# Stripping and sanding



## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

I have a teak dining table with leaves where the main section is slightly faded and has some light staining. I'm not sure what sort of finish is on it, but probably just some teak oil. Questions:

- Should I strip it before sanding? If so, any particular product? I am afraid of going too harsh on it since it is veneer...
- Any recommended techniques for getting the wood tone to look similar on the main section and leaves?
- What sort of sanding/grits should I use?

Thanks


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Anytime you refinish wood you should always start with a paint and varnish remover. It won't affect the veneer unless the veneer is loose and coming off anyway. I normally use Kleen Strip remover however I have a hunch your table is done with a lacquer finish. Strypeeze remover works better on lacquer. Brush a liberal amount of remover on the table keeping it wet with remover for about 15 minutes and scrape off the finish and as much of the residue as possible with a broad knife. Then as quickly as possible rinse the rest of the residue off with rags dripping wet with lacquer thinner frequently changing rags. Removers contain wax to retard evaporation and it's real important to get this residue off clean. 

Once you strip and sand the table and the leaves it should stain a uniform color. If it doesn't then it gets difficult. I normally mix a dye to supplement the color when it doesn't match. If you run into that problem come back and we will work that problem.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> Anytime you refinish wood you should always start with a paint and varnish remover. It won't affect the veneer unless the veneer is loose and coming off anyway. I normally use Kleen Strip remover however I have a hunch your table is done with a lacquer finish. Strypeeze remover works better on lacquer. Brush a liberal amount of remover on the table keeping it wet with remover for about 15 minutes and scrape off the finish and as much of the residue as possible with a broad knife. Then as quickly as possible rinse the rest of the residue off with rags dripping wet with lacquer thinner frequently changing rags. Removers contain wax to retard evaporation and it's real important to get this residue off clean.
> 
> Once you strip and sand the table and the leaves it should stain a uniform color. If it doesn't then it gets difficult. I normally mix a dye to supplement the color when it doesn't match. If you run into that problem come back and we will work that problem.


Thanks for the pointers. What makes you think it has lacquer on it? Is there a way to test?


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

slantedview said:


> Thanks for the pointers. What makes you think it has lacquer on it? Is there a way to test?


Drip some laquer thinner on it. If the finish liquefies, its lacquer


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*I wouldn't do this*



Steve Neul said:


> Anytime you refinish wood you should always start with a paint and varnish remover. It won't affect the veneer unless the veneer is loose and coming off anyway. I normally use Kleen Strip remover however I have a hunch your table is done with a lacquer finish. Strypeeze remover works better on lacquer. Brush a liberal amount of remover on the table keeping it wet with remover for about 15 minutes and scrape off the finish and as much of the residue as possible with a broad knife.* Then as quickly as possible rinse the rest of the residue off with rags dripping wet with lacquer thinner frequently changing rags.* Removers contain wax to retard evaporation and it's real important to get this residue off clean.
> 
> Once you strip and sand the table and the leaves it should stain a uniform color. If it doesn't then it gets difficult. I normally mix a dye to supplement the color when it doesn't match. If you run into that problem come back and we will work that problem.


Unless you are very experienced like Steve, and have a suitable, spark free environment, this is an explosion waiting to happen AND the fumes are not good to breathe, you will need a respirator.

Clear nail polish has an acetone base and will dissolve lacquer readily. Place a drop in a inconspicuous area and see if it dissolves the old finish. It may be teak oil or Danish oil as you stated..... ? 

Unfortunately, there is no easy fix. Refinishing a table top and large leaves is not a beginner project, in my opinion. Stripping with water based products is slow. The better strippers have toxic chemicals and will burn your hands and lungs. Aircraft stripper is one of the better ones, but caution must be used:

http://www.amazon.com/GAR343-KLEAN-STRIP-Aircraft-Stripper-Gallon/dp/B004Y1KX9E

Read answer no. 2 in the above link.


The Kleen Strip product and reviews:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Klean-Strip-1-gal-KS-3-Premium-Stripper-GKS3/100144685


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

slantedview said:


> Thanks for the pointers. What makes you think it has lacquer on it? Is there a way to test?


The only reason I think the finish might be lacquer is I've never run across a table of that style that wasn't finished with lacquer. Like epicfail48 suggested if you put lacquer thinner on the finish and it liquifies the finish it is lacquer. 

The project looks like a do it yourself project to me. You can find paint stripper in all the box stores and walmart. I don't think these products are there for the professional. The main thing you need to do when you strip the finish is not to do too much at once and be sure you thoroughly clean the stripper off after you get the finish off. As long as you have some ventilation you won't have any trouble with the fumes. I stripped the finish off 12' of base cabinets and doors right in someones kitchen this week. I just opened the windows and doors in the area so I would get some cross ventilation. I did though make sure there was nothing with an open flame on in the area.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Thanks for the responses. I've done this sort of project before - a few years back - on a similar table, and the finished product was pretty good but the main section was never quite the same color as the leaves - even after sanding. I suspect it was just sun faded and I didn't feel comfortable trying to dye/stain/bleach anything.

The product I used then was either Jasco or Bix stripper (can't remember which). Both state that they can remove lacquer, among other things. Is Strypeeze similar to those? While I'll be doing the stripping outdoors, my preference is to use a product that is just strong enough and no stronger 

To start - should I pickup some lacquer thinner to do a test with or just go straight to a product like Strypeeze?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Strypeeze is similar to Bix remover as best as I can remember. I've never used Jasco. More than likely I would still be using Bix if it were available in my area. I haven't seen any in 40 years. Anyway a methylene chloride remover is the type to use. Those citris removers are junk. 

Unless you could touch up the finish with dyes and recoat the table with lacquer there is no reason to test it with lacquer thinner. You might as well start with stripper and remove what ever finish is on it. Even if it had a oil finish, paint stripper would be the product to start with.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Sounds good. I'll see if I can pickup some Strypeeze or Bix for this weekend. I think I neutralized with mineral spirits last time. Is that still the thing to do? Also, any recommended sanding schedule?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I think mineral spirits is too mild. Sometimes the remover didn't completely strip the finish and the lacquer thinner is hot enough to finish the job.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> I think mineral spirits is too mild. Sometimes the remover didn't completely strip the finish and the lacquer thinner is hot enough to finish the job.


Thanks. So just to make sure I do this right:

1. strypeeze
2. lacquer thinner wipe down
3. sand
4. finish

Am I missing any other wipedown or cleaning steps?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

slantedview said:


> Thanks. So just to make sure I do this right:
> 
> 1. strypeeze
> 2. lacquer thinner wipe down
> ...


Looks like you have it. Just don't let your rags get too dirty with the stripper. Change them often.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Just finished cleaning up the stripping job. It did not go well. My wife ended up wanting me to not use anything with methylene chloride since we have kids around and we were weary of residue. So I thought I'd give one of the mellower strippers a shot and I ended up using readystrip. 

It worked OK on some parts, not well on others, but it left streaks all over the main table top where I wiped the stripper on! So far I've just cleaned up with lacquer thinner, but I'm pretty freaked out that I've ruined the piece (see picture - that is after the piece has been cleaned).

How do I get rid of these streaks!?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

You didn't ruin the top but I believe I would strip it again. You don't have to be afraid of methylene chloride removers. Just put down some old newspapers to catch what drips and dispose of it when you are done. In an hour or so the stuff will dry anyway. The fumes are the most dangerous part of that type remover.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> You didn't ruin the top but I believe I would strip it again. You don't have to be afraid of methylene chloride removers. Just put down some old newspapers to catch what drips and dispose of it when you are done. In an hour or so the stuff will dry anyway. The fumes are the most dangerous part of that type remover.


Ok - How do I get the streaks out? You think they'll come out when I sand? 

When I do sand should I start with 180 or 220 (it is veneered)?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I believe the streaks is the old finish that liquified and then dried back on. I'm not familiar with the remover you used but I've seen it with other removers. I think if it was completely stripped the streaks would be gone. Anyway if some of the finish is still on there it won't sand off enough to put a stain back on the table. It might appear to be gone when sanded but would stain blotchy.

When you do get it stripped 180 grit paper should work fine.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> I believe the streaks is the old finish that liquified and then dried back on. I'm not familiar with the remover you used but I've seen it with other removers. I think if it was completely stripped the streaks would be gone. Anyway if some of the finish is still on there it won't sand off enough to put a stain back on the table. It might appear to be gone when sanded but would stain blotchy.
> 
> When you do get it stripped 180 grit paper should work fine.


So you're saying I should strip it again before sanding?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

slantedview said:


> So you're saying I should strip it again before sanding?


Yes, it is though you took several layers off and left one. The wood is still sealed with the old finish. It is penetrated into the wood. Since it is veneered you wouldn't be able to sand enough off to help you.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Ok - relented and put on a coat of Strypeeze  30 minutes after first coat and the finish on the leaves appears to be in tact. Another coat - covered with plastic - waiting another 30 minutes...


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Maybe I was wrong about the finish. All I have to go by is the picture and it appeared the finish is still on there. Usually when there is marks like that it is because the finish didn't come completely off. 

Just wash it off good with lacquer thinner and let it dry and then sand it.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

The main table top is what's streaky in that picture. Most of the finish seems to have been removed, but streaks remain. The leaves on the other hand still seem to have their finish in tact and the strypeeze didn't do much to it. 

I just tried a coat of Strypeeze on the main table top and the second that stuff hits the wood you can see it penetrate and leave new streaks, then it dries up really fast in about 30 seconds. I think the lacquer thinner residue is causing the Strypeeze to dry out?


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Here's a picture of one leaf and the main section with Strypeeze doing its thing. Notice, it seems to be drying out really fast.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

When you use any remover it's necessary to keep it wet with the remover until it's time to scrape it off. Then it's important to wash it off with lacquer thinner quickly before the remover dries. Once you scrape the finish off the remover that is left dries really fast.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Since the high is in the 60s today I figure I'll have to wait till tomorrow to try another round of stripper. In the meantime, here's a picture of one of the leafs after stripping yesterday. It looks... horrible. Uneven blotching everywhere. This is after doing 1 overnight round of readystrip, cleaning, then 1 round of Strypeeze. I'm wondering if the Strypeeze formulations we have here in CA are not strong enough?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I can't really answer your question as to whether the remover is formulated different for California or not. What I can tell you is no remover works for every finish. If one brand isn't doing it you might need to try another. You might pick up a small can of Kleen Strip remover and see if that does any better.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> I can't really answer your question as to whether the remover is formulated different for California or not. What I can tell you is no remover works for every finish. If one brand isn't doing it you might need to try another. You might pick up a small can of Kleen Strip remover and see if that does any better.


Good idea. I have no idea what the finish is - lacquer thinner did nothing to it - but I'll need to pick up some more stripper anyways. I think I'll try Jasco since I've used it before and I like the way it applies.

Another question: How can I tell when the surface is sufficiently "stripped"? Will it all be dry and white'ish?


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## JCCLARK (Jan 30, 2007)

Get it good and wet with stripper and cover it with plastic.
That will keep it from drying out.
Plastic garbage bags work pretty good if you don't
have roll stock.

When I'm done stripping I scrub it real good with a red scotchbrite
pad with Dawn dish detergent, rinse,
then allow a lot of time to dry thoroughly.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

JCCLARK said:


> Get it good and wet with stripper and cover it with plastic.
> That will keep it from drying out.
> Plastic garbage bags work pretty good if you don't
> have roll stock.
> ...


The Jasco is on, plastic wrapped. How long can/should I let this stuff sit? I don't want to mess with it too early but I don't want it to damage the veneer glue or something if I leave it too long.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Don't leave it too long. If it dries it will stick the plastic down like glue. If it's going to work at all 15-20 minutes should do it.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> Don't leave it too long. If it dries it will stick the plastic down like glue. If it's going to work at all 15-20 minutes should do it.


Thanks - how do I know when the surface is fully stripped?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

slantedview said:


> Thanks - how do I know when the surface is fully stripped?


Well I never cover remover with plastic so that makes an unknown for me. It's always harder to tell too if you have to re-strip like you are doing. If it was the first strip and you went to test it you take a putty knife and scrape the remover off with the grain and if it scraped clean it would be ready. If not you re-wet the spot with remover and wait longer. The important thing in any case is to keep the surface wet with remover until you are ready to scrap it off. 

All you can do is scrape off the table and wash it down with lacquer thinner and hope for the best. If I haven't said this before you have to be really fast with the lacquer thinner rinse after you scrape it off or the finish will dry back on. Since you are stripping twice I would do a very thorough rinse with the lacquer thinner changing rags. Removers contain wax and you have to be sure you get all that wax off.


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## jacko9 (Dec 29, 2012)

*re-finishing*

I haven't stripped a table in a while since I try to avoid those nasty chemicals but, the last time I stripped off a wax layer the best chemical was methyl chloride (that was a while ago when you could buy it in California). For the top coat stripping I used something called "Green's Stripper" and I'm not sure they sell that any longer. I would suggest that you exhaust all possible stripping chemicals before sanding or there's a good chance you'll go through the veneer layer.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Still not sure if these pieces are fully stripped. The two leaves (first two pics) seem to have a harder surface to them - it doesn't feel quite like raw wood - maybe a poly? The center of the table (last pic) does feel more raw. Regardless, all of them are blotchy, streaky messes. I've tried hitting specific streaky parts with stripper just to see what will happen. The answer - nothing. The streaks were caused by the first round of stripping - the readystrip - where I brushed it back and forth.

Not sure how to proceed


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

It looks better. As stubborn as the finish is perhaps it's a conversion varnish. I've had a piece in my shop one time no remover would even knock the shine off of it. I even took a drawer to a Benco commercial remover company and nothing they had would touch it. If you do choose to try stripping again you might get a brass brush and while wet with remover scrub it with the grain and see if you can get anymore off. Personally from the way it looks now I would be inclined to sand the rest of it off.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

I tried sanding one of the leafs with some 150 and it didn't seem to do anything. Whatever finish is on it is pretty hard.

I just discovered that ReadyStrip - the stuff that left the streaks - is water based. I'm wondering if this means it should not be used with furniture (though it certainly doesn't say so). Would the fact that it's water based, and that I left it on for over 12 hours, have caused the streaks?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

slantedview said:


> I just discovered that ReadyStrip - the stuff that left the streaks - is water based. I'm wondering if this means it should not be used with furniture (though it certainly doesn't say so). Would the fact that it's water based, and that I left it on for over 12 hours, have caused the streaks?


All it means is it's a product developed for the environmentalist. They could care less if it works or how much work it causes, all that matters is that it doesn't contain methylene chloride which is needed to remove a finish. It being water based and having to strip over and over to get the finish off you would run the risk of the veneer off. Personally I refuse to buy any product that even suggests "Green". That also goes for low odor paint thinner too. Leaving the remover on for 12 hours didn't cause the streaks. Using a remover not strong enough to liquify the finish caused the streaks.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> Using a remover not strong enough to liquify the finish caused the streaks.


I'm wondering then, why the streaks are untouched even when I hit them with a thick coat of Jasco?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

slantedview said:


> I'm wondering then, why the streaks are untouched even when I hit them with a thick coat of Jasco?


The stuff just gets rubbed into the grain and stains the wood. In the future anytime you strip something scrape it off in the same direction as the grain if at all possible.

As far as the Jasco, I've never used that brand. I have heard from others that described it as being weak. If this is true then that might be the reason the streaks didn't come off.


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

This is basically a disaster. I have no idea what is in readystrip, but those streaks go all the way through the veneer. Ask me how I know (today was sanding day). The piece seems ruined. I can finish it, but what's the point with streaks and blotches all over? I'm at a loss.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

OK, if after even a little sanding the streaks didn't go away you need to go back to stripper. Try using either Kleen Strip remover or one that is flammable, which ever you can find. Also get a brass brush. Harbor freight sells some pretty good ones. Soak the wood for about 15 minutes keeping it wet with remover and brush it with the brass brush rubbing it with the grain. If the streaks go away rinse it off. If not apply some more remover and allow it to soak for another 15 minutes keeping it wet and brush it again. After two rounds of this if the finish doesn't come off then it's time to try a different remover. Another option is if you have a power washer. If it is low powered or you can adjust the pressure it will do better getting the residue off. The pressure needs to be around 1200 psi. It's low enough you can hold the nozzle about a foot from your hand and it doesn't hurt. I have one I bought from Harbor Freight that is 1600 psi and it's a little too much. I have to be careful not to damage the wood with it. 

I could recommend some commercial removers but they come in 5 gallon containers and the hasmat fees would be high for shipping.


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

If you sanded through the veneer, at this point its a better option to re-veneer the top rather than try to strip the old finish off. Sad but true


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## slantedview (Jan 9, 2011)

epicfail48 said:


> If you sanded through the veneer, at this point its a better option to re-veneer the top rather than try to strip the old finish off. Sad but true


I only started to go through in one place. I was watching carefully for it and I stopped - so it's not too bad.


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## Toolman50 (Mar 22, 2015)

slantedview said:


> Thanks - how do I know when the surface is fully stripped?


Slanted
The stripper usually will not remove the stain. Only the finish. 
In a porous wood, the stain can penetrate pretty deeply into open grain. 
Once the finish is removed, you will most likely need to sand the top by hand using a sanding block and starting with with 150 grit sandpaper and sanding through the higher grits to 220 grit. 
If you plan for on re-staining the table the original color or darker, it will not be necessary to sand the wood until it's white. The new stain will cover if sanded evenly. The key is to sand evenly. You don't want some areas sanded more than others. 
Good luck.


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