# Dark Staining Maple Veneer



## binaryclock (Mar 22, 2009)

Woodworking newbie here..

I need some advice if I'm doing this right to get a richer color on my cabinets.. closer to the original color of the stain i'm applying.

I built a beautiful cabinet for my kitchen out of 3/4 particle board maple veneer. I didn't know how hard it was to stain maple, and I didn't know it wasn't advisable to dark stain maple... so I guess I'm doing it the hard way, the first time 

I purchased some Minwax Red Mahogany stain and I've spent the last few days applying coat after coat of this stuff :/

I've put 6 coats on (thin followed by a 10-15 minute wipe off.)

It's got to a point where it's not light brown/orange anymore, but a deeper redish/brown tinge now. After 6 coats, if I keep applying thin coats followed by 10-15 wipedowns, is it going to keep getting richer and richer still, or have I pretty much reached the limit of what the pores can take? Is it possible to get the dark red/brown of the original stain?

Should I be applying a top coat gel stain or something instead to get that final rich color?

Any help would be appreciated...


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

If you are managing to build up Minwax stain on the surface applying more coats than you are risking having the finish not adhering to it. What will happen is when you put a finish on it the finish will adhere to the stain and not the wood. If it were me I would wipe the cabinets down with lacquer thinner and if the color is not dark enough spray them with an aniline dye stain to get the color you are wanting. The dyes are available online in powder form which won't have the hasmat fees of the premixed stain. The powders are mixed with alcohol and sprayed on at low pressure and not wiped. What it is, is ink. It will color the wood without putting anything on the surface that might cause adhesion problems. The dye powders can also be mixed with Minwax stains to alter the color. Mixwax is not a oil stain but an oil based aniline dye.


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## binaryclock (Mar 22, 2009)

Thank you so much for your reply.

Each time I apply a new coat the previous coat is dry to the touch. Would I still have adherence problems if the previous coats were dry?


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## binaryclock (Mar 22, 2009)

Also, how would I know if the stain has been built up on the surface, rather than in the pores of the wood? If I were to take mineral spirits and wipe the surface when the stain is dry, would the stain in pores come off with the mineral spirits?


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

binaryclock said:


> Also, how would I know if the stain has been built up on the surface, rather than in the pores of the wood? If I were to take mineral spirits and wipe the surface when the stain is dry, would the stain in pores come off with the mineral spirits?


Not as easy as with lacquer thinner. You might have been better off with a gel stain from the beginning. Minwax is an oil base stain (according to their website)..._A penetrating oil-based wood stain, available in 24 wood tone colors that can be used to enhance any wood surface._ It doesn't say anything about it being an oil base aniline dye.










 







.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

cabinetman said:


> Not as easy as with lacquer thinner. You might have been better off with a gel stain from the beginning. Minwax is an oil base stain (according to their website)..._A penetrating oil-based wood stain, available in 24 wood tone colors that can be used to enhance any wood surface._ It doesn't say anything about it being an oil base aniline dye.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 A few years ago I called the Minwax company looking for a tinting color I could use to alter the color of their stain because a universal tinting color would not suspend in it. They told me then that the color was an aniline dye and that aniline dye was all I could use or intermix different colors of Minwax stain. I have no idea what their website says.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

binaryclock said:


> Also, how would I know if the stain has been built up on the surface, rather than in the pores of the wood? If I were to take mineral spirits and wipe the surface when the stain is dry, would the stain in pores come off with the mineral spirits?


 If you have enough stain on the surface that might cause an adhesion problem you will be able to see it. It will look like it has a thin coat of paint on it. I'm sorry if I alarmed you. More than likely you have wiped all the excess each time you have stained it. I really just wanted to warn you that you can put too much stain on. Not being there I have to use a lot of imagination. If you do have a layer of dried stain on the surface mineral spirits probably won't cut it. It would need to be washed with lacquer thinner. This would be a last resort as you would then be in a position of having to re-stain it.


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## Rick Mosher (Feb 26, 2009)

Oil stain has an alkyd binder in it and is not meant to be layered in many coats. One time only, wipe on, wipe completely off. If you need a dark color you must use a dye stain especially on a light hard wood like maple. As you are a beginner I agree with Cman that a gel stain would be better if you must wipe something on. (Gel stain can be wiped on over dye stain)

Usually professional finishers use a dye stain on maple for a dark color, spraying it on then sealing the wood and toning to get the final color and evening out any blotching. Someone will recommend a conditioner but I think that isn't a good idea when going for a dark color. Dye stain can be sprayed on very evenly and then toned to get a nice finish.

One last thing, do yourself a favor and make samples of the ENTIRE finish process before you do anything to your project!


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## binaryclock (Mar 22, 2009)

Thanks again for the replies. I do want to do it right so if that means removing everything and starting again, I guess I must. After all, I'm here to learn not just to slap together things.

So right now I have the color I want on the cabinet. It's dry to the touch, and is a deep brown/red. I've put about 6 thin layers on it over the last week, wiping the excess off in 10 mins, and letting each layer to dry for over 10 hours or so.

Do you think I should just try to finish it with a vanish and see how it goes? Maybe try one of the shelves? How will I know if the multiple layers are causing problems after/while applying the vanish?

If I do opt to laquer it off and start over, will the gel stain get me the results I want in a coat or two? My wife is going to kill me if I have to work on this for another week  But at the same time, I want to do it right. After all, putting the cabinet together took time and effort.. just don't want to ruin it with the last step.


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