# Drawing Software



## f6maniac (Dec 14, 2012)

Are there any good free software programs you guys use for completing project drawings?

Curt
Palmdale Ca.


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## JMartel (Nov 30, 2011)

Google Sketchup


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## f6maniac (Dec 14, 2012)

I hadn't ever heard of that, but I'm not surprised if Google has what I need.

Thanks!


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## tc65 (Jan 9, 2012)

It was originally developed by Google, however, it has now been sold to Trimble and they now maintain it. Nothing much has changed. If you decide to use Sketchup I'd highly recommend spending some time with some tutorials or you'll get frustrated quickly.

BTW, If you hadn't noticed, there is a Sketchup help forum right here on WWT.


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## VIFmike (Jul 21, 2012)

There are several CAD programs that are free. The best is probably draftsight. Its pretty close to autocad or solidworks and is easy to learn.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

How much does Google sketch cost? Is it 2d and 3d?


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## tc65 (Jan 9, 2012)

Sketchup is free. And it is 3D (or at least as 3D as you can get on a two dimensional screen


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## f6maniac (Dec 14, 2012)

I downloaded the program and watched the first 3 tutorials. After another 20 minutes or so of practice I was able to draw a rectangle. wooo hooo! I guess I'm getting old, it looked so easy when the lady in the tutorial designed a house inside and out in 20 minutes.:blink:


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## VIFmike (Jul 21, 2012)

Sketchup is completely different than a CAD based program. All the commands are different. But it is pretty handy for making a 3d looking drawing for a client. That is what I am trying to learn for. I already have Solidworks and I can draw anything with it. I used to draw metal parts of all different shapes from a drafting board with the X and Y axis so the pieces could be cut on a laser, waterjet or plasma table. I even made lots of nestings. Many programs can nest for you but a human can get many more pieces on a sheet than a program. 

Now I use it when making tables to figure the best spacing and width of individual boards to make the look the best. I plan to get good enough with sketchup to do the same but with much better graphics than CAD to show clients.

I also hear there are add on things that you can download to do all kinds of things. I must do a lot more study on it myself.

If you are designing wood items then sketchup is probably the best to start with. If you are making individual pieces to be cut out by a machine then a CAD program is what you will need. Most of the machines I have used take dxf files and some only dxf files. Solidworks defaults to dwg files but you can save any drawing as a dxf easily.


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## tc65 (Jan 9, 2012)

When I first started using Sketchup I got a hold of a copy of _Fine Woodworking Guide to Sketchup._ It takes you through all the steps needed to get going with the program and walks you through more advanced tools while you are actually drawing woodworking projects. For me it was much easier to learn with the guide than watching videos and trying to remember how to do different functions. I'd highly recommend it to anyone just getting started with the program.


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## f6maniac (Dec 14, 2012)

Thanks Tim, I think I'll get a copy of the guide. I know the first 4 tutorials didn't help.


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## against_the_grain (Aug 15, 2010)

I'm not sure I grasp the whole CAD thing. I would think it would be pretty simple to store things like 2x lumber and sheet goods and other lumber sizes in a symbol library . When you need it, just pull it up, insert it, and trim to size 
in the drawing.

A few years ago I played around with Sketchup a little, got a little impatient and frustrated with the learning curve. I purchased Design CAD 2D from IMSI a few years back. Just recently got re-interested in it and trying to learn it again.

This company IMSI , also owns TurboCAD. I saw where TurboCAD has a Furniture Maker ver. 10 plugin for woodworkers.

I thought , awesome, finally something designed specifically for woodworking. Its a seperate software package that goes for around 200 dollars ! But the deal killer for me were the issues people were having with it. Apparently its not ready for prime time.

And customer support is practically non-existent from what I read on those forums.

As far as CAD goes, I'm beginning to think it might be overkill for the average woodworker. Until someone comes up with a dedicated program that is inexpensive and truly easy, I think most of us are probably better off using graph paper and pencil. 

CAD is more suitable for repetitious drawing than for drawing a one off work bench or other wood project.

Nevertheless, Probably like a lot of others, I still want to learn how to draw projects in CAD and save them electronically.

And of course if you are building for a client, it goes without saying that a well done presention doesn't hurt.


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## frankp (Oct 29, 2007)

against_the_grain said:


> I'm not sure I grasp the whole CAD thing. I would think it would be pretty simple to store things like 2x lumber and sheet goods and other lumber sizes in a symbol library . When you need it, just pull it up, insert it, and trim to size
> in the drawing.
> 
> A few years ago I played around with Sketchup a little, got a little impatient and frustrated with the learning curve. I purchased Design CAD 2D from IMSI a few years back. Just recently got re-interested in it and trying to learn it again.
> ...


A full blown CAD program probably is overkill for most folks. Sketchup, though, is free, has 3D (so you can actually see what a piece might look like for those that can't extrapolate 2D into 3D in their mind's eye) and while it has a learning curve, it's no worse than any other real CAD program. Also, once you learn it, you can upgrade to the "pro" version for about the same price as a fully functional CAD program and export all (or most) of the same file types. Plus, there's a huge library of free parts already out there for sketchup, whereas most CAD programs you have to pay for the libraries or build your own.


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## against_the_grain (Aug 15, 2010)

Another advantage of CAD is you don't have to draw the entire project. For example, you can draw half of a view and then use the mirror function to create the other half. Lots of time saving tools if you become proficient enough and can climb that learning curve.


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## tc65 (Jan 9, 2012)

FYI, you can do the same thing in Sketchup. It doesn't have a "mirror" function, but all you do is copy the component you want to duplicate and then flip it along the appropriate axis.


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## against_the_grain (Aug 15, 2010)

trc65 said:


> FYI, you can do the same thing in Sketchup. It doesn't have a "mirror" function, but all you do is copy the component you want to duplicate and then flip it along the appropriate axis.


Right. I was actually just saying CAD in a general way, including SKetchUp.


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## Kaps (Jan 2, 2013)

I would encourage staying with Sketchup long enough to be able to make a good decision. I have used Visio for projects for years now, and still do from time to time, but have come to really appreciate Sketchup. The ability to visualize a design is very powerful. I laid out a timber frame shed then wondered what it would look like in the back yard, so I did a very quick model of the house and dropped them both in Google Earth. When I gutted the kitchen I modeled it with the stove here, then there. Built a box to house a couple of monitors for the den I put it 'in place' to make sure it would work well, etc... No doubt there is a learning curve, but considering what your asking the software to do - interact in 3D on a 2D canvas, I think they have pretty well knocked it out of the park. The way that inference works is almost magical. Still frustrating at times but overall a good product. I happened to take a photo of the box, I'll try to link it in here...


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## WillemJM (Aug 18, 2011)

against_the_grain said:


> As far as CAD goes, I'm beginning to think it might be overkill for the average woodworker. Until someone comes up with a dedicated program that is inexpensive and truly easy, I think most of us are probably better off using graph paper and pencil.


I'm an advanced AutoCad and Solidworks user, profesionally for work in machine, plant design, electrical, equipment, piping layouts, buildings etc.

Here is my opinion:

1.) You are correct, for a lot of woodworking projects a pencil and paper is better suited and sometimes I enjoy building without anything if I have a clear picture in my mind.

2.) Some projects though, it is extremely useful. If I know how the final project needs to look, but I am not sure about the details of how to get there, I always do a parametric model first. This could be just me, as I have a busy wondering mind, not the best concentration, and if I build something complex without detailed drawings I tend to screw up terribly and blame myself for each screw-up. With parametric modeling, one makes those mistakes on the computer drawing and when we try and fit the parts together on the computer and they don't fit right, we just go and fix the part drawing and say "what was I thinking" instead of throwing away a piece of wood.

3.) I have tried using CAD for segmented and staved vessels (Vases, bowls, lamps etc.) and found that it is much easier just to draw the half item one side of the center line with pencil. Then I go to an Excel worksheet, where I plugged in all the formulas to do my segment or stave angles and sizes.


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## f6maniac (Dec 14, 2012)

Well it's good to read that I'm not the only one struggling to learn Sketchup. I plan to order the guide recommended by Tim and then try again.


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## SebringDon (Jan 2, 2013)

I found this site today thanks to another post in the forum somewhere. It's a great series just for woodworkers, focuses on assembling items out of dimensioned boxes (lumber) and it's free. I'd played with Sketchup doing a house plan, so I knew a bit, but this series really helped a lot from a woodworking perspective.

Sketchup for Woodworkers


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

VIFmike said:


> There are several CAD programs that are free. The best is probably draftsight. Its pretty close to autocad or solidworks and is easy to learn.


Thanks for the tip for draftsight. I have a full version of AutoCad but haven't found a way to transfer it to my new Ultrabook. I have a feeling it wouldn't run on Win 8 anyway.

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## against_the_grain (Aug 15, 2010)

"Thanks for the tip for draftsight. I have a full version of AutoCad but haven't found a way to transfer it to my new Ultrabook. I have a feeling it wouldn't run on Win 8 anyway."

Al


@Al

For what a full version of AutoCad costs it might be worthwhile to pick up an older laptop just to run that software. 

Edited to add: I suppose you probably already have it on another computer.


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## VIFmike (Jul 21, 2012)

I was using solidworks DWG editor to draw 2d parts to be cut out on a waterjet and installed in Armored cars. We made templates from hardboard and dimensioned them on a scale board and then transferred that into dwg editor. I was so used to that program I had trouble catching on with draftsight but once you get into it you get it. 

If you just forget the commands from other software and learn it from the start you are better off. Now I am trying to get into sketchup to draw 3d stuff easily for customer quotes. Good luck with it.


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## mobilepaul (Nov 8, 2012)

f6maniac said:


> Are there any good free software programs you guys use for completing project drawings?
> 
> Curt
> Palmdale Ca.




This is a repost of some of my posts in another thread with added content:

If you are just jumping into this game, relatively speaking, I highly suggest learning and using Sketchup. You can lay everything out so you that you may visualize what you are going to accomplish and change anything that does not strike your fancy. Once you have the design down, it's on to figure out the way that most efficiently accomplishes your cuts. You can, eventually, have your entire house "sketched" up. That way you can move furniture around, take out walls, add walls, whatever and all easily changed if not what you decide you want. 
There are some great tutorials on getting started with it. I just started using it about 3 weeks ago and I am now able to design the cabinets that are going into my new shop. In fact, if you go here:

http://www.finewoodworking.com/blog/design-click-build

and watch the

Drawing a shop cabinet:

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/105391/drawing-a-shop-cabinet

and the subsequent one

Drawing a shop cabinet - casters and drawers:

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/105556/drawing-a-shop-cabinet-casters-and-drawers

You will see a friend of mine, Dave, teach a really good set of tutorials on a cabinet I designed. There are other really good tutorials over there as well. 

Dave has a beginners tutorial:

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...ers-the-basics

you can get it at Amazon, that's where I purchased it, or at FWW... 

You will also find tutorials by Tim Killen on the FWW site. 

We have a couple of fine sketchup people on this forum

Chiefwoodworker on here has a web site called:

http://www.srww.com/google-sketchup.htm

MSketcher on here has a web site called:

http://www.mastersketchup.com/

I haven't, yet, spent any time on anyone else's site to see how they do things but I can tell you that I like the way Dave Richards models. Thinking ahead so if you need to modify something, later, you can with little effort.

I hope this helps,

Paul


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## mobilepaul (Nov 8, 2012)

additionally, I would load Sketchup 7.1 first and add the dxf/dwg importer and then load 8 which no longer supports the importer. You can have two versions but you cannot, by any way I could find, load a later version and then an older version.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

against_the_grain said:


> "Thanks for the tip for draftsight. I have a full version of AutoCad but haven't found a way to transfer it to my new Ultrabook. I have a feeling it wouldn't run on Win 8 anyway."
> 
> Al
> 
> ...


My old Thinkpad works and if I have to use it, I can. The Draftsight software it very close to AutoCad and I am very happy with it. There is almost zero learning curve and it supports DWG files from AutoCad. Sketchup is not what I'm looking for at all.

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

VIFmike said:


> I was using solidworks DWG editor to draw 2d parts to be cut out on a waterjet and installed in Armored cars. We made templates from hardboard and dimensioned them on a scale board and then transferred that into dwg editor. I was so used to that program I had trouble catching on with draftsight but once you get into it you get it.
> 
> If you just forget the commands from other software and learn it from the start you are better off. Now I am trying to get into sketchup to draw 3d stuff easily for customer quotes. Good luck with it.


Draftsight is very close to AutoCad which makes it very easy to use and trust, if you know A Cad.

With AutoCad being the lead software all over the world. I don't know why so many other software companies build theirs "outside the box". Nothing will ever be better or replace AutoCad. It's too big and wide spread.

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## SebringDon (Jan 2, 2013)

Al B Thayer said:


> Nothing will ever be better or replace AutoCad. It's too big and wide spread.


Never say never. They said that about the horse and buggy too.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

SebringDon said:


> Never say never. They said that about the horse and buggy too.


No they didn't. BTW this Draftsight Cad is almost exactly like AutoCad. Seems they know how to play the game.

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## letral (Feb 9, 2013)

there are many such type of software's , by using that you can draw, drawing is simple done in paint also , ahhahaha, but seriously i will suggest you to install Photoshop or coral draw to do this.


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## goXtreme (Jan 9, 2012)

I tried for about three hours this morning to draw a basic cabinet and I could not figure out how to get Sketchup to do what I wanted, as far as putting the shelves, doors and drawers in the right place, so I uninstalled it.

What a PIA


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## Burnt_Blade (Dec 26, 2009)

goXtreme said:


> I tried for about three hours this morning to draw a basic cabinet and I could not figure out how to get Sketchup to do what I wanted, as far as putting the shelves, doors and drawers in the right place, so I uninstalled it.
> 
> What a PIA


 Honestly, you have to give a program more time than that, all the people that are great with auto cad didn't learn it in three hours, maybe three months...lol. Give it another chance, but just don't be in a super rush, there is all kinds of video tutorials on youtube as well as the ones from sketchup itself. Google 'sketchup tutorials' and give it a chance, you will be glad you did.

Also, start by trying a simple thing like building the carcass, just a box, never mind fancy joints in it or rails and stiles and raised paneled doors on it etc...get comfortable with making just regular pieces of a carcass and learning to make them each components and then how to move them to butt up to each other properly on a corner etc.

Actually, you can post up your attempt as a .skp file and I and others can possibly then download the file and help you out with figuring it out.


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## Burnt_Blade (Dec 26, 2009)

http://www.sketchup.com/training/


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## goXtreme (Jan 9, 2012)

You are absolutely right about giving it more time, I have played with it before with about the same results.

I did watch and follow along with a couple of the videos yesterday, but it didnt seem like it was helping for what I was doing, but that is not saying that I didnt learn something because I did.

Im just not quite sure how I can put a 58"X33"X18" cabinet in there and have it be to scale and be able to understand it.

I will reinstall it though...


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## Burnt_Blade (Dec 26, 2009)

goXtreme said:


> You are absolutely right about giving it more time, I have played with it before with about the same results.
> 
> I did watch and follow along with a couple of the videos yesterday, but it didnt seem like it was helping for what I was doing, but that is not saying that I didnt learn something because I did.
> 
> ...


If you build it in the program like you would in the shop, one piece at a time, it might be less confusing and you could relate to it more better. The same as making something a component as soon as you use the push/pull tool to make it 3d...for each pc of wood in a project is really a component, at least thats how I wrapped my head around that concept.

with your cabinet, you want to make it one big single pc cabinet thats 58" long? Usually you would make two smaller ones and join them together, easier to manhandle them into place kinda thing..but ok, first thing I would do is draw a rectangle 18x .75" (thickness of the stock), then use push/pull to pull it up to 33"...only have to pull it up a little and click the mouse, then punch in 33 on the keypad and hit enter.

Then select the pointer and then triple click the board you just made and make it a component, call it 'left side'
Then you select the move tool and the component should still be active (the blue lines around it all, if not you use the pointer tool and click once on it to make it active) when move tool is selected, you hit the CTRL button then click on a corner of the component and drag a copy of it over to the side, this will be the other side of the cabinet.

You may already know all this, so apologies if I am wasting your time, just trying to help.


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## goXtreme (Jan 9, 2012)

Burnt_Blade said:


> If you build it in the program like you would in the shop, one piece at a time, it might be less confusing and you could relate to it more better. The same as making something a component as soon as you use the push/pull tool to make it 3d...for each pc of wood in a project is really a component, at least thats how I wrapped my head around that concept.
> 
> with your cabinet, you want to make it one big single pc cabinet thats 58" long? Usually you would make two smaller ones and join them together, easier to manhandle them into place kinda thing..but ok, first thing I would do is draw a rectangle 18x .75" (thickness of the stock), then use push/pull to pull it up to 33"...only have to pull it up a little and click the mouse, then punch in 33 on the keypad and hit enter.
> 
> ...


Are you kidding me???
That is great information, I will try that... Thank you!!!

Sent from my iPhone


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