# Sliding Door problem on old hutch



## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

I'm hoping someone has either some historical knowledge or some engineering creativity to help me out with a sliding door problem I've been trying to fix for some time. I have this Hoover Chair and Furniture Company Hutch (Lexington, NC - closed in 1968) with three bypass sliding doors on the bottom half. Each of the three doors has two wheels on the bottom (screwed into the door bottom with brackets) that fit into one of two wood channels on the piece itself. There are also two wood channels on the upper part of the opening of the piece where the doors fit in. On the top of the doors is another channel that runs along the top of the door with what appears to be a peg hole near the end of the channel. The ends of the door channel slightly taper up to the top edge of the door - as if a wheel used to fit in the door channel but was not screwed in with metal brackets like on the bottom of the door. 

We've been holding the doors parallel with a couple of screws just behind the top channels on the door opening but I'd like to find the hardware to fix this right or come up with something. Anyone have any ideas? I've tried to figure out how small washers or a peg with a small spring might work in the hole - but nothing is working.

The only hardware I can find is a "sliding door slide pin" from Rockler (Item #: 38905) - but because it screws into the back of the door (and I could adjust the screw to provide the proper height of the glide once the door was in place) the doors will not slide parallel because the wheels on the bottom of the doors are centered. Screwing this hardware to the back of the door would make them off kilter a bit.

Hope my explanation makes sense and that someone can give me some ideas. I'd sure appreciate the help. As I said, the company went out of business in 1968.
Thanks,
Chris


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## ducbsa (Jul 6, 2014)

Can you post some photos here?


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## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

Thanks for the suggestion ducbsa. I uploaded a few photos (the window stopped me from adding more) and put more under "my photos". Hope they illustrate my challenge. Appreciate any ideas you may have.


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## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

*more photos of the hutch*

Here are some additional photos showing the channels inside the hutch and the channels on the top of the doors


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## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

Here's how the screw has been propping up the doors on each end


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## TomCT2 (May 16, 2014)

if the slot in the top is deep enough, could you use some thinish HDPE cut into a long strip?
some aluminum flat stock would also work.
the 'long strip' would slide in the cabinet frame slot and 'ride with' the door left-right. 
use the peg hole to wedge it tight? if the strip slides in the door slot it could ride up the saw groove and stick - needs to be 'fixed' in position on the door itself.

the width has to be such that you can stick it up into the top slot far enough to get the bottom wheels in their slot; then let it 'down'

might have to clean up the frame slot for smooth action.


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## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

Thanks TomCT2.
I'd have to find HDPE that is really thin. Thinking out loud - If the HDPE is soft/flexible enough, I think that would cause less wear on the wood channels up top and it just might bend enough (depending on thickness) to allow me to slip the bottom wheels into the lower channel and then snap into place in the upper channels after giving a bit. I just have to make sure it's strong enough and secure in the door. Same considerations with the metal strip, which I know I could get thinner from the get-go.

From your experience is it acceptable to put some graphite in a wood channel like this for the material (whichever might work) to slide easier? Or is this not acceptable with wood? I know it can be dusty, so I might not want too much of it. Anything else in spray form that you are aware of that might help this slide?

Great ingenuity - thanks much. I'm going to give it a shot and do some experimenting. 
Appreciate the ideas.
Chris


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

The reason you are getting friction with the doors is a design flaw. The wheels on the bottom of the doors are suppose to be there to reduce friction, it wasn't intended to run in a groove. The groove is suppose to be slightly wider than the door thickness and deeper. Since you can't do that you might glue a thin strip of metal or plastic in the bottom of the grooves. I think Tom is right, over time the wheels have just worn the groove too deep and the door is dragging.


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## Gary Beasley (Jan 21, 2009)

The door looks like it might have had bent metal springs in the top slot that rode the upper slots in the cabinet. Obviously the designer was intent on building a door that rode on top of the wood surface instead of in a door thickness slot that is so common. Its too bad the wheel casings are nailed in, keeps you from pulling them out and reconditioning them. Do the wheels still turn freely?


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## TomCT2 (May 16, 2014)

I wouldn't do the graphite - except on extremely hard / dense wood it would disperse and just make a mess.

thin plastic cutting boards are readily available - the thin ones are typically on the small side so you'd have to piece on together -

too thick would be good (g) - you can make it thick to 'jam' in the door slot, then router it thinner for the top slot...

there's no evidence of the door bottoms rubbing on the cabinet frame, so the wheels are probably still functioning as designed.


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## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

Yes, the wheels turn freely. The main issue is engaging the top of the doors somehow.
Appreciate the input.


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## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

Steve, Gary and Tom - thanks for talking me through this. I've been tinkering around with several ideas but nothing seemed to work. I appreciate your time and the discussion. I'm going to play around with some of the cutting board material - both in the top and strips along the bottom. I'm not a journeyman woodworker by any stretch, but I do enjoy a good challenge and the chance to solve this puzzle!


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Are there any slots in the upper?*

Typically, you raise the door into a slot in the upper the lower it into a slot in the lower. The upper slot is deeper and the door is cut the right height so it's still trapped in the slot.

I think you are missing a pin that is screwed into the upper and will slide into the hole in the door slot. Once the door is pushed up and the pin is in the slot it's lowered into the channel on the bottom. There's no other reason I can see for the hole in the slot.....


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## Gary Beasley (Jan 21, 2009)

What I see on top is grooves for a piece of spring rod bent at 90 each end where the holes are drilled in the slot and bowed a bit so it raised out of the slot. This allows the wire to be flexed flat to install the door then it pops up to retain the door when in place.


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## Project Chris (Feb 11, 2018)

woodnthings, the "pin hole" stops about 3/4" down into the top of the door. 

Gary, I am not experienced enough to understand the concept you are explaining in this application. I understand what a spring rod is for curtains or hanging some other item between two solid surfaces, but I'm having a difficult time figuring this out. Is there somewhere you can direct me to visualize this and learn more? The concept of tension in keeping the doors in place is the theory I began with on this, but I wasn't sure how the tension would have been achieved. I want to understand and learn from what you are describing so any visualization would be helpful, if possible. Thank you.


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## TomCT2 (May 16, 2014)

Gary is, I think, talking about a (bend of) wire that rides in the upper cabinet groove and is held in place in the groove of the door. typically a 'spring' wire - i.e. stiff and tempered so it does not deform while the door is sliding. those are typically set in the door with one end of the wire pushed tightly into a small hole, the other end is bent to be flat in the groove and is not constrained by a hole - one end of the loop/bend of wire has to move to provide the vertical motion when mounting the door in the bottom groove.

I doubt that was used in your case - there's only one 'hole' in the groove of the door, right?
I get the impression this is a art-deco era piece or slightly later?
I have seen larger doors that have the same groove in the top - and used a thin wood strip snug in the door slot and loose in the top cabinet slot - using a slotted pin/dowel glued at 90' to the strip. the dowel pushes into the hole and keeps the wood strip from sliding left-right in the door groove.

that may have been the original design on your piece - and you could replace it with wood (maple or ash) altho HDPE would be better, imho.


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