# Best screw material?



## JavaGeek (Feb 2, 2010)

Hello,
I am pretty new to woodworking and am trying to learn the fundamentals. I am building a piece and want to use fasteners for some pieces (especially parts that are hidden from view). I noticed there are many choices of fastener material. What should I choose for woodworking (red oak & poplar mostly)?

What screw material is strongest?

Is stainless steel ideal if the the piece is not exposed to excessive moisture? Do you lose anything by choosing stainless over zinc-coated or black oxide for an indoor piece?

I noticed that the price difference for stainless isn't significant for the quantities that I use, so it's certainly an option, but I wouldn't choose it if I knew it was more likely to snap or didn't hold as well as other materials. 


Thanks!
Steven


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## wseand40 (Jan 24, 2010)

*Screws*

They all will do the job just fine. They all are weather resistant and strong. The design and placement of the fasteners are the most important thing. Make sure you are using the correct size fastener and screw for the job at hand.


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## mmwood_1 (Oct 24, 2007)

wseand40 said:


> They all will do the job just fine. They all are weather resistant and strong.


--So as not to mislead you, this statement is incorrect. In an outdoor application where it is rainy, the zinc screws and the black oxide screws will rust and snap within 2 years. Not relevant to your current project, I know, but in that application, you'd be better off with SS.


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## gregL (Feb 1, 2009)

Stainless steel screws are great for outdoor applications and marine applications but are made of softer metal and are not as strong as a hardened steel screws. Stainless steel screws are not necessary for interior use. find a store that specializes in fasteners instead of the big box stores that sell the extremely cheap quality fasteners


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## wseand40 (Jan 24, 2010)

*Screws*

Ok, zinc and black oxide are only a coatings on metal. Their intended use is not for corrosion resistance as well they don't lessen the corrosion attributes of the metal that has been coated with them. They have nothing to do with strength. Do your homework mmwood_1 before replying. If you are really worried about the strength. Find out what the Rockwell Hardness and tensile strengths are. Make sure it is a course screw or use a thru bolt with washer and nut. When in doubt build it stout. 

William


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## jraksdhs (Oct 19, 2008)

*wow....*



wseand40 said:


> Do your homework mmwood_1 before replying.


I dont think that was necessary......

You stated that they are all weather resistant and strong. Infact, black oxiode(drywall screws to most people) are not weather resistant, although zinc screws are. Also typical stainless steel screws found at most hardware stores are NOT as strong as a black oxiode(drywall) screw. I believe mark HAS done his "homework", maybe you should do yours.

jraks


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

I run two sets of screws in most sizes, steel and SS. I have found that the SS is softer and consequently easier to foul up the head when tightening hard.

http://www.screwfix.com/cats/A131353/Screws;jsessionid=VBY5F54IUJT4WCSTHZPCFFA

I use the Turbogold and Ultra screws from this mail order co.
johnep


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

"Stainless steel screws are great for outdoor applications and marine applications but are made of softer metal "

If stainless is softer than why is it so hard to drill?

G


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## JavaGeek (Feb 2, 2010)

johnep said:


> I run two sets of screws in most sizes, steel and SS. I have found that the SS is softer and consequently easier to foul up the head when tightening hard.
> 
> http://www.screwfix.com/cats/A131353/Screws;jsessionid=VBY5F54IUJT4WCSTHZPCFFA
> 
> ...



Screwfix looks awesome. I wish they were in the US (I'm sure they ship here, but that no doubt will raise the cost). 


Now I know how the rest of the world must feel when they stumble across awesome US sites like NewEgg or fastener-express


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## JavaGeek (Feb 2, 2010)

*I guess to use SS or not to use SS is the main question*

Ideally, I would like a well-made piece to outlive me. 

I am a hobbyist, so this is something I do for fun on the weekends and pieces are a mark of pride rather than purely utilitarian (if I just wanted something to hold the TV up, I could go to IKEA and get a good enough piece of furniture). I'm willing to be a little more meticulous if it means I can give the piece to the grandkids. 

Since many of you have decades of carpentry and woodworking experience...

If cost was not a factor, what would you people use? 

Is there a site that would quantify the strength of these screws? 

Logically, it seems like SS is a good choice then because I am worried about ambient humidity corroding the material over 50 years. Am I being silly?

I live near Boston (coastal New England) so we get full snow, heavy rain, hot summers, etc. I know it will take a long time for it to make a difference, but has anyone seen those screws get rust stains or get fragile over decades indoors?


I've worked with standard zinc coated screws from my local hardware store for years and have snapped quite a few #10 and #12 screws, even tightening them by hand. I don't have absolute faith in them. Haven't yet snapped a stainless screw, but that's mostly because I can't find long screws for the heavy jobs (like mounting shelves, for example) at my local hardware store. 

I am sure I am making a bigger deal out of this than I need to...I do enjoy tapping the wisdom of much more experienced carpenters and woodworkers, though.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

If you want to assure longivity of your screws then using stainless is probably the best.

The best stainless will be found at a marine supply house. They will be expensive (anything labled for use on a boat is expensive) but you will have a screw that will the lifetime of your project. 

Drilling the correct pilot hole for the screw size is the best way to prevent snapping any screw and "buggering" the heads.

Good luck.

George


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## Shamus (Aug 22, 2008)

JavaGeek said:


> Ideally, I would like a well-made piece to outlive me.
> 
> Am I being silly?
> 
> ...


I had to SNIP down to the above statements.

I do a fair amount of antique furniture restoration. Many pcs are treasures from New England manufacturers and are indeed sot-after by collectors as well as investors.

Since the screw was invented they have been made of steel. I see hundreds of 100+ yr old screws throughout a month, holding all types of furniture together. The only ones that have issues were stored in a damp basement or garage for years.

So, No, your not being silly and information sharing is a good deal, not a big deal. :thumbsup:


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

jraksdhs said:


> I dont think that was necessary......
> 
> You stated that they are all weather resistant and strong. Infact, black oxiode(drywall screws to most people) are not weather resistant, although zinc screws are. Also typical stainless steel screws found at most hardware stores are NOT as strong as a black oxiode(drywall) screw. I believe mark HAS done his "homework", maybe you should do yours.
> 
> jraks


I agree 100%

Also would like to add that the stainless steel screws at the BORG are not what I consider 'marine grade'. I do boat work quite often and I know there is a difference. All stainless is not the same just like all woods are not the same. If the pieces you make are not being used in an outdoor environment, I would not use stainless. Stainless will break much easier when screwing in than typical steel screws would. 

As for the type of wood, I would use red oak over poplar. Poplar is not now or ever was a popular wood. It is not very attractive to most people and is used mostly for trim that will be more or less stained and glazed very dark.


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## mmwood_1 (Oct 24, 2007)

wseand40 said:


> Do your homework mmwood_1 before replying. If you are really worried about the strength.
> 
> William


Excuse me, but it's nothing to do with homework, rather experience. As I'd said, in RAINY areas, such as Oregon where I live (perhaps it's irrelevant in NM where YOU live), when I have used black oxide or zinc screws for outdoor projects, they last about 2 years before they give out due to rust and weakening. Any tests or statistics on these things are unknown to me, and in this case, irrelevant also. But I could clarify that these were all #8 and #10 screws. Heavier screws may hold up longer in the rain. Nonetheless, This type of screw is just not well suited to outdoor use in RAINY climates. THAT was my point.


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