# Prop 65 Warning On Hand Tools? Is This A Real Concern?



## highmarcs (Jul 12, 2012)

Hello. I'm just getting into woodworking and I've run across a rather distressing thing. 

Several of the products I've looked into buying, including ANY of the combination squares from a major home improvement chain and all of the planes I've looked at online, from all of the well respected names have a Prop 65 WARNING! 

"This product contains chemicals known to the state of California to cause cancer, birth defects and other reproductive harm. Wash hands after use." 

I'm assuming this is about lead in the metal alloys. How big of a concern is this and is there ANY company who makes hand planes at least, without a prop 65 Warning? And please, let me know if I'm just being nutty, as I admit to being more than a bit neurotic when anything says "cause cancer", LOL.


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## Dominick (May 2, 2011)

Welcome to Woodtalk. 
Everything causes cancer in California. Lol


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Many products can cause cancer with overexposure. If you are going to use any product over and over frequently for years you should take measures to keep from ingesting them. Some products will soak in through the skin and some are inhaled. Occasional exposure I wouldn't worry about it.


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## amckenzie4 (Apr 29, 2010)

As near as I can tell, everything that's made of cast or molded anything -- from tools to garden hose to just about anything else -- has one of those labels. I've been assuming either the mold or the release agent has lead in it, or may have lead in it, so they have to put the label on. Once I bought a stainless steel faucet designed for a kitchen sink with one of those labels, I started kind of ignoring them.


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## Deanr (Jul 29, 2011)

I think you are going overboard on this one. The only reason that warning is on there is because when those products are sold in Cal. it must be. The same product sold outside Cal. does not require the warning. Some companies choose to put it on all their products whether they are sold in Cal. or elsewhere.
On hand tools how do you think you are going to get cancer from picking up that tool and holding it in your hand for a brief period of time? I can understand concern on items that are inhaled into your system but not hand tools. I think of all the times as a kid when I was fishing and biting down on lead sinkers to crimp them on our line or breaking open the mercury thermometer to play with the mercury.
(As always hindsight is 20/20.)
There are far more harmful things that we expose ourselves to on a regular basis than our handtools.


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## H. A. S. (Sep 23, 2010)

I wouldn't worry about hand tools causing anything, but cuts. If you want to get irradiated, just go through the airport. The gov. says it's perfectly safe, even when you fly several times a week.


Always trust Big Brother. He knows what's best for everyone.:laughing:


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## dbhost (Jan 28, 2008)

Prop 64 warnings are a joke imposed upon the rest of the country by the crybabies out west. Don't worry about it.

Seriously to put it in perspective. You can get cancer from the sun, from overexposure to water, from clothing etc... That prop 65 warning is on dang near everything, and is so vague and general in its application as to be completely meaningless.


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## Itchytoe (Dec 17, 2011)

If you just don't die, you're going to get cancer. There's absolutely nothing you can do to stop it. Cancer is part of aging, and part of evolution. It's ironic, but you can't live without it. Mutations, like cancer, are why humans can breathe the air, and why we have such disproportionally large brains, and why we walk upright... Everything causes cancer, except death. Right now, your body is producing cancerous cells. Fortunately, you have an immune system that kills off those cells and doesn't allow them to colonize. Well, it normally does that. Once in a while it fails.

Don't let the cali warning scare you. They say that about everything. Notice how it's only known to the state of California. Every other state thinks they're idiots. FYI, it's not the lead that they're warning you about. You'd die of lead poisoning before you'd get cancer from the lead. Just don't eat lead and you'll be ok.


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## MTL (Jan 21, 2012)

If you are that worried about cancer then I hope you drive a plug in electric car. You are much more likely to get cancer from pumping gas than working with woodworking tools.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Woodworking Talk


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## sawdustfactory (Jan 30, 2011)

http://oehha.ca.gov/prop65/background/p65plain.html


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## BigJoe16 (Feb 20, 2012)

It could be like the warning on food labels. " his product may contain or has been exposed to allergiens." 
Probably so they can't be sued if you tested it for cancer causing compounds and found some.


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## rrbrown (Feb 15, 2009)

OK I see it this way. According to the label it's only a problem if you live in California. The rest of the world is fine.

Do you live in California?if so your screwed because as stated everything is known to cause cancer there.:laughing::laughing:


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## mike1950 (Aug 29, 2010)

If you are worried about the labels on the tools then you should read the MSDS on the wood you are thinking of using and the finish you are putting on it. Also we are all terminal- nobody gets out of this alive- the only time you will stop being exposed to things that hurt you will be when you stop breathing. Also you ever seen the air or water in Ca. They need a label on the air..............


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## Theobroma (Nov 19, 2011)

Deanr said:


> I think of all the times as a kid when I was fishing and biting down on lead sinkers to crimp them on our line or breaking open the mercury thermometer to play with the mercury.


 I did those things as a kid too. I also did them while riding in the front seat of a car without a seat belt and while using the hair dryer in the shower.

It's a wonder how I survived.:blink::no:


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

Steve Neul said:


> Many products can cause cancer with overexposure. If you are going to use any product over and over frequently for years you should take measures to keep from ingesting them. Some products will soak in through the skin and some are inhaled. Occasional exposure I wouldn't worry about it.


Absolutely yes.

DO NOT eat any of the carpenter's squares that you purchase. That can be dangerous to your health.


g


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## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

Theobroma said:


> I did those things as a kid too. I also did them while riding in the front seat of a car without a seat belt and while using the hair dryer in the shower.
> 
> It's a wonder how I survived.:blink::no:


I ran with scissors once.


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## dbhost (Jan 28, 2008)

MTL said:


> If you are that worried about cancer then I hope you drive a plug in electric car. You are much more likely to get cancer from pumping gas than working with woodworking tools.
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Woodworking Talk


The strong electromagnetic fields produced by electric drive motors under continuous operation probably cause cancer...


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## Chaincarver Steve (Jul 30, 2011)

Companies are so afraid of being sued by idiots they're putting warn labels on the packs of warning labels. Just to cover their arses.



Shop Dad said:


> I ran with scissors once.


And I once looked a gift horse in the mouth. I am so screwed...


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## ryan50hrl (Jun 30, 2012)

I would recommend you do not eat your combo square.....cancer will be the least of your concerns.


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## JBSmall (Jul 6, 2012)

It's a wonder the CA NANCYS P. don't require a "THIS TOOL CAUSES CALLUSES" warning.

How about warnings about using that square on an icy roof? Let's all do that this winter and sue them for all they're worth during rehab.


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## rrich (Jun 24, 2009)

Dominick said:


> Welcome to Woodtalk.
> Everything causes cancer in California. Lol


Including the gas passed by the legislature while "idling".

(a.k.a. Doing nothing)


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## Dave66 (Apr 6, 2012)

One of the great mysteries of the universe is why stuff sold in CA becomes harmless as soon as you cross a state line or go more than a mile offshore. I've been told that Morgan Freeman is filming an episode of his TV show to explore this phenomenon.

I've lived here for over 40 years with no noticable ill effects so I don't give it much thought. AFAIK, those signs on every entrance to any public building do little except block the view.


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## Yeorwned (Jan 9, 2010)

The primary concern of anything with that warning is to simply wash your hands afterwards, primarily before putting your hands in your mouth or eating. Orally ingesting lead, which is the typical reason you'll see that warning, isn't good for you.


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## Dave66 (Apr 6, 2012)

That may be true in GA, but CA seems to be determined to regulate everything we see, feel, hear, taste, touch, and even think.

It's so overdone, that valid warnings are lost in the noise.


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## MGP Roofing (Jul 10, 2010)

This is ridiculous, however i'm sure its not lead thats the issue, more like something found in products made from oil, such as petrol, asphalt shingles or plastic products. I know that warning is on every pack of shingles I install. I do wash mu hands after work, but I'm sure its a non-event; I'm aware of many households here that collect their drinking water off of those same shingle roofs without any issue...


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## JBSmall (Jul 6, 2012)

I'm telling you. Roofs are the problem.
Do houses in California come with warning-labels?


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## peaceflwr (Mar 29, 2018)

This is a labeling law that the State of California has enacted to warn the public about the risk involved in over 1000 chemicals (including aloe leaf) that California has deemed MAY cause cancer and reproductive harm. Unfortunately, these chemicals are quite literally EVERYWHERE so these labels are appearing all over California.

Along with the lead in the metals there are plasticizers that make the PVC handle soft that causes cancer and reproductive harm if handled to frequently... it can migrate from the plastic. It is also in food (such as cheese) that has soft plastic packaging-- sliced cheese being the worst. From what I have read, there will soon be labels on our food to warn of carcinogens-- bacon is worse than asbestos! so if you are going to worry about the handle of a tool, I would also stop eating. And becoming Vegan is not the answer-- there are levels of lead AND cadmium in many food supplements and vitamins


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

we are a producer of handmade wooden products in pa. California contacted us 2 years ago and sated that we must label all products Prop 65 that we sell to calif residents warning of the cancer causing wood dust.


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## pro70z28 (Feb 26, 2018)

None of us will get out alive.


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## gj13us (Apr 19, 2016)

I guess the question is: Does California have lower cancer rates because of the labeling? 
My guess is: No.


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## holtzdreher (Jul 20, 2016)

as my grand pap said frequently, "Too much asparagus can kill you." I saw a warning on a box of steel wool soap pads for scouring metal pans, It said "Not for external or internal use on humans" I just can't imagine the idiotic deed that prompted such a warning. I am surprised that Kalifornia does not require warnings in super markets that peanut products are stored for sale in aisle 7 near other food products.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

The problem as I see it is all the warning labels and safety devices they come up with is making people more stupid thinking the world will prevent them from hurting themselves. I saw a show on TV this morning about someone is making a push to remove methylene chloride from over the counter paint and varnish remover. It seems someone was trying to strip paint off the inside of a walk in freezer and it killed them. How stupid can to get to use any chemical in an enclosed space like that.


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## bargoon (Apr 20, 2016)

A lot of things in woodworking can cause problems like not wearing a dust mask when working wood, not using guards, not wearing gloves and respirator when required.

You gotta pay attention to your safety. 

Also manufacturers go overboard on warnings to cover liability sorta like when McDonalds tells you their hot coffee is HOT!, haha,


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## Kerrys (May 2, 2016)

A 6 year old warning...nothing seems to have changed. The only warning needed, use common sense, if you lack common sense, find someone who has some or you are on your own.


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## gj13us (Apr 19, 2016)

Steve Neul said:


> The problem as I see it is all the warning labels and safety devices they come up with is making people more stupid thinking the world will prevent them from hurting themselves. I saw a show on TV this morning about someone is making a push to remove methylene chloride from over the counter paint and varnish remover. It seems someone was trying to strip paint off the inside of a walk in freezer and it killed them. How stupid can to get to use any chemical in an enclosed space like that.


There was the guy who worked as a tree trimmer until he lost his arm in the wood chipper. A piece got jammed and he reached in and his arm got caught. In the subsequent lawsuit, he claimed that he had not been properly taught that it was dangerous to reach into the chipper. This was 15 years after he'd been working as a tree trimmer. 

An old friend of mine won a lawsuit over a circular saw. He was using the saw, and lowered it toward his leg. The safety cover didn't spring back as it should have and he cut into his thigh. Supposedly. He also told me that he had been drinking at the time. 0


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## johnep (Apr 12, 2007)

Wood itself can be carcinogenic. Before dust extractors, nasal cancer was found in woodworkers in the furniture industry.
johnep


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## Catpower (Jan 11, 2016)

A couple years ago I bought a new John Deere tractor, out of boredom I started reading the owner's manual. It was as thick as the service manual for a 1958 John Deere 720 D I have. The new tractors manual was nothing but warnings and "Contact your dealer for repairs" 

It is all because of stupid lawsuits, and Deere wanting you to bring the tractor back because they weren't done sucking money out of your wallet, although it is an excellent tractor and has never needed any thing done on it yet


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## videoword (Feb 27, 2018)

Obviously everyone (outside of California) is going to flip their lids over this post.

But the reason is likely because there is lead in the product, which simply means this: don't lick your tools and don't let your toddlers play with them and put them in their mouths and especially if your kids are using the tools remind them to wash their hands after handling them.

It's not like they are lying to you. Lead, etc. does cause cancer and health/reproductive/developmental issues and can accumulate over time. So just don't rub your eyes or suck on your fingers after handling the new speed square without rinsing them first. In fact, you should probably rinse your tools before first use. Get any residual chemical power off of there.


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## new2woodwrk (Mar 16, 2015)

Just one word - "California" 'nuff said.

So glad I got out of there before the insanity got so bad LOL


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## Shop_Rat (Dec 22, 2015)

So, this thread is six years old, and the OP never wrote but one post. You don't think?..... Nah, you don't think he et one of them squares, got cancer and died on us did he?.... or DID he?:|


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## videoword (Feb 27, 2018)

Shop_Rat said:


> So, this thread is six years old, and the OP never wrote but one post. You don't think?..... Nah, you don't think he et one of them squares, got cancer and died on us did he?.... or DID he?<img src="http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/images/WoodworkingTalk_2016/smilies/tango_face_plain.png" border="0" alt="" title="Serious" class="inlineimg" />


Hahahaha!


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## pro70z28 (Feb 26, 2018)

MTL said:


> If you are that worried about cancer then I hope you drive a plug in electric car. You are much more likely to get cancer from pumping gas than working with woodworking tools.
> 
> Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Woodworking Talk


But you still have to follow those fossil fuel burning conveyances in traffic.


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## Cephus (Jan 28, 2018)

Shop_Rat said:


> So, this thread is six years old, and the OP never wrote but one post. You don't think?..... Nah, you don't think he et one of them squares, got cancer and died on us did he?.... or DID he?:|


That or he ate some Tide Pods. You never know.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

highmarcs said:


> Hello. I'm just getting into woodworking and I've run across a rather distressing thing.
> 
> Several of the products I've looked into buying, including ANY of the combination squares from a major home improvement chain and all of the planes I've looked at online, from all of the well respected names have a Prop 65 WARNING!
> 
> ...


The most dangerous thing that you can do is to be born. From that moment on you are dying. In Calif. there is probably also a warning that it causes cancer.

George


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Here they worry about chemicals and I saw a show last night where they expose the food we eat with radiation to sterilize it. Between the chemicals they use to control pest and that it's no wonder cancer is rampant.


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## pro70z28 (Feb 26, 2018)

We were in California a year ago. Riding in an elevator in a hotel, there were cancer warning labels inside the elevator. :sad2::sad2: It was at that point we knew we were in vewy vewy big trouble. :vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

The best I can tell so far with this is the bad news.. You're going to die. The good news however is it's probably not going to happen right away. There's a very real risk of death every single day you get out of bed and we could require warning labels on your ceiling to inform you of the many risks you'll face climbing out from under the covers, but you know...
I've worked with chemicals throughout my life that have killed people and I've known guys who became deathly ill being around them, but so far I've been pretty damn lucky and have remained relatively unscathed from spraying paints and coatings with some pretty gnarly stuff in them.
It's a half dozen of one and six of the other with this stuff.
Heck, just check out the gazillion warnings on food labels and most every household product and if you take them all to heart you'll stop eating, breathing, wiping your butt and sitting down longer than 15 seconds a day. Do the best you can and accept the very real risks of living because in the end something is going to kill you. 
There is a very real risk of using almost any product. It's how the world operates. There are no guarantees with any of them. That horrible chemical dihydrogen monoxide kills millions of people, but you just can't live without it.
I think the key to it all is moderation.. Don't eat a plane.. Sure, you can sprinkle salt on it, but it's still not going to go down very good with a glass of wine..


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## Kerrys (May 2, 2016)

I have been saying it for years; the leading cause of death is life.


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

Kerrys said:


> I have been saying it for years; the leading cause of death is life.


And add to it, Get old or die.. Those are really the only available options at this time..when someone says they're not getting older stop them right there because they're obviously lying or sadly misinformed about how life works..


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## BattleRidge (Jan 8, 2018)

If I see a warning tag or label I will take note. Whether it becomes a concern or not, and what precautions I take if any, depends on the warning and how I intend to use the product. If it is something that will see frequent use, I may give things a deeper thought, look or consideration. IF it is something that will be used by a child or my grandchild (or any younger person), I will give things a much deeper thought and look and likely incorporate precautions as needed.

As a retired fire chief (inspector, instructor, investigator, emergency medical technician and the other hats I have worn), I find that warnings of all sorts to be something worthy of taking note and promoting. Perhaps it is due to the immense amount of injuries and tragic deaths I have had the experience of being involved in trying to mitigate, or the goal of striving to prevent such tragedies to those I have worked and associate with, but I try to take even the little things seriously. In my life experience, many such warnings are the result of a previously tragic situation that someone has had the good common sense to try to limit - even if solely by allowing the consumer to be at least knowledgeable of it.

Be safe - and always think.


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## AtomicTermite (Feb 28, 2018)

I was watching "Good Morning America" on Friday morning 3-30-18 when they had a report that Ca was now going to require coffee shops such as starbucks to post warning that coffee could cause cancer. This is because of a chemical that was produced from the roasting of the coffee beans. Then they mentioned that a person with MIT stated that coffee is consumed by the living and that cancer only occurs in the living. I drove a truck for a few yrs and quickly figured out that when you crossed the Ca state line that you entered a world all their own. Should we ever have a earthquake strong enough for Ca to fall off into the ocean do not fear the movie industry will recover. One reason all companies put the prop 65 label on everything is they don't save separate items out just to send to Ca its cheaper just to put the label on everything.


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## Brian T. (Dec 19, 2012)

The lesson is simple = Don't eat hand planes.
There are soon to be labels on all coffee products in California declaring them to be carcinogenic.

Really nice and big white label with red printing on some Australian machinery:

NOT TO BE OPERATED BY XUCKWITS.


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## Tool Agnostic (Aug 13, 2017)

The comments in this thread have the widest range I have seen on Woodworking Talk. At the top end they are reasonably pertinent and intelligent.

There seems to be no limit to the bottom end.


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## Brian T. (Dec 19, 2012)

How true. Some quotes are wonderful. Live in OZ for some years. Their warning makes sense.

I'll invoke the April 01 clause.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Speaking about coffee, anyone drink decaf? One of the processes they use to make it is to soak the beans in methylene chloride. Methylene chloride happens to be the key ingredient in solvent based paint and varnish remover. It's considered a carcinogenic everywhere, not just California.


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## Tree Hugger (Sep 1, 2011)

Steve Neul said:


> Speaking about coffee, anyone drink decaf? One of the processes they use to make it is to soak the beans in methylene chloride. Methylene chloride happens to be the key ingredient in solvent based paint and varnish remover. It's considered a carcinogenic everywhere, not just California.


I mostly only drink coffee in the winter and it's half/caf.
No caffeine headaches that way but it may explain why I feel half dead in those months ...or is it the Illinois winters??

Speaking of what's in your food. My parents have grown most all there vegetables and fruit (organically) since I was a kid ...so over 50 years.
People would comment over the years at the size of his garden and say I bet you save a lot of money.
Dad would say I don't know about that ..but I know whats in my food .
Dad will be 91 soon and mom 86 , both still live in their home.


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## hawkeye10 (Feb 18, 2015)

Like my doctor told me about a condition I have. Everyone has to die of something. Now doesn't sound nice but it's true. One cigarette never hurt anyone.


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