# crotch tables



## Rick C. (Dec 17, 2008)

After the storms last week,I cut a large red oak off a neighbors house.Another neighbor was also cutting and was making the 33" log into firewood.I stopped him,and there was still 12' left from the root wad.I cut acouple 6" cookies off for the owner,he wanted them,and got a log a little over 9' long.There was a large crotch with about 2' of log below that was about 30"x24" kind of figure eight shape with double heart.I cut two 6" cookies for table tops and want to use the actual crotch with the two limbs as a base.I've sealed the ends and was wondering if I should kiln dry it all?I've never done tables like this and want to do it right.:thumbsup::thumbsup:
Thanks,
Rick


----------



## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

You would tie your kiln up forever with 6" stuff and it would case harden that stuff anyway most likely. As hard as it is to cause defects in a solar or DH kiln like Daren's design, I think you might do it trying to dry wood that thick, because the outside would dry way much quicker than the wood below say, 2" and it would case harden. I stand to be corrected as I have never tried to dry wood that thick in a kiln, but this is my understanding of why it isn't done. 

Vacuum kilns are designed for this and they have their limits too, so radar frequency kilns pick up where the regular vacuum kilns leave off. 
On top of the case hardening, that crotch wood has to dry very, very slow. Don't just seal the end grain, seal all the figured/crotch/burl anything that will tend to move a lot seal it too long grain or not. 

I got your envelope but have not tried to match it up yet I will delegate that to Mrs. TT today mebee. :stuart:


----------



## Rick C. (Dec 17, 2008)

Thanks T.T.,
I've never even heard of vaccuum or radar frequency kilns.:blink:
How long would they take to air dry?6 years?
I don't want them checking if I can avoid it,should I remove the bark and sap wood and seal the whole thing? 
A neighbor tried to do this,he cut it knocked the bark off sanded and urethaned it.It looked really good then the top cracked to the center.His was elm but I don't think that would act much different than RO.
Even though this is my first attempt I don't want it to become fire wood.:no:
Thanks Again,
Rick


----------



## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

Most thick wood is going to crack. All you can do is minimize it, and work with it as an attribute once it's dry enough to work. You also don't necessarily have to wait until it's dry to put it in service. Build with forgiving joinery and be prepared to maybe have to resurface it once or twice over the coming years if it moves more than you want. Let it dry a couple years or at least a year and that'll give you an idea of what it's gonna do. 

Yes remove the bark. Never heard of using urethane as a sealer for green logs so can't say it is a good idea. But any thick figured wood is going to crack almost certainly. That's not necessarily a bad thing. At some point the severity reaches a point where you say "I don't want to try to make this work" but that's the chance you take. To minimize it, use these basic gudelines:



 Don't use slabs/flitches with pith
If the best looking figure is going to be the one with pith in it (not uncommon) make sure the pith is centered perfectly on both ends (not always possible) but it will still likely move a lot
Seal the whole thing unless it is perfectly straight grained pieces (then why the heck would you want them anyway haha) with wax sealer
sticker, add weight, and cover the pieces allowing them to have good airflow and never exposed to sun and rain
Sprinkle them with Holy Water and commit them to God for several years :icon_cheesygrin:
I don't consider myself an "expert" by any means at drying thick flitches/slabs but I have at least two dozen out there as old as 5 years old now and most of them have not wrecked beyond usability, so just sharing my own personal experience with it. I'm sure there is much more worth knowing about the topic than what I have dabbled in.


----------



## Rick C. (Dec 17, 2008)

Hey T.T.,
Thanks But these aren't slabs but cookies cut from the end of the log.I cut them somewhat convex hoping that would cut down on movement.(don't know that it would).
The guy I know that did this sanded and finished them while green and they cracked.So far I wouldn't say too much but it's early.
You're right about the holy water,I know just where it is:yes:.
By the way,how hard is case hardened wood?Is that always a bad thing?I was hoping to use this by july:huh:.
Thanks,
Rick


----------



## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

Coooookie-san. Ahhhh soooooo.

Same thing. :laughing:


I think they will crack like the dickens but honestly I do not know. Try it. Maybe it will work.. :detective:

If it works I'll edit my posts to reflect my inerrant confidence that it will certainly work. :icon_cheesygrin:


----------

