# Ebonized Poplar with India Ink: Best Finish Would Be...?



## Pob (Feb 1, 2010)

Hi all, brand new to this forum. I am an artist (painter) and make my own frames. Have been struggling with finishing india ink ebonized poplar.

Quick breakdown of my process:

1. Milled poplar is mitred and glued to make frame.
2. Edges and "face" of frame sanded medium to fine. Very smooth finish.
3. India ink applied with the grain. This raises the grain a bit, though once dry, I rub the surface with dry rag, which smoothes things out a bit.
4. Often apply second coat of India, as it gives a truly deep ebony finish.

Now here's the problem:

for step 5, I've tried Tung oil, Minwax finish, olive oil, linseed oil, etc, but have settled on simple past wax lightly rubbed on, dried, then buffed off. sometimes this gives a grayish, smoky color to areas where the wax sunk in.

Tung oil and any of the stains remove too much of the india ink, which has me resorting to the past wax.

Is there a better product/process for getting a smooth, quick-drying, semi gloss finish to wood ebonized this way?


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

Some of the finishing gurus here will probably chime in with much better advice. But hardware store semi gloss spray lacquer (just the stuff in the rattle can) is easy to use and dries very fast. It should not effect your color.


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## Gene Howe (Feb 28, 2009)

Pob said:


> Hi all, brand new to this forum. I am an artist (painter) and make my own frames. Have been struggling with finishing india ink ebonized poplar.
> 
> Quick breakdown of my process:
> 
> ...


I would lightly sand (with 220 grit) just enough to remove the raised fibers after the 2nd coat of ink, apply a 3rd coat and rub it down with wadded craft paper or wadded grocery bags. 
EDIT: I've had good luck by dampening the raw wood with distilled water, allowing it to dry and sanding before introducing any water based colors. BTW, I didn't know that India ink was water based???
For the finish, you could try spray shellac. That should seal the ink. Then a coat of matte or semi gloss Polyurethane before waxing. If you feel it's still too glossy, apply the wax with 0000 steel wool.


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## Pob (Feb 1, 2010)

Gene Howe said:


> I would lightly sand (with 220 grit) just enough to remove the raised fibers after the 2nd coat of ink, apply a 3rd coat and rub it down with wadded craft paper or wadded grocery bags.
> EDIT: I've had good luck by dampening the raw wood with distilled water, allowing it to dry and sanding before introducing any water based colors. BTW, I didn't know that India ink was water based???
> For the finish, you could try spray shellac. That should seal the ink. Then a coat of matte or semi gloss Polyurethane before waxing. If you feel it's still too glossy, apply the wax with 0000 steel wool.


It washes up with water, and can be dulited by it, so I guess it is. Thanks for the info. I'll try the distilled water to force the raise, then sand it down. I assume a second "raising" of the grain would be greatly diminished? I've tried the lacquer sprays, but either I'm sloppy, or it has a propensity to dry in such a way that screams "amateur!" --which would be accurate. Wish there was something like tongue oil that could be worked into the wood after the ink ebonization, rather than sprayed on. The final effect I'm looking for isn't high-gloss piano ebony, but rather a not-dull, but not-shiny "natural" finish.


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## Gene Howe (Feb 28, 2009)

Pob said:


> It washes up with water, and can be dulited by it, so I guess it is. Thanks for the info. I'll try the distilled water to force the raise, then sand it down. I assume a second "raising" of the grain would be greatly diminished? I've tried the lacquer sprays, but either I'm sloppy, or it has a propensity to dry in such a way that screams "amateur!" --which would be accurate. Wish there was something like tongue oil that could be worked into the wood after the ink ebonization, rather than sprayed on. The final effect I'm looking for isn't high-gloss piano ebony, but rather a not-dull, but not-shiny "natural" finish.


Yep, second time around won't see as much grain raising.
Have you tried Dick Blick's Black Cat? It's water proof. Might be impervious to tung oil, too. Being water proof, it may not raise the grain, too. 
http://www.dickblick.com/products/blick-black-cat-waterproof-india-ink/#description
Do try the the spray shellac, though. It's forgiving and can be evened out with 0000 steel wool.


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## Pob (Feb 1, 2010)

Gene Howe said:


> Yep, second time around won't see as much grain raising.
> Have you tried Dick Blick's Black Cat? It's water proof. Might be impervious to tung oil, too. Being water proof, it may not raise the grain, too.
> http://www.dickblick.com/products/blick-black-cat-waterproof-india-ink/#description
> Do try the the spray shellac, though. It's forgiving and can be evened out with 0000 steel wool.


Very helpful, thanks. I use the Higgins India Ink (comes in big bottles), but hadn't seen the black cat. Will certainly try it. Will also get a can of spray shellac today and give it a shot. Thanks for the help. I'll post a followup, and perhaps some pictures.


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## bofa (Jul 17, 2010)

Hey Pob, sorry to reopen an old thread, but how did this process work out for you?


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## Gene Howe (Feb 28, 2009)

bofa said:


> Hey Pob, sorry to reopen an old thread, but how did this process work out for you?


Me too. Wonder if he's still active.


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## mdntrdr (Dec 22, 2009)

Gene Howe said:


> Me too. Wonder if he's still active.


Last activity was 2/1/10, the date of the OP.

I'm guessin not. :no:


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## Echofive (Dec 7, 2010)

I read this thread MANY times in the last several months. I was working on ways to ebonize hard maple, but after a few more projects I realized the lesser dense poplar was a better wood for my projects. I have not used any ebonizing techniques with poplar, but I did some extensive testing with maple.

I also used the Vinegar and steel wool method. Prior to using the steel wool method, I brewed a STRONG pitcher of black tea and brushed that on the wood. I brushed it on pretty thick and let it dry in. This 1) raises the grain which made subsequent sandings MUCH easier, and 2) the tea added tannins into the wood. The tannins are important AFTER the wood has been sanded and thoroughly dried. Then I brushed on my vinegar/steel wool. The wood darkened almost immediately. Still, after several brushings, and several days to allow the chemical reaction, I didn't achieve the deep black I was hoping for. It may work better on poplar versus maple since poplar isn't as dense.

I turned to india ink, which I found to be a little pricey, until I realized how far it went. Using maple, I diluted the india ink 5:1 with water. The idea was to make the ink as fluid as possible to penetrate the maple. HA.. fat chance. I will experiment with this further before trying on poplar. I'm betting the lesser dense poplar will soak the ink up more than maple.
My method with india ink:
Sand to 180, wipe with damp cloth, sand 180 again. (I'd use 220 on poplar) brush or rub india ink on. I went cross grain for initial coverage, rubbed with a sanding block and brown paper bag, then gave 2nd coat of ink going with the grain. Rubbed that down with paper bag. Using the spray shellac, gave it a nice coat, but not too thick, to seal the wood. This also made the ink more "fast", i.e, I didn't rub any ink off in following steps. After the shellac, I used semi-gloss poly thinned down to 3:1 with mineral spirits. This allows the air bubbles to pop a little easier. I added 5 coats, letting each dry but not cure. After the 5 coats cured, I gently sanded with 400 grit and mineral spirits to help it glide. This knocked the sheen off the finish, so I added 2 more coats, let it cure, then knocked that down with the paper bag again. I finished it off with Johnson's Paste Wax.

The finish came out durable and gorgeous. Now I hope my future projects come out as well as my test piece!!

I hope this information helps anyone struggling with this. My tests came from reading this and about (no lie) 200 threads from other websites.


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## Pob (Feb 1, 2010)

bofa said:


> Hey Pob, sorry to reopen an old thread, but how did this process work out for you?


I've been away from the forum for quite a while, and in checking in, apologize for leaving this comment unreplied to..

The Black Cat india ink is great, and the process has worked out fine, though still struggling with the finishing part. I put on two coats by brush, very thick to get a fully absorbed, rich black. Once dry, I rub the finish with dry heavy duck canvas which smoothes the finish nicely, but still leaves a little to be desired in terms of the satin finish I'm hoping for. To shellac, varnish, or otherwise "finish" the wood has not worked so far. Not sure why, but just seems to end up looking "amateur" (though, that's what I am). Just rubbing it down with canvas gives close to the finish. occasionally I have coated it with teak oil, and that has richened the blackness a bit, but doesn't do much for adding a bit of shine. All in all, though, the india ink is by far the best ebonizer solution.


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## Pob (Feb 1, 2010)

Echofive said:


> I read this thread MANY times in the last several months. I was working on ways to ebonize hard maple, but after a few more projects I realized the lesser dense poplar was a better wood for my projects. I have not used any ebonizing techniques with poplar, but I did some extensive testing with maple.
> 
> I also used the Vinegar and steel wool method. Prior to using the steel wool method, I brewed a STRONG pitcher of black tea and brushed that on the wood. I brushed it on pretty thick and let it dry in. This 1) raises the grain which made subsequent sandings MUCH easier, and 2) the tea added tannins into the wood. The tannins are important AFTER the wood has been sanded and thoroughly dried. Then I brushed on my vinegar/steel wool. The wood darkened almost immediately. Still, after several brushings, and several days to allow the chemical reaction, I didn't achieve the deep black I was hoping for. It may work better on poplar versus maple since poplar isn't as dense.
> 
> ...


Echo5, your solution worked for me. Have you had luck with the shellac? My problem is I often need to produce a frame in a day or two, and don't have the time to do multiple layers of shellac to achieve the best finish. So I rub the wood down with canvas to force a finish, but wish there was one more simple step/material I could apply to get a better end result.


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## Pob (Feb 1, 2010)

Gene Howe said:


> Me too. Wonder if he's still active.



Oops. Sorry all, I'm still here, just been very busy!


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

Pob said:


> My problem is I often need to produce a frame in a day or two, and don't have the time to do multiple layers of shellac to achieve the best finish. So I rub the wood down with canvas to force a finish, but wish there was one more simple step/material I could apply to get a better end result.



I have good luck with Poplar, Red Oak, and Maple, using an NGR (non-grain raising) aniline dye in black. When I used to spray lacquer, I used lacquer sanding sealer, and then water white clear in a satin finish. With waterbase polyurethane, I use no sealer. It gives as good a finish both in looks and feel as lacquer. Dries very fast and has an easy clean up.












 









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## Echofive (Dec 7, 2010)

Pob, I really don't have any place to work so my tool inventory is limited. Thus, my finishing area is limited, as well. The shellac I used, and I apologize in advance for throwing out brand names, is Bullseye shellac in a spray can. After I get the wood coated nicely with the ink, I let it dry well. Then I spray a good coat of the shellac on to seal everything. IF, and only if... the shellac needs a rubbing to smooth it out, I'll the use the brown paper bag. After that, I start with the polyurethane.

I'm a newby at all of this, too, but I thought I'd give my $.02 since I did have some experience.


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