# Woodpecker tools



## nbo10 (Jan 26, 2011)

Has anyone used woodpecker tools? I received a email from woodcraft with this nifty little dodad. It looks cool, but it's $150. :laughing: If I had the cash laying around I might be tempted to pick one up.


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## tc65 (Jan 9, 2012)

I've never splurged on one of their "OneTime Tool Products", but I've been really tempted a few times. They are just too expensive for my very modest budget. If I had the money, I'd definitely partake in some of their offerings but......

If you really want to drool, take a look at this page that lists all the "OneTime" tools that you can no longer have  https://www.woodpeck.com/onetimerun.html


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## mobilepaul (Nov 8, 2012)

nbo10 said:


> Has anyone used woodpecker tools? I received a email from woodcraft with this nifty little dodad. It looks cool, but it's $150. :laughing: If I had the cash laying around I might be tempted to pick one up.


I have a woodpeckers router table top and the lift designed by them. Both are very good quality. As for their one off tools, too pricey for me. I usually find that I can find something that will work close to the same for much less.

case in point:

http://www.harborfreight.com/self-centering-doweling-jig-41345.html

http://www.rockler.com/self-centeri..._campaign=PL&gclid=CLbnpOWp1b0CFYZcMgodomQAJQ

in action https://woodgears.ca/dowel/jig.html

here is one a little more expensive but, in my opinion, more versatile http://www.jessem.com/DOWELLING_JIG.html

Would I buy their tools if I had an unlimited budget, yes, but that will never be the case...


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## mrcanterbury (May 7, 2012)

I have tons if their measuring devices as well as the triangles and squares. They are top notch. I'd grab that too, but I just bought the festool domino this week. I'm just a believer in you get what you pay for.


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## jschaben (Apr 1, 2010)

I have several of their marking/measuring devices and they are all top notch. The only one time tool I've sprung for is their saddle square, spendy at $40 but I wish I had gone the $160 for the full set as the one I did get makes is sooo nice bringing a line around the corner. I also have their 12 and 24" rules with a rule stop that I use all the time. :smile:


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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

I wrote out a longer commentary on their tools a while ago, when I got an ad for a $100 12" square from them. Here's the short version.

Woodpeckers Square: 12" blade, 8" handle, guaranteed to .001". $100.

Empire Combination Square: 16" blade, ~3" handle, does 90 or 45 degree angles, guaranteed to .001". $15.

If it were long enough, either tool could mark a line on a board 9 feet long before the line was 1/100" off at the far end.

The Woodpeckers square will obviously be easier to keep perfectly flush with a board, but costs about 7 times as much. And I don't know about you, but I work with wood: movement of a hundredth of an inch is entirely possible after construction, so why do I care if I have ten times that accuracy while doing the construction? Or to think about it another way: I can get a perfectly adequate tool and about 12 board feet of 4/4 walnut (assuming about $7/bf, which is what I just found with a quick search) for the same cost as the Woodpeckers square, which is more accurate than any woodworker is likely to actually need.

Basically, I just don't see the value to woodworkers in buying tools that precise. The limit of the medium is really probably something like 1/100, unless you've figured out how to seal it so it won't move ever and use a laser to cut it. Even a really good table saw is likely to have runout in excess of 1/1000", so if you mark with a square that accurate, you lose the accuracy as soon as you cut.

Their non-marking tools, like this dowelling jig, may be worth it to some people, but I can't help feeling like most of their tools are overpriced as much as their square is. I've seen similar jigs sold in the $50 range at places like Woodcraft: the construction may not be quite the same quality, but they'll work just as well.


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## Fred Hargis (Apr 28, 2012)

Woodpecker's is nothing but high quality, great customer service, and a very high price point on almost everything. I've had 2 (still using one) of their router lifts and have nothing but praise for their products.


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## jschaben (Apr 1, 2010)

While I agree that given the amount wood can move, .001 seems like ludicrous accuracy with the exception of some projects; inlays and dovetails come to mind. But, there is such a thing as tolerance stackup, which comes around and bites me from time to time. The more accurate I can make the parts, the more tolerant the project will be to material idiosyncrasies. JMHO:smile:


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## Sorrowful Jones (Nov 28, 2010)

I got the same offer. Probably good quality but too much money for a once or twice use tool. jmho


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## Paarker (Mar 20, 2013)

There stuff is expensive but there quality can't be beat.


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## nbo10 (Jan 26, 2011)

I'm having a hard time resisting... I may end up having one later in the summer.


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## sawdustfactory (Jan 30, 2011)

nbo10 said:


> I'm having a hard time resisting... I may end up having one later in the summer.


A lot of Woodpeckers tools are limited runs. They take pre-orders and make a set number. Once gone, that's it, no more.


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## calwilliams63 (Dec 17, 2008)

I love how people are always so quick to bash tool companies for price and then try to compare apples to oranges. I own a similar doweling jig I bought from Woodcraft for like 40or 50 bucks and I think it's a piece of crap. If I didn't have to have one that day I would have gladly paid double to buy the Woodpeckers one which looks a lot nicer. If you can't afford a tool just say "it's out of my price range but looks nice". No need to be a prick about it.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

mrcanterbury said:


> I have tons if their measuring devices as well as the triangles and squares. They are top notch. I'd grab that too, but I just bought the festool domino this week. I'm just a believer in you get what you pay for.


I agree with you on getting what you pay for. Except for the Fe$tool products. There are a few costs associated with those tools you may not be aware of or are over looking. 

I like the wood pecker tools and see the quality and value in them. But the tool the OP posted I have no use for. Haven't drilled a dowel in 25 years. 

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## Burb (Nov 30, 2012)

calwilliams63 said:


> I love how people are always so quick to bash tool companies for price and then try to compare apples to oranges. I own a similar doweling jig I bought from Woodcraft for like 40or 50 bucks and I think it's a piece of crap. If I didn't have to have one that day I would have gladly paid double to buy the Woodpeckers one which looks a lot nicer. If you can't afford a tool just say "it's out of my price range but looks nice". No need to be a prick about it.


I agree 100%. Whenever I am buying a tool, I always look at his much I will use it, how much it is for high quality vs decent quality. Even when decent will likely fit the bill I still usually go for the highest quality I can afford at the time. 

Specific to Woodpeckers Tools, my first one will be here in July. I ordered the Corner Jig.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

nbo10 said:


> Has anyone used woodpecker tools? I received a email from woodcraft with this nifty little dodad. It looks cool, but it's $150. :laughing: If I had the cash laying around I might be tempted to pick one up.


I think they make an excellent tool. They also come up with some original designs, but are some like the Bridge City tools? Tools that really have no use.

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

jschaben said:


> I have several of their marking/measuring devices and they are all top notch. The only one time tool I've sprung for is their saddle square, spendy at $40 but I wish I had gone the $160 for the full set as the one I did get makes is sooo nice bringing a line around the corner. I also have their 12 and 24" rules with a rule stop that I use all the time. :smile:


I was thinking about buying the saddle square or making one. So you really like and use it? 

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

Fred Hargis said:


> Woodpecker's is nothing but high quality, great customer service, and a very high price point on almost everything. I've had 2 (still using one) of their router lifts and have nothing but praise for their products.


What happened to the other lift?

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

calwilliams63 said:


> I love how people are always so quick to bash tool companies for price and then try to compare apples to oranges. I own a similar doweling jig I bought from Woodcraft for like 40or 50 bucks and I think it's a piece of crap. If I didn't have to have one that day I would have gladly paid double to buy the Woodpeckers one which looks a lot nicer. If you can't afford a tool just say "it's out of my price range but looks nice". No need to be a prick about it.


Have you ever seen the Bridge City Tools line. I'd say they have quite a few tools that look nice, are out of my price range and actually have no place in the woodworking world. 

Wood Snob,
Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## calwilliams63 (Dec 17, 2008)

Al B Thayer said:


> Have you ever seen the Bridge City Tools line. I'd say they have quite a few tools that look nice, are out of my price range and actually have no place in the woodworking world.
> 
> Wood Snob,
> Al
> ...


I am actually quite familiar with BCT. I took a design class with the owner of Bridge City Jon Economaki at MASW a few years back. What a brilliant guy! But, to say his tools "actually have no place in the woodworking world" is absurd! I mean you do know they make handplanes and squares right? Lol! I think that would be enough to justify as woodworking tools. They make super precise, high quality tools and charge a fair premium for what you get. I don't really see the problem?? I mean only cause I can't justify spending 900 bucks on a block plane doesn't mean it's not worth the money to someone else. You realize that there is absolutely no backlash in the blade adjustment and every turn is equivalent to I think it was 1/1000 of an inch. I wish some of my Lie-Nielsen planes were like that. But, you get what you pay for. Oh, and not to mention the body of that plane is cut from a solid piece of stainless steel? Well, you know that's not cheap to have that cnc'd out right? I had the pleasure of holding some of these beautifully machined tools and they are phenomenally made. So, excuse me if don't agree with your ignorant statement. 
Woodworkers in general are usually pretty anal about most things. But, god forbid a company like Bridge City Tool Works or Festool make a quality tool and charge a fair premium for it. Apparently both of these companies are doing something right since BCT has been in business since 1983 and Festool 1925. So, I think myself and most people could learn a little something from companies like these.


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## jschaben (Apr 1, 2010)

Al B Thayer said:


> I was thinking about buying the saddle square or making one. So you really like and use it?
> 
> Al
> 
> Nails only hold themselves.


Yes, quite a bit more than I thought I would actually. I wish I had bought the whole set, I've looked and very few, if any, make such a tool that actually will bring a line around the corner without making some sort of interpolation. I suppose it would be easy enough to shop build one though. :smile:


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

I have the 8in saddle square, which is a square and rule. I do not use this often. Well made but does not get much use.

I have this saddle square from Lee Valley which does get a lot of use.
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=44836&cat=1,42936,50298,44836

I have the PRL V2 router lift. Upgraded from an earlier version where the router mounted via the base which limited bit height. The PRL V2 mounts to just the motor so I get better bit height. I wanted to avoid a chuck extension.

I also have some Woodpecker aluminium bars intended to be used like cauls. I use these often but as a stiff, straight reference for gluing sub-assemblies on board.

I also have the phenolic clamping squares. Do not get used much. My wife recently gave me the "precision" aluminium clamping squares as a birthday gift. When I check these against my machinists 90 deg square, they are close to 90 deg, but not as precise as the name would imply. Likely close enough for clamping wood, but not close enough that I would use one to set the table saw blade.

I have a couple of their knuckle clamps for use on the drill press. I like the design. 

Generally well designed and built.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

calwilliams63 said:


> I am actually quite familiar with BCT. I took a design class with the owner of Bridge City Jon Economaki at MASW a few years back. What a brilliant guy! But, to say his tools "actually have no place in the woodworking world" is absurd! I mean you do know they make handplanes and squares right? Lol! I think that would be enough to justify as woodworking tools. They make super precise, high quality tools and charge a fair premium for what you get. I don't really see the problem?? I mean only cause I can't justify spending 900 bucks on a block plane doesn't mean it's not worth the money to someone else. You realize that there is absolutely no backlash in the blade adjustment and every turn is equivalent to I think it was 1/1000 of an inch. I wish some of my Lie-Nielsen planes were like that. But, you get what you pay for. Oh, and not to mention the body of that plane is cut from a solid piece of stainless steel? Well, you know that's not cheap to have that cnc'd out right? I had the pleasure of holding some of these beautifully machined tools and they are phenomenally made. So, excuse me if don't agree with your ignorant statement.
> Woodworkers in general are usually pretty anal about most things. But, god forbid a company like Bridge City Tool Works or Festool make a quality tool and charge a fair premium for it. Apparently both of these companies are doing something right since BCT has been in business since 1983 and Festool 1925. So, I think myself and most people could learn a little something from companies like these.


I have one of their T squares. The one with one side that can be set at any angle. Had it for over 25 years. Used it maybe two times since I had it. 

I've built a lot of their Kerfmakers. Costs me about $.10 for the wood and a couple of hours to make. Use these sometimes. 

Which BCT do you own and use?

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

Dave Paine said:


> I have the 8in saddle square, which is a square and rule. I do not use this often. Well made but does not get much use.
> 
> I have this saddle square from Lee Valley which does get a lot of use.
> http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=44836&cat=1,42936,50298,44836
> ...


I think I could use that Veritas saddle square too. Nice price really.

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## J.C. (Jan 20, 2012)

Here's my favorite Woodpeckers one-time tools, Clamping Cauls. Use them all the time and if they offer them again, I'd probably buy one or two more sets.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

J.C. said:


> Here's my favorite Woodpeckers one-time tools, Clamping Cauls. Use them all the time and if they offer them again, I'd probably buy one or two more sets.


Why don't they still make them?

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

Al B Thayer said:


> Why don't they still make them?


Woodpecker have a series of "one time tools" where they send out emails to customers and make whatever quantity people pre-order. I think they are doing custom CNC design and need to pay for the setup.

If they get emails asking to make another production run, they may ask customers if any interest.

I expect they are trying to eliminate inventory of what may be expensive items to carry.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

Dave Paine said:


> Woodpecker have a series of "one time tools" where they send out emails to customers and make whatever quantity people pre-order. I think they are doing custom CNC design and need to pay for the setup.
> 
> If they get emails asking to make another production run, they may ask customers if any interest.
> 
> I expect they are trying to eliminate inventory of what may be expensive items to carry.


Thanks for the explanation. Guess I'm not on the Woodpecker list.
Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## sawdustfactory (Jan 30, 2011)

Al, I get the e-mails through Japan Woodworker and Woodcraft (same parent company these days).


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

sawdustfactory said:


> Al, I get the e-mails through Japan Woodworker and Woodcraft (same parent company these days).


I think I'll sign up. 

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

calwilliams63 said:


> I love how people are always so quick to bash tool companies for price and then try to compare apples to oranges. I own a similar doweling jig I bought from Woodcraft for like 40or 50 bucks and I think it's a piece of crap. If I didn't have to have one that day I would have gladly paid double to buy the Woodpeckers one which looks a lot nicer. If you can't afford a tool just say "it's out of my price range but looks nice". No need to be a prick about it.





calwilliams63 said:


> I am actually quite familiar with BCT. I took a design class with the owner of Bridge City Jon Economaki at MASW a few years back. What a brilliant guy! But, to say his tools "actually have no place in the woodworking world" is absurd! I mean you do know they make handplanes and squares right? Lol! I think that would be enough to justify as woodworking tools. They make super precise, high quality tools and charge a fair premium for what you get. I don't really see the problem?? I mean only cause I can't justify spending 900 bucks on a block plane doesn't mean it's not worth the money to someone else. You realize that there is absolutely no backlash in the blade adjustment and every turn is equivalent to I think it was 1/1000 of an inch. I wish some of my Lie-Nielsen planes were like that. But, you get what you pay for. Oh, and not to mention the body of that plane is cut from a solid piece of stainless steel? Well, you know that's not cheap to have that cnc'd out right? I had the pleasure of holding some of these beautifully machined tools and they are phenomenally made. So, excuse me if don't agree with your ignorant statement.
> Woodworkers in general are usually pretty anal about most things. But, god forbid a company like Bridge City Tool Works or Festool make a quality tool and charge a fair premium for it. Apparently both of these companies are doing something right since BCT has been in business since 1983 and Festool 1925. So, I think myself and most people could learn a little something from companies like these.


I'm going to assume I'm one of the people you're addressing, because I was one of the ones to say that Woodpeckers tools are overpriced.

I've used a doweling jig that a friend bought for around $25. Every hole was perfectly centered, the screws to adjust it moved smoothly and easily, and everything stayed as it was set with no problem. Cheap isn't a guarantee of bad quality any more than expensive is a guarantee of good quality.

If people want to spend that money, fine: they're going to get a good tool for it. But I look at tools by Woodpeckers and Festool and think "Yeah, it's nice, but is it really worth six or seven times as much as this less expensive one?" For the specific square I talked about, I don't think it is. The same goes for anything I've seen that was made by Festool. 

I'll also point out that there are a lot of companies that have stayed in business over the years by pricing their good high enough that they became a status symbol, whether or not they were actually any better than stuff made by the competition. So yes, I can learn something from them: Pricing things high and selling fewer of them is one way to stay in business. I can also learn from companies like Empire (founded 1919), who make good quality tools, and price them low enough that everyone can buy them. Neither route is inherently better, they're just different. But my personal bias goes towards buying inexpensive high quality tools over expensive high quality tools, because I believe the price difference is almost always far, far greater than the quality difference. 

It's not a question of out of my price range, either: I'd have to stretch my budget to buy from Starrett or Woodpeckers, but I could if I thought it was worth it. I don't. My $15 Empire combination square, treated well, will outlast me. It's not worth paying $100 or more to get one just a little bit better from someone else.

As to your comments on the BCT block plane: One of their bragging points is that a full turn of the adjustment wheel adjusts the blade 0.003", with no backlash. Everything is measured and machined to within a thousandth of an inch. My question is, what benefit do I get from that? I've watched Paul Sellers cut endgrain with a 100 year old Stanley #4, and wind up with a surface smooth enough that it reflected light. That has neither a mechanism with no backlash nor a knob that adjusts it in .003" increments; the mechanism has quite a bit of backlash, and the knob is considerably coarser. So what IS the value of that $900 plane over, say, a $200 plane from Veritas? Don't get me wrong, BCT makes a beautiful line of tools, but I don't think they're selling to woodworkers. I think they're selling to woodworkers who want bragging rights. That is, they've positioned themselves so that a high price is part of the benefit of their tools. If they can succeed doing that, more power to them, but their advertising doesn't convince me that their tools are any better, or worth the price premium.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

amckenzie

I can agree with you on your post except I don't think Woodpecker is at the level of overpricing like Fe$tool. Fe$tool is a plastic bodied tool just like other quality made tools. Fe$tools problem with cost lies with wages and taxes they have to pay. Also the way they are marketed and how the price can't be lowered buy any distributors. Timberland boots cost more in Germany than the United States and carries the same liability Fe$tool does. Yes I know Fe$tool owners, it's a good tool. So are my Timberland boots that cost half of what they cost in Germany.

Bridge City Tools on the other hand. Put a great deal more into their tools. The problem with that is it doesn't translate into a great deal more for the outcome of the woodworking. My try square guides my pencil across the wood the same as theirs does.

To me the Woodpecker tools are only slightly high and some are down right competitive.

Al

Nails only hold themselves.


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## jschaben (Apr 1, 2010)

Dave Paine said:


> I have the 8in saddle square, which is a square and rule. I do not use this often. Well made but does not get much use.
> 
> I have this saddle square from Lee Valley which does get a lot of use.
> http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=44836&cat=1,42936,50298,44836
> ...


Hi Dave - Thanks for the link. At about 1/3 the price of the Woodpecker and small enough to be useful in smaller places and on smaller stock it looked like a good value so I ordered one.:smile:


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