# Cabinet in corner and wall cabinet how do i find where they are screwed into wall



## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)

I am having new granite countertops installed and they came to template even with me showing pictures beforehand. However they got here and said they cant template without my corner cavinet being removed and I have called places to have them do it but noone can do it in before they reset the template date for the 6th of next month. Can anyone explain to me how to get it out. I'm assuming I have to remove the right cabinet and the corner cabinet is not screwed to walls after looking behind it it seems it just sits.... and are the two molding pieces inside cabinet on right hiding attachment screws? Any help would be more than appretiated....


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

The wall cabinets are likely screwed to the corner cabinet at the face frame, either through the styles, or from the inside of the corner cabinet. The wall cabinets should have some connection to the wall through a nail strip similar to what is shown on the right cabinet bottom shelf. The Corner cabinet is likely screwed to the existing counter top.

You are best to wait on whoever you have arranged to come out, there is more to that than just unscrewing the cabinets.

No good stone company will do a build and install off of pictures, it's unreasonable to think they would.


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## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)

Yeah I cant find someone to do it in the timeframe that it needs to be done in, unfortunately all 6 places I called are booked until july.... I Agree that the corner cabinet is screwed to countertop and it looks like two screws inside of the front of corner cabinet go downward. But I took pic of between the cabinets that dont show them attached and there are no screws attaching face frames like the other cabinets have. The "molding pieces you are talking about have nails and aren't screwed into studs? I worked for custom wood in NC and built corion countertops but I've never seen a cabinet not screwed into studs.... so this is new to me.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

Not that I have any answers to how or where they are attached to the walls, but here's the issues I see. They will not be at the same height to get reattached IF you run the countertop under them. This may or may not be a problem?
Any decent template maker/installer could make a cardboard template without removing them and that's my biased opinion having made quite a few templates in my career. It may be all done with a digital laser scan these days, so that's why they are asking that they be removed ... I donno?
In my opinion, the corner cabinet went in first, the the right and left sides were attached later. BUT, if they were rested on the countertops, there's no reason to attach them with long screws into the studs. The weight will be supported by the counter, so the attachmnt is mainly to keep them from tipping forward. They may all be screwed to one another, at least that's what would have done.


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

That corner would present a lot of challenges for a stone crew. The optimal is to have a full piece running into, and out of that corner, and seam it somewhere else. Going around the corner cabinet would force a seam in the corner somewhere. 

I personally would yank the corner cabinet and send it on it's way, or at a minimum cut the bottom off of it, and make it into a wall cabinet only.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Personally I think if they can't handle cutting the granite around that cabinet you need to shop for another counter guy. I've seen a lot harder fits done by counter people. At the very least the small cabinet to the right would have to come out plus you would have to trim off the bottom of the corner cabinet to get it to line up with the cabinet on the left after the deal is done. 

Anyway to answer your question the screws anchoring it to the wall were probably spackled and painted over where you can't see them. You might use one of those antique stud finders like a Stanley 47-400 which has a loose magnetic to find the screws. Then you can dig out the spackle and get to the screw or nail.


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

Steve Neul said:


> Personally I think if they can't handle cutting the granite around that cabinet you need to shop for another counter guy. I've seen a lot harder fits done by counter people. At the very least the small cabinet to the right would have to come out plus you would have to trim off the bottom of the corner cabinet to get it to line up with the cabinet on the left after the deal is done.
> 
> Anyway to answer your question the screws anchoring it to the wall were probably spackled and painted over where you can't see them. You might use one of those antique stud finders like a Stanley 47-400 which has a loose magnetic to find the screws. Then you can dig out the spackle and get to the screw or nail.


Or use a real strong magnet. I worked with a stone cutting place for a few days long ago and they cut things that appeared impossible to do. Funny how they finish them..kind of like auto body repair with a big random orbit sander except it's not a sander..same idea though..


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

It would appear to me that the countertop guys are taking the easy way out, removing the cabinet is opening a can of worms, either it will have to be trimmed on the bottom or the entire row of cabinets removed and raised. In all probability the trim was added after the cabinets were hung, removing and reinstalling it will be difficult to do without damaging some of it.


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## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)

To all!!!!!



shoot summ said:


> The wall cabinets are likely screwed to the corner cabinet at the face frame, either through the styles, or from the inside of the corner cabinet. The wall cabinets should have some connection to the wall through a nail strip similar to what is shown on the right cabinet bottom shelf. The Corner cabinet is likely screwed to the existing counter top.
> 
> You are best to wait on whoever you have arranged to come out, there is more to that than just unscrewing the cabinets.
> 
> No good stone company will do a build and install off of pictures, it's unreasonable to think they would.


I did not expect them to do everything by pics dude. I meant I showed them a picture of my cabinets and they said yeah we can do that but not ever telling me the cabinet needed to be moved. Can you cut around a cabinet like that when it's in the counter top there and if you trim the countertop off flush does the cabinet have support when a lazy Susan is underneath which means you would have to build something to support? Then tell granite people to cut around it?


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

Someone you know may have a metal detector.
johnep


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

Chris1988 said:


> To all!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> I did not expect them to do everything by pics dude. I meant I showed them a picture of my cabinets and they said yeah we can do that but not ever telling me the cabinet needed to be moved. Can you cut around a cabinet like that when it's in the counter top there and if you trim the countertop off flush does the cabinet have support when a lazy Susan is underneath which means you would have to build something to support? Then tell granite people to cut around it?


I made that comment based on the way you worded this statement dude.

"they came to template even with me showing pictures beforehand "

Is that cabinet in the existing counter top? It's pretty unusual to set a cabinet like that before the top goes in, normally they go on top of the counter.

Are you pulling the existing counters out? Typically they are removed before a stone install as well.

I'm having a hard time following your questions in this post, I'll try to separate them.

"Can you cut around a cabinet like that when it's in the counter top there and if you trim the countertop off flush does the cabinet have support when a lazy Susan is underneath which means you would have to build something to support?"

The stone guys could cut around that cabinet, IMO it isn't going to give you the best result for an install. If they do, that corner will be 2 pieces as there isn't enough stone left in the corner to transport the stone and not have a high risk of it breaking. So you will have a seam in that corner, likely diagonally at the front of that cabinet.

The lazy susan in the lower cabinet should be it's own entity and not dependent on the counter top/corner cabinet at all.


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## Stevedore (Dec 28, 2011)

If it were my kitchen, & I had to remove the cabinet temporarily for the granite templating & installation, I'd cut off the bottom of that cabinet & rebuild it before reinstalling it & make it the same height as the others. Personal preference of course, but I think it would look better & provide a significant increase in useable countertop space.


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

Stevedore said:


> If it were my kitchen, & I had to remove the cabinet temporarily for the granite templating & installation, I'd cut off the bottom of that cabinet & rebuild it before reinstalling it & make it the same height as the others. Personal preference of course, but I think it would look better & provide a significant increase in useable countertop space.


I agree, and it wouldn't look straight out of the 70's and 80's.


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

It probably sounds silly, but before I put granite countertops on the existing counters I'd get up on them and jump up and down on them to be absolutely sure they're not going to collapse to the weight of granite..That stuff is heavy to say the least. I mean that if by chance the existing cabinets do collapse or need replaced at any point you better have about 12 good strong friends and a few kegs of beer to offer them afterwards.. lol I just went through this with the last cabinets I built. It had an existing cabinet with granite sitting out in the garage, but water damage ruined the old cabinets.. We had to go hire a couple homeless guys to help get granite back up there and one of them was drunk.. (I know..terrible strategy, but it was the only option at the time lol)


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## velocipede (Jan 15, 2015)

Do you have to rely on contractors to do all of this work, or do you have wood working tools/skills that would let you re-do the existing corner cabinet? My choice would be to remove the cabinets and make sure the counter top framework was strong enough to support granite, then reinstall the cabinets with a remade corner unit that matches the others and does not sit on the counter. Counter space is more valuable than corner cabinet space. Raise it up to free up the counter.


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

WE had our particle board worktops covered by Granite Transformations. This a 1/4" skin glued on top of existing worktops. I consists of granite chips in multitude of colours in an acrylic binding coat like cement.
Ours is beige coloured and we are delighted. About 1/3 cost of solid granite.
johnep


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

allpurpose said:


> It probably sounds silly, but before I put granite countertops on the existing counters *I'd get up on them and jump up and down on them to be absolutely sure they're not going to collapse to the weight of granite*..That stuff is heavy to say the least. I mean that if by chance the existing cabinets do collapse or need replaced at any point you better have about 12 good strong friends and a few kegs of beer to offer them afterwards.. lol I just went through this with the last cabinets I built. It had an existing cabinet with granite sitting out in the garage, but water damage ruined the old cabinets.. We had to go hire a couple homeless guys to help get granite back up there and one of them was drunk.. (I know..terrible strategy, but it was the only option at the time lol)


I would not be jumping up and down on the old cabinets! 
First of all, that's a dynamic load rather than a static load like the granite would be. It's just not the same condition.
The granite's weight will be distributed over a wide area supported by the vertical pieces of the original cabinets. HOWEVER, on my install I put 1/2" hardboard over them all for two reasons:
First was to level them out for the flat surface of the granite/quartz I used
Second was to raise them 1/2" so the quartz would fit under the stainless range top, unique to my install.
leveling was important because any variation in flatness will stress the solid surface at a small area possibly causing it to fracture. I have been known to gently stand in my solid surface to reach things up on the top shelves.
Do a temperature and breath-o-lizer check on any strangers you hire to install them .....


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## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)

shoot summ said:


> I made that comment based on the way you worded this statement dude.
> 
> "they came to template even with me showing pictures beforehand "
> 
> ...


Sorry for the confusion. I know I'm talking fast and probably smashing it all together so....

So yes the corner cabinet sits on the current countertop that is laminate. I have to remove them before install they wanted a ridiculous amount when I have the ability to do that and no need to pay them to dipose of it when I have a dump right down the road and a trailer. But when I told them I'd pull them out it didnt think about that cabinet because they didnt say anything about it. So yes I will be removing the countertops myself to save money.

And secondly I understand that the lazy susan is it's own thing but my question is say I do cut it flush with cabinet instead of removing cabinet to remove the piece underneath. Without the corner cabinet being anchored to the wall will the "countertop piece under the corner cabinet support the corner cabinet or will it not work because there is nothing to hold up the cabinet since the countertop goes over the corner cabinet box which has the lazy susan in it being supported on the edges of the cabinet box. Does this make sense?

And thirdly I'm not worried about where the seam is honestly because it's going to have to have a seam somewhere and that short part would probably be best as the shorter the seam hopefully the less noticeable.

Thank you all for the replies btw.


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

Chris1988 said:


> Sorry for the confusion. I know I'm talking fast and probably smashing it all together so....
> 
> So yes the corner cabinet sits on the current countertop that is laminate. I have to remove them before install they wanted a ridiculous amount when I have the ability to do that and no need to pay them to dipose of it when I have a dump right down the road and a trailer. But when I told them I'd pull them out it didnt think about that cabinet because they didnt say anything about it. So yes I will be removing the countertops myself to save money.
> 
> ...


I understand now.

You will have to look under the counter top from the lazy susan cabinet and see what kind of support it has. It is likely you will need to add something there to hold it all up.

How thick are your new tops going to be, and how thick is the laminate? If you cut around the corner cabinet you would want the new tops to be thicker to cover up the old top that is left there.

As others have mentioned, you should also add some support on the base cabinets when the old top is off to help support the stone, it is heavy, it looks like your cabinets might be particle board, if the base cabinets are you should at least add a 3" strip at the tops on the sides that double the thickness.


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## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)

My cabinets are oak cabinets that I refinished with SW Emarald. They should be solid enough no issue like the countertop people said very rarely do they have to add support. 


After getting pissed I called the countertop place and the lady said she spoke with the head template guy who said that the cabinet doesnt need to be removed that the coutertop should be able to be slid out from underneath and the new one slide in underneath. But because I'm doing the tear out now im not sure how to accomplish that. It seems after further investigation that the cabinet IS face frame screwed to the other cabinets on left and right but I'm not certain (see first pic) But if it truly is. Can I possibly unscrew the cabinet from countertop and slide the piece out? The second pic is right inside the front edge of the corner cabinet







where I see two screws that may be holding it down to the countertop?









As for the thickness of the granite I beleive the exact is 3 cm my current counter is 1.5 inch. So approximately a 1/4 shorter? So maybe molding or something?


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## shoot summ (Feb 21, 2014)

Chris1988 said:


> My cabinets are oak cabinets that I refinished with SW Emarald. They should be solid enough no issue like the countertop people said very rarely do they have to add support.
> 
> 
> After getting pissed I called the countertop place and the lady said she spoke with the head template guy who said that the cabinet doesnt need to be removed that the coutertop should be able to be slid out from underneath and the new one slide in underneath. But because I'm doing the tear out now im not sure how to accomplish that. It seems after further investigation that the cabinet IS face frame screwed to the other cabinets on left and right but I'm not certain (see first pic) But if it truly is. Can I possibly unscrew the cabinet from countertop and slide the piece out? The second pic is right inside the front edge of the corner cabinet where I see two screws that may be holding it down to the countertop?
> ...


The cabinets have oak face frames, from your first pics the cases appear to be particle board, other pics look like they are melamine(particle board with white surface).

Getting the top out from under the cabinet could be a lot of fun, depends on how the top was built and installed. If it is fastened all from the bottom, then you should be able to get all of the screws out. If the top was built and laminated in place the installer could have gotten lazy and screwed through the base into the top of the cabinets, that will be a PITA.

I would be very surprised if your tops are 1.5", they are likely 3/4"(max) with a 1.5" face on them(probably oak too). Premade tops are sometimes thinner than 3/4".


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## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)

Wanted to update everyone an update I was screwed and stapled to the countertop at bottom and had screws behind lazy susan that had to be cut took about an hour but its out. I had to cut a piece over my dishwasher because it was all one piece the entire way but its loose and sitting under to support the cabinet until install but I'm pretty sure it has enough room to slide under no problem I may have to shim up and put a piece of trim around bottom but it's not a huge issue....


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## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)

So thank you very much everyone especially you shoot summ....


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## Chris1988 (Apr 26, 2021)




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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

__





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This would involve no ripping out and cost far less. Have a look.
johnep


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> I would not be jumping up and down on the old cabinets!
> First of all, that's a dynamic load rather than a static load like the granite would be. It's just not the same condition.
> The granite's weight will be distributed over a wide area supported by the vertical pieces of the original cabinets. HOWEVER, on my install I put 1/2" hardboard over them all for two reasons:
> First was to level them out for the flat surface of the granite/quartz I used
> ...


Jumping up and down idea was kind of overkill on my part really just to make the point that they better be good and sturdy. I don't mean to literally physically jump up and down on them..lol I suppose I could have worded that better.


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## TobyC (Apr 30, 2013)

shoot summ said:


> I personally would yank the corner cabinet and send it on it's way, or at a minimum cut the bottom off of it, and make it into a wall cabinet only.


I agree, I would rather have the counter space in that corner. Those corner cabinets are a trendy thing that you will come to hate very quickly.


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

Agree, I can just imagine having to move things out of the way to open the cabinet door.


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