# How to square up a panel too wide for your table saw?



## beelzerob (May 2, 2010)

Normally I'd use either my miter gauge, or my crosscut sled, to square the ends of a piece of stock. However, now I've glued up a panel that is just a tad too wide to fit onto the front of my table saw in front of the blade, so I'm not sure how best to square the end of the panel vs. the side of the panel.

1) I could use a router, if I can setup a fence at a right angle to the edge. My history with precise edges and routers isn't very good.

2) I could build a bigger crosscut sled so the panel could still rest on it against the crosscut sled fence and then be cut on the table saw....but that would mean a fair portion of the sled would be off the tablesaw table. I suppose it could be supported with rollers or such...

3) I could build an infeed table...basically the opposite of an outfeed table, so long as I can still reach to put the panel past the blade and such.

4) I could put the panel on my existing crosscut sled, with the blade all the way down, and then raise the blade into the panel to start the cut, and then complete it by pushing the sled. (Please don't yell at me...I'm just listing all the ideas that came up)

Now then...please dispense (once again) the obvious, easy, safe, and precise solution that always seems to elude my brainstorming....


----------



## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

I have needed to do this type of cut in the past.

In my case I use my circular saw and a fence which is a manually positioned straight edge.

There are many ways to calibrate the straight edge. If you are lucky you have a "good" carpenter square.

If you are not so lucky, you may need to rely on the old "3 - 4 - 5" pythagorean triangle principle. A perfect 90 deg triangle has dimensions of 3 on a side, 4 on another side and 5 on the side connecting the other two sides.

So even if you do not have a good carpenters square, you can easily make yourself a 3 - 4- 5 template to guide the placement of the fence for the circular saw.


----------



## beelzerob (May 2, 2010)

Ya, I thought of using a circular saw as well, but it seemed even riskier than the router method. 

And true, the common thread to both us setting up the square fence first.


----------



## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*what are you starting from?*

Does the panel have 2 parallel edges from a rip cut on the tables saw?

Or are none of the edges square to one another?

I'd get a dry wall square and they have 2 sizes a 24", and a 48". You can use a 24" leg on a framing square also.

You can probably use a 24" for your panel. Check the 2 edges using one side as a reference. If the width is greater than the distance in front of the blade, then you can use the rip fence rather than the miter gauge or sled. Just tack a narrow board to a square line made by your drywall square and run that against the fence. Then remove it and run the now newly square edge against the fence and make a parallel cut on the opposite edge. 

A panel saw or a sliding table table saw would be the best option, but not usually found in a home shop. It's a bit frustrating when this occurs and without the capacity it's not much fun. :no: bill


----------



## troyd1976 (Jul 26, 2011)

Do ya have a sliding miter saw or a radial arm saw? many times in this situation i do the max cut on my dewalt SCMS than flip the work piece and carefully line the blade up to the line ive already cut.
I used to do the ole' raise the TS blade to the work piece trick, but feel way safer doing it on the miter saw.


----------



## Mandres (Sep 6, 2011)

I'd use a circular saw too. Just measure the 3-4-5 triangle to make sure the fence is square. And really, if it's a hair out of perfect square, does it really matter?


----------



## beelzerob (May 2, 2010)

Well, I think I can safely say the 2 sides are parallel. So if I can lay that against a fence and cut 90 deg on each end, I'll have my square panel. Or really, for my purposes, I can probably get away with one side being square and the other end being pretty close to square.

No sliding miter saw, radial saw, panel saw, or sliding table table saw. 

I guess the circular saw could do it. I think that'll mean a new blade for it though, or it's sure to hack it to pieces. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever replaced the blade and it seems like it's been struggling through wood lately, so maybe a new blade would be welcome.


----------



## Richard D. (Jul 4, 2012)

An infeed table and turn your mitre gauge around to register on the front of the piece.


----------



## oldmacnut (Dec 27, 2010)

What about making a counterbalanced long ass miter bar for your tablesaw sled? that way its in the miter slot even if the sled sticks out 2 feet, a temp infeed table to help support.

Whatcha think?.


----------



## beelzerob (May 2, 2010)

Well, I'm warming to the idea of the circular saw...IF I made a jig for it. So I'd create a channel for the saw to ride in so that there was no chance of it slipping, and then place the board underneath it.

The only question left is....can the circular saw crosscut without tremendous tearout? Do they make a fine-toothed enough blade to do that? I usually only use my circular saw for butchery-type cuts, so something finer leaves me skeptical it is up to the task.


----------



## gideon (May 26, 2010)

the 3-4-5 - how does one apply this on different measurements. like 3-4-5 inches?


----------



## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*a 3-4-5 triangle*

is a "right" angle triangle., meaning the intersection of the shorter legs form a 90 degree angle. You can use inches, feet, or yards it will still be a 90 degree angle in the corner. You can multiply the numbers by a "constant" like 4, and get 12-16-20 also to make the dimensions suit your needs. 
This explains it:
http://www.mathsisfun.com/geometry/triangle-3-4-5.html


----------



## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

The easiest method IMO is a cutoff jig that you make in your shop. It's like a "T" square, and very easy to use with your handheld circular saw.









 







.


----------



## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Crosscutting 4 X 8 panels?*

I made a jig for accurately crosscutting the 48" dimension on a plywood sheet:

http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f27/4-x-8-panel-cross-cuts-10476/


----------



## jschaben (Apr 1, 2010)

beelzerob said:


> Well, I'm warming to the idea of the circular saw...IF I made a jig for it. So I'd create a channel for the saw to ride in so that there was no chance of it slipping, and then place the board underneath it.
> 
> The only question left is....can the circular saw crosscut without tremendous tearout? Do they make a fine-toothed enough blade to do that? I usually only use my circular saw for butchery-type cuts, so something finer leaves me skeptical it is up to the task.


Here's what I use on my circ for those kinds of cuts. Hard to tell from a cut on the table saw.
http://shopping.yahoo.com/760361054...ltra-fine-finishing-circular-saw-blade/prices

Home Depot carries 'em.


----------



## Larry G (Jul 4, 2012)

"can the circular saw crosscut without tremendous tearout"

Yes. I just use a general purpose blade in the saw, but you can experiment with blades if you like. First make a shallow cut in the panel. This will essentially score the wood without tear out and will make a sort of zero clearance channel for the final cut. Adjust the blade depth so that it will cut through and make the second cut.

It takes twice as much work, but it's why I haven't bought the festool saw. I've never needed the plunge feature and get as good a cut with my old skill saw.

Try a test cut.

I also use a 4ft drywall square to mark the cut. Measure the diagonals. If they're the same, it's square.


----------



## woodbutcher360 (Jul 1, 2012)

Looks good but you did go to a lot of work to make a saw guide.
It will also be hard to store and you risk knocking it out of square moving it about in the garage. Take up a lot of space also.
Here's what I would do;
1/4 inch hardboard. Cut 4" off the end. Cut a second piece 10" off the same end.
Glue the 1st piece to the 2nd piece making sure the machine edge (factory edge) is to the inside and your cut edge is flush with the 2nd piece cut edge.
What you will have is guide that you can clamp to any panel for cut off or for ripping.
The best part is this; clamp your guide to a piece of plywood making sure the saw blade is clear or the plywood.
Place the saw against the machine edge of the 1/4 inch hardboard and cut off the excess hardboard.
Now all you half to do is match the edge of your guide to your marks. The blade will always cut at your line.
Hope this helps. Oh yeah, drill a large hole in one end and hang it on the wall flat. no wasted space and cannot be knocked out of true.


----------



## WillemJM (Aug 18, 2011)

When I do this, I normally draw a pencil line square (by measuring) clamp a straight edge to the board that aligns the blade of my circular saw with the pencil line and cut.


----------



## woodbutcher360 (Jul 1, 2012)

WillemJM said:


> When I do this, I normally draw a pencil line square (by measuring) clamp a straight edge to the board that aligns the blade of my circular saw with the pencil line and cut.


yep I did the same for years, but then I decided on the jig that I use. I don't have to remember the distance from shoe to blade. I just align the edge of the jig, clamp it and cut it. :smile:


----------



## MT Stringer (Jul 21, 2009)

Don't forget to put some painters tape where your cut will be. Mark on top of it if you need to. the tape will help reduce tear out when you make your cut.

I have a straightedge (aluminum) that is attached to a piece of 1/4 inch Birch plywood. The plywood extednd out either side. The back side is used to clamp to the material being cut. The front side is (or was) wider than my circular saw. All you do is make a rip. Your blade will trim the ply to the exact width of your saw base to blade width. Then all you do is line up the plywood edge with your marks where the cut goes. Clamp and make your cut. It works well for me.

Here is a video that does a good job explaining what I am trying to convey.


----------



## Zircon (Aug 1, 2009)

_I had a similar problem. I made casing for my front door and I had to miter two pieces that were over seven feet long. I have a Ryobi table saw with a sliding table, but the table was too small._ I clamped on a larger piece of plywood with a 12"speed square aligned with the blade for the 45*. To support the end of the workpiece I positioned two roller stands in the direction of travel with a board between them. I got tight 45's that I don't think I could have gotten with a guide and a circular saw.


----------



## Pirate (Jul 23, 2009)

I made a cut like that, a few days ago.
I clamped a straight piece of wood under the panel. Used the straight edge as a fence, but the fence rode against the edge of the ts top, under the panel.


----------

