# Are You Tube videos "safe"?



## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

As someone who has posted many You Tube videos here, there was a comment nade in a different forum as to the content of You Tube videos being vetted for safety concerns. Yes, I watch them before posting for various concerns, audio quality, simplicity, good practices, etc. Some of them actually demonstrate "unsafe" practices and ways to avoid injury form kickbacks. Are those "safe" ?
What is safety in the woodshop? Never getting injured? Never having a kickback? What may be safe to one woodworker would not be safe to another, so trying to define it is pointless. This forum has a disclaimer regarding safety and potential injury and it's quite clear who's responsible, you are, not the forum or it's members.

I once posted a video of an experienced guy ripping rough edge planks "freehand" with using the fence, because the fence would have cause a kickback as the board changed dimension passing along it. It was removed because it deemed unsafe. Here's what did not get disclosed. The saw had a splitter in place, which can act as a "fence" once the kerf is made and will prevent the board from twisting and will prevent a kickback. But according to all the experts, ripping "freehand" is unsafe, so it must not be shown, allowed or demonstrated. There are times when it's the only choice, so it's better to understand how to do it. Safety in the shop is "relative" depending on the situation and the experience of the operator, I have knowingly done operations I considered "risky" but I made every effort to make them as safe as possible, after all it's my fingers that at are risk.

Is the internet "safe" no. Is You Tube "safe", no, not always, but it is very informative. Are there idiots posting woodworking videos on You Tube, yes. Do I cringe when seeing them doing things I'd never do, certainly. Do I comment regarding those instances, yes. Sometimes, they are thankful, other times I get ignored or dismissed. I will still comment regardless. The same applies here. If you see what you consider an unsafe practice, make a comment explaining the "how and the why" and see if you get a positive response?


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

Is climb cutting safe? We are advised to avoid climb cutting when using the router with exceptions for grain direction and whether we are "inside or on the perimeter" of a frame. Ah yes, those exceptions. Charles Neil posted a You Tube using a method he called "bump cutting" which is a way to climb cut safely, one of my favorites:





What about ripping on the radial arm saw, is it safe?
As someone who has done it many times, yes, it can be. I posted a thread here using a radial arm saw to straight line rip 14 ft long boards for a large barn door. The table and fence on the saw was 28 ft long! But I still got all sorts of warnings from the "safety police" here, one member even put 911 on speed dial, in case I got injured!
Here's the thread with all the fearful comments:








"Evil Machine"


I'm building a pair of barn doors for a friend, barter system. It's a 100 year old barn that was 100 years old before it was moved to it's current location. So it is time for some new doors. The old ones look like Southern yellow pine, west side exposure sun and rain and snow here in Michigan...




www.woodworkingtalk.com




The thread included the often made comments about the radial saw carriage being able to climb up on top of the workpiece. I've never had that happen, but my saws are well maintained and adjusted for zero play in the carriage bearings. Then there the debate as to pulling the saw from behind the fence or pushing the saw into the work from the front is safer. The owner's manuals advise "pulling" is the best method. I watched a You Tube where the guy pushed the saw about 15 times with no lifting of the workpiece what so ever, and it wasn't even totally level on the table:






One time I accidentally made a climb cut on the router table which made a unguided missle out of the workpiece, Fortunately, I had feather boards in place which kept my fingers away from the cutters. Often the holddowns can become "unintended" safety devices of a sort. Keeping the workpiece secure is vital to safety and accuracy on any machine with high speed rotating cutters. There are few spindle shaper operators who do not use a stock feeder because of the dangers involved. A router is a miniature shaper, so the same precautions apply.


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## m.n.j.chell (May 12, 2016)

.


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

I for one have no control over what is posted on Youtube or what is being said on social media. I do have control over what I publish and have been doing that for over twenty years. I would never want to feel that I was in any way responsible for harm or grief caused by bad information. I am not alone, I know many of us feel the same way, but the code that we had when this thing began is slowly eroding into a free for all feeding egos and post counts.


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

I'm sorry, but I cannot let this stand


woodnthings said:


> But according to all the experts, ripping "freehand" is unsafe, so it must not be shown, allowed or demonstrated. There are times when it's the only choice, so it's better to understand how to do it.


There is no scenario where freehand ripping is the only choice. Bandsaws and circular saws are both excellent options.

I am a deep cave diver that has been below 200' deep, in cold dark caves, underwater for over 3 hours, dove in 36 degree water, dove with 6 different tanks carrying 4 different gas mixtures, and done long penetrations into deep wrecks. It is inherently risky. When a practice is deemed unsafe by the diving community, it's because people have died doing it. There are always cowboys that try to approach standards with nonchalance, and they are universally sloppy in their diving habits. I do not dive with those people, and I know at least four former dive buddys who died or lost someone underwater.

Obviously woodworking is a lot more forgiving, but doing things safely should be on everyone's mind, and there's no room for the cowboy or special snowflake mentality. When there is a near universal recommendation against a practice for safety reasons, let's all pay close attention to those recommendations.


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

Also, I really respect @woodnthings and there are a lot of points he made that I do agree with. I don't mind seeing all the practices and sorting them out myself. I feel much different about my kids searching woodworking videos and seeing some of the crap that passes in other countries.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

BigCountry79 said:


> I'm sorry, but I cannot let this stand
> 
> 
> *There is no scenario where freehand ripping is the only choice. Bandsaws and circular saws are both excellent options.*
> ...


There are times when those options are not available. If you have never ripped or cut a plywood panel freehand then you may not understand how easy it is to slowly feed it and let the blade makes it way through. You must not twist it much or it will bind the blade, it may not kickback, just stall the motor. 
You can do as you wish of course. I'll wager that those who are so vehemently opposed to it have never had to do it?


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

FrankC said:


> I for one have no control over what is posted on Youtube or what is being said on social media. I do have control over what I publish and have been doing that for over twenty years. I would never want to feel that I was in any way responsible for harm or grief caused by bad information. I am not alone, I know many of us feel the same way, but the code that we had when this thing began is slowly eroding into a free for all feeding egos and post counts.


Do as you wish, but if your reference to egos and posts counts is directed at me, Bull Feathers. I have more "likes" and "friends" than anyone on this forum. I don't need any additional post counts. Safety is relative, if you aren't comfortable doing an operation. stop and rethink it. It's a basic rule in many trades.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

In my post above on the "evil machine" where I straight line ripped 2240 feet of Cypress on the radial arm saw, the work had a tendency to lift off the table since the blade is above it. Feeding direction must be against the rotation or it will "climb cut" and propel out the end. This is the mistake beginners often make and feed the work in from the wrong end and a kickback is the result.
Since the blade enter from under the work, it must be securely held down, with the left hand while the right hand pulls the saw across. The radial arm saws are designed for "right handed operation". and should not ever be used "cross handed". A little "stiff arm" is always advised when pulling the saw across, allowing it to feed at the rate it cuts best. It should not be "force fed".
Not nearly enough instruction was provided in the manuals I have, and far too little explanation of the physics involved, the "WHY's"


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## John Smith_inFL (Jul 4, 2018)

Just a short reminder


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

Disclaimers are nothing more than a warning, not permission to put someone in danger:

In many cases when it comes to personal injury compensation, a disclaimer will not be worth the paper it is written on if the organiser of the event or activity has failed to ensure that they have adequately prepared for the risk of injury, or failed to provide the correct equipment, guidance or training needed to minimise the risk of injury.


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## Rick Christopherson (Jun 27, 2016)

The problem is that people no longer take responsibility for their own choices or actions. They need to blame someone else...always. In bygone years, our mothers would admonish, "If your friends jumped off a bridge, would you?". Today the philosophy is, "His friends are to blame, because they jumped off the bridge first."


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## Rick Christopherson (Jun 27, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> Is climb cutting safe? We are advised to avoid climb cutting when using the router with exceptions for grain direction and whether we are "inside or on the perimeter" of a frame. Ah yes, those exceptions.


My philosophy is you don't sweep a topic under the rug to protect the few, but instead, educate the many. It was extremely bold, as it had never been done before, but I got climb-cutting information into all of my Festool Router Manuals, including passing legal review for liability. There was a team of liability lawyers, and we were on conference calls for hours at a time going line-by-line through my manuals before Festool would officially put their name on the covers.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

Rick Christopherson said:


> The problem is that* people no longer take responsibility for their own choices or actions.* They need to blame someone else...always. In bygone years, our mothers would admonish, "If your friends jumped off a bridge, would you?". Today the philosophy is, "His friends are to blame, because they jumped off the bridge first."


As an electrical engineer, you deal with "fatal possibilities" rather than "potential extremity amputations" as in woodworking. No one ever died from having a finger cut off as far as I know. Electricity is orders of magnitude more dangerous. This is why is best to avoid "DIYers electrical advice" on woodworking forums. While we may have basic information regarding motor HP and possiblyy dual wiring motors, even as in my own case having wired two shops and a garage, I wouldn't advise anyone on how to do it.

As to disclaimers, todays trail lawyers will sue anyone for any reason and may possibly win!.
I vaguely remember there was one Ryobi lawsuit where an inexperienced and untrained operator was awarded millions of dollars by a "jury of his peers" who couldn't understand, the table saw was not at fault, it also did not have "flesh sensing technology" had a "faulty blade guard" , but it was "operator error" from the git go. Then there's OJ.
Woodworking is dangerous. do so at your on risk.








$2 Million Awarded in Ryobi Table Saw Injury Lawsuit


A man who accidentally cut off his finger while using a table saw has agreed to a $2 million settlement with Ryobi Technologies, Inc.




dailyhornet.com


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

There was pushback against pressure gages in scuba diving when they became available because "you ought to know how much air you have".

People fight better ways and self-rationalize their reasons in their heads. "I learned the hard way and so should others" is a backwards mindset.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

woodnthings said:


> As someone who has posted many You Tube videos here, there was a comment nade in a different forum as to the content of You Tube videos being vetted for safety concerns. Yes, I watch them before posting for various concerns, audio quality, simplicity, good practices, etc. Some of them actually demonstrate "unsafe" practices and ways to avoid injury form kickbacks. Are those "safe" ?
> What is safety in the woodshop? Never getting injured? Never having a kickback? What may be safe to one woodworker would not be safe to another, so trying to define it is pointless. This forum has a disclaimer regarding safety and potential injury and it's quite clear who's responsible, you are, not the forum or it's members.
> 
> I once posted a video of an experienced guy ripping rough edge planks "freehand" with using the fence, because the fence would have cause a kickback as the board changed dimension passing along it. It was removed because it deemed unsafe. Here's what did not get disclosed. The saw had a splitter in place, which can act as a "fence" once the kerf is made and will prevent the board from twisting and will prevent a kickback. But according to all the experts, ripping "freehand" is unsafe, so it must not be shown, allowed or demonstrated. There are times when it's the only choice, so it's better to understand how to do it. Safety in the shop is "relative" depending on the situation and the experience of the operator, I have knowingly done operations I considered "risky" but I made every effort to make them as safe as possible, after all it's my fingers that at are risk.
> ...


If you only watch videos and never acquired tools you would be pretty safe. Some people would find a way to hurt themselves anyway.


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## asevereid (Apr 15, 2012)

Steve Neul said:


> If you only watch videos and never acquired tools you would be pretty safe. Some people would find a way to hurt themselves anyway.


I use a hammer quite often, and have for years. 
The hammer is for the most part, a blunt instrument... Yet I still occasionally hurt myself with it. 😅


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## Kerrys (May 2, 2016)

asevereid said:


> I use a hammer quite often, and have for years.
> The hammer is for the most part, a blunt instrument... Yet I still occasionally hurt myself with it. 😅


Short of compression fracturing a couple vertebrae i delivered the worse injury to myself while woodworking with a hammer. If framing is considered woodworking.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

asevereid said:


> I use a hammer quite often, and have for years.
> The hammer is for the most part, a blunt instrument... Yet I still occasionally hurt myself with it. 😅


Great example, and it's a hand tool!
My most painful injuries occurred with the relatively benign drill press.
Once the vise got swept off the the table and landed on my big toe, man that hurt.
Another time while drilling a 1" round stainless section secured in a vise, as the drill broke through it caught, lifted out of the vise and spun around full circle and whacked my left thumb knuckle so hard I thought I had broken it. That hurt bad for a week.
Any number of times the hammer was mis-aimed and struck my thumb. The waffle patterns leave prominent marks on flesh.
Always "seat" the nail before applying full force.
Screw drivers can slip out of slotted screws and gouge your fingers.
Ever get your hand caught between the box wrench and the frame of a truck while using an impact on the nit on the other side?
Ever get sliced open on a freshly shear pice of sheet metal?
The more work and the different types, the more you expose yourself to these types of accidents.
Remember when cars were involved in "accidents"? Now they call them "crashes" so no one is responsible.


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

asevereid said:


> I use a hammer quite often, and have for years.
> The hammer is for the most part, a blunt instrument... Yet I still occasionally hurt myself with it. 😅


Whenever I'm blunt with my wife, it usually hurts the worst...


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## B Coll (Nov 2, 2019)

FrankC said:


> Disclaimers are nothing more than a warning, not permission to put someone in danger:
> 
> In many cases when it comes to personal injury compensation, a disclaimer will not be worth the paper it is written on if the organiser of the event or activity has failed to ensure that they have adequately prepared for the risk of injury, or failed to provide the correct equipment, guidance or training needed to minimise the risk of injury.


Funny thing, 66 years on this planet and there are a lot of things on Youtube and other sites I have chosen not to do. I have not eaten a Tidepod, I have not bumper surfed behind a vehicle or bailed out of the drivers seat and held onto the door and surf. I did not take the "Coronavirus Challenge" and lick the grab bar on a subway car. I did not partake in the "Ice and Salt" burn your skin challenge or the smash gallons of milk in the supermarket craze. Perhaps I was blessed with common sense and have no responsibility towards those who are not so gifted.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

asevereid said:


> I use a hammer quite often, and have for years.
> The hammer is for the most part, a blunt instrument... Yet I still occasionally hurt myself with it. 😅


I knew a guy that nearly cut a finger off with a common hack saw. This was a few months after he did cut a finger off on a table saw. I hope he found a different kind of work.


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## DrRobert (Apr 27, 2015)

My opinion, whether you asked for it or not 😁 — Woodworking like lots if others, is dangerous hobby/profession. Not everyone should be a woodworker. Simply put, there are people who don’t have enough common sense to operate machinery. Then there are newbies & people who are living charmed lives. I was there once and almost lost a thumb. I encourage every newbie to buy a SawStop.

That said, some of the stuff I see on YouTube just makes me cringe. John Heisz is one of the worst. I posted a comment once about him ripping a 1” wide board with no push stick and his response was basically I was an ignorant ass.

IMO every content creator has a moral responsibility to their audience and their conscience. In many instances newbies have no frame of reference to know what is safe. I watched Jason @ Bourbon Moth almost get a finger in a router bit. I credit him for seizing the “teachable moment”, gave a lecture about his stupidity, and demonstrated a safer way. I respect him for that he probably saved someone from an injury. This is a person who shows he has a responsibility to his audience.

My point (in case you missed it 😳) is reputable people will take the time to intersperse safety information in their videos, not just fill us with awe at their skill. At the very minimum they should post a disclaimer.

Not everyone should be teaching ww’ing! But I still believe YouTube should be unregulated and uncensored!


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

DrRobert said:


> My opinion, whether you asked for it or not 😁 — *Woodworking like lots if others, is dangerous hobby/profession. * Not everyone should be a woodworker. Simply put, there are people who don’t have enough common sense to operate machinery. Then there are newbies & people who are living charmed lives. I was there once and almost lost a thumb. I encourage every newbie to buy a SawStop.
> 
> That said, some of the stuff I see on YouTube just makes me cringe. John Heisz is one of the worst. I posted a comment once about him ripping a 1” wide board with no push stick and his response was basically I was an ignorant ass.
> 
> ...


I have had the same "cringe" experiences. OH MAN, that's about to go SOUTH, kinda feeling!
You Tube is an "equal opportunity vessel" for those both skilled and unskilled to show what they know, or NOT.
We here, have the same potential and not everyone here has had formal training, street training, or years of experience.
We do our best to provide accurate information and in some cases, instruction.
In spite of that there's an entire forum Titled "Lets see Some Damage" where we see first hand the results of carelessness, or lack of safety gear, or just plain "dumb" moves by folks willing to admit their mistakes. There are 27 pages of posts dating back to 2006!
Is that "proof" that not everyone should be a woodworker? No, we are all capable of making mistakes.

Not enough emphasis has been placed on understanding how high speed rotating cutters behave, how they affect the workpiece, how the workpiece must be prepared for use on the table saw or router table, OR how the wood itself may move or react to being cut open, etc. There's a lot of simple and dynamic physics involved.
I will continue to emphasize that when making posts here, since I think it's a vital part of Shop Safety.

The question of whether we are liable for posting instructions, information in the form of links to other sources or You Tube videos is clear to me. No, we are simply the "messenger" not the source of the information, a conduit. And in the case of videos, any unsafe practices should be pointed out. Those videos that demonstrate unsafe practices fall into their own category. Then there's the question of "what is unsafe" ? Does the end of the video show an amputation? Or does the creator come away unscathed in spite of what we would describe as "bad or unsafe practices"?

The debate will probably continue .......


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

This is how we explain it in my industry...

Unsafe means that a small or unintentional deviation can result in injury or property damage. You can get away with many unsafe practices for a long time before you realize their consequences, and you cannot accurately quantify the accidents that did not happen due to safety practices (especially at a small scale).


Our preferred solution is to avoid unsafe practice / risk (Ie, rip warped boards on a bandsaw)
You can mitigate the probability by adopting procedures or training that reduces the likelihood of a negative event. (Ie, you suggested adding a splitter reduces likelihood. You also believe your skill reduces the probability of kickback)
You can also reduce the consequences of an accident through safeguards that minimize damage if an accident does happen. (Ie, wear safety glasses and stand to one side)

This is how we frame our security risks in my industry. It applies well to shop safety as well even if it's worded differently.


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

It all comes down to the fact you can be part of the problem or part of the solution, if you are putting yourself out there as a mentor show some responsibility.

If something is so stupid as to suggest drinking bleach most of us know we are listening to an idiot, it is the not so obvious that a newbie may not be aware of that one claiming to be a mentor should not be promoting.


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## Tree Hugger (Sep 1, 2011)

I've caught quite a few youtubes on the computer that are cringe worthy but safe.

You tube videos on the living room TV I've found is not so safe.

Wife told me No More You Tubes on the TV set ! You know ..with that tone of voice that makes you cringe a little.

Apparently it gets on her nerves .


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## LilMtnDave (12 mo ago)

FrankC said:


> It all comes down to the fact you can be part of the problem or part of the solution, if you are putting yourself out there as a mentor show some responsibility.
> 
> If something is so stupid as to suggest drinking bleach most of us know we are listening to an idiot, it is the not so obvious that a newbie may not be aware of that one claiming to be a mentor should not be promoting.


For someone who seems to pull the "no politics" card more than most you certainly pull from that world quite often. Oh and...only ignorance could have someone believing that was ever suggested.


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

The sentence began with "if" and an example of something very ridiculous, nothing political unless one wishes to make it so, by the way "disinfectant" was not specifically mentioned.


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## LilMtnDave (12 mo ago)

FrankC said:


> The sentence began with "if" and an example of something very ridiculous, nothing political unless one wishes to make it so, by the way "disinfectant" was not specifically mentioned.


The "If" did not disguise the source you were pulling from any more than my "someone" disguised my destination.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

FrankC said:


> It all comes down to the fact you can be part of the problem or part of the solution, *if you are putting yourself out there as a mentor* show some responsibility.


Having mentored quite a few youngsters in my 30 years at GM Design Studios, it was always face to face and over a period of weeks or months. They were assigned to me by management because they showed promise but needed direction. I don't know how you can "put yourself out there as a mentor" on the internet? It's not the same in any way. A paragraph on the web is nowhere near the same as person to person hands on instruction. No Comparison.
If you implying that someone posting here is being "irresponsible' you better have some great examples.
What is the problem someone would be "a part of"? Name names and show examples or your words just ring hollow.


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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

woodnthings said:


> Is climb cutting safe? We are advised to avoid climb cutting when using the router with exceptions for grain direction and whether we are "inside or on the perimeter" of a frame. Ah yes, those exceptions. Charles Neil posted a You Tube using a method he called "bump cutting" which is a way to climb cut safely, one of my favorites:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I almost don't know when I don't climb cut using a hand held router. Usually one or two passes with the climb and then the final pass when there is less than a 1/16 of an inch left over. I rarely do it when I have a cutter in a router table though. And the grooving bit as he mentioned is very notorious for chipping out. All you need to do is make a skim cut using a clime cut. Just enough to break the surface of the wood and then you can cut in the normal correct direction with nearly zero chance of chip out.

If I had only used a router a couple times I wouldn't advise someone to do it. But if you've handled a router a lot it's pretty easy to do and not really dangerous when you secure the pc you are working on.


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## DrRobert (Apr 27, 2015)

BigCountry79 said:


> You can get away with many unsafe practices for a long time before you realize their consequences, and you cannot accurately quantify the accidents that did not happen due to safety practices (especially at a small scale).


Excellent.

Years ago at a conference a Doogie Houser looking Dr. gave a lecture, and being one of the “old guys” I was sitting in the obligatory back row - you know, for nodding off unnoticed - er - those bathroom breaks.

He prefaced his talk with the following comment (paraphrased):

”I see a lot of grey hair out there, I would guess there is over 1000 years of cumulative experience in this hall. But I am here to say you can have a lot of experience doing something the wrong way.”

That was 20 years ago and is the one thing I remember from 100’s of hours of seminars. 😁


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## BigCountry79 (Jun 2, 2021)

DrRobert said:


> Excellent.
> 
> Years ago at a conference a Doogie Houser looking Dr. gave a lecture, and being one of the “old guys” I was sitting in the obligatory back row - you know, for nodding off unnoticed - er - those bathroom breaks.
> 
> ...


Haha!
Yeah, I'm that guy at my company, but after 23 years, I'm actually older than a lot of the folks I'm pushing now.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

Since the word "safe" appears in the title I wondered if woodworkers are at risk in comparison to other occupations with regard to fatalities.
They don't even show up in the top 10 most dangerous jobs:








The 10 most dangerous jobs in America


Here's a look at the 10 most dangerous jobs in America, based on data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. The most common workplace deaths were related to transportation




www.cnbc.com





However, carpenters show up in the lower end of the top 30:


https://finance.yahoo.com/news/30-most-dangerous-jobs-america-135344484.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9kdWNrZHVja2dvLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAJ9FO3x5C7nxe17LPKm6Rsutu_nCVa6aNrjhKSngE5j96AcVEiSDWW-9ip9n5SrkMtpOj2NDCl8XqMREeYfpkoVAxtpWjFXvXi7dEan2ccrJDQ0vKe8rV9C4Z0qMxZtdk5bVfdYD8lSoOBtLRvy9pSGTGRjw29mmAqay5Zy_qkPt


*26. Carpenters*
*Total Fatal Injuries: 99*_ *Fatal Injury Rate: 8 per 100,000 workers* *Most Common Fatal Accidents: Falls, slips, trips* *Median Base Salary: $49,520*
When you are going to be working sharp saws, chisels, and a variety of power tools that can behave unexpectedly, your safety is in your own hands. No matter how much of an expert you are with handling sharp tools to create art with wood, there is always a risk of getting injured. The injury can be a minor cut, or, in the worst case you can become the next captain hook._

As I said earlier, an amputation of a finger or two will not result in a fatality, but a cut to the wrist which severs an major blood vessel may if you end up passed out on the shop floor for any length of time. It would be difficult to imagine a situation where one's wrist would come unto contact with a fully elevated tablesaw blade.
Carpenters are often crosscutting boards across their upper legs or other unstable supports, so they are more at risk with a circular saw. For me, watching a 48" or larger saw mill blade scares the pants off me. I wouldn't want to be within 25 ft of that spinning blade.
Having spent my childhood on a farm with exposed PTO shafts and flat belts driving threshing machines I knew that farmers were at a greater risk than many others.
My own worst finger injury was from an exposed gear set that attracted me to ride my fore finger lightly above it when suddenly it passed right through the meshing gears. At the age of 8 I didn't know any better and there were no safety covers on the gears. That shut down the entire threshing operation so the neighbors could drive me screaming in the back seat of an Oldsmobile to the nearest doctor in a town 40 miles from the farm. It's still a vivid memory!
I'm happy to say in the 60+ years that followed I've never had even a close call on the tablesaw or other woodworking machines.


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## TomCT2 (May 16, 2014)

moons ago I took issue with a timber framing 'expert' who insisted mineral oil is a poison, it's made from gasoline, it should never be used on cutting boards.

I took up with Cricket whether total BS, totally false/untrue stuff should be allowed - since one would expect such a hobby forum would provide/contain/foster correct information.
I was told to express my opinions and let the user make up their own mind. obviously rank beginners are really quite expert at doing that.

so, it appears the policy has changed.


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## Rick Christopherson (Jun 27, 2016)

TomCT2 said:


> moons ago I took issue with a timber framing 'expert' who insisted mineral oil is a poison, it's made from gasoline, it should never be used on cutting boards.


This is the reason why it is critical to NOT censor information that someone feels is untrue, because only with open discussion can better information be ascertained. Because, you see, that timber framer was actually correct about mineral oil not being safe to consume. Many things over the past couple of years were wrongfully silenced in the name of preventing so called misinformation.


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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

Mineral oil is sold as a laxative.


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## FrankC (Aug 24, 2012)

All too often information is taken out of context, both sides can be correct in what they are claiming, it is just that what they are claiming may not be relative to the situation at hand. A tablespoon of mineral oil on a cutting board is highly unlikely to harm anyone, whereas consuming larger quantities into your body on a regular basis has been determined to be unhealthy.


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## Rick Christopherson (Jun 27, 2016)

Correct. It is classified as unhealthy or even poisonous in large dosage, but in small doses can be helpful.


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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

Yes, we are talking about it in the context of rubbing it on a cutting board, letting it soak in and wiping it off and letting it dry.

Not slugging it from the bottle.

Yes, if you are going to be haphazardly careless and take a large dose of it you might injure yourself. Same with lots of things. Alcohol, Tylenon, Aspirin etc... You can die from drinking to much water.

Read the instructions comes to mind.


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## TomCT2 (May 16, 2014)

Rick Christopherson said:


> Correct. It is classified as unhealthy or even poisonous in large dosage, but in small doses can be helpful.


you have heard of perfectly healthy stupid college kids suffering death from drinking too much water, right . . .?


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