# CBN Wheels



## TomC (Oct 27, 2008)

Any body using CBN wheels for sharpening? If so how do you like them? Would you buy them again?
Tom


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## Burb (Nov 30, 2012)

Of the 120+ members of my turning club! I believe there is only 1 guy using that wheel. And I know 1 other as well. Both love it, but most say it's not worth the $$. In a training class taught by Doug Thompson (Thompson Lathe Tools) he said that he did not feel they were worth the investment. I'm very happy with my Norton wheel and it does a great job for me.

Mark


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## Tom King (Nov 22, 2013)

I have one, and like it a lot. I haven't had it long enough to use it much yet. it's FAST and SMOOTH. I haven't used it for turning tools yet, just chisels. No more slow wet grinder for me, and no more truing wheels.

I do this for a living though, and time is money.

I just got the fine wheel from D-way to see how I liked it, and it doesn't look like I will need to put anything on the other side of the Metabo grinder. No heat in the steel, it cuts so fast.


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## john lucas (Sep 18, 2007)

I use the 180 grit wheel from D way. I do like it but not sure I would recommend it to everyone. First off it's expensive, between 150 and $200 depending on who you buy it from. It doesn't change size or groove, it is perfectly balanced. It cuts fast and doesn't heat up the tool. 
There is some dissagreement on this but even though it's 180 grit I find it removes a lot of steel even with a very light touch. So my tools seem to be getting short faster. I have another friend who thinks the same thing but another turner disagrees with us. Still it's a wonderful wheel. It's not the best for shaping, you might need the 80 grit CBN if you need to do a lot of shaping.
Now here's the problem. You can buy a bunch of Norton wheels for what you pay for this wheel. You do have to true them up when you mount them and clean and true them up every so often. You also have to compensate for the wheel changing size since you do have to true it up occasionally. I have a video on sharpening that shows you how to compensate for wheel wear. 
So what I recommend. If you have lots of money the CBN is really sweet and probably worth the expense. If not the Norton Blue wheels will last a newbie a long time and cost a lot less. It is way better than the crappy gray wheels that come on most grinders. The white wheels are also good.


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## Bonanza35 (Jan 20, 2011)

I bought the D-Way 180 grit wheel at the first of this year. I'm a fan. I was using a Norton blue wheel and had no complaints other than having to true it often. I sharpen frequently and have come to appreciate having a perfectly true wheel which is something I don't hear a lot of talk about. The One Way wheel dresser will get the Norton wheel running smooth as silk and it performs great for awhile then needs dressing again. Personally, I think a mechanical dresser is important if you use matrix wheels and want zero bounce. 
The CBN on the other hand is true out of the box and stays that way. It does seem to remove steel faster and requires a very light touch. I've enjoyed not having the interruption of stopping to true my wheel but that certainly isn't a huge deal. It also has a wider sharpening surface which is nice. That being said, I couldn't prove that it gets significantly better results that a well tuned matrix wheel. I researched options for a buddy of mine who is basically starting from scratch and this is the best apples to apples comparison I came up with: a blue Norton 100 grit wheel and the One Way Dresser would run $118 retail. The D-Way CBN is $185 retail. Is it worth the extra $67? That simply comes down to your budget IMHO. If the money isn't a factor get a CBN and be done with it. If you have to take that $67 out of your grocery budget then get the Norton and dresser and know that you'll get the same results. That's my take on it for what it's worth.


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## John Doyle (Mar 7, 2014)

TomC said:


> Any body using CBN wheels for sharpening? If so how do you like them? Would you buy them again?
> Tom


I would also like to buy a CBN wheel to fit to my tormek slow grinder but I have not been able to get any advice as to whether it would be suitable for running so slow on the tormek. Also what grit would i fit as the tormek only runs at about 120 rpm. I think that 80 grit would be ok but am open to suggestions. Can anyone help me out on this. 
JD


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## john lucas (Sep 18, 2007)

Speed really only has the affect of taking a little longer to get the edge. Grit size is grit size no matter what the speed. If your used to sharpening on the Tormek the wheel is roughly 220 with the rough stone and supposedly around 1000 grit when you use the fine side of the grader. so I would go with the 180.


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## jgilfor (Jan 25, 2013)

John, I just posted a response on one of the other web forums to a similar topic.

I have had Dave's wheels (both 80 and 180) for a couple years now and really love them.

I agree that they take a much lighter hand than with AO wheels to keep from going through a tool much faster than you are used to.

I think these wheels come grittier than labeled, and soften with use until they stabilize at the advertised grit after a few months. This is just my opinion though.

I can touch up the edge on my gouge or scraper faster with these than with the AO wheels. No dressing, and with the Varigrind jig, I just have some lines on the rail to quickly set up the distance depending upon the angle I'm using. Never have to remeasure, because the wheels don't shrink with use.

I like the combination of the 80 grit CBN wheel and my Roborest platform. I use that for most sharpening needs, and only use the Varigrind on the 180 side for reshaping gouges with side ground wings. The finish I get with the coarse CBN wheel is superior to anything I ever got with my AO wheels. Also, with the newer high vanadium and hardened steels, I feel like my AO wheels took forever to sharpen. Not so with the CBN variety.

I do think there is probably some greater familiarity with AO wheels for those who have been woodturning longer than the average. I believe that, if you are used to AO wheels for the last 20 years (for instance), there's likely to be a greater sense of "boy these feel different", than for those who have only a few years experience (like me).


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## Bill Boehme (Feb 9, 2014)

John Doyle said:


> I would also like to buy a CBN wheel to fit to my tormek slow grinder but I have not been able to get any advice as to whether it would be suitable for running so slow on the tormek. Also what grit would i fit as the tormek only runs at about 120 rpm. I think that 80 grit would be ok but am open to suggestions. Can anyone help me out on this.
> JD


You could get a bushing or Oilite bearing and some thrust bearings or washers to make up for the difference in width and give it a try, but I predict that you will be disappointed in the results. The Tormek stone is advertised to produce roughly similar results of sharpening with 220 grit when the stone is roughed up with the grader, but that doesn't mean that the stone is actually 220 grit (its native grit is closer to 1000 which is what it will eventually wear down to unless you occasionally rough it up). It is like trying to compare apples and oranges -- a dry grinder runs at 1800 RPM to produce its surface effect on the steel while the Tormek runs at 90 RPM and requires heavy pressure to produce a similar edge. I think that if you did that with a CBN wheel it would take longer as John Lucas said and probably not give as good results as either the CBN on a dry grinder or the Tormek with its stone running in water.

I think that trying to combine the best of two different sharpening methods into one device might be akin to trying to combine the speed of a microwave oven with the slow cooking flavor of a crock-pot into a single device.


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## TomC (Oct 27, 2008)

Thanks for the info. I am adding one of these wheels to my wish list. Depending how I do sells this year will depend on when I buy. I have several other Turing tools ahead of this wheel.again thanks for the info.
Tom


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

John Doyle said:


> I would also like to buy a CBN wheel to fit to my tormek slow grinder but I have not been able to get any advice as to whether it would be suitable for running so slow on the tormek. Also what grit would i fit as the tormek only runs at about 120 rpm. I think that 80 grit would be ok but am open to suggestions. Can anyone help me out on this. JD


Down under they sell a CBN especially for the Tormek. I would imagine it is available there as well. It is advertised for the Tormek so I should think it works well.

I think CBN is the way to go. I have an extremely tight budget but it is my next must have for my cave 8" x 1 1/2"

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

DaveTTC said:


> Down under they sell a CBN especially for the Tormek. I would imagine it is available there as well. It is advertised for the Tormek so I should think it works well.


This may be what DaveTTC has seen in Australia.

Woodcut is a New Zealand company.

http://www.cwsonline.com.au/shop/item/woodcut-cbn-wheel-250mm-x-40mm-x-180g

The link was in this thread in another forum where a member Jim Carroll has been using the wheel on his Tormek.

http://www.woodworkforums.com/showthread.php?t=176064


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## TomC (Oct 27, 2008)

I saw the question on using the CBN wheel on the Tormek and found a diamond impregnated wheel for the Tormek. It is sold by Tand J tools in the UK. They say it never need to be redressed and can be recoated one time. A search of the net did not reveal any US suppliers.
Tom


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Dave Paine said:


> This may be what DaveTTC has seen in Australia. Woodcut is a New Zealand company. http://www.cwsonline.com.au/shop/item/woodcut-cbn-wheel-250mm-x-40mm-x-180g The link was in this thread in another forum where a member Jim Carroll has been using the wheel on his Tormek. http://www.woodworkforums.com/showthread.php?t=176064


That's the one 


(imagine thumbs up icon here) 

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## john lucas (Sep 18, 2007)

the diamond wheels don't hold up. There have been quite a few threads on this.


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## TomC (Oct 27, 2008)

john lucas said:


> the diamond wheels don't hold up. There have been quite a few threads on this.


Good to know. Thanks, Tom


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## DST (Jan 10, 2011)

John Doyle said:


> I would also like to buy a CBN wheel to fit to my tormek slow grinder but I have not been able to get any advice as to whether it would be suitable for running so slow on the tormek. Also what grit would i fit as the tormek only runs at about 120 rpm. I think that 80 grit would be ok but am open to suggestions. Can anyone help me out on this. JD


The CBN wheels are steel so make sure you dont run your Tormek Wet.


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## TomC (Oct 27, 2008)

Well I ordered the D-way CBN wheel on Friday and got it in the mail today. Yesterday I order the Raptor setup gauges from Craft Supply. I hope to have them by The end of the week. Will post here on how I like the new setup. I need to get busy building a sharpening station for the shop. I am currently going to my garage to sharpen my tools. I have cleared up a spot in the shop for a cabinet with drawers for my grinder. Just have to build it.
Tom


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## jgilfor (Jan 25, 2013)

I have a Woodcut CBN wheel on my T7. It is nickel plated, so is safe for use wet, as is the recommendation from the wheel's maker.

Mine is 280 grit, but is still a bit rough, having yet to be fully "broken in". So far,mi LOVE it! seems best of both worlds. Faster than Tormek white wheel, but slower and cooler than dry grinder at high speed. No need to worry about stone slurry or trueing up ever. Very controllable for sharpening and fast enough for a mild reshape without pulling your hair out. Still use the dry grinder for major reshaping though. I have the Tormek dry grinder jig set up on my fine CBN wheel side. I still use the 80 grit CBN dry wheel with a Roborest for some tools.


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## Quickstep (Apr 10, 2012)

I hope you don't mind me reviving this thread, but it seemed better than starting a new thread. 

I'm ready to take the CBN plunge, but I'm agonizing over buying the D-Way 180 grit or the Woodturning Wonders 220 grit. 

I've read that the CBN wheels cut really fast and that even the 180 removes material really fast. So, I'm wondering if the 220 from Woodturning Wonders would be a good choice. Seems like I get more control and a finer finish, am I right? (Seriously, is that a reasonable conclusion?)

The D-Way wheels seem to have a sterling reputation (and Dave seems like a great guy) and that means a lot to me, so I'm wondering if anyone knows what makes the difference in price between the D-Way wheels and the Woodturning Wonders wheels. 

So boils down to price and the usefulness of a 220 wheel. 


For what it's worth, I don't plan to do shaping, just sharpening of my turning tools. If I do get into shaping, I figure I'll either do it on a regular stone wheel, or maybe step up to a second CBN wheel. 


Please give me some sage advice.


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## john lucas (Sep 18, 2007)

I doubt there will be much difference in the 2 grits. I am currently doing some sharpening on a 320 grit sanding belt to try and learn the differences in finer grits. yes it does produce a more polished edge. The quality of cut is marginally different and would be even less so if your turning skills aren't very good. 
I believe (but it's still kind of hard to tell) that a more polished edge holds an edge longer. That's kind of subjective but I've been using the finer belt on my spindle roughing gouge which takes a lot of abuse and it sure seems to improve the edge life. However it's a subtle thing and I sure have'nt done any kind of scientific test.
I can't talk about the difference in quality between the 2 brands. D way has of course been out longer and has a good reputation. The other wheel has only been out a fairly short time but I haven't heard of any quality issues. As for which is better I have no way of knowing. I am drooling over the 320 grit wheel that woodturning wonders had at the Georgia symposium but they didn't know when it might be out for sale.


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## Quickstep (Apr 10, 2012)

Here you go John!

http://woodturnerswonders.com/products/cbn-wheel-4-in-1-design-350-grit

In checking on this, I noticed that Woodturners Wonders now also offers the 4-in-one wheel. Aargh! Now I have yet another variable to consider. Is the flat edge on the side of the wheel worth having? Does anyone use the sides of their stone wheels?


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## Bonanza35 (Jan 20, 2011)

Quickstep said:


> Here you go John! http://woodturnerswonders.com/products/cbn-wheel-4-in-1-design-350-grit In checking on this, I noticed that Woodturners Wonders now also offers the 4-in-one wheel. Aargh! Now I have yet another variable to consider. Is the flat edge on the side of the wheel worth having? Does anyone use the sides of their stone wheels?


Thanks for the link (even though it was meant for John). My only beef with the DWay 180 grit radiased wheel is that, although I love it for gouges, it is too aggressive when sharpening my tiny hollowing tips on the corners of the wheel. I had no idea there was a 350 grit wheel! I'll give a review as soon as it gets here!


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## john lucas (Sep 18, 2007)

when I need to sharpen my small tools (and believe me I have some seriously small tools) I turn the grinder off and let the wheel slow down. When it gets to the speed I think will work I grind the tools. Works great this way and actually works better with the CBN because it's so heavy it will hold it's speed longer. With my older grinding wheels I had to sharpen fairly quickly when it reached the right slow speed because the tool against the stone would slow it down rapidly. Not so much with the CBN


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## Quickstep (Apr 10, 2012)

I was hoping to tease out some more opinions on the preferences for D-Way versus Woodturners wonders. Any opinions to be had?


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## john lucas (Sep 18, 2007)

I hope someone can answer you. However CBN wheels are relatively new for woodturners so there aren't that many out there and there many not be anyone who owns more than one brand. Since they have a very long life I don't know anyone who has worn one out yet. I will probably buy one of the 350 grit wheels but I don't think that will be a fair comparison with my 180 wheel until about 5 years from now when they start to wear.


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## Bonanza35 (Jan 20, 2011)

Quickstep said:


> I was hoping to tease out some more opinions on the preferences for D-Way versus Woodturners wonders. Any opinions to be had?


Well, I ordered the 350 late night on 11/2. It arrived today, 11/5. Impressive turn around. I now have the DWay 180 and the woodturners Wonders 350 running side by side. The first thing that jumped out was how dead smooth it runs now with 2 CBNs. I mean NO detectable vibration. I'm sure there's a break in period before I'll get a true picture of how they compare so I'll try to remember to follow up in a few weeks. I don't think you are in my neck of the woods or I'd invite you to try them out. 

Yes I realize that it was an unnecessary purchase, my wife pointed that out very clearly. I'm not even a tool junky but sharpening is one area where I don't mind spending some money and effort because I always feel like it pays off. I'll let you know if this buy follows suit.


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## DST (Jan 10, 2011)

Our club has both and the quality so far seems to be equal.


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## kenrizza (Nov 19, 2014)

*Affordable CBN Wheels*

If you go to http://woodturnerswonders.com you can buy two wheels for what the competition sells one for. There is even Unique profile wheels that no one else has that will do 4 types of sharpening and they are still priced lower than anyone else and have a lifetime warranty. If you never sharpened your tools with a CBN wheel before you will be amazed and now they are affordable. 

Recent Testimonial:

In a Word! Wow!
As promised, they are super!
I sharpened every tool I owned.
They have never been as sharp.
Was able to produce a very smooth cut.
Riding the bevel is a breeze.

I will gladly recommend these wheels and your service. 
feel free to give them this email address. [email protected]
You can quote me!
Thanks again.
Bob Atchison
(reprinted with permission)


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