# Found a sawmill to cut some wood for me



## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

This thread is directed at the guys that have portable bandsaw mills. I found a fellow to saw some logs for me @ $75.00 per hour. Would this price be comparable to sawing by the BdFt?


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

Depends on how many bft he can saw in an hour...I run a little manual mill and can't saw nearly as many bft/hr as the guys who run the bigger engines with hydraulic assistance. That is saying once the log is on the mill, my machine just cuts slower and I have to manually flip the log. There are other things that burn up hours too though, like handling the logs on the ground-to the mill. Sawing small logs we all waste time loading and getting set up, that is why I charge by the hour not the bft on small ones, a guy just can't make the bft per hour to pay himself.

And of course the all important variable, the sawyer. Just because he has big iron doesn't guarantee high bft numbers. Heck he may not know how to run the thing, or not like to work hard.

Don't mistake high bft numbers for the important part though, it's quality over quantity in the sawmill game. I imagine you would rather have (just numbers out of thin air) 300 bft of well sawn lumber that is all but ready to use VS 500 bft of poorly sawn stuff you have many hours in dressing, wasting your time and wood.

Quality and quantity are not mutually exclusive, you can have both. If the guy has a good machine and knows how to run it you will have an amazing pile of lumber for the $75 hr.


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## Julian the woodnut (Nov 5, 2008)

If I had to pay $75 I would have ended up paying about $350 for 200 bf of elm that I had milled. Instead I paid 25 cents a foot and ended up hitting a few eyebolts at $6 a blade. I spent a grand total of $68 for that 200 bf.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

Thanks Daren and Julian,
Don't get me wrong, i am not complaining about the price i was just wondering. This fellow has a wood mizer all hydraulic and he sets on a seat and rides along as he saws. I watched him saw some small stuff for a guy yesterday and he boogied right along. I have an aromatic cedar i am going to remove out of my back yard, so it won't end up going through the pool cage during a hurricane, and am not going to give it to the tree service:no:. I'll keep ya'll posted with pictures, this tree is really gnarley at the butt end so i'm hoping for some unique grain patterns:thumbsup:. OMT---LOML thinks i'm nuts, well for this one time i'll prove her wrong:laughing:


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## dirtclod (May 7, 2008)

Do everything you can to make the job go as fast as possible. That includes making sure the logs are trimmed of limb swells, bucked, and stacked in a place he says works for his mill setup. . Make sure all the mud has been removed before he gets there. Have a place to stack the lumber (trailer or local foundation ready) and take care of procuring your stickers before he gets there. ($75.00/hr is high for cutting stickers.) Be quick to move logs, slabs and lumber so it's your time getting used and not his

There could be travel and setup fees that'll run the price up. You need to take that into account vs the ttl bf you expect. You can pool your logs with neighbors as one way to get the volume up. Is it practical to move the logs to him and save the travel and setup fees?


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

*I'll be ready*

Dirtclod,
I will be taking the logs to the saw, also i will offbare for him so all he has to do is "SAW". A friend and i used to saw our own lumber when i was still up north (we rented a bandsaw mill) so it won't be like i am going into this a greenhorn. Like i mentioned this is aromatic ceder and i am considering leaving i think what you would call a live edge on some. I am guessing the biggest log will be 18 to 20" at the butt end so i'm hoping to get desent BdFt from this tree. I guess i will have to brush up on the doyle scale to give myself an estimate of what i have. Thanks for your input.
OMT--I checked some of the threads on milling to give myself an idea as to what you sawyers paint the ends of your logs.


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

Garry,

The guys have covered your hourly rate vs BF rate question and I can't add anything to it, but I do want to address this:



garryswf said:


> Dirtclod,
> . . . I am guessing the biggest log will be 18 to 20" at the butt end so i'm hoping to get desent BdFt from this tree. I guess i will have to brush up on the doyle scale to give myself an estimate of what i have. . . .



ERC has more taper than just about any other species you'll run across. Even a well developed, mature tree will have more taper than what you can see until the slabs start coming off. In addition, most of them will have a percentage of bark inclusion. Then there is the crook factor. An ERC can look real straight just standing there, but even a slight gradual curve in the log will add significantly to the waste. 

ERC is one of the species that a sawyer who is familiar with will not mill them by the BF because he gets paid by how many BF you leave with, not by the total BF he sawed to get you that amount. I had a buddy in East Texas (now retired) who would saw anything except ERC. He just heated them. My guess is you already told him what species you have and that's why he said $75 hour. Maybe he only saws by the hour for any species, but if he didn't he likely would have only quoted you by the hour for ERC. 

Also, you shouldn't use Doyle, Scribner, nor International scales to accurately estimate the BF in smaller ERC logs in general because ERC inherently produces much more waste than most other species. The ends are usually irregularly shaped also making it hard to get an accurate small end dia. You can use D or S or I for the high quality, no inclusion, straight, solid, slightly tapered ERC and come out close but most ERC logs will not fall into this category. 

The cedar scale below will be more accurate overall, and once you get into logs 18" and up then yes you can use Doyle, or better yet the 1/8" International scale (not the 1/4" Int hardwood). But sicne you aren't going to run into many cedars with 18" ends at the top of the sawlog (I do but still rare even here) just use the scale below. Even then, remember cedar can have as much as 30% waste and even more, so don;t have any expectations as to BF at all, and you won't be disappointed. 

All diameters are for the small end








And one last thing to remember, this cedar scale was calculated for cedar mills to sell by, not buy by, if you catch my drift.


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## garryswf (Aug 17, 2009)

TT,
Thank You for the post, and the chart, and yes i do get your drift on sell by vs not buy by comment:thumbsup:. Thats what i like about this forum, always folks ready to help with great advice. Have a great day my friend.


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