# Kitchen cabinet retouching



## Howard Ferstler (Sep 27, 2007)

Hey, I have a group of oak kitchen cabinets that I installed about 25 years ago. They still look good, but in a couple of places the finished has deteriorated to the point where the clear coat has flaked off or rubbed off. My wife uses hand lotion a lot, and I think that may have played a part. Yesterday, I installed handles and knobs on the doors and drawers to keep this from happening any more. However, the offending areas still need just a bit of work.

I want to touch up those areas, but I want to use the right clear coating. I know that most furniture makers use a lacquer clear coat, because it dries fast and does not need sanding between coats. Amateurs often use polyurethane varnish, because of its supposed durability.

My question is: would kitchen cabinet makers use the lacquer approach to get the job done fast, or would they stick with poly to insure long-term durability, even though it would slow down the production process?

Once I have the answer I can happily touch up the offending areas, either with artist-brush applied clear lacquer or clear poly varnish. I know that the wrong touch-up materials might cause more problems than they solve.

Many thanks for input.

Howard Ferstler


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## jack warner (Oct 15, 2010)

actually most cab shops are using a conversion varnish now.
use the same finish thats on there if you know it. best thing to do is t/u the area you need to and spray the hole door/drawer.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

If you have a lacquer finish it's OK to use lacquer as a touch up. Anything else, lacquer will likely be a problem. If you don't know, you can use an oil base varnish/polyurethane, or a waterbase polyurethane.

I wouldn't go through the fire drill to determine what the existing finish is.









 







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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

25 years ago there were probably a great many shops using lacquer however most cabinets were put in a house unfinished and the house painter did the finishing work. The problem with touching up the finish with lacquer is if it has a varnish type finish is the solvents in lacquer. The solvents are so strong that it will often make the varnish wrinkle up like you put paint and varnish remover on it. You can test the finish by putting lacquer on it in an inconspicuous spot but you can get mixed results. After 25 years sometimes varnish dries so hard that it may only lift in spots and not where you test. The safest way to touch it up is to use an oil based polyurethane. You are most likely not going to be able to work just the spot but the entire board or door. Regardless of the finish the polyurethane will adhere however you should first thoroughly clean the cabinet first. I like using a product called Krud Kutter Gloss Off frequently changing rags to do this.


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## Howard Ferstler (Sep 27, 2007)

After scoping multiple sources, I am going to use some lacquer thinner on a Q-tip and test in an inconspicuous area. If the thinner dissolves the stuff and the spot becomes smooth, it is probably lacquer. If it has no or little effect, or if it roughens the surface but does not then smooth out, it is probably varnish.

The results will give me a clue about the touch-up work. The offending spots are small and it is not all that easy to see the blemishes even now, so I figure that some careful, artist-grade work with a very small brush (artist type) should do the trick.

Thanks for the infor.

Howard Ferstler


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

Howard Ferstler said:


> After scoping multiple sources, I am going to use some lacquer thinner on a Q-tip and test in an inconspicuous area. If the thinner dissolves the stuff and the spot becomes smooth, it is probably lacquer. If it has no or little effect, or if it roughens the surface but does not then smooth out, it is probably varnish.
> 
> The results will give me a clue about the touch-up work. The offending spots are small and it is not all that easy to see the blemishes even now, so I figure that some careful, artist-grade work with a very small brush (artist type) should do the trick.
> 
> ...


Your testing may seem simplistic and telling, but lacquer thinner is a solvent for most any finish that could be present. How the finish reacts (sooner or later) is unpredictable. I wouldn't trust using it to make a determination.









 







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## Rick Mosher (Feb 26, 2009)

Commercial cabinet shops haven't used lacquer on kitchen cabinets for many years ( so 25 years you are probably looking at lacquer). It just isn't durable enough in wet areas like around the sink. It is probably a conversion varnish, pre-cat or post-cat lacquer. If your cabinets are lacquer it is very easy to touch up. Mohawk makes a complete line of aerosol touch up lacquers in different sheens just for that purpose. You can even get a pre-cat lacquer in aerosol which will be more durable than what you have and it will go right over the existing finish (whatever it is if it isn't lacquer)


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

Rick Mosher said:


> You can even get a pre-cat lacquer in aerosol which will be more durable than what you have and it will go right over the existing finish (whatever it is if it isn't lacquer)


So you are suggesting there is an aerosol spray that is a solvent based lacquer (lacquer thinner/acetone) that has no effect on oil base varnish, oil base polyurethane, shellac, or waterbase polyurethane?










 







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## jack warner (Oct 15, 2010)

i use a lot of mohawk products. there wb pre cat lacquer is pretty damn good stuff. a bit thin for me and to hard witch is why i dont like lacquer.when your wood expands a lacquer will crack.
but ive never seen a pre cat in a rattle can. ive never seen that
must be a very short shelf life


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

jack warner said:


> i use a lot of mohawk products. there wb pre cat lacquer is pretty damn good stuff. a bit thin for me and to hard witch is why i dont like lacquer.when your wood expands a lacquer will crack.
> but ive never seen a pre cat in a rattle can. ive never seen that
> must be a very short shelf life


 I thought the same thing but I don't use much rattle can anything. Rick was right though, mohawk does make it.


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## Rick Mosher (Feb 26, 2009)

cabinetman said:


> So you are suggesting there is an aerosol spray that is a solvent based lacquer (lacquer thinner/acetone) that has no effect on oil base varnish, oil base polyurethane, shellac, or waterbase polyurethane?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Yes, Mohawk products are designed to be able to touch up pretty much anything. The trick is for the first 2-3 coats not to spray too wet of a coat if you're going over varnish or it could wrinkle. If I was going to touch up over varnish I would put down a barrier coat of De-waxed shellac (after cleaning and scuffing thoroughly)first and then topcoat with the lacquer. (Zinnser Seal Coat is also available in an aerosol also I believe) 

The Mohawk pre-cat lacquer isn't a really strong pre-cat so it does have a long shelf life. It's not like a post cat with a short pot life or even commercial pre-cat which have a shelf life of maybe 6 months.

It also isn't a very good pre-cat but it is a little better than using a regular lacquer. (There is also a 2k urethane available in aerosol cans.)


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

Rick Mosher said:


> Yes, Mohawk products are designed to be able to touch up pretty much anything. The trick is for the first 2-3 coats not to spray too wet of a coat if you're going over varnish or it could wrinkle. If I was going to touch up over varnish I would put down a barrier coat of De-waxed shellac (after cleaning and scuffing thoroughly)first and then topcoat with the lacquer. (Zinnser Seal Coat is also available in an aerosol also I believe)
> 
> The Mohawk pre-cat lacquer isn't a really strong pre-cat so it does have a long shelf life. It's not like a post cat with a short pot life or even commercial pre-cat which have a shelf life of maybe 6 months.
> 
> It also isn't a very good pre-cat but it is a little better than using a regular lacquer. (There is also a 2k urethane available in aerosol cans.)


We're addressing touching up spots in a kitchen. You could sand, add dewaxed shellac, and then topcoat, providing you don't overlap the shellac. Doing that seems like too any steps. Dewaxed shellac does work, but IMO too soft for a durable base or a finish.

As for the aerosol lacquer...did you read the MSDS. That stuff has gotta be toxic as all get out. I wouldn't use that on the job. An easier method might be to use a Preval applicator, and touch up with OB varnish, or WB poly.









 







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## slevapaul (Aug 25, 2012)

They really look nice. They does not seems to require any finishing now. But if you feel it is essential, then it is better to use the previous finishing. Thanks for sharing the nice info.


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## steamfab (Jun 22, 2012)

Neat job on the kitchen!


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