# Multiple Dust Collectors?



## Wil_Bloodworth (Apr 7, 2017)

I've been doing a lot of research for my new shop. I almost purchased a Clear Vue system the other night but I figured the entire system (ducting and all) would end up being around $2500-ish.

Right now, I only have a JET XACTA table saw [still in the box on the pallet], a Bosch GCM12SD compound miter saw [still in the box], a Bosch 1617EVSPK router [still in the box], and a Shop Fox W1668 drill press [yes, still in the box]. To me, the only two of those that will get used the most are the TS and the CMS (at least initially).

I ran across Grizzly's G1163P (1 HP Light Duty Dust Collector). https://www.grizzly.com/products/G1163P?utm_campaign=zPage&utm_source=grizzly.com. And their G1029Z2P 2HP 6" machine. They are $180 and $325 respectively. Total with shipping comes to around $655 which is considerably less than $2500!










That said, I figured why not just get the small $180 DC and build it into my outfeed table and connect it directly to the TS. The other DC could be built into the miter station and service everything else. That would eliminate probably about 90% of the tubing and reduce noise as well.

Is my thinking totally flawed here? What are the downsides to doing it this way?

Thank you!

- Wil


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## Techsniffer (Feb 19, 2017)

I've been researching DC solutions for a few months now in prep for when I finally get a good table saw. I've looked at dozens of DC's from the $50 shop vacs to the $4000 ones. And to be honest I keep coming back to the Harbor Freight DC for @$200. I have watched countless videos on customization, modification, different accessories etc and I can't really find anything that gives better bang for the buck. I dont think I've seen one video on YouTube where people actually trash the HF DC, most praise it for being one of the few gems you can buy at HF (along with their F clamps, which are pretty great I have several)

Average for the mid/higher end DC's seems to be @ $2000 give or take $500. Yet the HF DC is $200 and with a few hundred for mods (cyclone, better air filter, custom mounting etc) I will still be at or below $600 for roughly the same performance, aside from the higher HP models, which from everything I've read aren't really useful unless you have a large shop or running multiple tools at the same time.

With the mods you usually get better filtration both on dust/chip collection as well as air filtration than almost any 'stock' DC that's 5 times the price. If I could find better quality solutions at more reasonable prices then I might change my opinion, but spending less than $1000 for a DC, chip separator, better air filter, hoses, piping, connectors, sweeps etc that will rival or beat out a $2000 base DC it kind of seems like a no-brainer to me.

As far as building it into a outfeed table & miter station I think that would be hard, you still need air intake which would still be a point for noise escape which wouldn't really help you in that aspect, not to mention having to crawl in/under something to empty the bag would be a literal and figurative pain in the arse. I would think of a permanent mounting area, or at the very least a home-made mobile DC cart.


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

Wil_Bloodworth said:


> I've been doing a lot of research for my new shop. I almost purchased a Clear Vue system the other night but I figured the entire system (ducting and all) would end up being around $2500-ish.
> 
> Right now, I only have a JET XACTA table saw [still in the box on the pallet], a Bosch GCM12SD compound miter saw [still in the box], a Bosch 1617EVSPK router [still in the box], and a Shop Fox W1668 drill press [yes, still in the box]. To me, the only two of those that will get used the most are the TS and the CMS (at least initially).
> 
> ...


I have the 2 hp machine not with the proper ducting quite yet but it has been a good one it will almost keep up with my 20 inch planer, if properly piped it would do it fine but 20 feet of 4 inch flex with a 30 gallon trash can "cyclone" in the middle really screws the SP But I will say that $30 cyclone Grizzly sells really surprised me how much longer the machine runs without having to clean the filter

BTW if you decide to duct your whole shop you would save quite a bit of money by going to Plano to Locke supply if you wanted sheet metal duct or their plumbing dept has PVC sewer pipe

I was reading in one of the wood working mags a couple months ago and they had estimated prices for duct and fittings and was at least 5 times the price you could get it from Locke


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## MT Stringer (Jul 21, 2009)

I have my tools in a one car garage. The CMS is on one side and the table saw is on the other. I have a Shop Vac w/Dust Deputy plumbed to the CMS. Also, a port is available to hook up a hose for the ROS, router, etc.

A Harbor Freight 2hp DC is plumbed to the table saw with an additional 4 inch port to hook up a hose to the drum sander, band saw or joiner.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*You could have many small DC units*

One "theory" is to have several small 1 HP DC units around the shop, each hooked to it's own machine. I don't know if anyone a has tried it yet.... 

In my case I have 2 Jet 1100 DCs with minimum flex hose lengths that I swap between several machines. I have inovated a "quick connect" coupling that allows me to swap hoses in less than 10 seconds. I have the normal machines, table saws, a jointer, a planer or two, and drum sanders. It works better for me than having overhead piping and all the associated blast gates and drops.

The main issue is performance with the smaller DCs. Look at it this way. A DC is a air blower as much as it is an air sucker. It will only suck efficiently IF it is not restricted on the outlet end by a filter that is clogged or doesn't have enough surface area. It will also have reduced efficiency if there are too many sharp bends and the flex hose lengths are excessive. So you have to make the best of both worlds. Bag filters are just not as efficient as pleated fin filters... not as much surface area for a comparable size. 

Different machines generate different size particles .... fine dust from sanders, medium dust from table and band saws and larger chips and shavings from jointers and planers. A planer will fill a small drum or bag with shavings in a short time under continuous use. A table saw will take much longer to fill the drum or bag. The drum sander will clog the bag in just a few minutes, rendering it useless because the air can't escape. 

A cyclone may separate out the fine dust from the chips BUT if the drum is too small it will fill rapidly. I am not a fan of cyclones for the small shop because of that and the greater expense. They may be fine for a shop vac to keep the filter clean, but they also take up almost an equal amount of floor space as the shop vac. I am also not a fan for that reason. I clean my filters weekly and have extras to replace the dirty ones if I'm in the middle of a job. I do have 4 shop vacs that remain attached to the router tables, bandsaws, and RAS and one for clean ups. I bought them on sale for around $60.00 or so.:smile3:


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## Wil_Bloodworth (Apr 7, 2017)

Awesome. Thank you for the info on the Plano store. That's not too far from my house.


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## Brian(J) (Feb 22, 2016)

Wil_Bloodworth said:


> I've been doing a lot of research for my new shop. I almost purchased a Clear Vue system the other night but I figured the entire system (ducting and all) would end up being around $2500-ish.
> Total with shipping comes to around $655 which is considerably less than $2500!
> 
> That said, I figured why not just get the small $180 DC and build it into my outfeed table and connect it directly to the TS.
> ...


Newton's First Law of Affordable Shops: Check Craigslist. In the Seattle area at this moment there are about 10 nice looking DC's from $150 to $300, and another 10 at higher prices. I paid $200 for a Delta 50-760.


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

Wil_Bloodworth said:


> Awesome. Thank you for the info on the Plano store. That's not too far from my house.



They are at the corner of Park and Avenue K, just east of Central


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## Wil_Bloodworth (Apr 7, 2017)

After all research was done, I ended up just going with a single dust collection system (the JET DC-1100VX-CK). Now gonna have to run down to Locke supply to figure out what piping to use. Thank you again @Catpower for the referral.

ALL of the machines are still in their original boxes so it's going to be an extremely busy June!


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## Wil_Bloodworth (Apr 7, 2017)

woodnthings said:


> In my case I have 2 Jet 1100 DCs...
> 
> ...I do have 4 shop vacs that remain attached to the router tables...


2 large DCs and 4 shop vacs. Wow! No ceiling-mounted air filtration?!


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Nope, for several reasons....*

First off, I have sloped ceilings which would make it difficult to install them except right down the center where there is a steel I beam.
I did not want to do that.

Secondly, the Jets were reasonable around $500 to $600 on sale with the remotes. By using them on more than one machine with "quick disconnects" it only take a few seconds to swap out the hoses. 

The 4 shop vacs have their own machines .... one on 2 bandsaws, one on a 12" RAS, one switches between 2 router tables and the 4th is for shop clean ups and hooked to the ROS. They were also on sale for around $60.00 or so. 

It works for me in my space, and that's all that matters. You should understand the difference in air velocity and air volume between a shop vac and a full size DC. Shop vacs have a high velocity air stream with low CFM flow. The DCs have lower velocity air stream but high CFMs flow. Shop vac are great for fine dust off the machines small dust ports like the RAS, or bandsaw and the DCs atre best for the planer, jointers and drum sanders where large volumes of chips and fine dust are created. A shop vac hooked to a thickness planer will fill up in a short time if operated continuously.


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## Wil_Bloodworth (Apr 7, 2017)

@woodnthings Oh, I wasn't giving you a hard time. I was just saying that was awesome.
@Catpower: Did you go with PVC or metal piping?


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

Wil_Bloodworth said:


> @*woodnthings* Oh, I wasn't giving you a hard time. I was just saying that was awesome.
> 
> @*Catpower*: Did you go with PVC or metal piping?


Haven't done either yet, but we are going to do something shortly, the grand kids owe me for getting them a go cart They can be the rafter monkeys LOL

Will probably use snap lock metal and install a barometric damper that would open in case I forgot to open a blast gate. A good DC might have enough oomph to collapse snap lock pipe. If you do decide to got metal, when you are at Locke pick up a bucket of duct sealant, it is kind of messy but does a much better job of sealing the ducts, and it would probably reinforce the duct somewhat


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## Wil_Bloodworth (Apr 7, 2017)

Catpower said:


> Haven't done either yet, but we are going to do something shortly, the grand kids owe me for getting them a go cart They can be the rafter monkeys LOL
> 
> Will probably use snap lock metal and install a barometric damper that would open in case I forgot to open a blast gate. A good DC might have enough oomph to collapse snap lock pipe. If you do decide to got metal, when you are at Locke pick up a bucket of duct sealant, it is kind of messy but does a much better job of sealing the ducts, and it would probably reinforce the duct somewhat


I'm thinking about going the PVC route but it will all come down to cost. I think the metal snap lock tubing feels a bit "light" and the DC might collapse it if I forget to open up the appropriate gates as you mentioned... which I'm certain I will forget.


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

Wil_Bloodworth said:


> I'm thinking about going the PVC route but it will all come down to cost. I think the metal snap lock tubing feels a bit "light" and the DC might collapse it if I forget to open up the appropriate gates as you mentioned... which I'm certain I will forget.



When you go to Locke ask them if they have any draw bands, they will probably look at you like you are speaking Greek, (the counter help isn't the brightest bulb in the bx) but they are bands that go around the pipe to connect the pipe to a fitting with out crimping the pipe, kind of a butt to butt joint. I am about positive they would stop the pipe from collapsing because they would force it to stay round

The thing that will kill the PVC is the fittings.up to 4 inch are reasonable 6 inch gets kind of insane, but you live in Frisco, so you have to be rich LOL


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## Wil_Bloodworth (Apr 7, 2017)

Ha. Yes, I live in Frisco but am far from rich. I can always go into Locke and buy one piece of PVC at a time. Maybe they have layaway.


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## Larry42 (Jan 10, 2014)

Watch out using the snap lock furnace duct. It is made for positive pressure not negative. I've seen it collapsed with a small dust collector. 
There were some good suggestions about not using too much flex duct, it has a high internal resistance to flow. The more filter area you have the better. There is a lot of differences in the air flow on different filter materials. You can have custom bags made relatively cheaply by several companies that specialize in it. Have a big one made and hang it out of the way. Next problem is the stated air moving on many cheap collectors. It is often stated as "free air" meaning no resistance. Good collectors will state it in terms of static pressure.


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