# Outdoor Furniture - Pressure Treated Lumber?



## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

Good Evening all,

Only my second post, but lurky for a couple of weeks. Am starting fresh, (new, but not brand new, Almost) I am going to purchase a B&D Firestorm Plunge router and 10" table saw very soon. My main focus at least at the begining will be Adrondack (sp?) outdoor furniture for my trailer. I know most if not all of you use cedar or maybe teak, but I am going to start with pressure treated lumber. Does any see or know of a problem with this? I know they won't last as long as Teak or cedar but You have to START somewhere right?

Also I am sure there is someone that remembers the 70's maybe even 60's style "redwood" furniture. It looked as thought it was built strictly out of 2x4's. They had the lounge chair cushions that usually had VINYL with buttons and bright ugly flowers? Would anyone happen to know where I could find some plans? or even pictures that I might be able to figure it out from looking at it? For some reason my wife LOVES there, the last set we had went into the campfire about 10 years ago, after MANY MANY YEARS of service.

THANK YOU ALL for this board and the friendly and VERY HELPFUL advice and comments!

Cheers:notworthy:


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## mmwood_1 (Oct 24, 2007)

If you're going to use PT wood for your adirondak chairs, my advice is to be careful of splinter spots. Try to have the places such as the seat and arm rests as free of splintery spots as possible. Splinters from PT wood can get infected easily and, man, do they hurt when they do.

As for the redwood furniture, I made some of that for my mom when I was a teenager in the '70s. But I'm not sure where you'd get plans. They were basically all made like picnic benches. Put together with either nails, bolts, or screws. My mom had magazines with photos and directions, so that was what I went by. Good luck.


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## Terry Beeson (May 29, 2008)

I have two Adirondack chairs, two straight chairs, a small table, and an outdoor dining table all made of PT wood. Mark is right about the splinter spots, but other than that, I LOVE my furniture. It's going through its 10th summer along with some other A-chairs I made for my mom and my sister. Just keep them treated with a good water treatment and you'll be fine. Oh... and use deck screws to assemble... not nails...


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

mmwood_1 said:


> As for the redwood furniture, I made some of that for my mom when I was a teenager in the '70s. But I'm not sure where you'd get plans. *They were basically all made like picnic benches.* .


 
MM That is the stuff I am talking about exactly. I never really cared for them, (HATE VINYL in the summer, plus you always got up with the button marks on your legs LOL) But my wife love them!

Will keep looking though thanks. Maybe someone here will know or have some pics.


Terry, absoutley splinter free. (have a 3 year old grandson that has to be WHEREVER MomMom is so splinters would be a concern. Any suggestions on keeping it splinter free, aside from the obvious "well sanded"? Also in reference to keeping it sealed. I was under the impression that pressure treated wood, wouldn't accept stain/Thompson sealer. (thought that was the point of pressure treated to keep the moisture out? Or am I under the wrong assumption? (Which happens quite a bit! haha)

Thanks guys :icon_cool:


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## dirtclod (May 7, 2008)

PT lumber should not be used for outdoor funiture. Besides the splinters, consider the chemicals that will be released. They will absorb through your skin via the armrest, and get onto any food container and into any food that comes into contact with it. Despite how carefull you are, others (especially kids) won't take the precautions that you do to avoid this.

There's two picnic tables outside that were made of PT wood. Despite being painted, the pine pitch oozed out and beaded up on the surface. The beads are hard during the winter and soft during the summer. It doesn't take much imagination to see that the pitch carried the PT chemicals out with it. No one will use them.

You mentioned redwood, but old growth cypress is also commonly used for Adirondack chairs. A visit to your local small sawmill may yield some good advice on local species that will work for this application and will probably be less expensive. Besides, if you're getting into woodworking there's no one better to get to know than your local sawmill man. [Does this make me sound bias? :laughing:]


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## jerry (Nov 1, 2006)

If you insist on using PT pine for furniture use a small (1/4" or smaller) round-over bit in your new router and round over any edges that can be touched,or will touch someone. Next after this wood dries out(and probably warps) apply a coat of shellac before any other finish. I understand this maybe less expensive in the short term,but it is not a good idea. And remember this advice is worth what it cost.

Jerry


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

dirtclod said:


> PT lumber should not be used for outdoor funiture. Besides the splinters, consider the chemicals that will be released. They will absorb through your skin via the armrest, and get onto any food container and into any food that comes into contact with it. Despite how carefull you are, others (especially kids) won't take the precautions that you do to avoid this.
> 
> There's two picnic tables outside that were made of PT wood. Despite being painted, the pine pitch oozed out and beaded up on the surface. The beads are hard during the winter and soft during the summer. It doesn't take much imagination to see that the pitch carried the PT chemicals out with it. No one will use them.
> 
> ...


The problem with the chemicals would be my big concern too. I think PT lumber would be fine for anything you are not going to be sitting on, but there is a lot of concern being expressed these days about playground equipment made out of PT lumber.

Gerry


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## 16ga (May 20, 2007)

Is this the kinda furniture you mean? 









As you can see my chair lost a leg when my tree stand fell but I could get you some pictures and measurements for it. We also still have the picnic table and bench. The set also had a piece that was 2 chairs with a small table between them but its gone now.


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## Handyman (Jan 2, 2008)

Evil Scotsman said:


> Good Evening all,....................
> 
> ...........My main focus at least at the begining will be Adrondack (sp?) outdoor furniture for my trailer. I know most if not all of you use cedar or maybe teak, but I am going to start with pressure treated lumber. Does any see or know of a problem with this?
> 
> ...


PT wood will work well for you, and hold up for many years. Yes there are better wood out there you can use, but PT will do.

As others have said, Round over your edges, sand well, and after the chairs are built and the wood dries out, give them a good coat of a water sealer every year and they will hold up well. One more thing. Use stainless nails, screws or bolts only. The cemicals in PT wood are corrosive and will eat you fasteners. If you can't get stainless, use a triple dipped galvanized fastener.


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## User3489 (Dec 6, 2007)

*PT Wood*

If you are going to sand it,WEAR a respirator. Lungs full of that stuff is real bad. I have white cedar chairs and a round picnic table on my deck. I bought the set unfinished. I sanded everything, then put plastic down on the grass and put the table and chair on it. I mixed up clear epoxy thinned with methyl Ethel kaetone ( sp) so it would run and penetrate into the wood. It needs to run to get into the seems between the boards. When dry I gave it another coat. I re-sanded and gave it 2 coats of spar varnish. That was 8 years ago and it still looks good. Dale

PS I put stain on before the epoxy.


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

16Ga, that is exactly the stuff I am talking about. I think I still have the button marks on my legs from a long weekend at the Jersery Shore in 1981, haha

Man If you could get pics AND measurements THAT WOULD BE FANTASTIC! My wife will LOVE IT! THANK YOU

Also Thank You's to everyone that posted about the PT wood for furniture. I am going to research it further, there seems to be some conflicting opinions. But both arguements make sense. 

I will post what I can find. 

As ALWAYS ALL opinions and comments are welcome. MAY BE getting router and table saw this weekend!

Cheers


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## 16ga (May 20, 2007)

No problem Scotsman.
Just give me a few days to get them. 

Most of the springs on my chair rusted out and snapped so I ended up nailing a piece of plywood to the seat. That took care of the cushion on mine.


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

16ga said:


> No problem Scotsman.
> Just give me a few days to get them.
> 
> Most of the springs on my chair rusted out and snapped so I ended up nailing a piece of plywood to the seat. That took care of the cushion on mine.


 
16ga, THANK YOU!!! Take your time there isn't a big rush! I appreicate it very much! It is funny you should mention the springs snapping. That is EXACTLY what happened to our set at the very end, and I ended up doing the same thing and putting a piece of plywood in for the seat. (actually liked it better) haha Again Thanks


:notworthy:


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

Still haven't had time to research the PT lumber for use with the furniture. But am wondering, would it be better to use straight up pine and the use a product like Thompsons? I KNOW they WOULDN'T last as long as the good wood, BUT, seeing that I am just getting into this, I don't want to spend alot of money on lumber and then screw it up. Once I have it down THEN I go buy good lumber for a set to last forever? Would I at least get 2 or 3 years from it IF I seal them every year?


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## Handyman (Jan 2, 2008)

Dont bother with regulor pine wood. It won't last 2 years even with paint or sealer. If the termites dont eat it, the mold or will. It will go first at the piont where it makes contact with the ground.


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## dirtclod (May 7, 2008)

Get some black locust. No chemicals, no finish, no problem.


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## Scott MacLean (Apr 23, 2008)

Hi - here is a site for Adirondack chairs http://www.popularmechanics.com/home_journal/workshop/2919751.html?series=20 - but looking at 16ga's photo and your reference to cushions - I don't think this is what you are looking for. I don't see a problem with PT wood either if prepared and properly sealed and maintained. I would be sure to properly fasten wood - especially at the edges to prevent warping and cupping. 
Scott
www.handymacimprovements.com


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## 16ga (May 20, 2007)

While I would personally go with cedar or white oak myself I do have a treated lumber bench that’s been sitting in the yard for a few years now. We coat it with sealer every time we seal the deck and its holding up well.


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

Scott, TY for the link, I had actually found this one earlier AND it IS on list. (but they are for ME! lol) My wife doesn't like them, she refers to them as the "Rocketman" chairs. haha I myself, prefer the "rocketman" chairs. 

I would love to build one of the twins with the table in the middle and possibly a glider. BUT you have to walk before you can run, and I am still crawling!


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## Scott MacLean (Apr 23, 2008)

Evil Scotsman,

Just ask your wife if she wants to be married to a rocket man or a lazy Susan. :laughing:


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

Scott MacLean said:


> Evil Scotsman,
> 
> Just ask your wife if she wants to be married to a rocket man or a lazy Susan. :laughing:


 
LOL! She would ALWAYS prefer the rocketman, (less she has to do haha) just doesn't like his style of furniture! :whistling2:


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

16GA 

YOU ROCK! :yes:


Thanks for the pictures and measurements! Will post pics as soon as something is completed!

Thanks

:thumbsup:


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

*UPDATED! Hazards fo PT lumber for Furniture*

Finally had some time to do some research. I will NOT be using PT lumber for my outdoor furniture. Thank you everyone for bringing this to my attention. Would RED OAK work?


http://www.mass.gov/dep/toxics/ptwoodqa.htm

http://www.mass.gov/dep/toxics/ptwoodqa.htm#three


In February 2003, the United States Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) released the results of its studies examining decks and play sets made from pressure treated wood. Because arsenic is thought to be the most potent of the three substances in pressure treated wood, the CPSC risk assessment focused only on this substance. *The research concluded that a young child who plays on pressure treated playground structures for an equivalent of 156 hours per year, or three times per week, over a five-year period has an increased risk of developing lung or bladder cancer in his or her lifetime.*

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/12/31/earlyshow/health/main590994.shtml


:thumbdown:


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## 16ga (May 20, 2007)

> Would RED OAK work?


If you’re going to use oak go with White Oak. Its rot resistant and should last awhile if you seal it every few years.


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## gary696 (Apr 10, 2008)

Evil Scotsman said:


> Finally had some time to do some research. I will NOT be using PT lumber for my outdoor furniture. Thank you everyone for bringing this to my attention. Would RED OAK work?
> 
> 
> http://www.mass.gov/dep/toxics/ptwoodqa.htm
> ...


It is my understanding that since that study, PT wood no longer contains arsenic.


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## LITLHOF (Nov 18, 2007)

*Re PT for outdoor furniture*

Hey EvilScotsman:

You probably would come out better all the way around with cypress for your projects, especially if you use ss screws. Good luck with your chairs. Litlhof.


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## lucas.j.dunton (Feb 27, 2008)

i would go with honey locust or black locust, hard as hell and more rot resistant than cedar
ive seen locust fence post in the ground for 20 years and only get a little punky for about 1/2"


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

*Pressure Treated OUT! In Cedar? Locust? Oak?*

OK, after doing a little research I have decided NOT to use pressure treated wood for our outdoor furniture. I have has several recommendations, white oak, locust, cypress, etc. I KNOW this is NOT going to sit well with ANYONE here, BUT, what I think I am going to do is build one out of pine. I know it won't last long IF it make the season, but I am just starting out in this hobby, (don't even have my tools yet, HOPEFULLY this weekend) I don't want to spend a ton of money on lumber and then screw up the project and be out the cash. I will build it JUST FOR the experience. (Plus I could then use it as a template. 

What would Cypress/White Oak/Locust cost? I can not find any prices anywhere w/o calling?


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## fungku (Jul 3, 2008)

Lumber prices change like gas prices! :laughing:


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## dirtclod (May 7, 2008)

Evil Scotsman said:


> OK, after doing a little research I have decided NOT to use pressure treated wood for our outdoor furniture. I have has several recommendations, white oak, locust, cypress, etc. I KNOW this is NOT going to sit well with ANYONE here, BUT, what I think I am going to do is build one out of pine. I know it won't last long IF it make the season, but I am just starting out in this hobby, (don't even have my tools yet, HOPEFULLY this weekend) I don't want to spend a ton of money on lumber and then screw up the project and be out the cash. I will build it JUST FOR the experience. (Plus I could then use it as a template.


We're letting you slide this time because you're using it for a template...but next time you better watch it! :boxing::smartass::laughing:



Evil Scotsman said:


> What would Cypress/White Oak/Locust cost? I can not find any prices anywhere w/o calling?


Typically if you bought greenwhite oak you'll pay from .50 - 1.50/bf for 2x4's and 1x4's depending on who the supplier is. Air-dried will run 1.00-3.75. Locust may run 1 - 5.00. Best to check your local sawmill for prices/availability. I don't know about cypress - not much growing around here - suspect your area may be the same. 

BTW - Locust heartwood is the part that has the high decay resistance.


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## mdlbldrmatt135 (Dec 6, 2006)

Pressure treated is ACQ not CCA now........ and I'd Hope by now most places are out of the CCA stuff....and only selling the ACQ


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## Evil Scotsman (May 30, 2008)

mdlbldrmatt135 said:


> Pressure treated is ACQ not CCA now........ and I'd Hope by now most places are out of the CCA stuff....and only selling the ACQ


 
MD, I'll bite, (Total Newbie) what is ACQ and CCA? What is the difference? I am assuming by your quote CCA is BAD!

Thanks


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## [email protected] (Mar 2, 2017)

Here's a nice chair plan by Ana White: It's called a Bristol Outdoor Lounge Chair. You can get the complete plans at: http://www.ana-white.com/2012/02/plans/bristol-outdoor-lounge-chair. Sorry I couldn't incorporate the picture here.


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