# New Lie Nielsen plane not that flat



## Seawalker (Jul 18, 2012)

Took my new LN 60.5 block plane out of the box and decided I should double check the sole with a straight edge. I held it up to the light and saw surprising amount come through. I build acoustic guitars and plane my surfaces/joints very flat - flatter than the sole of this LN. So I thought maybe it just needs some additional flattening touch up - and went to work lapping it on DMT diamond plates. After a lot of work I was able to improve it. But then I noticed that LN ensures their planes to be within .0015 of an inch. So I have them a call to ask about it. They said they don’t recommend using diamond plates as they can go out of flat after use - and it very hard to get this level of precision. I was told I should send it back and they would check and if need be put it back on the machine for a nominal fee. So I sent it back to them. When I received it back I checked and once again the sole was not as flat as when I lapped it myself. There is quite a bit of light coming through again. For example I can slide a piece of paper between the straight edge and the middle of the sole. (Which is about .0039”). I get flatter results on running wood through the jointer. 

I want to say that I’m not bashing Mr Nielsen at all. I am being a picky BUT The reason I opted for a LN plane over a Woodriver or something was so that I could be assured I got a tool that I didn’t have to work on to get it within spec and was checked before it leaves the shop.


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

Sure your straightedge is straight? Amazing how many of them actually arent

Ruling that out, id keep talking with them until they got the problem rectified, if theyre promising .0015, for that price you should get that accuracy


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## Tree Hugger (Sep 1, 2011)

Do you have a buddy that works in a machine shop.? Very easy to check with the correct certified equipment.
.0015" flatness on a plane that size is not hard to achieve in a machine shop with the right equipment, but costs go up as the precision level gets finer .


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## Seawalker (Jul 18, 2012)

Well I’m embarrassed to say one of my straight edges was out. It does look much better but I’m going to check next week at a machine shop.


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

Seawalker said:


> Well I’m embarrassed to say one of my straight edges was out. It does look much better but I’m going to check next week at a machine shop.


Like i said, its incredibly common so dont get yourself down about it. If i measure something thats supposed to be flat but isnt, first thing i do is check the measuring instrument. Its amazing just how often that a straightedge or square just isnt. 

If you can get a machine shop to check out the plane without costing an arm and a leg, go for it, no harm. If theyre charging though, may as well skip it. A handplane for wood decidedly does not need the same level of accuracy as a machine tool does. You can get the sole of that plane brought down to have no points deviate from perfect flatness by more than .0001", but youre tilting at windmills, all youll do is waste a lot of money for no benefit


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

So how does the plane actually cut wood?


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

This thread reads like another "problem" that is being over thought.


George


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## mjadams61 (Jan 1, 2016)

FrankC said:


> So how does the plane actually cut wood?


https://www.wonkeedonkeetools.co.uk/woodworking-hand-planes/how-does-a-plane-work/


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

mjadams61 said:


> https://www.wonkeedonkeetools.co.uk/woodworking-hand-planes/how-does-a-plane-work/


Well I will be darned, so that is how one works. 

My point was how well does the plane he purchased function.


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## Seawalker (Jul 18, 2012)

I wouldn’t say I was overthinking it. When I first got the plane it was definitely not flat - checked with a good straight edge. Most important it was not as flat as I need to have my surfaces planed too. After lapping the sole myself it was good enough but not to the Lie Nielsen spec of 0015.” No big deal, but I paid for a Lie Nielsen!

When I got the plane back from them I used a different straight edge( a bad one). I checked again with my good straight edge when I got to the shop and it is almost perfect. Better then what I was able to get with the DMT plates. Double checked with a starrett straight edge to make sure my (good) straight edge was straight


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*You should get what you paid for....*

The specs as advertised should match the reality. Period. If not, it should be returned as "defective". Obviously, the measurements should be as precise as possible.

If a woodworker wants to use a micrometrer or a feeler gauge to setup their equipment it's their perogative. It's not overthinking, it's making sure the maker lives up to it's promises. Instrument making is precision woodworking and involves a lot more than cutting pieces and gluing them up. I couldn't do it without taking a class and I have 50 years of woodworking experience. 

I'm a "cut and fit" woodworker rather than a "measure and hope" type. Of course I have to measure when it's required, but if I can make a mark and cut to it, I will. I helped my son make a wood laminate for a cell phone charger recently. The charger needed to be within 1/16" of the back of the phone for it to recognize it. We had no wood that was that thickness, so we ran it through the drum sander until the signal was recognized. It started out as 1/8" Maple plywood and it was reduced to 1/16" thickness. I frankly didn't think it would work, but I learned how thin that sander would go without blowing up the material.
A sand until it works approach.......


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

woodnthings said:


> The specs as advertised should match the reality. Period. If not, it should be returned as "defective". Obviously, the measurements should be as precise as possible.


Here here. If you pay for something, you should get it. In this case, the 'something' was the sole of the plane deviating from flat by no more than .0015, and that something Lie Nielsen really likes having people pay through the nose for. If im paying over $300 for a bench plane, i expect to be able to sit it on my surface plane and not get a .002 feeler gauge under there. At that price i also expect it to be attached to a motor but thats a different discussion.

It doesnt matter how well the plane worked, the quality of the shavings or whether mercury was in retrograde, all that matters is something not delivering for the price. Theres no overthinking it there


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