# Woodworking in an apartment/condo... possible?



## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Hi

I was wondering if it possible to do woodworking in an apartment/condo.

If yes, how can I achieve that?

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## kentucky tom (Feb 19, 2017)

Sure, small projects bird house, wood turning use your imagination


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

kentucky tom said:


> Sure, small projects bird house, wood turning use your imagination


My main worries are noise and wood dust/collection

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## MontanaBoom (Mar 15, 2017)

When I lived in my apartment, I used to take my tools down to the parking area, and do my work there. End of the day, pack it all back upstairs. Made a decent bedroom set that way.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

In an apartment or condo you do not use power tools that make noise. That is about anything with the exception of a lathe.

You work small projects with hand tools. You learn and practice real wood-crafting skills this way.

George


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## Mort (Jan 4, 2014)

Carving (hand tools) is something that could be done in an apartment. And most cities will have maker spaces.


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## Jim Frye (Aug 24, 2016)

When I was in the Air Force, we lived in an off base townhouse. The guy next door was an officer and he would do woodworking outside on his patio. He always seemed to fire up his power tools while our baby was trying to sleep (bedrooms were in the back over the patios). I never understood him as we had a fully equipped woodworking hobby shop on base that would have made Norm Abrams drool. Buy good quality hand tools and learn to use them well. You'll be a good neighbor as long as you don't scream loudly at a mistake. If you need to break down sheet goods, you could do it in the parking lot of where you buy it. All you need is four 2x4s, a good guide, and a cordless circular saw fitted with a good carbide blade.


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## Toolman50 (Mar 22, 2015)

An apartment or condo is not a good place to do woodworking for several reasons. 
Power tools make too much noise. Outlets were designed for lamps but not power tools. 
All completed projects need a final finish and an apartment is a poor spot for finishing. And you have to sleep in this apartment after your work. Breathing the dust you've made or the finish vapors you've applied. 
I suggest using your time reading up on woodworking, finding and developing plans to use in the future. 
This will help prepare you for a good start when you move to a place more accommodating to woodworking projects.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

What I did is I rented an apartment with an extra room and removed the carpet and did wood carving and assembly work. For machinery I rented a mini-warehouse and run my power tools off the power for the lights.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

GeorgeC said:


> In an apartment or condo you do not use power tools that make noise. That is about anything with the exception of a lathe.
> 
> You work small projects with hand tools. You learn and practice real wood-crafting skills this way.
> 
> George



Yeah I agree ... aren't lathe noisy? Plus wood flying out when doing wood turning 

Do people get bored doing woodturning?



Mort said:


> Carving (hand tools) is something that could be done in an apartment. And most cities will have maker spaces.



I don't live in a city... it a pretty residential area, probably like 40 mins away from the city and I ain't doing that



MontanaBoom said:


> When I lived in my apartment, I used to take my tools down to the parking area, and do my work there. End of the day, pack it all back upstairs. Made a decent bedroom set that way.



Lol That too much of a hassle for me to bring things down to the basement 



Jim Frye said:


> When I was in the Air Force, we lived in an off base townhouse. The guy next door was an officer and he would do woodworking outside on his patio. He always seemed to fire up his power tools while our baby was trying to sleep (bedrooms were in the back over the patios). I never understood him as we had a fully equipped woodworking hobby shop on base that would have made Norm Abrams drool. Buy good quality hand tools and learn to use them well. You'll be a good neighbor as long as you don't scream loudly at a mistake. If you need to break down sheet goods, you could do it in the parking lot of where you buy it. All you need is four 2x4s, a good guide, and a cordless circular saw fitted with a good carbide blade.



I agree with going hand tools route 

I think it just a matter of how to set up in the apartment/condo and what things I can make with limited space and equipment.




Toolman50 said:


> An apartment or condo is not a good place to do woodworking for several reasons.
> 
> Power tools make too much noise. Outlets were designed for lamps but not power tools.
> 
> ...



You are the first person to tell me to not do woodworking in an apartment/condo

I have no idea when I will able to get a house...It could be 5 years, that's a long time of just reading up on woodworking 



Steve Neul said:


> What I did is I rented an apartment with an extra room and removed the carpet and did wood carving and assembly work. For machinery I rented a mini-warehouse and run my power tools off the power for the lights.



The condo/apartment is 1 bed 1 den place... only option is to do it in the den

What kind of wood carving did you make? What kind of assembly work?



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## renraw9002 (Mar 19, 2016)

Lol I happen to have your same issue. I may not be the favorite neighbor amongst everyone here as I do use power tools including a small table saw out on the porch of my apartment. I never do any woodworking inside as there's no space and I have no desire to rip up carpet or clean up a dusty mess. However I am always courteous when it comes to the neighbors. I've had on a few times a neighbor politely ask me to stop as they were trying to work on a school project or in another case a work project and would like some quiet to do so to which I politely apologized and either switched to doing something else with just hand tools that I knew would be quiet or I just cleaned everything up and went inside.

One big note to keep in mind is I work 2nd shift and it seems the vast majority of the other apartment dwellers near me all work day turn as both apartment buildings next to me have virtually empty parking lots so that gives me time to work before work lol. It's only been during the weekends when someone has ever complained to me. As just another note of courteousness I have asked neighbors if my woodworking does bother them at all and the responses varied from: Not at all; eh it used to, but I don't notice it anymore; You woodwork? I never even noticed, I never hear anything coming from over there except when you and your wife argue; sometimes it does when I hear that vacuum going. You get the picture. Biggest thing is don't be a dick. I've made plenty of things living in an apartment and yes I read and watch videos.... a lot. It's more of a lack of money to buy supplies to be able to do anything with than it is a "I don't want to bother the neighbors" thing.


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

We did have poster who made electric guitars in his apartment. Forgotten his name. Had a nice view of the mountains out of his window.
johnep


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

mulak said:


> Yeah I agree ... aren't lathe noisy? Plus wood flying out when doing wood turning
> 
> Do people get bored doing woodturning?
> 
> ...


At that period in my life I was making nothing but furniture. It was the mid 1970's so I can't remember specifically what I was doing. I do remember I carved the center panel of this bed in the apartment. 

As far as the apartment, I leased a two bedroom apartment with the intention of making a shop in one bedroom.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

renraw9002 said:


> Lol I happen to have your same issue. I may not be the favorite neighbor amongst everyone here as I do use power tools including a small table saw out on the porch of my apartment. I never do any woodworking inside as there's no space and I have no desire to rip up carpet or clean up a dusty mess. However I am always courteous when it comes to the neighbors. I've had on a few times a neighbor politely ask me to stop as they were trying to work on a school project or in another case a work project and would like some quiet to do so to which I politely apologized and either switched to doing something else with just hand tools that I knew would be quiet or I just cleaned everything up and went inside.
> 
> One big note to keep in mind is I work 2nd shift and it seems the vast majority of the other apartment dwellers near me all work day turn as both apartment buildings next to me have virtually empty parking lots so that gives me time to work before work lol. It's only been during the weekends when someone has ever complained to me. As just another note of courteousness I have asked neighbors if my woodworking does bother them at all and the responses varied from: Not at all; eh it used to, but I don't notice it anymore; You woodwork? I never even noticed, I never hear anything coming from over there except when you and your wife argue; sometimes it does when I hear that vacuum going. You get the picture. Biggest thing is don't be a dick. I've made plenty of things living in an apartment and yes I read and watch videos.... a lot. It's more of a lack of money to buy supplies to be able to do anything with than it is a "I don't want to bother the neighbors" thing.


It seem to be a bigger pain in the butt because I think my condo will be fussy about it and are a bit strict on how the condo is run because for example we aren't allow to have xmas christmas lights on Feb 1 even if the lights are off. It has to be taken off and put it in storage or only allow certain outdoor furniture on the balcony.

It seem that I have to pick a different hobby and hoping some day I will get my own house/garage and do woodworking then

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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*try wood carving*



mulak said:


> It seem to be a bigger pain in the butt because I think my condo will be fussy about it and are a bit strict on how the condo is run because for example we aren't allow to have xmas christmas lights on Feb 1 even if the lights are off. It has to be taken off and put it in storage or only allow certain outdoor furniture on the balcony.
> 
> It seem that I have to pick a different hobby and hoping some day I will get my own house/garage and do woodworking then
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk


Carving is a quiet hobby, make little mess and will challenge you artistic skills. You can use mallets and gouges for large projects. You'll need a good workholding vise made for carvers and a heavy bench that won't move. It would work best if you are on the first floor or have a concrete base. A Dremel or Foredom rotary grinder would save some time. :smile3:


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## Toolman50 (Mar 22, 2015)

mulak said:


> You are the first person to tell me to not do woodworking in an apartment/condo
> 
> I have no idea when I will able to get a house...It could be 5 years, that's a long time of just reading up on woodworking.
> 
> ...



I tried woodworking in an apartment many years ago. So I know it's not practical. 
Can you do it? Of course you can, but that still doesn't make it practical. It's like finding a guy overhauling his motorcycle in the den. Yes you can do it, but it's not practical.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

mulak said:


> It seem to be a bigger pain in the butt because I think my condo will be fussy about it and are a bit strict on how the condo is run because for example we aren't allow to have xmas christmas lights on Feb 1 even if the lights are off. It has to be taken off and put it in storage or only allow certain outdoor furniture on the balcony.
> 
> It seem that I have to pick a different hobby and hoping some day I will get my own house/garage and do woodworking then
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk


The lights and February 1 are more practical than fussy. People leave them on the house too long and the weather deteriorates them and they become a fire hazard. Some entire towns require this as well. You know if they didn't make an ordinance a lot of people would leave the lights up year round. I know I had to cut apart a steel fence one time because the posts were rotted off at the ground. On the fence was a row a Christmas lights the insulation was rotted away on a lot of the wire and the bare wires touching the fence. I think if it wasn't for the paint on the fence somebody would have gotten zapped.


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## jaguar1201 (Sep 7, 2011)

47 years ago, I did woodworking in our 1 bedroom apt kitchen, and in the building basement. When our daughter was to be born, I made a cradle with turned spindles and countoured head and foot board, that would swing on pegs mounted in the uprights which were attached to the stand. Every thing was made out of hard maple. I had a cheapo JC Penny lathe and turned spindles in the kitchen. The noisy router and electric saw operations were mostly done in the basement. Drilling was done with a brace. Gluing was in the kitchen using pipe clamps. We still have the cradle in the attic.
Enrico


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

mulak said:


> Hi
> 
> I was wondering if it possible to do woodworking in an apartment/condo.
> 
> ...


Hand tools are generally very quiet. Dust shouldn't be much of an issue if you have a vacuum on hand. Remember the only thing that makes sawdust, is a saw. 

Woodworking inside is very possible, I work in my basement no problem.


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## Jig_saw (May 17, 2015)

Rodrat said:


> Hand tools are generally very quiet. Dust shouldn't be much of an issue if you have a vacuum on hand. Remember the only thing that makes sawdust, is a saw.
> 
> Woodworking inside is very possible, I work in my basement no problem.


I agree with Rodrat. Hand tools not only make less noise, they also make less dust. A handsaw has much thinner kerf than a power saw - much less sawdust.:thumbsup: Chisels and handplanes produce chips and shavings, much easier to clean up than the fine dust produced by routers, power saws, planers, etc.

Plus, you develop some muscles working with hand tools.:wink2:


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

Jig_saw said:


> Plus, you develop some muscles working with hand tools.:wink2:


I'm still a newby as a woodworker myself but as an all hand tool woodworker I can say that I lost 15 pounds already and gained 10 of it back as muscle. 

Dropped almost two inches off my pants line. I almost look like I did in high school.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Rodrat said:


> Hand tools are generally very quiet. Dust shouldn't be much of an issue if you have a vacuum on hand. Remember the only thing that makes sawdust, is a saw.
> 
> 
> 
> Woodworking inside is very possible, I work in my basement no problem.



Saw and sandpaper that make sawdust unless there is some hand tool for sandpaper substitute beside planes 

What quiet vacuum do you recommend?



jaguar1201 said:


> 47 years ago, I did woodworking in our 1 bedroom apt kitchen, and in the building basement. When our daughter was to be born, I made a cradle with turned spindles and countoured head and foot board, that would swing on pegs mounted in the uprights which were attached to the stand. Every thing was made out of hard maple. I had a cheapo JC Penny lathe and turned spindles in the kitchen. The noisy router and electric saw operations were mostly done in the basement. Drilling was done with a brace. Gluing was in the kitchen using pipe clamps. We still have the cradle in the attic.
> Enrico



Oh wow that's awesome



Steve Neul said:


> The lights and February 1 are more practical than fussy. People leave them on the house too long and the weather deteriorates them and they become a fire hazard. Some entire towns require this as well. You know if they didn't make an ordinance a lot of people would leave the lights up year round. I know I had to cut apart a steel fence one time because the posts were rotted off at the ground. On the fence was a row a Christmas lights the insulation was rotted away on a lot of the wire and the bare wires touching the fence. I think if it wasn't for the paint on the fence somebody would have gotten zapped.



I didn't expect that ... I guess that is a good thing after all lol... I don't want to get zap 



Jig_saw said:


> I agree with Rodrat. Hand tools not only make less noise, they also make less dust. A handsaw has much thinner kerf than a power saw - much less sawdust.:thumbsup: Chisels and handplanes produce chips and shavings, much easier to clean up than the fine dust produced by routers, power saws, planers, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> Plus, you develop some muscles working with hand tools.:wink2:






Rodrat said:


> I'm still a newby as a woodworker myself but as an all hand tool woodworker I can say that I lost 15 pounds already and gained 10 of it back as muscle.
> 
> 
> 
> Dropped almost two inches off my pants line. I almost look like I did in high school.




Ooo I do like to build up muscles ... are hand tools really that physically demanding?




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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

Quiet vacuum? Don't really have anything for that, I just use the cheapo shop vac I bought.

I suppose sandpaper does make dust but I stop at the smoothing plane. I like the look and feel it leaves. 

As for the workout, plaining is easy. You can do that all day. Sawing on the other hand is tiresome. Doing dovetails is fairly tiresome for me. But it's all a good tired. You really feel like you accomplished something. It's not quite like hitting the gym or something but you don't see too many hand tool workers that don't look at least a little fit. 

I also prefer hand tools because at the end of the day my clean up is way easier, I'm not deaf and I don't feel so bad about grabbing seconds at dinner.


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## Jig_saw (May 17, 2015)

To add to what Rodrat wrote, bigger bench planes also give equal workout to both hands ... you don't want to mess with a woodworker who spends 5-6 hours everyday with a jointer plane


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Jig_saw said:


> To add to what Rodrat wrote, bigger bench planes also give equal workout to both hands ... you don't want to mess with a woodworker who spends 5-6 hours everyday with a jointer plane






Rodrat said:


> Quiet vacuum? Don't really have anything for that, I just use the cheapo shop vac I bought.
> 
> I suppose sandpaper does make dust but I stop at the smoothing plane. I like the look and feel it leaves.
> 
> ...




Cheap shop vac .. easy enough

Planining, sawing and dovetails sounds fun lol ... I know where you are coming, without machine it more rewarding knowing you made something with your hands with the same quality as the machine can produce


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## tjdux (Feb 3, 2017)

You can use a cabinet scraper in replacement for and paper to a degree. It will smooth things up pretty decent. It will make a mess but less than sanding.

Why don't you ask if you can run some power tools in the parking lot? Also a plastic tote and a few tools is plenty easy to carry.

I do all my remote work away from my shop that way. Carry tools in carry tools out. 

Signiture; Check out my garage progress http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352703


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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

Yes, you can do woodworking in an apartment. There are limitations, but you absolutely can. Having done it (and currently working in a small space despite having a house), here are my thoughts.

1) Carpet is horrible. If you have carpet, get a tarp to put down while you're working.

2) Accept having a "small" bench. My current bench is about 4'x2', and is quite workable. I've never wished it was deeper, but an extra foot or two of length would be really nice.

3) Think carefully about what tools you're going to use. In a small space with shared walls, you're going to end up doing most things with hand tools. I'd consider getting a circular saw and guide track for long rip cuts, because they're just a pain to do by hand: just make sure to take them out to the parking lot to use them...

4) Think carefully about storage. Until I started getting into moulding planes, I was able to store 99% of my tools in a single "Dutch" style chest, roughly 31"x13". The primary exception is a Langdon miter box. I've made some changes, but the chest still looks pretty much like this:
Dutch Toolchest - open by a_mckenzie_4, on Flickr

You could probably build a Shaker-style workbench and keep just as much stuff, but I'd rather not have my tools blocked in by whatever I'm working on.

5) Keep up with the mess. Hand tools largely produce chips and shavings, not dust, but it still piles up. And the dust gets EVERYWHERE if you don't keep on top of it. Plan to sweep every day you use the shop, and vacuum every few days.

6) Think carefully about finishes. Milk paint is moderately durable and has little to no odor, so it's a good choice. Wax would be good, and shellac (wiped on rather than sprayed) would also be a good choice. Any kind of spray finish, for instance, is likely to end in tears.

7) Consider your projects. My "work" space is a little less than six feet square. My storage space is another 20"x48", in the form of a wire-rack shelf unit. Right now I'm working on a toddler-sized bed frame, with no problems. I built these toy chests in there, which are about 24"x24"x32". I did take over the dining table to paint the parts, but the final glue up was back in the shop space.

Chest 03 by a_mckenzie_4, on Flickr


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

tjdux said:


> You can use a cabinet scraper in replacement for and paper to a degree. It will smooth things up pretty decent. It will make a mess but less than sanding.
> 
> Why don't you ask if you can run some power tools in the parking lot? Also a plastic tote and a few tools is plenty easy to carry.
> 
> ...


Ahh ok cool ... good to know that there is an alternative for sand paper

I'm a bit nervous by asking the condo board because they may not approve me for cutting wood in the parking lot. Since now they know what I am doing, they may not want me to woodwork at all in my condo because of possible noises. 

I could cut the wood at my mom's place which is like 7-10mins away



amckenzie4 said:


> Yes, you can do woodworking in an apartment. There are limitations, but you absolutely can. Having done it (and currently working in a small space despite having a house), here are my thoughts.
> 
> 1) Carpet is horrible. If you have carpet, get a tarp to put down while you're working.
> 
> ...












1. This is the layout of my condo. My place doesn't have any carpet at all, it hardwood everywhere and tiles in the kitchen and bathroom area

2. Definitely have to accept a small bench 

3. Things that I want to make does dictate what tools I need. Definitely have to think about the circular saw/parking lot situation. 

What general woodwork projects really require a circular saw because maybe i dont need it right now and do projects with tools I have and just wait until I get my own house/garage/basement

4. Yeah I agree ... I don't want tools in my way

it a nice looking dutch storage chest. I have one of those craftsman tool chest, is that feasible? Or too much? My mom got it for me at a garage sale for like 20 bucks I think.

5. Will try to keep up the mess

6. No idea what milk paint is and found out that it take in like a stain but look like paint.

Gotcha... no spray no tears 

7. I haven't decided if I'm putting a small table for office in the den, just a place to put my laptop but it may not worth doing that because I don't do office work since I'm a pastry chef which pretty much doesn't require an office.

But might have a 2x4' closet unit in the den area.

I like toy chest ... look good

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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

That's a pretty nice layout, honestly.

Assuming you're living alone, you might consider turning the "den" into a shop space. A bench about 5' long against the wall shared with the bedroom would let you work on fairly long pieces, since you could run them out into the dining room while you were working. Make your first project a set of folding screens to hide the mess behind when you've got guests, and you can use the space pretty easily. They're pretty easy to make, too, which is a nice bonus. Just sweep the dust back into the "shop", and set up the screens.

Pretty much any tool chest will do: I happen to like working with the layout of the one I have, but work with what you've got until you figure out what (if anything) you don't like about it. If the chest you have is metal (which it sounds like it is) you'll want to line it with something to keep sharp edges from hitting the metal, but other than that I don't see a problem with it.

As to the circular saw: there's nothing that says you "have to" have any powered tools at all. When you get right down to it, no one at all had powered tools in their shop until a hundred years or go, give or take, and a lot of the most iconic furniture styles were created during times when everything was hand built. I find long rip cuts to be annoying, and hard to do accurately (as do most beginners, from what I've heard), so I like having the option of a power tool with a fence. If you're mostly going to be doing limited projects with lumber that's pre-cut to width, you can almost certainly get away without one.

Thanks for the compliment on the chest! That's painted with milk paint, by the way... no way could I have gotten away with latex paint in the dining room!


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## tjdux (Feb 3, 2017)

There may have been more "power" tools 100+ years ago than you would think. Between water, steam and animal power cutting lumber was right up there with food production in terms of importance.

None the less its still totally possible to do it by had. 

That said a circular saw to break down plywood to will save hours of time and sweat.

Break it down with a pair or 3 saw horses in the parking lot or balcony (if you can) and i would try and run an extension cord from your apt to the lot to get a cheaper saw rather than batt powered. Then use planes inside to shape it better (if needed)

Plus i would really look into doing as much as possible on that balcony. Much easier to clean up at the end of the day.

Signiture; Check out my garage progress http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352703


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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

tjdux said:


> There may have been more "power" tools 100+ years ago than you would think. Between water, steam and animal power cutting lumber was right up there with food production in terms of importance.
> 
> None the less its still totally possible to do it by had.
> 
> ...


Yeah, a hundred years is an understatement. 150 would be a better number to use... at that point lumber was being produced with powered tools, but most shops would have just started the move to powered machinery.

Plywood! There's a good point: don't try to use hand tools with plywood. You and your tools will both regret it. Cutting quarter inch ply for a panel, sure... dedicate a saw to that job, and don't use it for anything else. But don't try to make furniture out of plywood with hand tools. It will dull the blade remarkably quickly, and then the ply will start to splinter.


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

Interested to hear you are a pastry chef. I am working on Sugar Free recipes at the moment. Main project is a SF Sponge Cake. Gluten Free (GF) is all the rage at the moment but SF foods are comparatively rare.
I need to avoid sugar as a diabetic. 
johnep


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

amckenzie4 said:


> That's a pretty nice layout, honestly.
> 
> As to the circular saw: there's nothing that says you "have to" have any powered tools at all. When you get right down to it, no one at all had powered tools in their shop until a hundred years or go, give or take, and a lot of the most iconic furniture styles were created during times when everything was hand built. I find long rip cuts to be annoying, and hard to do accurately (as do most beginners, from what I've heard), so I like having the option of a power tool with a fence. If you're mostly going to be doing limited projects with lumber that's pre-cut to width, you can almost certainly get away without one.


I dont remember where but I recently learned a handy tip ripping by hand (also works for cross cuts). For the rip, after you scribed your line, cut square across the top so you have a small track front to back. Then tilt the saw to follow your front line staying in the track and only focus on cutting that line. 

I think it might have been Roy Underhill. But either way I have been cutting beautifully straight rips for a week now. The phrase he used was "focus on only cutting one line at a time"


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

Mort said:


> Carving (hand tools) is something that could be done in an apartment. And most cities will have maker spaces.


Well Mort, just wittling with a pocket knife probably technically qualifies as woodworking. 
I guess it really depends on how involved you want to get and the physical size of your projects. I'm assuming you won't be building any 8' long formal dining room tables in your apartment. Then again you might. Post pictures if you do.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

I built a grandfather clock (emperor clock kit) on the washer dryer (they made a great workbench), had a 10" bandsaw and 6" jointer - fairly quiet equipment. built a few clocks with them. and yes, I was one of those that rebuilt a motorcycle in my living room.


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## renraw9002 (Mar 19, 2016)

mulak said:


> Ooo I do like to build up muscles ... are hand tools really that physically demanding?
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


absolutely. talk to me again after you've been hand sanding for hours on a big project or multiple little ones. Or picking up and putting down a circular saw or hand saw, hammering in nails, glueing up projects. You will feel the burn, but you won't notice (at least I don't) until you go inside for a break or for the end of the day and suddenly you're sitting there thinking HOLY *expletive* things hurt I didn't even know could hurt. You'll still feel good about what you got done, but yes hand tools can be very physically demanding over time.


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## wkearney99 (Mar 23, 2017)

renraw9002 said:


> absolutely. talk to me again after you've been hand sanding for hours on a big project or multiple little ones.


Depending on the kind of job, decent hand planes and card scrapers can provide a great finish without having to sand much (if at all). That and not generate a ton of fine dust particulates. THAT would be my bigger concern for doing any power tool woodworking in that small condo. Do not underestimate how badly that fine dust can clog up air handler filters... and your lungs.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

johnep1934 said:


> Interested to hear you are a pastry chef. I am working on Sugar Free recipes at the moment. Main project is a SF Sponge Cake. Gluten Free (GF) is all the rage at the moment but SF foods are comparatively rare.
> 
> I need to avoid sugar as a diabetic.
> 
> johnep



Sugar free is tough ... have to use like fruit juices or something that is naturally sweet and then have to deal with the liquid because it affect the texture since sugar have no liquid which is easy to deal with

Can use splenda but never work with it though



Rodrat said:


> I dont remember where but I recently learned a handy tip ripping by hand (also works for cross cuts). For the rip, after you scribed your line, cut square across the top so you have a small track front to back. Then tilt the saw to follow your front line staying in the track and only focus on cutting that line.
> 
> I think it might have been Roy Underhill. But either way I have been cutting beautifully straight rips for a week now. The phrase he used was "focus on only cutting one line at a time"



That make sense ... thanks for the tip

Will check out Roy underhill



tjdux said:


> There may have been more "power" tools 100+ years ago than you would think. Between water, steam and animal power cutting lumber was right up there with food production in terms of importance.
> 
> None the less its still totally possible to do it by had.
> 
> ...



Been thinking about getting the circular saw and possibly do it in the balcony :S oh boy

How long do you think it take to rip the biggest piece? Maybe I can do it quick or spread out the cuts over time so neighbours won't get annoy



allpurpose said:


> Well Mort, just wittling with a pocket knife probably technically qualifies as woodworking.
> 
> I guess it really depends on how involved you want to get and the physical size of your projects. I'm assuming you won't be building any 8' long formal dining room tables in your apartment. Then again you might. Post pictures if you do.



Well no .. I don't need a long formal table lol but do need a coffee table and dining table of some kind for my place. I thought I could build them myself.



amckenzie4 said:


> That's a pretty nice layout, honestly.
> 
> Assuming you're living alone, you might consider turning the "den" into a shop space. A bench about 5' long against the wall shared with the bedroom would let you work on fairly long pieces, since you could run them out into the dining room while you were working. Make your first project a set of folding screens to hide the mess behind when you've got guests, and you can use the space pretty easily. They're pretty easy to make, too, which is a nice bonus. Just sweep the dust back into the "shop", and set up the screens.
> 
> ...



Yeah I'm alone... ooo 5' bench lol ... is that a standard size? How deep for the bench?

Here is my tool chest and yes it metal









Yeah I understand where you are coming from regarding the circular saw

Uhh a fence? I assumed that is a guide for straight cut?.. maybe I need a woodworker 101 to learn about tools and their lingos before starting this  lol ... is there a book on like "work your way" kind of thing? Like beginner projects and increase difficulty in each project over time

there is a possibility of getting a circular saw, still haven't decided on it. If I can do it quick before it annoy the neighbour then maybe but I can't going to the basement or parking lot and do it there.. that ain't happening 

Do you prefer milk paint over wood stain?




TimPa said:


> I built a grandfather clock (emperor clock kit) on the washer dryer (they made a great workbench), had a 10" bandsaw and 6" jointer - fairly quiet equipment. built a few clocks with them. and yes, I was one of those that rebuilt a motorcycle in my living room.



lol that's cool that you did a grandfather clock on the washer dryer and that's crazy that you rebuilt a motorcycle in your living room... crazy but badass lol



amckenzie4 said:


> Yeah, a hundred years is an understatement. 150 would be a better number to use... at that point lumber was being produced with powered tools, but most shops would have just started the move to powered machinery.
> 
> 
> 
> Plywood! There's a good point: don't try to use hand tools with plywood. You and your tools will both regret it. Cutting quarter inch ply for a panel, sure... dedicate a saw to that job, and don't use it for anything else. But don't try to make furniture out of plywood with hand tools. It will dull the blade remarkably quickly, and then the ply will start to splinter.



Ahh good to know about plywood

I'm surprised that people work with plywood for furniture. I thought woodworker like to work with one solid wood piece and joint them together



renraw9002 said:


> absolutely. talk to me again after you've been hand sanding for hours on a big project or multiple little ones. Or picking up and putting down a circular saw or hand saw, hammering in nails, glueing up projects. You will feel the burn, but you won't notice (at least I don't) until you go inside for a break or for the end of the day and suddenly you're sitting there thinking HOLY *expletive* things hurt I didn't even know could hurt. You'll still feel good about what you got done, but yes hand tools can be very physically demanding over time.



Lmao ... something to look forward to

What about orbital sanders? Worth it? Are they noisy?



wkearney99 said:


> Depending on the kind of job, decent hand planes and card scrapers can provide a great finish without having to sand much (if at all). That and not generate a ton of fine dust particulates. THAT would be my bigger concern for doing any power tool woodworking in that small condo. Do not underestimate how badly that fine dust can clog up air handler filters... and your lungs.



That is good to know

What about orbital sander? Are they noisy? If not, maybe I can do it on the balcony 


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

mulak said:


> Yeah I'm alone... ooo 5' bench lol ... is that a standard size? How deep for the bench?


A 5 foot bench is considered on the small size for sure but its what I have and it plenty workable though a normal workbench is usually somewhere between 6 to 8 feet I think. The average historical workbench is only 13-22 inches wide. I made mine wider and actually regret doing it considering the limited space I work with and it starts to get harder to reach across the table for when you inevitably put something on the end.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Rodrat said:


> A 5 foot bench is considered on the small size for sure but its what I have and it plenty workable though a normal workbench is usually somewhere between 6 to 8 feet I think. The average historical workbench is only 13-22 inches wide. I made mine wider and actually regret doing it considering the limited space I work with and it starts to get harder to reach across the table for when you inevitably put something on the end.



What kind of bench do you have?

Oh really ... that's good to know, I thought wider the better in a way so you lay it out better and not worry about things falling off the bench or whatever


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## renraw9002 (Mar 19, 2016)

mulak said:


> That is good to know
> 
> What about orbital sander? Are they noisy? If not, maybe I can do it on the balcony
> 
> ...


Most any powered sander is going to be pretty loud. Especially if you hook a vacuum up to it and run the vacuum at the same time you're sanding (which btw is so convenient for clean up purposes). 

For rough smoothing use a belt sander which will save you a lot of time and aching. I also have a 1/4 sheet palm sander which is great for finer sanding. An orbital sander is kind of like a jack of both trades though. Supposedly an orbital sander is good for not getting those little swirls you can get from a palm sander. I've been using my palm sander since Christmas and I've yet to see any swirls in my finishes so idk what they're talking about.


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## tjdux (Feb 3, 2017)

Orbital sander leaves fish hooks and palm sanders can leave little circles. They are about the same evil in my opinion. 

As far as a circular saw to break stuff down quickly.... It will depend on how many cuts and obviously your skill which will improve with practice. A good tool to improve circular saw speed is streight edge cutting guides. Harbor freight sells a 4ft one for aboit 15 bucks on sale. Its worth it. 

Actually i would reccomend a trip there when you start buying tools in general. They have great prices and generally decent quality stuff. Stay away from their cordless battery powered tools but if it plugs into the wall its probably ok. And if its not you have 90 days return or exchange no questions asked. Keep your receipts.

You could roll in there get a circular saw, extension cord, saw horses, edge guide, clamps (threaded clamp bar type not the quick grip squeeze handles) drill, some brad point bits, chisels (although for lots of hand work o would reccomend spending more $ on decent ones, same with planes) hammer, screw drivers, pliers, hand saw (they have a decent flush cut saw but for lots of hand cutting again soend more for quality, check amazon for Japanese hand saws), level, square, and tape measure all for around 200-300$. Then mosey over tona lumber yard and get some 1x materials and build a tool box.

Signiture; Check out my garage progress http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352703


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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

mulak said:


> Been thinking about getting the circular saw and possibly do it in the balcony :S oh boy
> 
> How long do you think it take to rip the biggest piece? Maybe I can do it quick or spread out the cuts over time so neighbours won't get annoy



Working on the balcony is definitely possible. Once you've set up the guide, a six foot cut will take less than a minute. Granted, that's a minute of a screaming power tool, but it is pretty short.



mulak said:


> Yeah I'm alone... ooo 5' bench lol ... is that a standard size? How deep for the bench?


There really isn't a standard. These days people mostly seem to go 6' or 8', because those are convenient sizes to get lumber in. Mine is 4', and is a little cramped, but is also the biggest I can fit into the space I'm using.

This is an old photo, but it looks more or less the same now:

Bench 1 by a_mckenzie_4, on Flickr

As to depth: There's a compulsion to make it as deep as possible, which I think is a mistake. My bench is just over 24" deep, and I never really use the back third for anything except setting tools down while I'm working. I'm planning to build another once I get my garage insulated, and probably make it 20" deep, with a narrow shelf above it for setting tools down on. 

The tool rack has been fantastic, though... I highly recommend hanging a rack behind the bench when you're setting up. I mostly don't use it for permanent storage, just to set out tools I know I'm going to need, and it's a LOT safer than just setting a chisel down on the bench.




mulak said:


> Here is my tool chest and yes it metal
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, I meant guide, not fence. They can sometimes be used interchangeably, though.

I highly recommend Jim Tolpin's "New Traditonal Woodworker", Sellers' "Working Wood 1 & 2" (one book, despite the name), and the magazines "Popular Woodworking" and "Fine Woodworking". You'll pick up terminology as you go, and never be afraid to ask.

And that chest will serve you well! Just please, please, line the drawers with something that won't damage cutting edges.



mulak said:


> there is a possibility of getting a circular saw, still haven't decided on it. If I can do it quick before it annoy the neighbour then maybe but I can't going to the basement or parking lot and do it there.. that ain't happening
> 
> Do you prefer milk paint over wood stain?


To be honest, I've only worked with stain once or twice: I generally prefer either the natural color of the wood or paint. So I do prefer milk paint, but not for any technical reasons... I just like the way it looks.



mulak said:


> Ahh good to know about plywood
> 
> I'm surprised that people work with plywood for furniture. I thought woodworker like to work with one solid wood piece and joint them together


A lot of furniture makers use plywood these days. It's stable, easy to get, reliable, and consistent. My workbench has a top made of four layers of 3/4" ply, and the walls of the "box" underneath are made of plywood. I don't use it much, but again, mostly because of the tools I use and my shop size. I can't easily work on a 4'x8' sheet of ply in a 6' square space. If you've got a reasonably sized shop with a table saw, it's a useful material.





mulak said:


> Lmao ... something to look forward to
> 
> What about orbital sanders? Worth it? Are they noisy?


Orbital sanders are nice, and not too loud as power tools go. You'll definitely want earplugs, though. That said, since I stopped using power tools I've also mostly stopped using powered sanders. A hand plane or scraper can leave a really nice surface, and if I sand at all it's generally a once over to make everything catch the light the same way. I did use an orbital sander on a queen bed frame I made, though... that was a lot of surface area and I was in a hurry.


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## wkearney99 (Mar 23, 2017)

mulak said:


> Will check out Roy underhill


http://www.pbs.org/woodwrightsshop/

http://www.pbs.org/woodwrightsshop/watch-on-line/watch-episodes-topics/

Set your DVR to record it from your local PBS affiliate.

I've gotten my 8yo to start watching it. He's been delighted to discover how easily one can use hand tools for woodworking. I gave him spokeshave and some scrap wood and he turned out a pretty decent 'sword handle' in no time at all. Then showed him how a power tool setup wouldn't really have made the job any easier, and certainly not as inexpensive, tool-wise.


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## wkearney99 (Mar 23, 2017)

amckenzie4 said:


> Working on the balcony is definitely possible.


Until your neighbors start having to deal with sawdust cast off from your work. That it's a condo makes it even less appealing, given the hassles of associations and all.

Depending on where you're located there may be a woodworkers club nearby. Check around. Some have full shops and various membership options to fit different needs. Upside is you don't have to own or maintain larger/louder pieces of equipment. Downside is scheduling your time back/forth.


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

To answer your question from earlier, I built Paul Sellers work bench but I didn't make the tool well because I made it too wide to begin with. 

Once I realized how wide I made it by mistake I couldn't fit the tool well into it without it eating all my space. 

His bench is super easy for a new guy to make as a first project and hardly costs anything. It's also very very sturdy.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

amckenzie4 said:


> Working on the balcony is definitely possible. Once you've set up the guide, a six foot cut will take less than a minute. Granted, that's a minute of a screaming power tool, but it is pretty short.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That a nice looking bench... I like the tool rack feature and it give protection from hitting the wall as well

Good to know to not have a deep bench

Thanks for the book recommendations ... I will check them out on the weekend at chapters 

What do you recommend to line the drawers with? Rubber?

Seem like I can't use plywood since it create havoc on hand tools. So It not suitable for me at the moment



wkearney99 said:


> http://www.pbs.org/woodwrightsshop/
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I actually don't have this show on pbs but found another woodworking show but don't know if it hand tools wood working 



tjdux said:


> Orbital sander leaves fish hooks and palm sanders can leave little circles. They are about the same evil in my opinion.
> 
> As far as a circular saw to break stuff down quickly.... It will depend on how many cuts and obviously your skill which will improve with practice. A good tool to improve circular saw speed is streight edge cutting guides. Harbor freight sells a 4ft one for aboit 15 bucks on sale. Its worth it.
> 
> ...



Haha yeah I can't go to harbor freight. I live in Canada, we don't have those stores here.

I have heard about a Japanese hand saw on amazon from one of the blogs I read recently ... I wasn't expecting that 




Rodrat said:


> To answer your question from earlier, I built Paul Sellers work bench but I didn't make the tool well because I made it too wide to begin with.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Interesting looking bench .. why is there a lower level on the table down the middle of Paul sellers bench?



wkearney99 said:


> Until your neighbors start having to deal with sawdust cast off from your work. That it's a condo makes it even less appealing, given the hassles of associations and all.
> 
> 
> 
> Depending on where you're located there may be a woodworkers club nearby. Check around. Some have full shops and various membership options to fit different needs. Upside is you don't have to own or maintain larger/louder pieces of equipment. Downside is scheduling your time back/forth.



Lol oh boy... you are making me doubt doing the balcony now..Didn't think of the sawdust going down below to the neighbour... I was only thinking of the noise




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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

The lower level is a place to set tools and other objects down and it keeps them in hands reach but wont stick up in the way. Its not necessary but I imagine it would be nice to have. Lots of benches have them. 









Also I would look into Paul Sellers video series on youtube and his website woodworkingmasterclasses.com 
He is an excellent teacher for hand tools.


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## tjdux (Feb 3, 2017)

If your in canada look up "samurai carpenter" on youtube. Its pretty good stuff and he has a crazy nice shop and every powertool imaginable he actually makes lots of projects with hand tools and shows many useful ways to use them and sharpen them which is equally important. Too bad no harbor freight. They may deliver to Canada but no clue of that's really worth it

Signiture; Check out my garage progress http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352703


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

The Samurai Carpenter just seems like an all around cool dude. I wouldn't mind meeting him. I know he has been trying to do meet ups for his fans but I live a thousand miles away from him.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Rodrat said:


> The lower level is a place to set tools and other objects down and it keeps them in hands reach but wont stick up in the way. Its not necessary but I imagine it would be nice to have. Lots of benches have them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yeah it good to have additional storage especially for wood pieces if I have nowhere to store them

I dislike (subtle version) my craftsman drill. My mom got it for me for quite some time ago... if I squeeze it the trigger, it spin so fast and it overdrive and tear up the grooves in the screws. I have to lightly touch the trigger in order to work well enough 

I will check out Paul sellers videos, I saw his stuffs on his site. I really liked his projects, I somewhat like to do a more modern touch to them, just cleaner lines basically... overall the concepts of his stuffs are great considering they are made from hand tools



Rodrat said:


> The Samurai Carpenter just seems like an all around cool dude. I wouldn't mind meeting him. I know he has been trying to do meet ups for his fans but I live a thousand miles away from him.



That would be cool 



tjdux said:


> If your in canada look up "samurai carpenter" on youtube. Its pretty good stuff and he has a crazy nice shop and every powertool imaginable he actually makes lots of projects with hand tools and shows many useful ways to use them and sharpen them which is equally important. Too bad no harbor freight. They may deliver to Canada but no clue of that's really worth it
> 
> Signiture; Check out my garage progress http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352703




Ohh sweet ... thanks for the information on the samurai 




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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

mulak said:


> That a nice looking bench... I like the tool rack feature and it give protection from hitting the wall as well
> 
> Good to know to not have a deep bench
> 
> ...


Rubber drawer liner, felt, something like that. The big thing is to keep the tools from sliding around and banging into the metal as you open and close the drawers. Some people go with a "French fit" system (custom holders for every tool), but I'm too lazy for that.

Japanese and Asian style tools are pretty neat. I have a Shark brand ryoba that I like quite a lot, and a few planes made by Mujingfang that are surprisingly good for their price, particularly the 11" jack. 

Using their saws is very different, though, since it cuts on the pull. For me, I find it easier to use the ryoba for long cuts in thin stock, and a western style saw for everything else, but it's all personal preference at this point.

Plywood is pretty hard on hand tools, and it's also tough to get a full sheet through a regular size door. With a circular saw and a good guide system you can still do a lot with it, but you're not going to want to work with it inside the condo.

Sawing on the porch.... running a shop vac to pick up most of the dust would probably be sufficient, but I admit I hadn't thought too much about dust on the porch downstairs.


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## WesTex (Jan 5, 2014)

Get some of the mat that is sold to line mechanic's toolboxes. They not only cushion the tools, but are impregnated to help ward off rust. 
They are thin, easily cut to fit, and inexpensive. 
I bought the mat at Lowe's. I expect one could find it at auto supply stores, or online. 
Similar matting can be found a bit cheaper to line kitchen cabinet shelves, but it doesn't have the rust inhibitor. 
I've only seen the toolbox mat in black. The kitchen liner is available in several colors. 


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

I don't really know what else I would add to your thread but as a newby to woodworking myself who only uses hand tools, if you have any questions, feel free to ask. I might be able to help.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

amckenzie4 said:


> Rubber drawer liner, felt, something like that. The big thing is to keep the tools from sliding around and banging into the metal as you open and close the drawers. Some people go with a "French fit" system (custom holders for every tool), but I'm too lazy for that.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Will look for those liner material 

That's pretty cool looking Asian style tools

Yeah plywood is probably not suitable for me and condo living 

Do you do woodworking as a hobby? Business? Do you sell your stuffs? 

What kind of things do you make?



Rodrat said:


> I don't really know what else I would add to your thread but as a newby to woodworking myself who only uses hand tools, if you have any questions, feel free to ask. I might be able to help.



That would be great ... thanks for the help and advices

Do you do woodworking as a hobby? Business? Do you sell your stuffs? 

What kind of things do you make?






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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

Right now a hobby but I'm hoping to turn it into a business down the road. 

So far I built mostly a few handy jigs for my work bench. A stool for my wife, a small hand plane, and I'm working (albeit at a snails pace) on a cabinet for my bathroom.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Rodrat said:


> Right now a hobby but I'm hoping to turn it into a business down the road.
> 
> 
> 
> So far I built mostly a few handy jigs for my work bench. A stool for my wife, a small hand plane, and I'm working (albeit at a snails pace) on a cabinet for my bathroom.




Oh nice!

What kind of business do you want to do? Do you have a niche in mind or just doing general woodworking items?


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

I have a really cool idea for some custom cutting boards that I have shared with a few people and I have several people excited about them so hopefully I can get that going. 

I don't want to give too much info away as they are pretty unique.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Rodrat said:


> I have a really cool idea for some custom cutting boards that I have shared with a few people and I have several people excited about them so hopefully I can get that going.
> 
> I don't want to give too much info away as they are pretty unique.


Oh nice ... I hope it work out

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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

mulak said:


> Will look for those liner material
> 
> That's pretty cool looking Asian style tools
> 
> ...


Entirely a hobby for me, though I may end up selling a few pieces at some point. I made the toy chests for my nephews, a queen bed frame for a friend, a couple of picture frames, and the like. A few small boxes for storing shop parts as an experiment with splined miter joints, which came out sort of OK.

It's been fun, and I'll keep up with it as long as it stays fun. :smile3:


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Interesting development just recently happen that my mom is allowing me to use her garage for woodworking when the weather is warming up because she park her car in garage during winter.

I was a bit surprised that she is cool with it but at least I'm not limited by the condo. So basically I can make whatever I want I guess. I have to decide what wood items are easy to sell or what things people are willingly to buy from a freelance woodworker at home. I can't just make whatever I want and do nothing with the finish product if I don't have any place to put it personally, so it best to do it as some sort of side business


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

So where are you going to store your workbench and materials when the weather is cold? Moving those things are going to be a hassle.


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## mulak (Sep 3, 2016)

Rodrat said:


> So where are you going to store your workbench and materials when the weather is cold? Moving those things are going to be a hassle.




Yeah true... I'm hoping I would get a house by then if possible


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## Rodrat (Aug 31, 2016)

Good luck on that one. Hope it works out for ya.


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