# Need an accurate tape measure...any out there?



## jtrom

I am new to the wood scene and am kinda disappointed at the accuracy of brand new tapes I am buying off the shelf. Any help?


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## Gene Howe

IMO, tapes are mere estimates. I have 3 Stanley tapes and some off brands, too. None measure exactly the same.
Just find one you like (easy to read, works well mechanically, easy to use, etc) and use it, and only it, throughout an entire project. An inch and 3/8 may not really be an inch and 3/8 but it will be the same for each piece of "inch and 3/8" you make.
I try really hard to not use a tape in the shop. I use story sticks, known width blocks, 1,2,3 blocks, keyway stock, etc.


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## cabinetman

jtrom said:


> I am new to the wood scene and am kinda disappointed at the accuracy of brand new tapes I am buying off the shelf. Any help?



I've got several brands and sizes, but prefer Stanley Powerlock II. I check it against a 6' steel rule. I use the same tape throughout the project.


















 







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## Gene Howe

C-man, looks like you raided my tape drawer. :laughing:


cabinetman said:


> I've got several brands and sizes, but prefer Stanley Powerlock II. I check it against a 6' steel rule. I use the same tape throughout the project.
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## firemedic

I know I'm going to hear that they ain't no good, cause I seem to be the only one who likes em...

But I really like Lufkin 25' self centering tapes. In fact I have at least a dozen of em. :smile: still never can seem to find one though :laughing:

~tom "Ignorance is not a lack of intelligence - it's a lack of know-how"


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## ccrow

I prefer the Stanley FatMax, but I end up using my Komelon fractional more than anything. I'm sure I'll get some crap about using a fractional tape, but ah well. I'm sure there a bigger offenses out there.


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## cocheseuga

What's inaccurate about it?

I don't know about accuracy, but the best one I've held in my hand is the Stanley Leverlock.


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## cabinetman

Gene Howe said:


> C-man, looks like you raided my tape drawer. :laughing:


Hey Gene...do you have one of those Blum tape measures (like in my picture) too? I'll bet it's a collectors item by now.









 







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## woodnthings

*accuracy "test"*

Get a bunch and hook each one to a fixed object and run them out to 10 ft. see if they match. Discard the ones that are "off", keep the ones that match. I use the same theory in selecting outside thermometers. See how many say exactly the same in the store. Pick one of those. Probably close enough.

Just be sure the hooks on the ends more freely, 'cause that will throw off your inside and outside measurements...if you dare use them that way...... :blink: bill


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## WillemJM

Interesting thread.

I had no idea that tape measures are not accurate and are a problem.

The way I work is where extreme accuracy is necessary, I normally oversize and then creep up to the final dimension by sizing and fitting, until it fits perfectly. If I have items which all need to be the same size, I set up so I only measure the first one, the rest follow with a stop block, or other means so they are all exactly the same.

Squares are a different issue which can really get me into trouble. Not many squares are actually square.


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## Gene Howe

Not a Bum one but, one shaped like it. Got that orange one and the fat yellow one as well as the metal Stanleys and the 100 ft tape. My favorite is the 12' Stanley Powerlock II, which I understand is no longer made.
Around the house, the wife has probably a dozen of those small ones that used to be given away as advertisements. I can't read them, the tape is so skinny.:thumbdown: I stole her red sewing tape to measure belts and other circumferences. :laughing:



cabinetman said:


> Hey Gene...do you have one of those Blum tape measures (like in my picture) too? I'll bet it's a collectors item by now.
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## woodnthings

WillemJM said:


> Interesting thread.
> 
> Squares are a different issue which can really get me into trouble. *Not many squares are actually square.*N


I got a couple of buddies who are really square.... :blink:... actually not real buddies, but real square. Nice, but square.  bill


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## BigBull

We either purchase Starrett or Lufkin tapes for our shop.


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## WillemJM

woodnthings said:


> I got a couple of buddies who are really square.... :blink:... actually not real buddies, but real square. Nice, but square.  bill


They must be old and special, the younger generation sold at the box stores are far from square. :laughing:

You still get "Squares" though, linky below. They have expensive American habits though.

http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2000437/762/STARRETT-12-Combination-Square.aspx


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## Lancer33

I use steel rules....6" to 1 Meter.


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## tvman44

I like the Stanley Power Lock II but they are hard to find anymore.


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## Dominick

I use a stanley. But then again a tape line is a tape line. They all measure the same.


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## jtrom

My accuracy problem stems from the amount of "play" in the hook at the beginning of the tape. Each tape, even same models, seem to have different amounts of play and slightly different measurments. How do even use a tape for an inside measurement with all that play?


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## Dominick

That play is there for a reason. Not sure if you new that. For measuring internal & external measurements.


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## tcleve4911

Ever use the "burn an inch" method?


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## jtrom

I am thinking in theory the play in the hook should equal the thickness of the material of the hook...but the play is a lil different for each tape measure, even the same model, resulting slightly different measurements...I am talking like 1/32 of an inch. I am beginning to think that tapes were never meant to be that accurate. I am new to wood but have experience with metal work, engines ect. where 1/32 was a lot.


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## cabinetman

jtrom said:


> I am thinking in theory the play in the hook should equal the thickness of the material of the hook...but the play is a lil different for each tape measure, even the same model, resulting slightly different measurements...I am talking like 1/32 of an inch. I am beginning to think that tapes were never meant to be that accurate. I am new to wood but have experience with metal work, engines ect. where 1/32 was a lot.


The thickness of the tab, and allowance, is more like 1/16" than 1/32".










 







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## jtrom

cabinetman said:


> The thickness of the tab, and allowance, is more like 1/16" than 1/32".
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Right, I am just saying one tape can be off by 1/32 inch from another tape, if put side by side


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## jtrom

Let me rephrase my question : What is the best quality and most accurate tape measure on the market?


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## GeorgeC

jtrom said:


> I am new to the wood scene and am kinda disappointed at the accuracy of brand new tapes I am buying off the shelf. Any help?


I have never had a tape measure that was not accurate for any work that I was doing.

George


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## Dominick

GeorgeC said:


> I have never had a tape measure that was not accurate for any work that I was doing.
> 
> George


+1 George. Maybe I'm missing something here lol.


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## tcleve4911

Are we talking accuracy or ease of use?

I use a Stanley Powerlock.
It has a whole bunch of numbers and little lines that look just like every other Stanley Powerlock.


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## jtrom

Maybe I just bought a bad tape measure.....my Stanley fat max is slighty off when I put it up against a steel ruler


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## bentwood

jtrom said:


> I am new to the wood scene and am kinda disappointed at the accuracy of brand new tapes I am buying off the shelf. Any help?





jtrom said:


> Let me rephrase my question : What is the best quality and most accurate tape measure on the market?


My first thought was that when somthing doesn't fit , it's usualy because of a mistake on my part rather than a sub-standard measuring tool.
But since you asked,the answer as you first asked is,I would say get yourself a 10' to 12' Stanley tape like most of us use to start with. 
As far as what is best quility and most accurate,Starrett is widly thought to be as good as they come for measurements if you insist on presision. 
Unless you have managed to aquire state of art sizeing and cutting tools,I suggest not stressing over tape measures.
This stuff is supposed to be fun. 
Regardless what some might tell you that they are capiable of,no project is perfect. To the contrary,the most highly sought after furnitue in the world shows tool marks and less than laser perfect joints.


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## ModCo Design

I use Stanley for everyday use, but when it comes to finish and furniture I use the fastcap tape measures like the ones in the link, they are very accurate and helps having standard and metric on the same tape. 

http://woodworker.com/cgi-bin/fullp..._medium=feed&gclid=COu2kpKgzK4CFeYGRQodylxoBA


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## Katoman

I use a Tajima on the site and really like it. In the shop I just use a 12' Stanley. I don't think it matters that much as long as you use the same tape. 

I take the clips off my tapes as I never use them anyways.

For super accuracy on smaller stuff I use a starett ruler.


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## tcleve4911

jtrom said:


> Maybe I just bought a bad tape measure.....my Stanley fat max is slighty off when I put it up against a steel ruler


Are you hooking the tab or lining up the hash marks? 
I can't believe the tape measure itself would be off.....


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## Evilfrog

bentwood said:


> My first thought was that when somthing doesn't fit , it's usualy because of a mistake on my part rather than a sub-standard measuring tool.
> But since you asked,the answer as you first asked is,I would say get yourself a 10' to 12' Stanley tape like most of us use to start with.
> As far as what is best quility and most accurate,Starrett is widly thought to be as good as they come for measurements if you insist on presision.
> Unless you have managed to aquire state of art sizeing and cutting tools,I suggest not stressing over tape measures.
> This stuff is supposed to be fun.
> Regardless what some might tell you that they are capiable of,no project is perfect. To the contrary,the most highly sought after furnitue in the world shows tool marks and less than laser perfect joints.


While you're correct that furniture doesn't require high precision, other projects like; for instance, instrument making; do. Then again, I wouldn't use a tape measure for those projects. 

Starrett tape measures aren't that expensive. I can vouch for their other measuring tools. But i've never own one of their tape measures. However, if you are really worried about accuracy, i'd check them out as bentwood suggested.


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## Steve Neul

I have several different brands of tape measures. Lately I've been accumulating Harbor Freight tapes because I can get them free with a coupon. They all measure a little different so I use the top of my table saw as a reference. It is exactly 27" long so I bend the end of my tapes in or out until they measure 27" on my saw. I also use this to fix a tape that has been dropped on the floor.


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## cheese9988

Wow, alot of misinformation here.

First off, the federal specifications for a retractable tape measure are +/- 1/32 inch for the first twelve feet, +/- 1/16 inch above that. Most companies will exceed this tolerance, but you have to call because they vary from tape to tape.

The federal spec for a long line steel tape (type you have to roll up) is +/- 0.100 inch/100 ft with a specific amount of tension applied depending on the length.

Yes the hook moves the thickness of its tab to account for inside measurements.

Comparing two tape measures by lining them up side by side is not the correct way to calibrate a tape measure. You either need an optical comparator (and alot of free time), a cmm, or a laser interferometer.

Starrett tape measures are terrible imo. Its not because they are usually out of tolerance, it is because the lock and the reel are poor designs. The locks either fail and won't hold the tape, or the reel is so tight near the end that you have to force it out. I am in no way saying their products are bad, I am just saying they should start making them domestically again.

The Lufkins and Stanley tapes are much better. The Lufkins have the best locking mechanisms and almost always exceed their own tolerances by a substantial amount. The Stanleys are the most durable, ever see the commercials with the hammer hitting their product over and over again, thats them. The coating on the Stanley tapes seem thicker, how long that prevents rust, I'm not sure.

Chinese tapes, stay far, far away. The metal is often cheap, not treated correctly and the hook is a soft metal and often bends easily. This means that years later your tape is rusted and has either shrunk/grown due to the metal not being aged enough. The hook has bent out and the rivets are coming out. What are the Chinese tapes accurate to, does China have a standards bureau to conform to?

Your not going to get much better than than 0.030 inch on a tape. Starrett, Lufkin and Stanley are all similar in accuracy, each specs their tapes differently though. If you need something more accurate, steel rules are as accurate as +/- 0.0025 inch for a Starrett (would recommend). Get a caliper for even more accuracy (+/- 0.001 inch).


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## jtrom

Thanks for clearing that up Cheese. The reason I need such accuracy is I am building a wooden homebuilt aircraft, not furniture. Just the horizontal tail, made from Sitka Spruce, is 8 ft. long, and being off by 1/32 of an inch could be trouble. I probably need a long steel ruler....at least 60 inches...


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## Possumpoint

In my opinion it matters not which brand or type of tape measure you use so long as you use the same one throughout the project.


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## truckjohn

If you are worried about the accuracy of your tape measure - then you should buy a papered/calibrated model rather than a normal shelf model....

They are a more or less standard item at many gage houses and industrial supply places.. and they are going to come to you certified to some specific accuracy....

Expect to pay more.. but then again - you will pay more if you want something accurate vs something cheap...

Thanks


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## Pirate

tcleve4911 said:


> Ever use the "burn an inch" method?


All the time.


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## Irishroey

just wondering in anyone has experience with these tapes and what their thought were 

http://www.tooled-up.com/ManCategory.asp?MID=FES1&CID=8


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## MastersHand

Pirate said:


> All the time.


Ever get Burned?


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## MastersHand

I wrote a thread on which tape do you use. Theres a lot of different opinions on the subject. I would say in your case building an aircraft to go metric it doesn't get more precise. Also something to think about is your pencil. I use 0.5 mechanical pencils and my tape is a 16' metric Stanley . I use a fat max for measuring the room I'm putting woodwork in.


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## cheese9988

Irishroey said:


> just wondering in anyone has experience with these tapes and what their thought were
> 
> http://www.tooled-up.com/ManCategory.asp?MID=FES1&CID=8


Get a lufkin, they are less than $20 at home depot. As I have explained, their lock and reel mechanisms are the cadillacs. Most of them roll up like they are on ball bearings. The item you posted is an off brand.


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## cheese9988

MastersHand said:


> I wrote a thread on which tape do you use. Theres a lot of different opinions on the subject. I would say in your case building an aircraft to go metric it doesn't get more precise. Also something to think about is your pencil. I use 0.5 mechanical pencils and my tape is a 16' metric Stanley . I use a fat max for measuring the room I'm putting woodwork in.


Are you saying the metric tapes are more accurate? In the case of tapes, they are not. Just convert English to metric and the tolerance is the same.


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## MastersHand

cheese9988 said:


> Are you saying the metric tapes are more accurate? In the case of tapes, they are not. Just convert English to metric and the tolerance is the same.


It's exactly what I'm saying unless you get one with 32nd and 64ths otherwise 10 1/2" " heavy is not my idea of accurate I like to work to the " Exact











I do HighEnd work and anything that gives me better results I go with. We IMO should switch to metric


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## lawrence

SAE is by far the most accurate* and usable system . The metric system jumps from millimeters which is a huge space to micrometers which are too small to use effectively whereas SAE is, as stated, when brought down to 32nds and 64ths, just perfect for any use. 
May be if they would at least extend a millimeter mark(say the 5th one)to use as reference so you dont have to count each one in that 10 block,then just maybe it would be practical .
*they are both just as accurate as you care to break it down, but you have to consider practical usage in the overall performance


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## Longknife

lawrence said:


> SAE is by far the most accurate* and usable system . The metric system jumps from millimeters which is a huge space to micrometers which are too small to use effectively whereas SAE is, as stated, when brought down to 32nds and 64ths, just perfect for any use.
> May be if they would at least extend a millimeter mark(say the 5th one)to use as reference so you dont have to count each one in that 10 block,then just maybe it would be practical .
> *they are both just as accurate as you care to break it down, but you have to consider practical usage in the overall performance


I don't want to start a Metric vs Imperial war here as I understand this is a sensitive subject. I just want to clarify a few things.

The ruler in the picture below has a 1 mm scale with *every 5th mm marked. *The lower scale has 1/2 mm increments wich is the smallest my eyes can deal with and IMO covers most of the applications in WW.

You are not limted to millimeters and micrometers, you can also use 1/10 of a mm. One example is on calipers as shown in the picture.


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## GeorgeC

lawrence said:


> SAE is by far the most accurate* and usable system . The metric system jumps from millimeters which is a huge space to micrometers which are too small to use effectively whereas SAE is, as stated, when brought down to 32nds and 64ths, just perfect for any use.
> May be if they would at least extend a millimeter mark(say the 5th one)to use as reference so you dont have to count each one in that 10 block,then just maybe it would be practical .
> *they are both just as accurate as you care to break it down, but you have to consider practical usage in the overall performance


Your statement that SAE is the most accurate is not correct. Any system will provide the same accuracy if used properly.

George


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## cabinetman

GeorgeC said:


> Your statement that SAE is the most accurate is not correct. Any system will provide the same accuracy if used properly.
> 
> George


+1. :yes: You could also add...as accurate as you can see.










 







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## Itchytoe

lawrence said:


> The metric system jumps from millimeters which is a huge space to micrometers which are too small to use effectively


That's not really true. The metric system allows the use of things like decimillimeters, and centimillimeters, which are 1/10 and 1/100 of a millimeter respectively. The two terms are rarely used, but the idea is often used. 5.5 millimeters? That's just 55 decimillimeters, or 550 centimillimeters. The metric system divides all measurements in tenths, even though the US doesn't know about it. The vast majority of the world uses it for a reason. 


When it all comes down to it, no 2 are exactly the same, and none of them match what you consider the standard to be. They're all off a little. Typically, if you use the same brand, they'll all be off by the same amount, so it won't make a difference in the end result. In fact, you could make up your own system and use that. As long as it's consistent, you'll be fine. Nobody else will know what you're talking about when you tell them your desk is exactly 14 snarfs long and 7.5 snarfs deep though.


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## lawrence

GeorgeC said:


> Your statement that SAE is the most accurate is not correct. Any system will provide the same accuracy if used properly.
> 
> George


That's the reason the * page note was used

accurate and usable , has to be both or is worthless


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## woodnthings

*Any Komelon fans?*

Rockler has a great sale on 16 footers:
http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=31386&utm_source=NL&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=V2101


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## lawrence

Longknife said:


> The ruler in the picture below has a 1 mm scale with *every 5th mm marked. *The lower scale has 1/2 mm increments wich is the smallest my eyes can deal with and IMO covers most of the applications in WW.
> View attachment 41135


 Never seen one like that, could be useful, but still leaves you counting lines 


Longknife said:


> You are not limted to millimeters and micrometers, you can also use 1/10 of a mm. One example is on calipers as shown in the picture.
> 
> View attachment 41135


far too small for WW...that would be like measuring to 1/254th


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## GeorgeC

lawrence said:


> That's the reason the * page note was used
> 
> accurate and usable , has to be both or is worthless


Just when did a little "*" become a "page note?"

Are you attempting to say that the metric system is not usable? If so that would be am amazing and incomprehensible remark.



George


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## hands made for wood

After reading some of the comments made on this thread, i've decided to start using the metric system.. I'm only 18, but I strive for accuracy, perfection, and efficiency in all my projects and the more I think about it, metric will help me do just that. :smile: It will take some transitioning, but i'm up for It!

I appreciate all the helpful insight guys :yes:


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## HandToolGuy

woodnthings said:


> Rockler has a great sale on 16 footers:


I am a huge Komelon fan. I bought a 25 ft model a year or two ago and pretty much stopped using my other tapes. Thanks for the tip on the 16 ft model sale.


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## cheese9988

Where do you guys get your information from???

SAE (society for automotive engineers) is a set of standards to which automobile manufacturers conform to. What does this have to do with a ruler???

GGG-T-106f is the federal standard for tape measures and rulers. You can buy a ruler in any increment you want. Hell Starrett will even custom manufacture them for a price. Most metric rules will come in 1 mm or 0.5 mm, but most manufacturers will sell other scales.

1 mm scale = 1/25.4 = 0.040 inch rounded
0.5 mm scale = 0.5/25.4 = 0.020 inch rounded
1/32 inch = 0.031 inch rounded
1/64 inch = 0.016 inch rounded

Your going to tell me that you can see a difference of 0.009 inch and 0.004 inch on a piece of wood??? I would also like to point out that only the machinists rules have tolerances below +/- 0.010 inch.


As for the metric system, we are the ONLY country that does not use it. We are very slowly moving toward it. Many companies already use it as well as the NIST. People just don't know it.

The SI unit for length is the meter, which is defined by NIST and other international bodies as the distance light travels in 1/299792485th of a second. NIST has to transfer that measurement to the English system which adds a greater uncertainty to the measurement.

Furthermore the metric system is more standardized. Right down to which units to use and how they are written. Every derived unit traces itself back to an SI unit of measurement. The English system is an extremely old system that is open to interpretation. You can literally say my car is traveling at 10 garage door lengths per second. But whats the length of my garage door compared to yours?

English:
1/4 + 1/8 + 1/16 + 1/16 = 1 inch
12 inch = a foot
5280 feet = mile

Metric:
1000 mm = 1 meter
1000 m = 1 kilometer
10 mm = 1 cm
1 micrometer (micron) = 0.001 mm

All your doing is moving a decimal point around instead of useless conversions and fractions. When we use metric at work, we talk in microns (0.001 mm). Machinists will usually use thousands and tenthousands for English and the same for metric. 2 micron is roughly 1 tenthousand.


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## woodnthings

*Good Info*

I've worked in both systems at GM, they both are fine, tho we used 1/10s and /100's , not fractions. We split a mm's to 1/2 when measuring by eye. 
My Question is on this:
Metric:
1000 mm = 1 meter
1000 m = 1 kilometer
10 mm = 1 cm
*1 m = 0.001 mm*
1 micrometer (micron) = 0.001 mm

Can you explain, or is it a typo? :blink: bill


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## cheese9988

woodnthings said:


> I've worked in both systems at GM, they both are fine, tho we used 1/10s and /100's , not fractions. We split a mm's to 1/2 when measuring by eye.
> My Question is on this:
> Metric:
> 1000 mm = 1 meter
> 1000 m = 1 kilometer
> 10 mm = 1 cm
> *1 m = 0.001 mm*
> 1 micrometer (micron) = 0.001 mm
> 
> Can you explain, or is it a typo? :blink: bill


Thats a typo. Should be the other way around 1 m = 1000 mm. :thumbsup:


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## lawrence

GeorgeC said:


> Just when did a little "*" become a "page note?"


I meant footnote



GeorgeC said:


> Are you attempting to say that the metric system is not usable? If so that would be am amazing and incomprehensible remark.
> 
> 
> 
> George


Oh no, any knowledge is of benefit, while usable it is not valuable enough to warrant re-education. To a person in the scientific fields it may come in handy because it is easy to handle mathematically, but to the layman it has little to none benefits. Which is why we Americans dont use it as our official measurement system.
I gave it a try today...I think I broke it...it just wont work right for me....lol


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## lawrence

cheese9988 said:


> Where do you guys get your information from???
> 
> SAE (society for automotive engineers) is a set of standards to which automobile manufacturers conform to. What does this have to do with a ruler???


SAE means Standard American Equivalent and has for far longer than the society for automotive engineers or even automobiles for that matter.

As far as the ruler part goes:
http://www.kmstools.com/magnum-6-metric-sae-ruler-514

http://www.hobbytoolsupply.com/prod...rchitecture-SAE-Scale-%2d-SOLID-ALUMINUM.html


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## cocheseuga

lawrence said:


> I meant footnote
> 
> 
> Oh no, any knowledge is of benefit, while usable it is not valuable enough to warrant re-education. To a person in the scientific fields it may come in handy because it is easy to handle mathematically, but to the layman it has little to none benefits. Which is why we Americans dont use it as our official measurement system.
> I gave it a try today...I think I broke it...it just wont work right for me....lol


Not that I necessarily disagree, but it's far easier to divide and multiply by a factor of ten than to try and figure out all the convoluted ways us Americans have in converting stuff.

Going from a teaspoon to a gallon requires a fair bit of thought. A milliliter to a liter doesn't.


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## lawrence

cocheseuga said:


> Not that I necessarily disagree, but it's far easier to divide and multiply by a factor of ten than to try and figure out all the convoluted ways us Americans have in converting stuff.
> 
> Going from a teaspoon to a gallon requires a fair bit of thought. A milliliter to a liter doesn't.


I agree with that....but then again my construction calculator takes it in stride....lol


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## Measure Once

*Not all Tape Measures are bad*

:yes:


jtrom said:


> I am new to the wood scene and am kinda disappointed at the accuracy of brand new tapes I am buying off the shelf. Any help?


A Tape Measure Calibration Tool will help you find an accurate tape measure.

Placing a properly bent "End Hook" in the right location, with the rivets set just right, and exactly in line with the blade, is a real challenge for tape measure manufactures. They make too many, too fast, and they make them in China or Mexico where no one really cares how your project comes out. 

Use a tape measure calibrator to find an accurate tape measure at the store. Then use it to keep your tape measure accurate.


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## Woodwart

I always figure I'm making a piece of furniture, not an F35 Stealth Fighter. If I'm off by 1/32" I can work around that.


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## Woodwart

lawrence said:


> SAE means Standard American Equivalent and has for far longer than the society for automotive engineers or even automobiles for that matter.
> 
> As far as the ruler part goes:
> http://www.kmstools.com/magnum-6-metric-sae-ruler-514
> 
> http://www.hobbytoolsupply.com/prod...rchitecture-SAE-Scale-%2d-SOLID-ALUMINUM.html


Oh, come on! Everyone knows it stands for Self Addressed Envelope!


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## Chris Curl

Woodwart said:


> I always figure I'm making a piece of furniture, not an F35 Stealth Fighter. If I'm off by 1/32" I can work around that.


i'm with you on this one. working with wood is not a very exact thing, what with the way it can move over time and swell and contract with the weather.

there are other methods for making sure everything fits together snug and square and clean, none of which involve a tape measure.


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## woodnthings

*as suggested*

Just use the same measure for the entire project from determining the size of the room to setting the fence on the saw. Any variation won't matter that way. If you are selecting at the store and can run several out to a 10 ft length, see if they all read the same when hooked over the same piece.
If one reads different than the other, don't get that one. I buy in multiples of 3 anyway, so I can at least find one of them. Now I have a drawer full, but I can't remember which drawer it is....gotta get some labels. :blink:


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## firemedic

I probably already posted this in this thread but I'm too lazy to go back and find it...

I very rarely use a tape measure. Story sticks mostly. If I measure any thing it's the top of a table or the height of a leg or panel... Otherwise it's just whatever looks right.


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## firemedic

firemedic said:


> I know I'm going to hear that they ain't no good, cause I seem to be the only one who likes em...
> 
> But I really like Lufkin 25' self centering tapes. In fact I have at least a dozen of em. :smile: still never can seem to find one though :laughing:
> 
> ~tom "Ignorance is not a lack of intelligence - it's a lack of know-how"


Maybe THAT'S why I never use em! :laughing:


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## Moark Willy

jtrom said:


> I am new to the wood scene and am kinda disappointed at the accuracy of brand new tapes I am buying off the shelf. Any help?


It's not the tapes......if you get my drift.....:laughing:


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## jharris2

Woodwart said:


> Oh, come on! Everyone knows it stands for Self Addressed Envelope!


That's SASE (Self Addressed Stamped Envelope)


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## johnmark

measuring is the enemy of precision.


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## Woodwart

jharris2 said:


> That's SASE (Self Addressed Stamped Envelope)


Not if you don't put a stamp on it!


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## DaveTTC

I find my digital laser to be an accurate measure. It is a Makita I think, measure from about 6" 150mm to length of a house block 50 metres whatever that is in imperial. And it compares with my tape to the mm, what ever that is in parts of an inch.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## GeorgeC

jtrom said:


> I am new to the wood scene and am kinda disappointed at the accuracy of brand new tapes I am buying off the shelf. Any help?


What have you done to determine that the tape measures that you are buying are not accurate?

To my knowledge I have never had a tape measure that was not perfectly adequate for what I used it for. All I ever use a tape measure for is woodworking and carpentry.

George


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## cabinetman

Steve Neul said:


> I have several different brands of tape measures. Lately I've been accumulating Harbor Freight tapes because I can get them free with a coupon. They all measure a little different so I use the top of my table saw as a reference. It is exactly 27" long so I bend the end of my tapes in or out until they measure 27" on my saw. I also use this to fix a tape that has been dropped on the floor.


Well Stevie...I would never do that. All you've done is to make the first 27" read the same. What about the rest of the tape? There is the possibility that it's printed incorrectly. 








 







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## Gene Howe

+100



firemedic said:


> i probably already posted this in this thread but i'm too lazy to go back and find it...
> 
> I very rarely use a tape measure. Story sticks mostly. If i measure any thing it's the top of a table or the height of a leg or panel... Otherwise it's just whatever looks right.


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## Steve Neul

cabinetman said:


> Well Stevie...I would never do that. All you've done is to make the first 27" read the same. What about the rest of the tape? There is the possibility that it's printed incorrectly.
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The only variable on a tape measure is the tab on the end. If you get is synchronized with the print the tape will measure accurately. Very rarely do I need to do anything with a tape measure. It's mostly when one gets dropped and bent. As far as the accuracy of the print, in the 40+ years in the business I've never seen one not printed accurate even with harbor freight freebees. Everything I cut fits.


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## Art Smith

"English:
1/4 + 1/8 + 1/16 + 1/16 = 1 inch
12 inch = a foot
5280 feet = mile"

There you have it! This is why all my stuff comes up too long!:laughing:
I have been thinking that 1/4 + 1/8 +1/16 +1/16 = 1/2 for a long time

Cut it proud and trim to fit.....or use a heavy mallet to adjust!


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## Chris Curl

cabinetman said:


> What about the rest of the tape? There is the possibility that it's printed incorrectly.


It seems to me that is a worry that is at the same time not very realistic, and also extremely difficult to determine.

If you are going to worry about that, are you also going to worry that the distance between inchs 17 and 18 might be a tad big, but the difference is made up because it is a tad short between 16 and 17?


Art Smith said:


> Cut it proud and trim to fit


great advice!


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## railaw

Measure Once said:


> :yes:
> 
> A Tape Measure Calibration Tool will help you find an accurate tape measure.
> 
> Placing a properly bent "End Hook" in the right location, with the rivets set just right, and exactly in line with the blade, is a real challenge for tape measure manufactures. They make too many, too fast, and they make them in China or Mexico where no one really cares how your project comes out.
> 
> Use a tape measure calibrator to find an accurate tape measure at the store. Then use it to keep your tape measure accurate.


I believe the Stanley fax max brand tapes are still made in new Britain ct. Or at least assembled there. Let put it this way, if you go to their factory there's a huge dumpster outside full of tapes (unwound and without cases) that haven't passed muster.


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## cabinetman

Chris Curl said:


> It seems to me that is a worry that is at the same time not very realistic, and also extremely difficult to determine.
> 
> If you are going to worry about that, are you also going to worry that the distance between inchs 17 and 18 might be a tad big, but the difference is made up because it is a tad short between 16 and 17?


I don't worry about it. Having other tapes to check it eliminates my concern. But it could be possible that somewhere along the tape there could be a problem. But, I wouldn't do what Steve does to the ends of the tapes.









 







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## Measure Once

cabinetman said:


> Well Stevie...I would never do that. All you've done is to make the first 27" read the same. What about the rest of the tape? There is the possibility that it's printed incorrectly.
> 
> Bending the End Hook to regain accuracy will only work if your tape
> measure was accurate to begin with. The biggest culprit of accuracy problems is the dropped tape. This can easily shorten a tape measure 1/8". A Tape Measure Calibrator (a Lixer) will make this easy.
> 
> The printing on Starrett and Lufkin tape measures are much better than Stanley. If accuracy is an issue don't use generic tapes.
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## Ike Man

*Reply*

Hello Jtrom, 
I understand your dilemma entirely. I purchase the tape measures for the employees at my Manufacturing Company and reject 75% due to the scales being different. I've purchased tape measures for the last 20 years and am amazed at the acceptable tolerances. 
For a woodworker in their home shop or even a production facility, the error is acceptable (wood can be made to fit) But for a metal production plant the error cant be allowed; or items wont work. 
If GM or Toyota used the tape measures with the allowed tolerances, YIKES! 
I understand the problem totally and take a two percision measurement devices with me to the store and only purchase the tape measures that make the cut.


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## Steve Neul

I probably have around a dozen tape measures which 6 are the harbor freight freebies. They all measure alike except for one of the HF tapes. I think tapes have gotten better over the years. I've worked at shops where you couldn't cut anything unless you used the one shop tape measure.


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## Measure Once

Ike Man said:


> Hello Jtrom,
> I understand your dilemma entirely. I purchase the tape measures for the employees at my Manufacturing Company and reject 75% due to the scales being different. I've purchased tape measures for the last 20 years and am amazed at the acceptable tolerances.
> For a woodworker in their home shop or even a production facility, the error is acceptable (wood can be made to fit) But for a metal production plant the error cant be allowed; or items wont work.
> If GM or Toyota used the tape measures with the allowed tolerances, YIKES!
> I understand the problem totally and take a two percision measurement devices with me to the store and only purchase the tape measures that make the cut.


We have a cabinet shop and accurate measurements are important to us as well. Inaccurate measurements cost time and money and certainly a great deal of frustration. 

We also use "two precision measurement devices" a calibrated tape measure and a tape measure calibration tool (Lixer Tools) www.lixertools.com. This helps everyone in our shop stay on the same page (peacefully).


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## Fastback

I live near a HF so I get lot of free tapes. I would guess I have between 40 and 50 tapes, but I don't use these they are just hung for display or if ever used to find the distance between to points. The tapes that do get used are my Stanley's. I have several but lately I have been migrating to my Fat Max, I think because I can see it better. To be honest when in the shop I use my Lufkin folding 6-foot rule. It is what my Father a union carpenter always used. Old habits are hard to brake.

The main thing is to always use the same measuring device on a project that you started with.

Paul


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## ryan50hrl

I'm really disappointed in the fat max tapes lately. I just bought a new one to replace the one that found its way into the saw blade (by the way...the blade armor doesn't hold up against a radial arm saw attack) and the new ones blade printing seems much less precise and clear. Hoping its a bad batch, but over all the tape measure seems cheaper.


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## Sleeper

I only really know of one tape that was completely out of whack and it was something my mother-in-law bought from a dollar store. 

I found that as long as I use the same tape throughout a project I don't have a problem. Its only when I'm measuring something to relay to someone else that things go wrong, but even than it's usually less than an 1/8" depending on how long the measurement is.

Anyway I wasn't going to respond to this when I realized how old this thread is, but since so many have already replied I figured what the heck


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## smoothjazz077

I just use the same tape measure for the entire project. Keep it simple.

Scott


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