# Making Birds Mouth Shelf Standards



## EWerner (Oct 14, 2010)

I saw in an old woodworking book a design for a birds mouth, or saw tooth, shelf standards and have always wanted to build some. Now that I am constructing a built in system it is a good time to incorporate it into the design.

Starting to create the birds mouths.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

received some old bookshelves from a car dealer that had those. i think the spacing was about 1 1/2" per flat. never knew what they were called. son still has 'em.


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## EWerner (Oct 14, 2010)

Second cuts to make the birds mouth.


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## rayking49 (Nov 6, 2011)

I've seen them, but never made them.


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## phinds (Mar 25, 2009)

I'm aware of bird's mouth joints in roofing, where it makes good sense, but I don't get the advantage of them in shelving where you could more easily just dado out a rectangular slot to accept the shelving. Is it just that you like the look?


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

its just a clever idea for shelf adjustability that can be made all from wood, probably before pin use and stronger than most. there is a cleat with angled ends that spans between the birds mouths, then the shelf rests on top of the cleats.


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## phinds (Mar 25, 2009)

TimPa said:


> its just a clever idea for shelf adjustability that can be made all from wood, probably before pin use and stronger than most. there is a cleat with angled ends that spans between the birds mouths, then the shelf rests on top of the cleats.


But there's no adjustability, so I still don't get the point. That is, it appears that the OP just slotted solid wood, not created adjustable sections.


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## <*(((>< (Feb 24, 2010)

They are adjustable. You make cleats that are loose and have the birdsmouth angle cut on the ends. You the move the cleats up and down on both sides and place the loose shelf on top of the cleats at whatever height you want. The shelf bears it's weight on the cleats and the cleats are supported by the birdsmouth.

Haven't though of using my RAS for this, that looks like a perfect application for it. Thanks for sharing, be sure and post the finished result.


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## Woodenhorse (May 24, 2011)

These were commonly used in cabinets of frame and panel construction before pins came into common use. You could not cut dadoes in a floating panel very easily but these could be made and easily inserted even after the cabinet was completed.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

phinds said:


> But there's no adjustability, so I still don't get the point. That is, it appears that the OP just slotted solid wood, not created adjustable sections.


Hi Phinds. what you see in the op pic is 1 of 4 pieces that will be placed vertically in each corner of the cabinet, with birds mouths facing toward each other on the side of the cabinet. a cleat wiith the same engle cut on it's ends, will span horizontally across and engage in the brids mouth of the vertical members.


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## phinds (Mar 25, 2009)

TimPa said:


> Hi Phinds. what you see in the op pic is 1 of 4 pieces that will be placed vertically in each corner of the cabinet, with birds mouths facing toward each other on the side of the cabinet. a cleat wiith the same engle cut on it's ends, will span horizontally across and engage in the brids mouth of the vertical members.


OK, but I'm still not getting the adjustability. Is it no true that the OP just cut slots in a solid piece? I don't see any mechanism to allow the cleats to slide up/down which would be necessary for adjustability.

What am I missing?


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## <*(((>< (Feb 24, 2010)

Birdsmouth Shelf Standards


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## phinds (Mar 25, 2009)

<*(((>< said:


> Birdsmouth Shelf Standards


AH ... thanks. NOW I get it. They are NOT adjustable, they just provide different places to put the shelves. That is, I kept thinking that everyone was saying that the cleats would slide up and down. The link you provided makes it clear that's not what's intended. I was fooled by the large distance between the openings in the OP's post but the frequent openings in the link makes it clear.


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## EWerner (Oct 14, 2010)

I am just having some fun while making a set if routine cabinets plus it will create conversation when people see it. Plus I don't like shelf pins much as the holes can elongate over time creating a sloppy self rest. So in the end just creating a challenge for myself.


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## Chris Curl (Jan 1, 2013)

Those are a neat way to solve that age old solution.

I also don't like the pins for the same reasons stated.


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## big blue (Jun 14, 2013)

*Birds mouth shelf supports*

Hi guys this is my first time on this forum. I know all about this system. My company is called Sawtooth Shelf System and I sell it through Lee Valley, Woodcraft, Woodworkers, Vandykes and on my site sawtoothshelfsystem.com check it out and let me know what you think. I would really like to hear back from you guys. Thanks


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## DannyT (Apr 26, 2011)

I doubt if people on a woodworking site would buy something they could get the satisfaction from making themselves.


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## big blue (Jun 14, 2013)

*birds mouth shelf supports*

I was not trying to make a sale. I have been a woodworker owning a shop for 37 years and know all about this shelf system so if any woodworkers want info I can help.


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## jharris2 (Jul 9, 2012)

We all know that this method is nothing new.

Having said that Big Blue has introduced some pretty slick innovations.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

phinds said:


> AH ... thanks. NOW I get it. They are NOT adjustable, they just provide different places to put the shelves. That is, I kept thinking that everyone was saying that the cleats would slide up and down. The link you provided makes it clear that's not what's intended. I was fooled by the large distance between the openings in the OP's post but the frequent openings in the link makes it clear.


???? that looks adjustable to me....


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## Chris Curl (Jan 1, 2013)

jharris2 said:


> We all know that this method is nothing new.
> 
> Having said that Big Blue has introduced some pretty slick innovations.


yes, some of the innovations are pretty slick! i especially like the drawer guides that fit in the teeth.


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