# Not so square possible ruined project.



## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

Hey everyone, so I'm begining to put the peices together for a end table I am making for my wife. Using the bedlock system I assembles two sides and glued them together with tight bond. Today I tood a look reading to stain the sides and I found that one side doesnt seem as square as I thought it was. I knew one peice wasn't cut just right, but close. I was hoping to fill it in if needed and be done with it. Now I see that that side doesnt lay flat. Now there will be cross peices on the botom all the way around, and a drawer installed. So this should help with stability. But do I now have to worry about it being lop sided.... I hate to loose it with so many hours already invested...... HELP!!!!!!:huh:


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

If you can't live with it, take it apart and fix it. BTDT.


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## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

If I take it apart is will be worst off than now I am affraid. Guess I;ll just toss the whole thing.


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## Kenbo (Sep 16, 2008)

Don't toss it just yet. How about posting some photos and lets see if there is something that we can suggest for you. Taking it apart may be your best option. Then you can square up the cuts that are off. You may lose a little bit in the overall size, but you will be much happier with the results and will end up with a project that you can be proud to say that you built.
Ken


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## woody woodturner (Jul 9, 2010)

yea let us have a look :thumbsup:


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## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

Unfortunatly too late. I was unhappy with yet another lousy end project, so I distroyed it, and tossed the scrap. Guess this isnt going to be for me... Looks like I'll be selling a few things in craigslist very soon. Thank you all for you help.:boat:


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## Kenbo (Sep 16, 2008)

Although I can't tell you what to do, I would suggest giving it another try. A very common mistake with people who are new to woodworking is the eagerness to finish a project right away. Woodworking, for the most part, isn't something that you can learn overnight, nor can you rush the project for good results. Before glueing and assembly, taking the time to make sure that all cuts are square and going through a dry run assembly is important. Assemble all parts first using only clamps, with no glue. Whatever doesn't fit, fix it before continuing. Although it may seem frustrating to see a joint fit poorly with other pieces due to a bad cut, the extra time and work is well worth it once you feel the sense of accomplishment and pride in a piece that you have made. Don't give up on yourself, we haven't given up on you.
Ken


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*NIcely put Ken*

Woodworking requires considerable patience and the above was spoken by a Master of Patience, and Hall of Famer. They are words to be understood and followed. The other component of woodworking is accuracy. Accuracy is a learned skill and it's acquired by practice. Take it from an old teacher, some projects may get an A but an incomplete is was my most dreaded grade. You obviously learned a few things with this project, so take those experiences and build on them for the next one. All of us had a failure or two as we muddled along. You have a wealth of experience here to draw upon. ALWAYS take step by step photos to explain your progress and illustrate your work. These will allow us to suggest solutions and alternatives. Stay with it and don't give up! :thumbsup: bill


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## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

I apriciate your comments, b ut this isn't my first time around. I have worked with wood off and on for years, much due to being from a family of carpenters. You7'd think I would have picked something up from them, but no not really. After all this time I still can't cut a straight line to save my life. It might be better if I had a miter or table saw, but I do not, and can not afford them. I am left with hand saws both western and japanese style saws. Still no matter how many time I measure and re-measure. Or how much time I take to stay on my line... I still end up with missed cuts... Eh no worries.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Ah ha!*

Guess what most of us would have a difficult time cutting a perfectly straight and square line with a handsaw as well. Power tools have made it so much easier. I'd be totally lost without my table saw, jointer and planer and I admire those who can use hand tools to make a project from scratch. But that ain't me! 
Why not save up a few bucks and look on Craig's List for an older Craftsman belt drive saw usually around $100.00 or so. That's what I started on 50 years ago at age 18 with High School graduation money.
The table saw will give you the accuracy you can't get by hand. 
Just some advice from someone who's been there and done that.  bill


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## craftsman jay (Jun 26, 2010)

I'll be honest with you. I can't believe some of the knowledge and skill most of the guys on here possess. The work they do is often intimidating. But I try not to compare myself, and know I'm just at a different stage. These guys didn't come out of the womb with a plane and chisel in their hands. 

Everyone makes mistakes. I'm a carpenter, and I still make mistakes using power tools. But I throw it in the scrap pile and keep going.

For most, woodworking is an escape. A place you can relax, and Sometimes have some frustration along the way. But when you finally complete that piece youll say, wow I did that! 

Nothing worth doing is ever easy, but it does get easier.


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## Just Bill (Dec 29, 2008)

Norm's old addage of "Measure twice, cut once" has never worked for me, I still manage to screw it up. Careful planning is a critical as careful cutting. Not that this helps now that your project has been trashed. 

I have been restoring 36 Plymouth woody for more years than I care to mention, and have had my share of restarts and do-overs. Redid the front doors 2-3 times, there was no tailgate/lift gate so I improvises the design by adding a 3rd stop light. It is a 47 Plymouth tail light recessed into a divider for the liftgate glass. I made that part 7 times before I was happy with it.

Don't get discouraged, most of us have to make do-overs, all the time. And it is so much fun when you finally get it right.


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## Willie T (Feb 1, 2009)

I built an airplane with wooden wings. You talk about some re-dos! But the trick is not to look at anything as a project that "Has to get done!", but rather as a chance to enjoy some relaxing hours alone in your shop... away from the hassles and pressure of your daily world.

My wings took months. So what? I loved every minute of it.


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## dag2000 (Jul 29, 2010)

I am a newcomer to woodworking and DIY in general. But I suspect it is a lot like golf. You don't have to have a great result to enjoy it. You just have to enjoy the process. Come to think of it, it's also like sex.


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## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

Well did a littel serfing on craigy's today looking for a table saw. Didn't really find anything that spoke to me in my current price range. I then went over to miter saw's and found a Rigid 10" for 60.00. I took it home and cut a few scraps, seems to cut well, though it did tear out a littel. Not sure if that could be the blade or just that it is pine. Still much better than a hand saw.... Dang... does that mean I'm back in it?


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*A seldom mention tool...*



dribron said:


> I apriciate your comments, b ut this isn't my first time around. I have worked with wood off and on for years, much due to being from a family of carpenters. You7'd think I would have picked something up from them, but no not really. After all this time I still can't cut a straight line to save my life. It might be better if I had a miter or table saw, but I do not, and can not afford them. I am left with hand saws both western and japanese style saws. Still no matter how many time I measure and re-measure. Or how much time I take to stay on my line... I still end up with missed cuts... Eh no worries.


When using a handsaw and in certain cases even a table saw, it's best to leave some material "proud" or extra to sand or plane off after assembly. The block plane is a tool I often use for this to remove a 1/32" from a rabbet that is proud. It is therefore not necessary to cut exactly to a line, just close. Here's an example:


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## Kenbo (Sep 16, 2008)

dribron said:


> Dang... does that mean I'm back in it?


I never thought that you were ever out of it. You just needed a break and some encouragement.
Ken


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## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

Nice... now I need to figure out this miter saw. Seems it is missing the table insert, so my cuts, well practice cuts are tearing out towards the end of the cut. Playing around I found that I can get a nice cut if I put a scrap under the peice I need cut. I guess that will work untill I can find an insert for my MS.. 
Any idea's would be apriciated... Thanks!!


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## Kenbo (Sep 16, 2008)

I read that thread about your saw troubles. I was going to suggest an auxillary table for it. An auxillary table would basically be a piece of plywood, roughly the same size as your miter saws table. You would have to secure the plywood to you miter saw somehow (nice and secure) and run the blade of you miter saw down through the plywood. This would serve as the new table insert. Kind of a make shift zero clearance.
Ken


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## AlWood (Apr 18, 2010)

dribron, I take it you are "coming back", and I am glad for you. The guys here are so supportive; this is great! On a "psychological" level (no, no I am not a psychologist, don't run away:no -- from my very childhood I've got a rule (installed I guess by my dad): if something doesn't come together, be it a project or a jump from a cliff into water, never walk away; keep doing it till you've got it done!:hammer: I sort of knew that if I wouldn't, the feeling of failure would set in -- and it is the stuff of which losers are made...

Good luck!:thumbsup:


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## rrbrown (Feb 15, 2009)

dribron if your having trouble don't quit you just need to look at this a different way. Try some different simple projects so you can get some confidence then move on to harder projects. Everything starts with the basics and grows.


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## Leatherneck (Dec 14, 2008)

concerning the tear out ...

Is it a carbide blade? How many teeth? I'd remove the blade and look it over very closely. See if there's any damaged teeth.

Welcome and congrats on your saw :thumbsup:


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## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

I took it out earlyer and did see two teeth that are slightly dammaged. I'll look into buying a new blade when I can afford it.hat may be a week or two with the price of saw blades. 
Thanks!


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Make sure you get a blade for miter saws*

They have zero or negative hook angle to the teeth. Something like
this from Rockler: http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=22469


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## Melinda_dd (Aug 5, 2010)

Dribron.... I feel your pain.

Everytime I do a project I feel I need a new tool to do the job better, but funds just don't run to them.
Personally I'm a recycler... I use pallets and things to make animal houses and other things that don't need to be "pretty"... but recently, I want to do things properly. Be a proper woodworker and make things nice to look at and what people say wow that's great.
So I'm now a firm believer.... practice and confidence..... keep at it!!


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## fromthehills (Aug 21, 2010)

I've got to try that blade. I'm a big fan of the Diablo blades. Here's the thing, after shipping that blade's going to cost more than the saw. On a budget, measure your length, square over to the back, run your square down that back edge, and score it with your razor knife. You can do that on the bottom face, too, but if you make sure your show face is on top, and your blade's not missing more teeth than the cast of _Deliverance_, you can avoid the tear out. Cut just a fuzz long and sand it to length, as mentioned before.


I don't know much about anyone else, but personally I've been working with wood since I was 5yo. I've been doing it professionally for close to 18 years. Granted, ten of that was mostly framing, siding, and a little interior trim. I still make plenty of mistakes. I could show you my pile of failed practice dovetails. Or the piece of oak plywood that slipped while cutting a dado. I have all my fingers and toes, and I'm pretty happy with that. The rest is just life and experiences.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*OK. Hows about this one then*

*
From Amazon Freud 10-Inch 60 Tooth ATB Fine Finish Saw Blade with 5/8-Inch Arbor and PermaShield Coating*

List Price: $60.05 Price: *$39.90* & this item ships for *FREE with Super Saver Shipping*. You Save: $20.15 (34%)


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## fromthehills (Aug 21, 2010)

http://www.amazon.com/Freud-D1060X-10-Inch-PermaShield-Coating


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Broken link, I think!*

No one home at that link...:blink: bill


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## fromthehills (Aug 21, 2010)

Amazon.com: Freud D1060X Diablo 10-Inch 60 Tooth ATB Fine Finish Saw Blade with 5/8-Inch Arbor and PermaShield Coating: Home Improvement

Having a hard time posting the link. Oh well, it's easy enough to find.

Funny, it's not going through in any combo. I don't know.

This one went through. Once


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## dribron (Jul 19, 2010)

Looks like the same blade I got from HomeDepot, I paid 39.99 for it there as well without shipping cost. Though it may be free shipping from Amazon being that it is over 25.00, so a pretty good deal if you do not have a HomeDepot near by.


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## SteveEl (Sep 7, 2010)

D, I know it's been a few weeks.... if you're still giving it a go.... I am a beginner woodworker. Awhile back I picked up an old craftsman bench top (model 113.295752) with a stack of blades for $80 off of Craigslist. It didn't go too well at first, but then someone gave me Taunton Presse's book on Tablesaws, and I recently I bought the current issue (Oct-2010) of Wood Magazines shop tricks, and the current Shop Notes at Home Depot. Started making some of those jigs and WOW! Now I can't wait to get into the shop. It would be a very large paperweight without the books and magazines.

Have Fun,
SteveEl

~~~Power tools are great. You can make 2x the mistakes in 1/2 the time. Also, prior planning prevents poor performance, so include travel time for a couple more trips to the store.


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## shelley.sidney (Oct 30, 2010)

Make sure they cut it deep enough to accept glass and a matte and a backerboard if you are going to put all those things in the frame. (If you're close to me, I can do it for you in about 10 minutes)


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