# Oak and Holly Trees



## Devon7234 (Jan 6, 2011)

I have access to a large volume of oak and holly trees. I'm going to mill the oaks into 8 foot long, 3/4 inch thick sections via a timber jig on my chainsaw. Would it increase the drying time if I were to soak the oak in denatured alcohol for 24 hours, then air dry it in the rafters of my cold drafty garage? Maybe my attic? I figured I'd go through the ropes of milling with some oaks before I touch the holly. Also, I read that planing both surfaces of a fresh cut board can yield faster drying times with less discoloration..any truth in this?


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

If you want to end up with 3/4'' I would cut it a full 1'' (any species) then plane after its dry, not while wet. The only milling experience I have had with holly it really cupped/twisted when drying, but the logs were small so I cannot say it all holly will (but bet most is tough to dry flat). If I milled it again I would cut it even thicker than 1'' to get 3/4'' finished.

You lost me with the denatured alcohol. Here is some reading on air drying from our reference section :



Daren said:


> 3 links from a discussion in the "forestry and milling" section. dirtclod has a couple good ones http://www.chilternsaonb.org/downloads/publications/Air_Drying_of_Timber.pdf
> http://nrs.fs.fed.us/pubs/rp/rp_nc228.pdf
> 
> I had one bookmarked too. Between these 3 I reckon there is about all you need to know on the subject :smile:
> http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplgtr/fplgtr117.pdf


I did a quick google search to try to confirm/refute my suspicions about holly moving while drying (pretty much confirmed) and most of the stuff I skimmed said to keep it's white color it should be kiln dried fast or it will turn gray. Then there is the issue of sticker stain. I'm sure holly is prone to it just like maple so you want to make sure and use dry/''white'' wood for stickers. Reading any of the links on air drying from above will explain stickering/stacking of milled lumber.


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

Planing green lumber is called presurfacing. The advantages include ~12% energy savings in drying (and also faster drying), increased kiln capacity, & 15 times less surface checking than dry planed lumber. Disadvantages are the disposal of wet (heavy) shavings & the need to mill the rough sizes thicker than if you were going to plane after drying. According to the Doc (Dr. Gene Wengert) - the final planed size to achieve 4/4 is 1.03" 
Oak is the only species deemed worth the extra effort of presurfacing especially Red Oak. Merrilat Industries (big kitchen cabinet company) presurfaces all of their oak. 

I've never worked with Holly but I would like to. Just because it moves a lot like Daren says - remember it makes great accent wood especially where you want a nice white color so don't let the crooks and bows and twists discourage you. Short Holly can always find a home. 






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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

TexasTimbers said:


> Just because it moves a lot like Daren says - remember it makes great accent wood especially where you want a nice white color so don't let the crooks and bows and twists discourage you. Short Holly can always find a home.


Oh for sure, I was not trying to discourage, just mention what to expect. Even smalls like you said are not easy to find (and are pretty darn pricey for a "domestic'' :blink




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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

I knew you weren't I was just speaking in general. But I mentioned you in the same sentence so it probably came across like that. They were 'posed to be two separate thoughts.



Daren said:


> . . . Even smalls like you said are not easy to find (and are pretty darn pricey for a "domestic'' :blink


That's what I've gathered about Holly. I'm trying to get on his good side - I have ulterior motives. :shifty:







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## slabmaster (Mar 30, 2008)

*denatured*

Denatured alcohol will disapate water and speed up the drying process, but it can also dry too fast and cause cracking. So if your not in a hurry i would just let it air dry naturally.


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## TexasTimbers (Oct 17, 2006)

DA works great where it can easily penetrate end grain such as in turning blocks and cookies, but I don't think it will displace water very readily in rough sawn boards unless soaked for a lonnnng time or unless it was forced into the grain in a pressure chamber. Using it on a scale like that would cost a small fortune too. 











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## Devon7234 (Jan 6, 2011)

What I am gathering from these posts:
1.Stack it as soon as we cut it in a warm dry place, like my attic.
2.Paint the ends with asphalt sealer upon cutting.
3.Weigh it down heavily to prevent movement and warping. 
I'll put wax paper along the stickers to prevent any kind of bleeding and color discoloration....
We are thinking of keeping a portion for ourselves for inlays against walnut/cherry. We would like to sell a portion of it to finance other shop necessities as well. We think the internet is the best venue for this. However, we are unsure as to what lengths to lumber the wood when the time comes. Is there a safe dimension we can count on that people would be the most interested in? As of now there are plenty of 8+ foot lengths, 6+ inch widths. We were however contemplating cutting them down to 6 foot lengths, 2 inch widths by 2 inches thick. Should we keep it as big as possible and if so is there a limit?


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## slabmaster (Mar 30, 2008)

*width*

For top dollar, keep it as wide as you can and the thinner it is the faster it will dry.


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## Devon7234 (Jan 6, 2011)

square side = (circumference / pi) / sqrt(2)
square side = circumference * 0.225

40 circumference above yields a 9x9 square. Does this sound about right? Is there a calculator or an applet I can just bunch the circumference into and yield these dimensions to save time? 

Also, have problems milling my lumber. Came to the conclusion I need a band saw. Something with a 12in+ resawing ability. Any brands come to mind?


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

Devon7234 said:


> Is there a calculator or an applet I can just bunch the circumference into and yield these dimensions to save time?


We use diameter. Log volume calculator. You have to chose a "scale", I use Doyle.





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## HomeBody (Nov 24, 2010)

Devon7234 said:


> 1.Stack it as soon as we cut it in a warm dry place, like my attic.


With summer coming your attic may be too hot and the wood will dry too quickly and check or warp. A garage or barn might be a better choice. Gary


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## phinds (Mar 25, 2009)

OOPS ... posted something about holly and then realized I was talking about persimmon. Senior moment, I guess.

Paul


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