# Sharpening on glass with sandpaper



## Visions (Jun 16, 2011)

I know there are probably more than a few people who sharpen this way, myself being one of them. And if you do, than you likely know that super-fine paper (1500-2500 grit) doesn't last too long when sharpening good tool steel, it just doesn't cut well at all after just a few sharpenings.

Well, I used some .5 micron diamond paste on a sheet of 12,000 grit micro mesh, just to see how it worked, and man does it ever work!
It cuts much faster than just the paper alone, and you only need a small amount of paste, and it lasts a good while. So you're not using a ton of the diamond paste.
I'm still using the same sheet of Micro Mesh I first tried this on over a month ago, and it still works great!

I have also been trying coarser grades of diamond paste on the lower grit Micro Mesh, and it's been working very well. I just match the Micro Mesh to the diamond paste of about the same grit, and it seems to work very well, and it cuts very fast too.

I've been getting my paste from tedpella.com ( http://www.tedpella.com/material_html/polish2.htm#895-20) and the 5 gram tubes go a long way and aren't too expensive.

This basically turns your sandpaper into a diamond hone, and even though the paste isn't cheap, you don't use it very fast and it's still cheaper than buying 4 or 5 big diamond plates @$60-$100+ a pop.

If you sharpen with paper on glass, give this a shot, it really works well! I do recommend the Micro Mesh though, as it seems to hold up better than some other papers.

Wayne

PS: You can also use the paste on cardboard (not corrugated) and basically make a strop on the cheap. Or, if you have some leather, just make a real strop. They work well for putting a final polish on stuff, and the diamond cuts so much faster than standard abrasive compounds.


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## H. A. S. (Sep 23, 2010)

If anyone ever has trouble getting a razor edge on a tool, try looking at that edge using a microscope. You'll never have a problem getting it, once you see the edge for what it really is. Just a tip.


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## Piazzak (Aug 4, 2011)

Thanks for the tip. 

I have been using sandpaper, and then finishing with a Japanese natural blue stone. 

Have you tried the coarser diamond paste? 

Piazzak


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## H. A. S. (Sep 23, 2010)

Yep, a tube of diamond paste will last for years in a home shop.


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## Visions (Jun 16, 2011)

I believe the coarsest paste I have is 5 micron, and it works real good for bringing back a really dull edge.

I don't use anything more coarse than that, as I have a Grizzly 8" wet-grinder (Tormek knock-off) that I use for any heavy material removal, so I don't bother with anything really coarse.

I have a table I use for sharpening that has an 18" x 30"-1/4" glass plate with all the grits I normally use stuck on it in half sheets. And to keep it clean, I have a lid that covers that table and uses prop hinges to keep it open. I also installed a 24" florescent tube fixture under the lid to provide lighting. I keep my honing guide and a jig with stop-blocks at all the angles I use in the table, as well a spray bottle of water hangs right there.
This system has made it very easy to quickly sharpen any of my chisels or plane irons very quickly, shut the lid and get back to work right away. 
I find when I make sharpening easy and convenient, I don't put it off as much and things tend to go much easier, as I'm always using very sharp tools. And at times, the wet-grinder felt like a pain and I would put off sharpening until I absolutely had to, and it didn't make life easy by any means.

Wayne


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

In lieu of diamond paste or sandpaper, frosted glass (sand blasted with fine grit or chemically etched) makes a VERY good sharpener. I sharpen my carving/whittling knives almost exclusively with textured glass and it puts a razor edge that easily shaves the arm hairs. Then I polish it off with a leather strop and buffing/polishing compound to remove the bur and refine the edge.


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## WillemJM (Aug 18, 2011)

Visions said:


> I know there are probably more than a few people who sharpen this way, myself being one of them. And if you do, than you likely know that super-fine paper (1500-2500 grit) doesn't last too long when sharpening good tool steel, it just doesn't cut well at all after just a few sharpenings.
> 
> Well, I used some .5 micron diamond paste on a sheet of 12,000 grit micro mesh, just to see how it worked, and man does it ever work!
> It cuts much faster than just the paper alone, and you only need a small amount of paste, and it lasts a good while. So you're not using a ton of the diamond paste.
> ...


Thx for posting up, what is "Micro Mesh" and where do do you purchase it?


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## del schisler (Nov 5, 2009)

WillemJM said:


> Thx for posting up, what is "Micro Mesh" and where do do you purchase it?


google is your friend go here and read all about the micro mash and where to buy it . http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp..._gc.r_pw.&fp=e383b5a7f79131c3&biw=991&bih=567


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

I am going to try carborundum paste that we used to use for car valve lapping. Not seen diamond paste in UK.
johnep


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## Visions (Jun 16, 2011)

johnep34 said:


> I am going to try carborundum paste that we used to use for car valve lapping. Not seen diamond paste in UK.
> johnep


WHOA! Easy killer! That paste is WAY to coarse/abrasive for a fine edge!

No, but in all seriousness, that is just too coarse of an abrasive to use.

Look to any company that supplies straight-razors and their sharpening equipment. I know there are several top straight-razor manufacturers in England (DOVO for starters), so you will definitely be able to find someone selling them.

Try this link, the place is in the UK and they sell stropping paste, which is a fine abrasive that will work similar to the diamond paste, but won't cut quite as fast and will need to be reapplied more frequently.
http://www.executive-shaving.co.uk/shaving/strop-paste/strop-paste.php

If you do a google search, you can likely find some other retailers as well, and maybe one that carries diamond paste, as many use it on straight-razors.

Wayne


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Visions said:


> I believe the coarsest paste I have is 5 micron, and it works real good for bringing back a really dull edge.
> 
> I don't use anything more coarse than that, as I have a Grizzly 8" wet-grinder (Tormek knock-off) that I use for any heavy material removal, so I don't bother with anything really coarse.
> 
> ...


Man, you are serious about sharpening and that is meant in a good way. For years I tried to sharpen a knife, chisels, blades etc razor sharp but never could. Just in the last 10 years or so I have gotten fairly good at it. I am always looking for new and better ways so I am really interested in this thread, I appreciate all the information from all of you. I really like your idea of your sharpening table, that is neat.

ChaincarverSteve, I knew you were a wood carver, are you on the woodcarvers Illustrated forum? I do a little carving and want my knives and gouges extremely sharp, so far I am not totally happy with my results.


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## Visions (Jun 16, 2011)

Thanks for the compliments jiju1943.

I like handplanes and I like them kept "shaving sharp" most all the time, as well as most all my other tools. In order to keep tools this way, we need to keep sharpening simple, easy and convenient or it will get put off and your work will suffer because of it. Not only that, dull tools are dangerous, as you must use more force to cut with them, and this extra force can cause bad accidents should you slip. Like not being able to stop pushing fast enough and shoving a chisel into yourself. Not fun (ask me how I know).

Wayne


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## Piazzak (Aug 4, 2011)

What I've found to be fastest is about 600 grit sandpaper, followed up by a Japanese natural blue stone. 
The sandpaper removes so much metal, I hardly ever have to use a grinder.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

I finish honing with tooth paste on lather, the tooth paste is about 8,000 grit. I am in the process of making a sharpener using the 1/4 thick glass disk of a Work Sharp machine. I am using an old neck massager which has two shafts and turns 34 RPM which will never get the knives hot. So far I can't find the arbors so I will probably make them.


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

jiju1943 said:


> I finish honing with tooth paste on lather, the tooth paste is about 8,000 grit. I am in the process of making a sharpener using the 1/4 thick glass disk of a Work Sharp machine. I am using an old neck massager which has two shafts and turns 34 RPM which will never get the knives hot. So far I can't find the arbors so I will probably make them.


Aw man, get you some buffing and/or polishing compound. Toothpaste is a nasty mess.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Chaincarver Steve said:


> Aw man, get you some buffing and/or polishing compound. Toothpaste is a nasty mess.


I got the polishing compound but the tooth paste is finer. You are right about it being a mess so I let it dry before I use it on my blades.:smile:

I plan to get the diamond paste one day soon, I hope, that stuff cuts quick and will last a looooong time.


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## Devildog (Apr 20, 2008)

@chaincarver steve

are you serious about the frosted glass as a sharpener? how do you go about it? is this more of a honing thing, or can you really sharpen?

enquiring minds (with dull planer blades) want to know!


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

Devildog said:


> @chaincarver steve
> 
> are you serious about the frosted glass as a sharpener? how do you go about it? is this more of a honing thing, or can you really sharpen?
> 
> enquiring minds (with dull planer blades) want to know!


I am absolutely serious. Depending on the coarseness of the texturing ("frosting") you can sharpen or home. I use textured glass rods out of high pressure sodium light bulbs to sharpen and hone (different "grits") my whittling knives. Then I buff/deburr with a leather strop and polishing compound. And have done so for 20+ years.










You could also use a frosted glass candle holder, such as this:










or something like this (providing the bottom is flat)...










HOWEVER, for sharpening planer knives, you'll obviously need something bigger and flatter. I don't know a specific source, but I'd think any glass business could supply it or point you in the right direction. And any glass company that etches glasses can do it for you. A harder, heat resistant glass (such as quartz glass) would be best, in a perfect world, but not necessary. Not for its heat resistant but for its hardness.

Just keep in mind that you want either sand blasted or acid etched texturing, and NOT a molded texture.

But yeah, you'll be blown away at how well glass will sharpen and/or hone knives. Plus, it's much more resistant to cupping and scalloping like a natural stone will do over time.


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## firemedic (Dec 26, 2010)

Steve, that's pretty wild... Never considered it though it does make sense. That's why I hang around here! Always learning something new!

~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Steve, that is a great idea, what kind of light do they use those type bulbs in? I will be looking for some sandblasted glass also. I have been planning to go by a glass company to pick up a small piece of thick plate glass anyway, I will check to see if they have any frosted while I am there. I appreciate the information.


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

firemedic said:


> Steve, that's pretty wild... Never considered it though it does make sense. That's why I hang around here! Always learning something new!
> 
> ~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...


You can also buy commercially available ceramic sharpening rods but the glass ones I use easily equal or rival the ceramic ones. Plus, it's tough to find ceramic rods that aren't so brittle you have to baby 'em.

Another comment on my earlier statements; if you have someone sandblast you one, tell them you need it as level as possible. Most companies that do sand etching are using stencils and they strive for uneven depth to add to the texture, beauty and light play of the image being blasted. So you may want to point out that you need a flat surface, as it is not a decorative or art piece.


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## Devildog (Apr 20, 2008)

went by a glass shop today to get glass for the doors we're making.... and I picked up a piece of frosted 5mm glass.
I had an old scrap of super hard wood (hope odorata) from the miter saw which was just about the right angle, so I grabbed a planer blade and used the scrap as a quick jig
wow.
honing/sharpening went fast, and the blades are back to razor sharp. 
chaincarver steve, hat is off to you-- great idea!


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

Devildog said:


> went by a glass shop today to get glass for the doors we're making.... and I picked up a piece of frosted 5mm glass.
> I had an old scrap of super hard wood (hope odorata) from the miter saw which was just about the right angle, so I grabbed a planer blade and used the scrap as a quick jig
> wow.
> honing/sharpening went fast, and the blades are back to razor sharp.
> chaincarver steve, hat is off to you-- great idea!



Awesome! I'm really glad some one here tried it to be able to back up my claims, because I know it may sound far-fetched to some members. But I've been sharpening with glass for over 20 years. I know it works. And it works very well.

The best part is that you probably got a larger, better sharpener than you could buy. And for a fraction of the price of a much smaller "real" sharpener. :thumbsup:


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

jiju1943 said:


> Steve, that is a great idea, what kind of light do they use those type bulbs in? I will be looking for some sandblasted glass also. I have been planning to go by a glass company to pick up a small piece of thick plate glass anyway, I will check to see if they have any frosted while I am there. I appreciate the information.


I'm sorry I missed your question, man. Those kinds of light bulbs are used in parking lot pole lamps and street lighting, as they are designed to put out very intense light. You can buy the bulbs at home improvement and hardware stores. Or you can ask a lighting company if they'd save you a few the next time they do a bulb replacement job.

The larger sized bulbs generally have a longer rod inside.

Just break the bulb open and cut the frosted rod free from the wires and you'll have a sharpener that will rival or surpass any commercially available sharpening rod.


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## BigJim (Sep 2, 2008)

Thanks Steve, I appreciate that. I just got to thinking, glass is made out of sand and sand makes a great sharpening compound (sand paper). I am going to give the frosted glass a try, I have been wanting to get a 3/8 inch thick piece of glass to glue sand paper on so now I can also pick up a frosted piece.


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