# Re-grinding a bowl gouge



## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Hi all,

I have a 1/2" Patience and Nicholson bowl gouge that was originally ground as a bottom feeder type gouge. I tried to give it a fingernail shape, but now it doesn't cut worth a hoot. It's around a 60 degree bevel. The wings though are not sharp at all. They seem to be rolled inward too far no matter what I do. Could the flute type be the wrong type for a fingernail bowl gouge? It seems deep and u-shaped. I've read somewhere that some flute types are not good for fingernail grinds. Is this true? 

Any advise is appreciated. I've pretty much ground this one down an inch already and have about 4 1/2" of flute left, so I'm going to keep using it as a practice gouge. Good thing it wasn't too expensive. :thumbdown:


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## john lucas (Sep 18, 2007)

Need more info. What method are you using to sharpen. There are different shapes to the flutes on bowl gouges and some leave the wings thinner or more acute than others. However even on a thick wall you should be able to get a sharp edge it just might be less acute. The less acute angles hold that edge longer than the finer angled edges. So it's a trade off. 

Let us know how you sharpen and we might be able to help.


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## hwebb99 (Nov 27, 2012)

Did you grind the top down to the profile you want?






























The first three pictures are of my Thompson gouges, the last 2 are of my cheap psi gouge. The Thompson gouges have a fingernail grind, the psi gouge had a standard grind. I tried unsuccessfully to grind a fingernail grind on the psi gouge. I later learned you have to grind the top down first. I assume you are using a grinder to sharpen, be careful not to overheat your tool.


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

I use the Penn State Wolverine knock off. I eyeball the bevel to the grinding stone which is a white Norton wheel. It's in the fingernail jig. The side walls are indeed very thick. I probably just need more practice. I need a second gouge anyways....

hwebb99, those profiles look like what I'm shooting for. I wish I could see your post better but there's some stupid adds in the way.


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## 9thousandfeet (Dec 28, 2014)

P&N makes two flute profiles, one a traditional "V-shape" and the other a wider "U-shape". Either will successfully accept a swept-back or "fingernail" type of grind, though for my money the second kind is better suited for that. 
I've had one for years and it's now down to about an inch and a half of flute left. Still great for working the outside profiles of bowls. P&N tools are a really good bang for the buck in my opinion. I've not noticed any really substantial difference in edge-holding ability between them and more expensive (and often shorter) brands, even the "powder metal" brands which get the most rave reviews in woodturning forums.

Anyway, if there's any way in the world you can post a photo of the tip of the tool in its current condition that would make it much easier for anyone to make suggestions.
Failing that, a full description of your sharpening approach and what kind of sharpening jig, if any, you're using would be the next best thing.


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## 9thousandfeet (Dec 28, 2014)

ACP said:


> I wish I could see your post better but there's some stupid adds in the way.


This is off-topic, so I won't go on and on about it. But google "AdBlock" to find a browser plugin which will make those ads disappear.


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## hwebb99 (Nov 27, 2012)

My Thompson tools came with that profile. I set my wolverine jig to the correct angle, clamp the tool at the correct length (1-3/4), set the v-arm at the correct length, and grind away. I know that sounds like a lot of steps, but it probably only takes me 45 seconds to sharpen a gouge. If you are looking to buy a new gouge I highly recommend Thompson tools they have a 6 inch flute, and hold an edge great. I have turned about 20 ten inch bowls, and have maybe ground off an 1/8 inch.


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Sweet. Thanks guys, I'll post a photo of it when I get home. I think my angle might be too much but I'll post it and see what you guys think.


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## NCPaladin (Aug 7, 2010)

9thousandfeet said:


> This is off-topic, so I won't go on and on about it. But google "AdBlock" to find a browser plugin which will make those ads disappear.


Sorry but I have the same problem and it is not popups or hovers.

If ACP is the same as mine he is referring to ads to the right of the normal screen. Usually only with hwebb99 do the ads cover the text or pictures. Only about 1/2 (width) of the post appears and you have to scroll to see the other half (with the pictures staying in their original location over the text or pictures).
I don't know but in looking at the post of hwebb below this "reply block", all text and pictures go straight across with no breaks.
I think if "enter" was hit after each paragraph and after each picture it would force things back to the left.

Maybe a moderator know how to correct it if this is not correct.


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Okay, here she is. The secondary was from my attempt to get a very swept back wing. The "fresher" bevel is from the penn state jig last night.


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## hwebb99 (Nov 27, 2012)

NCPaladin said:


> Sorry but I have the same problem and it is not popups or hovers.
> 
> If ACP is the same as mine he is referring to ads to the right of the normal screen. Usually only with hwebb99 do the ads cover the text or pictures. Only about 1/2 (width) of the post appears and you have to scroll to see the other half (with the pictures staying in their original location over the text or pictures).
> I don't know but in looking at the post of hwebb below this "reply block", all text and pictures go straight across with no breaks.
> ...


I usually post from my iPad. Could that have something to do with it?


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## 9thousandfeet (Dec 28, 2014)

NCPaladin said:


> Sorry but I have the same problem and it is not popups or hovers.


That's odd.
Even with adblock disabled and all my other cookie control plugins disabled, I don't see any ads here at all. No popups, no sidebar ads, no nothing.
But if I _was_ getting ads that I couldn't block, and if they were making some posts unreadable, I'd start a thread in the "Site Help and Suggestions" forum asking about it.
Best not to derail this thread with that issue, probably.


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## 9thousandfeet (Dec 28, 2014)

ACP, the grind profile you show in the photo looks like it's at least somewhere in the ballpark, but it's difficult to assess the nose angle you've chosen from the perspective that photo is taken from.
It looks kinda steep to me, and the side angle looks even steeper, but again it's real hard to tell in that photo.
Any chance of a photo from the side, showing the nose angle? And one of the way you have your jig set up would be helpful too.


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## ACP (Jan 24, 2009)

Ok good news! I got it figured out. I made one of Cap'n Eddies grinder set-up gauges and was able to put a 50 degree bevel on it. It was at 60-63ish and that was just too much. I used it last night on a small green bowl and it worked fantastic. Thanks for the advise guys.


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## 9thousandfeet (Dec 28, 2014)

Good news indeed.
I thought it looked a little steep.

Once the angle gets beyond a certain point, I've found the benefits of a swept back grind start to diminish rapidly. I have a couple of gouges ground to around 75 degrees or maybe a bit more (I don't actually measure angles on any cutting edges, I just kinda eyeball them) for reaching into deeper bowls when a regular 45-50ish gouge runs out of access, and I don't mess around with any fingernail profiles on those. They just don't work well enough at those angles to make it worthwhile in my experience.


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