.


you know a big part of this post was intended for you Daren......it's the sentence above that I'm most interested in the answer.I understand though.you know last week I called the US Munksfors dist.He happens to be a guy named Mark right here in Kennesaw,Ga. His Co. is Kenne-Saw.He told me he contacted Munksfors a few years back and asked them to develope a blade of his spec.(you know they only made meat blades at the time)so he could meet the demand of the bandmill sawyers.Evidently the blades we use are the result of that conversation.
Now,I have been gullable before.........but thats what I was told by the him.He's also selling them to me for $17.75 each which I thought was pretty reasonable, considering.
Anyway,I know this has nothing to do with the thread but now we know where the blade came from....


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## Capt Crutch (Jan 21, 2008)

Cool thread. How many horsepower on that mill, Mark?


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

SirMarkXXX said:


> He happens to be a guy named Mark right here in Kennesaw,Ga. His Co. is Kenne-Saw.
> Now,I have been gullable before.........but thats what I was told by the him.


Well...he is not blowing smoke up your skirt . That is where I get my blades (gonna have to check the last invoice though, I don't think I paid that, maybe :huh:, but I am only using 12' bands) One thing I can say is a $17 blade that gets 50% more mileage than a $14 blade is well worth the money.
I don't know Mark over there I guess, but have had nothing but good business with Kenne-Saw and Munks. I think they will head you in the right direction, they know their blades and can make recommendations. (frozen logs/dirty logs/hard logs/production on soft wood) I know, since you said you where kinda asking me, you wanted more info on set. Man that is a deep subject. I would stick with the manufacturers recommendations. It just so happens I have a professional sharpening shop and tools to do stuff to suit me, but it may not suit another guys mill/wood he is sawing.


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## Marko (Feb 11, 2008)

16hp Vanguard V-twin Capt.!


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## Marko (Feb 11, 2008)

Daren said:


> I only use Munks, I just had this discussion with another sawyer here this week. The first time I sawed through 3 small nails and then cleanly cut another 600 bft on the same blade...I never bought anything else. I had tried several other brands before that, nothing but Munks for the last 3 years (not to say something else has not come along in that time, but I am happy so why change) Being an "urban logger" and sawing 90% yard trees it is very rare my blades die of old age. It is always metal poisoning that does them in.
> 
> As far as tooth set I am probably the last guy to take advice from. I sharpen/set my own and do some weird custom stuff for resaw (almost no set) and other uses. I only saw hard wood (rock maple/osage/ash/hickory...) walnut is about the softest hardwood I saw. I do saw cedar though. Your lesser set makes cutting really hard wood easier, but then again you have a little more motor than I do, I am only running 13 HP. Maybe some others will chime in with specific set numbers and be more helpful. I am less technical, I just have blades set and organized for what I am doing at the time.





Daren said:


> Well...he is not blowing smoke up your skirt . That is where I get my blades (gonna have to check the last invoice though, I don't think I paid that, maybe :huh:, but I am only using 12' bands) One thing I can say is a $17 blade that gets 50% more mileage than a $14 blade is well worth the money.
> I don't know Mark over there I guess, but have had nothing but good business with Kenne-Saw and Munks. I think they will head you in the right direction, they know their blades and can make recommendations. (frozen logs/dirty logs/hard logs/production on soft wood) I know, since you said you where kinda asking me, you wanted more info on set. Man that is a deep subject. I would stick with the manufacturers recommendations. It just so happens I have a professional sharpening shop and tools to do stuff to suit me, but it may not suit another guys mill/wood he is sawing.


i understand Daren, probably like asking to explain the lumber grading system or the complexity thereof......for only having that WM to compare to,I'm very happy with the blades,I'm also happy with the HP too.just think,I begged Hudson to put a 23hp on it....they told be I was  nutz. I have literally tried to bogg it down and it push's right on through barely dippin' below 3400rpm.I also can't believe how much it sounds lika a harley either.90degree V i guess...makes for great sound while rippin' log's.


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## arkyrick (Feb 13, 2008)

I have ordered a new sawmill from WM and I was attracted to it because of using one that a buddy owned, The only thing different that I got on mine was an electric start (arm got tired) Here's something that came up while I was using his, he put on a sharp band and he tightened it by guessing, I questioned him about if he had a guage or something to test the band to see if it was tight enough, he shrugged my question off saying he just had a feel for it. During our sawing of red cedar logs I noticed a couple of times when we got near a knot that the blade sort of flexed up and down causing a wave in the board I felt that his blade was too loose am I right and shouldn't you adjust the tension with a guage or something the band must stretch with use doesn't it.:huh:


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

arkyrick said:


> (arm got tired) , I questioned him about if he had a guage or something to test the band to see if it was tight enough, he shrugged my question off saying he just had a feel for it. During our sawing of red cedar logs I noticed a couple of times when we got near a knot that the blade sort of flexed up and down causing a wave in the board I felt that his blade was too loose am I right and shouldn't you adjust the tension with a guage or something the band must stretch with use doesn't it.:huh:


Arm got tired? :laughing: (you will get that joke later) Your buddies "gauge" was off. I have the same one, it is kinda like a piano tuner (by sound), sorry another one you will have to get with experience. Hey, good news is you got a sawmill.


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## joasis (Sep 15, 2006)

You can actually measure the stretch of the blade, and whatever company you buy blades from should have the tech info for you. No matter what you hear about red or aromatic cedar, it can present it's own problems in milling, plus the bark tends to hold dirt and sand very well....I prefer to circle mill cedars.


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

Rick too since you bought a WM they have excellent customer support. They have all the tech info on blade tension and can answer any questions should you have problems. My mill is set up a little different than a WM. I have had discussions with sawyers who use dial indicators and a straight edge clamped to the blade to measure deflection/tension.


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## Marko (Feb 11, 2008)

*Personally,I use a Torque wrench to tension my blades.30-35 ftlbs. takes care of it.Alittle trick I learned is to creep up on the torque setting.i.e. if your torque spec is 30,i'll set the wrench for 20 than 25 and finish er out at 30.This is a fundamental trick that most of us should already know prior to picking up a torque wrench however, if you are like me there's some things that just did not interest me or that I thought were not impotant when learning how to operate a fancy tool like that.....*


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

I just bought a box of monkey blades from Mark at Kennesaw a couple weeks ago. I haven't used one yet because I still have some life left on the Woodmizer that's on it. 

I have somewhere in the neighborhood of 350 1.5" Woodmizer blades, and about 70 - 80 Lenox Woodmasters but I have not been happy with the Woodmizer resharp program so I have meaning to find another source to resharpen my blades. I hope to not ever use enough to justify buying my own sharpener unless I run across a really good deal. i don't even average 30 blades a month as it stands. If I ever get a resharpener then I can train my boys to sharpen blades. :shifty: 

I look forward to trying out the monkeys if this rain will ever stop. I have never heard anyone say there disatisfied with them.


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

I better clarify for those that may not be aware - Woodmizer resharp and Woodmizer Sawmills are only very loosely tied. I had the guy at Woodmizer Resharp explain it to me once and don't remember it all exactly but my understanding is that Woodmizer Sawmills does not oversee that resharp operation. 

Don't want anyone thinking I am ragging on Woodmizer Sawmills. Although there are some things I do not like about the way WM Sawmills does things, overall they are a fantastic company and I have been well pleased with their service.


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## firefighteremt153 (Jan 25, 2008)

Does this Mark fella from Kenne-saw sell anything besides blades? Just curious b/c I'm about 5 minutes from Kennesaw GA.


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## Carl Middleton (Dec 8, 2008)

TT is there a web site for the monkey blades I've never heard of them I take my blades to WM Pa and they resharpen right there


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## Kirk Allen (Nov 7, 2006)

TexasTimbers said:


> I have somewhere in the neighborhood of 350 1.5" Woodmizer blades, and about 70 - 80 Lenox Woodmasters
> 
> I hope to not ever use enough to justify buying my own sharpener unless I run across a really good deal. i don't even average 30 blades a month as it stands.
> quote]
> ...


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## Kirk Allen (Nov 7, 2006)

Marko, Nice set up! 

I have used the Monks blades, commonly refered to as monkey blades and was quite pleased with them. The cost was $15 a blade and I believe I just saw an add for them again at that price. I will check and see for sure. 

The challenge I had with them had nothing to do with performance. It was a challenge of resharpening. After paying someone to resharp, ship them both ways, the cost was about the same as my WM blades, which I can sharpen myself. The Monks blades have a different profile so I could not use the same CBN wheel I use on my WM blades, which brings things to a whole nother topic. 

Prior to the CBN wheel availability from WM I was using a standard grinding stone and lets just say it sucked resharpening my blades. The CBN has changed that entirely. I sharpened 8 blades this afternoon in just under an hour and they are razor sharp. 

TT, the challenge I had with the WM resharp was more often than not they would discard a "damaged" blade and replace it with a new one, which was the program I was on. After getting the CBN system I quickly realized that those nail battered blades only take another pass before the CBN has done its trick. WM was just throwing them out when in reality they had a whole lot more life in them. Same thing with a blade that has a tooth or two, three missing. We can still get a lot of lumber cut with them resharpened but they would just discard them.


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

Carl Middleton said:


> TT is there a web site for the monkey blades I've never heard of them I take my blades to WM Pa and they resharpen right there


I bought mine from Kenne-saw Supply. Menominee also carries them but I liked dealing with Mark at Kenne-saw. 

I bought the Munks before I realized I could get a new cam made for the WM sharpener (which I haven't got fixed yet so I loaned the cam to the guy who sharpens them for me). I had Tim Cook make a cam with the Munks profile that fits onto my WM sharpener, now I can essentially convert all those WM blades I got with my mill into munky blades. 

The steel is a little different between the WM, the Munks, and the Timber Wolf blades which have the same profile as the MunksforSågar blades. I haven't tried the Timber Wolf blades but have heard from two other sawyers who have used them all, they like the Timber Wolf the best. 

Me, I am going to use the several dozen Munky blades I have until I can't get any more sharps out of them, then I will use the WM blades with the Munky profile. What I will probably also do is order a dozen Timber Wolf's and try them. I f I like them better still, I'll sell the WM steel and get into the Timber Wolf steel.

Carl, one thing you will find on this band blade topic, every sawyer will have their favorties. They will tell you Acme bands are heads above all others. that doesn't mean it is true. It just means that's just that persons opinion. My opinion based on my expeirence is that Munky blades stay sharper longer, and so I use them. 

KA I don't understand why you don't understand. Would you have turned down free blades? Not me. Re: the Munks, call Tim Cook. He'll make you a cam for $90 and then you can sharpen your own Munks.


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## Kirk Allen (Nov 7, 2006)

I use CBN wheels so its not a cam issue. The CBN wheel cust the whole profile in one pass. It is not moving the blade while its ground like the old system.


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

yeah I caught that your using a CBN just giving you the info in case you have an old setup still and wanted the ability to sharpen your own munkys.


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## Kirk Allen (Nov 7, 2006)

Marko,
Coleman Sawmill Supply has MunkforsSagar blades for $15.57. 800-459-4626
Thats for 13'2"x 1 1/4" x .041 x 7/8 TS

They can make them any size you want though.


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

I think you're talking to the wall Kirk. I believe Marko has been out of the sawing business for as long as he quit posting here. Stand to be corrected.


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

TexasTimbers said:


> I believe Marko has been out of the sawing business for as long as he quit posting here.


Yea, he moved on to other things.


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## Kirk Allen (Nov 7, 2006)

The information is still valid for anyone interested. I didnt pay any mind to the date of his original post.


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