# Wood and finishes for a Timber Camper Van



## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Hi all, I want to make a timber camper to go on the back of my 6 ton dual cab Mazda truck. I preliminary sketch of what I have in mind is below. First is to consider feasibility of timber then look at joints and layout and finish. 

My idea was western red cedar maybe 6 x 2's with a rebate to take cedar lining boards inside and out with polystyrene panel in-between. I was thinking of an oil finish. I know cedar is soft, but it is light and durable. 

I want to sleep my wife and at least 3 children in the camper plus the usual. I will probably have toilet and shower in an enclosed car trailer behind. Any advice on solar power etc would be appreciated also. 

I would like to have multiple USB charging points for iPads etc. the truck is 24V but I am open to a separate battery system. 









The entire build would be around 21 foot or 6.2 M

I throw it open for suggestions, criticisms & observations etc.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

I should add, I was thinking of sheet metal / aluminum roof but hope to do the curved front from timber. There is a possibility I may have the front pivot with some flip up wall on the side and a flip up window over looking the rear roof. This would give more headroom when we sit up in bed.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## rayking49 (Nov 6, 2011)

That'll be cool man. I look forward to seeing it. Cedar is light, should be pretty neat.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

The idea sounds interesting and should draw looks from bystanders.

However, timber construction is not light weight. Light weight is the goal of all RV manufacturers. Unless of course you are into the million dollar category.

George


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

GeorgeC said:


> The idea sounds interesting and should draw looks from bystanders.
> 
> However, timber construction is not light weight. Light weight is the goal of all RV manufacturers. Unless of course you are into the million dollar category.
> 
> George


I know it's a compromise on the weight factor. I figured western red cedar might be one of the lighter timbers and somewhat affordable. I don't know if balsa wood would be an option, or available sizes and cost. 

I like the idea of a head turner to advertise what I do - work with wood

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

A wooodie camper. Sounds very interesting.

I remember the Morris Minor staion wagons with the wooden panels and body frame. I even got to help re-finish part of one back in 1974.

I do not have immediate ideas, but have you seen the Splinter all wood sports car? A concept car by Joe Harmon.

If you have not see this, I think the site will be worth a look to get some ideas. Lots of lamination in this beauty.

http://www.joeharmondesign.com/

The panels could be wood veneer glued onto aluminium or fibreglass panels. Light and strong.


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## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

I agree, this sounds interesting. I hope you can pull this off Dave. If using wood, I probably would use cedar, but who am I to say.


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Dave Paine said:


> A wooodie camper. Sounds very interesting.
> 
> I remember the Morris Minor staion wagons with the wooden panels and body frame. I even got to help re-finish part of one back in 1974.
> 
> ...


They look great. Don't think mine will quite be as elaborate as that. Thanks for the link, I'm sure there will be ideas I can use there.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Dominick said:


> I agree, this sounds interesting. I hope you can pull this off Dave. If using wood, I probably would use cedar, but who am I to say.


I think I will use cedar unless someone comes up with something else. From what i could find since a started research, cedar seems to be one of the lightest timbers out there. Some balsa wood comes in at 1/2 the weight but I'm not sure of the available sizes or if it would suit the intended use. 

If I were to use balsa I would like to use it for the main frame and then cedar for the panels. I imagine the contrast would look good. Can anyone tell me of balsa would be a viable proposition.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

DaveTTC said:


> If I were to use balsa I would like to use it for the main frame and then cedar for the panels. I imagine the contrast would look good. Can anyone tell me of balsa would be a viable proposition.


I do not know about the strength of balsa, but you have me interested.

I have a few pieces of 3/4 x 3 stock I purchased decades ago. At this point I do not recall the original project, but it never happened.

I will do some empirical tests for our collective knowledge. Stay tuned. :smile:


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Dave Paine said:


> I do not know about the strength of balsa, but you have me interested.
> 
> I have a few pieces of 3/4 x 3 stock I purchased decades ago. At this point I do not recall the original project, but it never happened.
> 
> I will do some empirical tests for our collective knowledge. Stay tuned. :smile:


Sounds good. If I were to use it I would hope to get it in 6 x 2 and in 12 foot lengths. I would need to know if it reacts to climate changes at a similar rate to western red cedar as I would like to have tongue and groove lining boards to make up the panels and balsa for the frame.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

I think regardless of what wood you use you can expect problems with shrinkage and warpage. In your plans I would try to make each part of it in sections that are removable in case one of them goes bad and needs to be replaced. I think from time to time you will need to repair or replace a section. A marine grade spar varnish would be a good finish however regardless of what finish you use finish the back side as well.


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Steve Neul said:


> I think regardless of what wood you use you can expect problems with shrinkage and warpage. In your plans I would try to make each part of it in sections that are removable in case one of them goes bad and needs to be replaced. I think from time to time you will need to repair or replace a section. A marine grade spar varnish would be a good finish however regardless of what finish you use finish the back side as well.


I will look into the finish. Thanks. Panels will be easy enough to replace if need be, hopefully it won't come to that. I have lived in a number of weatherboard homes and am hoping it will be reasonable stable however I will probably travel from the remotest 'outback' to the Alpines and the coast

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## rayking49 (Nov 6, 2011)

Man I'm excited about this. I can't wait to see what you come up with.


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

rayking49 said:


> Man I'm excited about this. I can't wait to see what you come up with.


Hope to have some more sketches in the next few weeks and if all goes well will start the build around New Years.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## realistic (Sep 22, 2012)

sweeet !! good luck with your project


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## jharris2 (Jul 9, 2012)

Fantastic project idea. Subscribed!

Build thread! Build thread! Build thread!

Jeff


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

jharris2 said:


> Fantastic project idea. Subscribed!
> 
> Build thread! Build thread! Build thread!
> 
> Jeff


All goes well I'll have pictures of the truck with a rendition of the idea by the weekend.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## J Thomas (Aug 14, 2012)

Cool idea Dave but here's something to keep in mind.. The wood is bound to expand / contract with temp / humidity changes. Couple this with the fact that there's going to be stress from the vehicle motion in cornering, bumps, hard stops etc.. This is bound to rack the whole assembly to some degree.
I can't see how you're going to keep this waterproofed or leak proofed. 
If you're driving 40 mph onto a 30 mph headwind with a downpour... well you've got hurricane force driven rain!
I don't want to talk ya out of it & I am looking fwd to seeing the build, but I did feel this needed consideration..
..Jon..


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

J Thomas said:


> Cool idea Dave but here's something to keep in mind.. The wood is bound to expand / contract with temp / humidity changes. Couple this with the fact that there's going to be stress from the vehicle motion in cornering, bumps, hard stops etc.. This is bound to rack the whole assembly to some degree.
> I can't see how you're going to keep this waterproofed or leak proofed.
> If you're driving 40 mph onto a 30 mph headwind with a downpour... well you've got hurricane force driven rain!
> I don't want to talk ya out of it & I am looking fwd to seeing the build, but I did feel this needed consideration..
> ..Jon..


I'm hoping to be able travel at 65 mph on the highway, so that compounds these issues even further. I have thought about these things and have mentally prepared for it. Racking is probably the biggest issue in my mind. 

As I come up with more detailed plans I am hoping you and others may come up with observations and anything I may have overlooked before the build. The plan is for this to be a one off build so I need to get it right the first time.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

As far as keeping it watertight while driving, I think I would make the wood that shows seperate from the camper. What I'm trying to explain is built the camper with mounting brackets for the woodwork and make the camper watertight with sheetmetal or fiberglass. Then attach the woodwork with finish bolts. That way the woodwork can shrink, water can get behind it and you can replace panels if needed and all the while the camper will stay dry.


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Steve Neul said:


> As far as keeping it watertight while driving, I think I would make the wood that shows seperate from the camper. What I'm trying to explain is built the camper with mounting brackets for the woodwork and make the camper watertight with sheetmetal or fiberglass. Then attach the woodwork with finish bolts. That way the woodwork can shrink, water can get behind it and you can replace panels if needed and all the while the camper will stay dry.


Thanks Steve, I'll draw som details soon and let me know what you think. I'm hoping for virtually all timber construction except the roof however your option is a realistic alternative if what I draw has too many flaws

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## realistic (Sep 22, 2012)

*framework for camper*

steve nuel, made some "really good" points about framework,panels,etc. definitely something to take into consideration:thumbsup:"steve" great input !!


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

*First tests with balsa*

I found my 3 pieces of balsa, each 1in x 3in x 36in. I must have purchased these around 20 years ago. Still had the manufacturers label "Premium sanded" whatever that was supposed to mean.

I have read the various properties of balsa, being lighter and pound for pound as strong as certain other woods. The challenge is Dave needs to use less weight.

For the first test I thought I would see how well hanger bolts could be installed.

I did the first test without pictures so this is the second attempt.
The hanger bolt is half lag thread and half machine thread. I made a hole with an awl, no surprise a larger hole than normal.
I tightened two machine screws to allow me to insert the hanger bolt. You can just make out the hole from the awl. The hole on the right was my first attempt. 









I then screwed on a knob with the 1/4in thread. I tried to tighten the knob.









After a few turns I could feel the hanger bolt starting to slip, so I removed the knob. The tearout is beginning to show on the left. A lot more on my first attempt on the right.









I then decided to see how rigid the bolt would be. I tried pushing with my thumb. To my surprise the bolt moved. I could easily have pulled this out.









Dave, not a good result. I am not sure how you could use balsa by itself to attach the kinds of loads you will have in the camper.

*What next tests would you like to see?*

I am not likely to use my 3 pieces, so I am happy to do whatever real world tests which will help understand how you could use balsa in the camper project.

I can do a through hole with nut and washer on one side and the knob on the other. I may not observe a load pulling the nut/washer or knob through the wood but I do expect to crush the wood on one or both sides.


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## DaveTTC (May 25, 2012)

Dave you are a legendary gentleman or as the younger generation might say an awesome dude. I am on the job ATM but a little later I will come back to this with a couple of sketches and see what we come up with. 

As you say - it does not look good at this preliminary stage.

Dave The Turning Cowboy


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

DaveTTC said:


> Dave you are a legendary gentleman or as the younger generation might say an awesome dude. I am on the job ATM but a little later I will come back to this with a couple of sketches and see what we come up with.
> 
> As you say - it does not look good at this preliminary stage.
> 
> Dave The Turning Cowboy


You are welcome. I feel the forum(s) are intended for wood workers to help each other. Sometimes with advice, sometimes more.

You have helped to trigger my gray matter. Tonight I remembered why I purchased the balsa.

Back in 1982 I purchased a 16ft daysailer, what the UK would call a dinghy. I am not sure of the term in Australia.

I read various sailing magazines back then, and one article was about a streamlined centre board. I purchased the balsa with the desire to glue the pieces together, make a streamlined shape and then cover with fibreglass to make a much improved centre board. I now recall drawing out the outline on graph paper and plotting the curve of the thickness change over the length.

No surprise that I did not get around to the project.

I still have the day sailer parked on the property. I have not used it for several years. The boat has held up better than the trailer.


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