# TS fence and Rails



## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

I could use any information, including pictures if you could post them, that pertain to rails and fence for a table saw. A friend and i are in the process of designing this for my saw on his CAD program. I know this may sound alittle frugal (cheap to some folks) but i do enjoy making things like this and have enough experience working with metal to pull something like this off. Metal thickness, square tubing and angle dementions for the front and rear rail, and anything else, including a picture of the locking mechanism for the fence would be nice. Thanks


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

Hi Garry

I am a little like you, in that I am always trying to save a buck, and like to build things. Given the staggering cost of a good table saw rip fence system, such as a Beismeyer, I don't blame you a bit for trying to build your own. I would take a good look at the Beismeyer system as a starting point if I were in your position. I am not saying it can't be improved, but I have that style on my contractor saw, and it seems to work quite well.

Gerry


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

When the Biesemeyer first came out a buddy and I made up a rudimentary "T" square type fence that worked pretty good. Below is a rough drawing from memory.

You could go to one of the online fence systems and pull up a parts list with an explosion drawing. Or hike over to a Rockler or Woodcraft store and check one out...and make notes.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*rails and fence*

Thanks guys for the information. I have already purchased 21/2x21/2 square tubing and 3x3 angle. I think i have figured out a way to fasten the tubing directly to the front of the saw and eliminate the angle the tubing normally fastens to. I will try to get a picture on this thread so you can see the method to my madness. Thanks again.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Just a start*

[/attach] The pictures show the finished length of the rails and how i intend to attach the fence to the front rail in order to move it from side to side. The angle directly under the tubing "which in the end will be the fence" will be 11" long made of 2.5x2.5x3/16" angle. There will be a 2x2x1/8" angle bolted from the underside the full length of the tubing which will give the top angle a channel to slide in. Any suggestions or comments? I am going into this with an open mind so type away guys, who knows when this project is complete we all might have come up with a should i say "better mouse trap". I think i have the locking mechinism figured out but beings this is the first fence i have attempted i will probably be wrong. There will be a 3/4" all thread rod going the length inside the fence tubing which will, in the end lock the fence in place from the back rail. I think what i have in mind will work but if it does not i can convert to the cam lock system, for a cost of $35.00 plus shipping. That is what the cam lock cost purchased from Biesmeyer.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*The Beise*

Slides horizontally on nylon glides and has rear face nylon glides. You can make a cam lock, Just take a 3/4" or 1" round and drill a hole slightly off center on the flat face for a through bolt, instant cam. Then drill and tap a hole on the round side for the lever, probably 3/8" or 1/2" for the handle. Or just weld on a 1/2" rod with a threaded end for a plastic knob. It bears on a welded tongue which presses againt the front face of the rectangle tube. :thumbsup: Looks good so far, just don't slide metal on metal. And I'm sure you know the Beise only locks at the front, no through bolt needed. I love both of mine.....:yes: bill


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Wnt*

Is that a case of beer i see under you TS? I may be old but i'm not blind (yet)


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Yea,... so?*

Takes one to spot one. I'd say Strohs, in case you were wondering and that case has been empty for at least 25 years. They used to sell 'em for .50 apiece here in Detroit at the brewery. They make great parts storage boxes, strong and plastic coated. Now quit lookin' around for trouble, keep this a secret between us. OK? :thumbsup:bill


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*rails*

Finally have the rails mounted, and have already got the fence ready to assemble, thanks again Bill.
View attachment 11200


View attachment 11201


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Great Job Garry!*

I got a couple of saws that need a fence made....:laughing: No just kidding.:no: Can't wait to see the fence and how you ended up locking it to the rails. Keep posting. BTW stop in I'll buy you a beer!:thumbsup: bill
BTW part 2 they make plastic end caps for various size tubes..or you can use a piece of hardwood as a plug with reduced ends and rounded corners. Those things hurt when you walk into them in the dark! They're right at the "wrong" height! You can keep things like straight edges inside if you don't plug them too tight and then forget where you put "things" .:blink: bill


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## clarionflyer (Apr 27, 2008)

That's beautiful, Garry.
I have enough trouble getting wood projects right, let alone metal. I'm impressed.
Dave


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Racking my brain*

Bill,
The fence will lock to the rails the same way your Biesemeyer does, the three point locking is a piece of cake, thanks again for the pics. I considered buying the cam lever for the Biese but hey that would kinda be cheating on this project. My biggest issue was how to make the fence so it could be squared to the mitre groove, but i think i have that figured out, but i will take any suggestions!!! BTW those oak pallets you see in the back ground will be a small table and chairs for the grandson, soon as i get the saw done.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Well, let's keep going on this*

The Beise uses a full length "bar behind the rear of the fence with nylon glides in front of set screws on the right and left ends. The set screws bear against the bar which is "tack" welded in the center and springs out on either end. It's pretty simple actually. I'll post some pix Gotta go now! bill


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

The rails look rock solid Garry. Looking forward to seeing the fence you build. Are the rails powder coated?

Gerry


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Great*

Bill - I think i got what you mean, and i was thinking the adjusting part of this would be the hardest. A pic would be nice. If the local Woodcraft store would have had the Biesemeyer fence in stock it sure would have saved you alot of aggrivation!

Gerry - No sir it is not powder coated, just Painted.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*No aggravation at all!*



garryswf said:


> Bill - I think i got what you mean, and i was thinking the adjusting part of this would be the hardest. A pic would be nice. If the local Woodcraft store would have had the Biesemeyer fence in stock it sure would have saved you alot of aggrivation!
> Gerry - No sir it is not powder coated, just Painted.


Hey Garry, if you're ambitious/courageous enough to do this, I'm glad to help out. If you're going to order the cam lock from Beise why not get the rub shoe as well, save on shipping for 2 pieces instead of one. Maybe they would have the nylon glide pieces as well? Oh heck, just ship the whole fence! :laughing: bill 
BTW post the URL for the parts dept.from Biese if you can.:thumbsup: bill
SEE PHOTOS IN POST ABOVE ^.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Bill,
I am not buying the cam lock for the Biese, i want to make it myself. Buying it would be counter productive/not cost effective/and anyway i like a good challenge. I am amazed at how simple the Biese fence really is. OMT, the only reason i want all the pictures is to get a good look at that Strohs beer case, been along time since i have seen one of them!!!!!!!! That is what my dad used to drink "FIRE BREWED", at that time "VERY early 60s" i think it cost around 35 to 50 cents a bottle, maybe.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Grrrrr!*

Now I suppose I have to go take a picture of an empty Strohs Box? 
When you stoppin' by for a Labatts? :laughing: bill


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*No more beer case remarks*

There will be no more remarks about the empty Strohs beer case:no:. I understand this is a woodworking forum :yes:, and such talk should not be permitted :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:. OMT, is Labatts a dance or a beer:thumbup::whistling2::laughing: :thumbsup:


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## clarionflyer (Apr 27, 2008)

Let's talk shop safety, here, folks.
Especially concerning beer...








Never, !ever! put that wet beer can on your tablesaw top .
:laughing::laughing::laughing:

Sorry, a little off topic, but I am looking forward to seeing the finished fence, Garry.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

YOU! so am I!!


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Bill,
Being the idiot i am this is what i came up with for the web site for Biese fence replacement parts -- www.mikestools.com/biesemeyerreplacement-parts


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Replacement parts*

Bill 
her is the web site for biese replacement parts, that i found. www.mikestools.com/biesemeyerreplacement-parts


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*I'll give you one last try*

Neither of these links work. :thumbdown: They are the same. :blink: What?
 bill


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Sorry*

Bill,
Thats the best i can do, told you i'm an idiot. Try it on your home page and see if you can bring it up. The site has all the replacement parts for a biese.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*That's Ok Garry, I feel your pain*

Let's try this one:http://www.mikestools.com/Power-Tool-Manufacturer-Biesemeyer-Manufacturing.aspx 
Actually for replacement parts it's this one:
http://www.mikestools.com/biesemeyer-replacement-parts_1418.aspx
Google did not like the other one(s).:thumbdown: Thanks for heading me in the right direction, even tho it was down the wrong road! :laughing: Idoits are a dime a dozen, insane :blink: is when you keep doing the same thing over again and expecting things to change.....Keep on keepin' on there. What about that fence? :icon_smile: bill


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*waiting for welder*

Bill,
I am waiting for the welding machine to arrive, supposed to be here tomorrow. The only thing i have left to do until then is drill and tap the holes so i can adjust the fence to square, all the other parts are cut and ready to weld. The only major thing i need to make is the cam lever, that is going to be alot of grinding. Making it out of 3/4 x 2"x 10" piece of flat bar. Keep you posted on progress. Have a good day. BTW the pics you posted have been a huge help, when i get stumped i log on to this site and study them.TY


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*FINALLy !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*

Fence is welded together, checked to make sure it clamped to the front rail, it did, and when it did the back end come up off the table about 2". Grinded the weld off lowered the cam lever supports about 1/2" and TADAAAAAA, rock solid and fence stays on the table at the back rail. Now i can't show it to you until it is a little further along. Ok gotta go mow the yard before the LOML gets home, thats right "HEN PECKED":yes:


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Fence*

Her is a couple of pictures of the fence, still have alot of work to do. The ugly handle has not had anything done to it except the face that locks it to the front rail, total cost todate $72.00 and change.
View attachment 11282


View attachment 11283


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*It works thats all that matters*

Ok, here it is all but the sacrificial fence. My grandsons bike only has one handgrip now. It didn't look that dirty when i took the pictures. 

View attachment 11299
View attachment 11296


View attachment 11297


View attachment 11298


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

Looking good. How wide a panel will you be able to rip?

Gerry


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Gerry,
Thanks, to the left of the blade i can rip 12-1/8"-- to the right of the blade i can rip 24-1/8".


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Last Post on this project, Time to start using it!!*

Ok fellows, Her are two pictures, one after it was purchased and the other after the fence and rails were completed. Thanks to everyone for their helpful info and to you WnT for the pics. The first pic was taken right after it was purchased, the second was taken after fence and rails were completed. OK, time to make sawdust :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes:
View attachment 11347


View attachment 11348


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Great Job Garry*

Glad I could helpout. As with anything DIY there's always "things" we'd do different, but I think it turned out fine and if it squares itself when locked that's all the matters. PITA if not! I did like the light grey color better, :yes: JMO! bill
BTW is the kid ridin' the bike one handed?


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## boardmaker (Nov 3, 2009)

garry,
I was wondering on the rails, are those stick on slides or did you remove the paint and that is unfinished steel? If it is some form of slide, what is it and where did you get it? 
I'm jealous and I believe I'll be building one myself. I've already been looking in our scrap piles for tubing.


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## boardmaker (Nov 3, 2009)

http://www.twistedknotwoodshop.com/tsquarefence.pdf
I hope this link works. It's a little late in the game but definitely worth a look. It's a pdf about building a rail and fence nearly identical to the one you built. Except it uses 2x3 for the rails. 
It even has cad files.


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## John in Tennessee (Jun 11, 2008)

*Scattwe Cat Little around the base of the table saw..*

If you spill your beer around your table saw the floor would be slick and dangerous. Cat litter could elevate this problem.


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## John in Tennessee (Jun 11, 2008)

*Scatter Cat Little around the base of the table saw..*

If you spill your beer around your table saw the floor would be slick and dangerous. Cat litter could elevate this problem.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*IS this a ...*

Question... a reply... a comment....a solution... a wise crack.... 
a personal problem, ......a diagnosis,... or part of a 12 step program in table saw safety??:blink: bill

Cat litter could *elevate* this problem.?


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## Gorp (Jul 17, 2009)

garryswf said:


> Bill,
> I am not buying the cam lock for the Biese, i want to make it myself. Buying it would be counter productive/not cost effective/and anyway i like a good challenge. I am amazed at how simple the Biese fence really is. OMT, the only reason i want all the pictures is to get a good look at that Strohs beer case, been along time since i have seen one of them!!!!!!!! That is what my dad used to drink "FIRE BREWED", at that time "VERY early 60s" i think it cost around 35 to 50 cents a bottle, maybe.


I have a new set of nylon glides that jet sent to me a long time ago if you need them. I was trying to get a replacemant set for may contractors and they sent me the ones for a cabinet saw. Now that I have a new Unisaw I no longer need them. 

I got them for free and expect the same price plus shipping.:thumbsup:


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Gorp,
Thanks, but no thanks. The fence works great, so i hate to alter anything. The only thing i have left to do is put the measuring tape on the front rail. Thank you for the offer though.


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## Burnt_Blade (Dec 26, 2009)

What I wondered about these types of fences that clamp only at the front of the saw...would the rear part of the fence not move on you? It only takes a small amount of play in the fence in this area to mess up your cut, right?

I am looking at a better fence for my old Craftsman TS, still have the original...and after reading this post I am definitely thinking of doing the same, altho I don't have any welding exp or weld equipment unfortunately.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*Fence Stability*

Burntblade,
The fence i built for my Delta Unisaw is "ROCK SOLID" there is no movement at the rear of this fence when it is locked on the front rail, and i can thank ole WoodnThings for that, he posted many pictures of his factory fence for me to go by. There are a few things i would do different if i were to do it again but overall i am satisifed.


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

Burnt_Blade said:


> What I wondered about these types of fences that clamp only at the front of the saw...would the rear part of the fence not move on you? It only takes a small amount of play in the fence in this area to mess up your cut, right?
> 
> I am looking at a better fence for my old Craftsman TS, still have the original...and after reading this post I am definitely thinking of doing the same, altho I don't have any welding exp or weld equipment unfortunately.


I have a Beismeyer style fence on my table saw, and it appears to be very solid when locked.:thumbsup:

Gerry


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## Dusty82 (Dec 23, 2009)

A home made Beismeyer type fence for less than $100? :blink: Where do I sign up? 

Excellent job! :thumbsup:


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Dusty,
Sorry to bust your bubble but the rails and fence cost over $100 bucks to build, $107 and change to be exact :laughing::laughing::laughing: On a more serious note i will say this, if don't own or do not have access to a welder for the construction part of the rails and fence, then finding a deal on ebay or CL would be a better choice.


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## Dusty82 (Dec 23, 2009)

Still beats the skippy out of $500 for a Biesemeyer! My bubble remains firmly intact, my good man, and I stand by my statement that you did an excellent job. :thumbsup:

Now, where do I sign up for one...? :laughing:


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## SteveEl (Sep 7, 2010)

Funny how old threads come back to life, isn't it? That sounds like a cool project though I couldn't open any of your pics. 

FYI for others who stop by this thread, there is a no-welding alternative approach described in Tauntons "Working with Table Saws". Author Worth Barton says it performs like a high end fence and at time (1994) his parts cost $65. If I try it, I'll let you know how it goes.

SteveEl
CentralPA


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