# Designing a kitchen before house is built



## RichO (Apr 29, 2009)

Hello all,

Looking for a little advice here. Wondering how cabinet shops/contractors come up with kitchen cabinet dimensions when house plans are drawn up.

If I am designing cabinets that cover 3 walls, like this.









The measurements of the left and right side cabinets aren't so critical but how do you go about getting everything to come out exact for the center wall?

Say a kitchen is supposed to be 14' wide along that wall. When the kitchen is complete, drywall up, painted, etc. does that measurement always come out exact, and if not how does a cabinet maker account for that?

I am going to eventually have a house built and I want to build the kitchen myself but because it is such a huge undertaking, I want to start on the cabinets before they even break ground. I have a medium size home shop so I will need to build them one section at a time.

Thanks for any advice you can offer.


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## jlhaslip (Jan 16, 2010)

Production Cabinets are built in 3 inch increments from about 12 inch to 42 inch.
Most production built cabinet outfits sell 3 " filler strips to use when the cabinets don't quite fit the layout.
If you are going to build your own, then you can custom fit them as you build.

Drywall and framing are not very often done to exact dimensions for several reasons, like the framer's level is usually different than the cabinet guy's level. Drywall mud builds up in the corners, or is sanded too hand. Lots of things happen.

Also, the design may need to be tweaked when you take measurements after the drywall is installed and painted if you will be custom cutting.

A perfect spot for adjusting the cabinet sizes for the image you show would be the stove opening. Leave that one unbuilt until the final dimensions are known. You should be able to assemble the box with a wider face frame and plane it down to fit.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

after building my own house and kitchen cabinets, personally i would wait until the kitchen walls are up to build cabinets, so that i could maximize every space. the other consideration is if there are any references to line up, for example a window directly over a sink, etc. make sure to account for plumbing locations as well, even the stove exhaust if going outside. make many sketches first.


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## jlord (Feb 1, 2010)

I would wait till walls are up also before building most of your cabs. Taking layout into consideration you can get a head start on some of the cabinets like the corner cabinets, upper cabinet above stove if you know vent size (usually 30"w you will modify for power & venting anyway when installing), upper fridge cabinet (same size as opening), & pantry. Some of these cabinets will be a certain size no matter what your finished room dimensions are.

Depending on the layout you have you might be able to get a head start on some of these. You can custom size the other cabinets to fill in once you know your finish dimensions. You should have size & layout of kitchen before construction starts on house anyways to give an idea of which cabinets you could get a head start on.


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## RichO (Apr 29, 2009)

Thanks for the advice.

I can't really wait until the walls are up because I work full time and can only make the cabinets in my spare time, so I need a big head start.

It sounds like I can build most of them in sections and just wait on the few that require critical dimensions to make the whole thing fit. If necessary I can also wait on building the doors, the most time consuming part, until after the cabinets are installed.

The project won't be starting for quite a while yet but once it does I'm sure I'll be needing some more advice along the way :smile:


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

There are times I get complete plans, but I don't build until the finished walls are complete. What you can do is do your drawings, i.e., plan view and elevations, and cut and prep (dadoes and rabbets) the ends, dividers, and drawer parts. From your drawings, plan out a cut sheet based on 4x8 material so you can maximize the sheets. 

If the doors are R&S, you can cut the stock in lengths, and tape them together until you're ready. That will help keep them straight.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*More advice..*

For this to work you need to use a face frame style of cabinet with the side frames extra 1/2" wide or so to allow for a final trim when installed. The cabinets and doors can all be made, assembled, and finished including the doors this way. You're just allowing for a variation in wall length of 2 -3 inches total. If you can get your builder to hold closer than that, better yet. My were within 1", but I was lucky, and he was skilled. By allowing the frames to "fly off" on both sides you get double the allowance on each cabinet.
You can trim them to final size with a circular saw and a fine tooth blade after you know the final dimension, rather than using filler panels. I used filler panels to close up some narrow spaces between the cabinets 1/2" or so, in the same wood and finish as the finals just cut and spray some extra 3" wide lengths. 
For a European style or frameless, you can build them all except the two on opposites sides of an appliance or opening, as was mentioned, then assemble the previously cut side panels and a back and bottom to fit the dimension required after installing the others. Just make up some extra sides, right and left with the dados for the bottom and rabbets for the back and set them aside until all the others are installed.
That's my advice for this circumstance. :thumbsup: bill


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## wooddude9 (Sep 6, 2008)

The one thing you said is having a house built so if you have all the dimensions for the room just oversee that when the slab is poured or subfloor. And the carpenter lays out the placement of the walls that they account for all added surfaces to meet the measurement you built it at.Keep an eye an the guys as they plumb the walls and give yourself a little working room for a couple fillers like everyone said. I would say go for it you'll save alot of money in the long run with all the other costs involved in building a new home.........good luck


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

Ema Rich said:


> Hello guys!
> 
> Thanks for the above information and I am doing an assignment which includes writing out a brief stating all the appliances, where the plugs will be, where lighting will go etc. for the builders and electricians. thing is iv never seen or written a brief like that for a builder or electrician before in my life so could do with a few tips.



You might get a better response from starting your own thread.


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## mics_54 (Oct 28, 2008)

I would suggest you ask the builder and electricians where these items should go. The builder and electrician and plumber go by the plan which is designed by the architect. Specifics on locations of services is most often dictated by building codes, appliance and fiixture manufacturers and property owner preferences.....and it would be anything but brief.


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