# Shop Fire



## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

I know lots of reasons for shop fires, but what I really want to know is first hand experience.

Has anyone here ever had a shop fire?
And do you know or suspect what caused it?


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## John Smith_inFL (Jul 4, 2018)

one of my best friends had a fairly large sign shop, 
with all wood framing. after cutting his grass with
a riding mower, he parked it behind the shop under a lean-to. 
went in his house to take a shower only to be summoned
to the door with loud banging by his neighbor.
the lawnmower apparently had a leak in the fuel hose
and when gas dripped onto the hot muffler and caught fire.
quickly spreading to the wood framed building.
the structure was fully engulfed by time the fire trucks arrived.
the complete building and all its contents was a total loss.
so - not all fires originate _inside_ the building. 

my personal experience was a lightning strike on the office part
of the building. small fire on the desk with papers and stuff.
but, no physical damage other than all the electronics were toast.

.


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## Pineknot_86 (Feb 19, 2016)

Hmmm. Have smoke detector in the shop with several more around the house. Watch things in the shop that could cause a fire. Also have a fire extinguisher in the shop, right inside the door to be used elsewhere.


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## Kerrys (May 2, 2016)

A long time ago, almost to long ago to remember I worked for a cabinet shop that suffered a fire and two explosions. Believe it or not one of the explosions saved the shop. It started with a pile of overspray that had been swept up in the paint booth and discarded in a five gallon bucket. The bucket should have been disposed of but instead was forgotten and left in the paint booth at quitting time. Sometime during the night the bucket about a third full of overspray powder self ignited. This stuff poured out thick, heavy, extremely flammable smoke, filling the paint booth until it exploded, flattening all four walls of the booth and destroying the ceiling. This explosion shook the hell out of the rest of the shop which filled the air with fine sawdust that in turn exploded. The dust explosion blew every door and window out of the building including two large sliding doors that I would say were about ten foot high by twelve foot wide. One of the sliding doors, or should I say what was left of the door was blown about twenty to thirty feet away. The dust explosion also literally blow out almost all of any fire that was present. When the fire department arrived they said that other than a few small smoldering pieces of wood there was no fire. 

Almost all of the equipment in the shop was still operating and stacks of material such as plywood or hardwood were fine only the top sheet or layer was slightly scorched. A day of cleaning, replacing doors, windows and the shop was back at work. We had to build a new paint booth.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

@Kerrys
Now that's one hell of a story
For one thing, I never would have thought that the lacquer overspray dust would self ignite. I just sweep it up and never give it a thought. It makes sense, but I never gave it a thought. 

When I first started woodworking, ny shop was less than a week old in a warehouse building. We were closing up later than normal and and my eyes started to burn. So did my girlfriends. We searched all over and could not find the source. Then I kicked a pile of old stain rags and it started to smoke. I quickly kicked it more to spread the rags out on the concrete floor. and problem was found and safely taken care of. I simply poured water on the rags and put them outside on top of the concrete.

Not even a year later, one day I heard this whoosh sound. I looked around and barely able to see a very light colored flame slowly creeping up a wall and then disappeared at about 4 or 5 feet from the ground. For a few seconds I was in a panic. I had 55 gal drums of nitrocellulous lacquer, lacquer thinner and Methyline Chloride. I wasn't even concerned about the lumber at that point. Anyway, there was no damage. 

I always swept the floors everyday, just didn't give much thought to the dust on the walls. Now when I start cleaning up, I start blowing down with a leaf blower. I blow down the shelves, walls, overhead and finally the floors. 

All of the above comments are greatly appreciated. It's been about 7 years since my last shop and when I get a new shop, I want to be prepared. When not doing something for a long while you tend to forget. At age 73 you tend to forget a lot more than when you were in your 30's. 

Also note that the little wall mounted fire extinguishers are a lot better than nothing but not much to depend on once a fire gets going. I would suggest that when one of this gets past its expiration point, rather than just chuck it, actually use it to get the feel of one. You will be surprised at how fast it empties out. Its OK for a trash can fire, but if its lumber or chemicals, use it to head for the door and get out. 

Hope we get some more first hand stories.


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## WeebyWoodWorker (Jun 11, 2017)

Never had an actual fire but a few weeks ago I was routing a channel in a piece and when I cleaned out the chips I saw I had embers in it. Stomped it out immediately but that sure did scare the heck out of me...

-T


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## lexadmn (Jan 5, 2018)

No shop fire, but last July we refinished our oak floors as they were looking pretty well worn and the existing finish was 18 years old.
As I sanded the floor with the floor sander, I would empty the sawdust into a plastic bucket on the back porch and planned to take it to the barrel in the back yard (where I usually burn sawdust).
After emptying the bag from the sander the first two times, I stopped for something.... don't remember why, but about an hour later I seen smoke blowing out of the bucket on the porch.
I went to the porch to see what was going on, and yea.. the bucket of sawdust was burning!

KC


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

TonyB's experience is something to remember. Rags that have been used around flammable liquids should never just be wadded up and tossed on a table or whatever. These do and have spontaneously ignited. Hang them outside to thoroughly dry or place in closed metal container.


George


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## djg (Dec 24, 2009)

lexadmn said:


> ...... the bucket of sawdust was burning!
> KC


How did a bucket of sawdust catch fire? I wonder about the sawdust setting in my dust collector bag.


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## djg (Dec 24, 2009)

Tony B said:


> @Kerrys
> 
> Not even a year later, one day I heard this whoosh sound. I looked around and barely able to see a very light colored flame slowly creeping up a wall and then disappeared at about 4 or 5 feet from the ground.
> 
> I always swept the floors everyday, just didn't give much thought to the dust on the walls. Now when I start cleaning up, I start blowing down with a leaf blower. I blow down the shelves, walls, overhead and finally the floors.


Thus dust on your walls caught on fire? What was the source of ignition?


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## John Smith_inFL (Jul 4, 2018)

my "catastrophe avoided" was using a hand-held belt sander
with a bag full of fine dust to grind a piece of steel. then went to lunch.
returning from lunch, the bag on the sander was smoking.
hot sparks from the steel in the sawdust bag had started to smolder.
I can only imagine what would have happened if this was at the end of the day
and left to smolder overnight. (NOT doing that no more !!)
so - don't mix wood and metalworking without thinking twice about 
the possible after effects. sort of like the oily rags syndrome.

.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

GeorgeC said:


> .......... Rags that have been used around flammable liquids should never just be wadded up and tossed on a table or whatever. These do and have spontaneously ignited. Hang them outside to thoroughly dry or place in closed metal container................George


I have always known that oily rags will spontaneously combust. This is something I heard over and over again all my life. Until then, I never believed it. When it happened, I was astounded. Just couldn't believe my eyes. But it happened.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

djg said:


> Thus dust on your walls caught on fire? What was the source of ignition?


I have no idea why it happened. I didn't smoke at that time. No one else was here yet. A cigarette butt wouldn't still be hot from an employee the evening before. No electrical sparks that I was aware of.


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## JIMMIEM (Oct 12, 2014)

My workshop is the basement and several months ago I had a fire that started in my shop vac. I was vacuuming up some saw dust and the basement started filling with an acrid smoke from the burning plastic. All the smoke detectors in the house (they are wired together) went off . I was choking and having trouble seeing but I was able to get the bulk head open and carry the vac up the stairs and get it to the back yard. The basement smell was pretty bad. I put out some deodorizers and plates of charcoal to try and get rid of the odor. I couldn't work in the basement for a couple of weeks.
When I opened the vac I saw that there was too much dust on the filter which probably caused the motor to overheat.


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## lexadmn (Jan 5, 2018)

djg said:


> How did a bucket of sawdust catch fire? I wonder about the sawdust setting in my dust collector bag.


I have no idea....
The bucket was a clean plastic that was used for beer making a few years ago. It was clean.
Otherwise it was red oak, white oak, oil based stain and oil based poly from 18 years ago.

KC


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## sunnybob (Sep 3, 2016)

I worked on a miltary base for several years. If we had used any kind of hot work or grinding machinery (not just flame), we had to stop that work 2 hours before leaving the site, and then do a complete sweep through the building and sign it off before going home.

Do you remember when Windsor castle in the UK was burnt down? 
$50,000,000 repair bill. caused by a spotlamp.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Windsor_Castle_fire


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## DrRobert (Apr 27, 2015)

Tony B said:


> I have always known that oily rags will spontaneously combust. This is something I heard over and over again all my life. Until then, I never believed it. When it happened, I was astounded. Just couldn't believe my eyes. But it happened.


I have a friend who restores old cars. His entire shop with 4 antique cars and 3 motorcycles burned because of oily rags thrown in a drum.


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## Buckmark13 (Jul 16, 2018)

Rags used with oil based stain were thrown in a dumpster full of cardboard at our family's furniture shop. Combine that with the heat and humidity of August and a dumpster fire is a sure thing.


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## TomW (Mar 18, 2020)

Just make sure you have a couple different types of fire extinguishers and know which to use for each situation. Some are for combustibles like paper and wood. Others are for flammable liquids like grease, gasoline, and oil. Then there are ones for electrical fires. Be prepared ahead of time. When you are trying to deal with a fire in your shop is not the time to figure it out.


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## KellyCraig (Feb 12, 2021)

Not a shop but a cedar mill (shakes and shingles) in Pacific Beach, Washington. We were working on the equipment. My friend had to weld a flatsaw.

If you've ever seen a cedar mill, you know the amount of sawdust laying around could fill a house. It's impossible to keep up with in those old, thrown together sheds that house bandsaws, flatsaws and conveyors.

The wind was blowing, which is probably what sealed the fate of the mill. I was near the saw being welded on and was drowning everything I could with water from a hose. I was focusing on an area about twenty feet around the flatsaw being welded. I focused more on the down wind side. I, probably, reached out as much as thirty feet from the work area, which is a heck of a long ways from the danger zone. Apparently, the problem started farther out. The wind penetrated the drafty old building and must have carried some of the sparks farther down the line. The next morning, the mill was gone, along with log loaders and so on.

Such fires were and are a common worry in cedar mills.


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## KellyCraig (Feb 12, 2021)

My first shop was in Bremerton, Washington, back around 75. Dust collection was something only big corporations knew about and could afford. Mine, like many hobby shop owners, was a Craftsman vacuum. The dust was a constant battle, and I did try to battle it. To that end, I installed a couple squirrel cage fans in a wall, then modified the man-door so I could open a window to allow air in when the fans were running. 

I never used the fans for dust collection. Instead, I used them for cleaning. I'd open the large window I installed in the door, kick the fan(s) on, the use my electric leaf blower to make all the dust airborne. The fan(s) would empty the shop of dust laden air quickly. I never realized how much dust was being dumped into the wild until I opened the main door one day and saw I was turning the neighborhood gray.

Now, I have two three horse, "four bag" collectors and a dedicated Harbor Freight unit. In spite of that, firing up the leaf blower still pushes a LOT of dust into the outside air. Clearly, and as others indicate with tales of flames crawling up walls, just having a lot of quality dust collection is not enough.


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## David Nickell (Jul 6, 2020)

I have a wood stove in my shop and I always put oily rags in there. If they ever self-ignite, it shouldn't be a problem.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

So I went to use my shop vac for a sanding project, but the sound silencer came off accidentally. Out fell about a dozen piece of dog kibbles. 
Ok, but the dog's bowl is down 1 story and separated by two drywalled walls, and 3 doors. How did they get inside the shop vac through the suction port and stuffed into the silencer? Is the squirrel still inside the shop vac after 1/2 hr of sanding? I'll never know probably. I vacuumed them up so they're back inside the dust collection part of the shop vac. ..... maybe along with the squirrel. He'll have about 2 days worth of snacks. If there's a foul smell, he didn't find his way back out.


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## David Nickell (Jul 6, 2020)

woodnthings said:


> So I went to use my shop vac for a sanding project, but the sound silencer came off accidentally. Out fell about a dozen piece of dog kibbles.
> Ok, but the dog's bowl is down 1 story and separated by two drywalled walls, and 3 doors. How did they get inside the shop vac through the suction port and stuffed into the silencer? Is the squirrel still inside the shop vac after 1/2 hr of sanding? I'll never know probably. I vacuumed them up so they're back inside the dust collection part of the shop vac. ..... maybe along with the squirrel. He'll have about 2 days worth of snacks. If there's a foul smell, he didn't find his way back out.


Sounds like a mouse to me..


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