# Need help wiring new switch.



## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

I have a 3/4hp 8" bench grinder made by Buffalo. The original switch was push/pull rocker type. It literally fell apart in pieces. I was wondering how to wire another switch to the machine. The wires from the machine are; a red & black coming from power cord. A white & black coming from capacitor and a red & black coming from the motor. What type of switch do I need for these 6 wires?


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Can you post some pictures? It should be single phase 110V so only one line should be on a switch.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

Wire in the new switch exactly as the old switch was wired. 

No reason to change anything.

George


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

I thought of that George, however no one makes this type of switch anymore. I usually can do this type of thing without advise but this one has 6 wires and the switch "literally" fell to pieces so I didn't get to see how it was wired prior to.

I'll try and post pics tomorrow.


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

Dondi12 said:


> I thought of that George, however no one makes this type of switch anymore. I usually can do this type of thing without advise but this one has 6 wires and the switch "literally" fell to pieces so I didn't get to see how it was wired prior to.
> 
> I'll try and post pics tomorrow.


Are you stating that there are actually 6 loose wire ends that need to be fastened to something. That sounds unlikely.

George


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*a 6 wire switch .....*

A double pole, double throw switch would have 6 terminals:









Unlikely to have one to control a non-reversible 3/4 HP motor, but possible....:blink:


Maybe this:
http://www.simplecircuitdiagram.com/2010/11/18/capacitor-startcapacitor-run-induction-motor/


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## Tman1 (Jan 14, 2013)

Are there other connections already made that you have not included in your description? There are not enough wires to make a capacitor motor work. There must be at least one more wire and/or connection. Pictures of the wires and switch pieces could be helpful. Also resistance measurements across the different wires and identifying which of the cord wires is hot and which is neutral (or is it 230v?) would also be helpful.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

Ill get right on the pics and post them ASAP.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

*Pics of Grinder switch wire*

one photo is of the original switch that fell apart. The other is of the wires.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

the reason i cant use the existing switch is because this is an old grinder and the plastic housing for the original switch has disintegrated with age and fell apart.


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## difalkner (Nov 27, 2011)

How many terminals are on the back side of the old switch? Can you post a photo of that? I doubt it was breaking more than one line to control on/off.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Having it completely unwired I think you need to take it to a motor repair shop to straighten it out. It's possible the old switch interrupted the neutral as well as the power line. If you knew which was the neutral it doesn't have to be on a switch, it could just be taped together with a wire nut. Probably the red wire in this case is the neutral. If you could trace it to the plug it would go into the outlet on the left. The black wire is probably the current carrying line which should go into the right side of the outlet. The green wire is the ground. It ties to the body of the grinder. In any case the old switch could be replaced with a household light switch. You just need to find out where all the rest of the wires go. The yellow and white wires are a mystery.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

I agree Steve, I thought I could use a standard single pole switch but as you see when I turned it over I realized how much I don't know about wiring. The two white wires from the capacitor go in towards the motor and a white and yellow come out. Hmmm, throws me for a loop. Do you recommend another website?


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*try this site*

there's about a Zillion diagrams here:
http://www.usmotors.com/TechDocs/Connection-Diagrams.aspx

They also have a chat line and contact us info.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Dondi12 said:


> I agree Steve, I thought I could use a standard single pole switch but as you see when I turned it over I realized how much I don't know about wiring. The two white wires from the capacitor go in towards the motor and a white and yellow come out. Hmmm, throws me for a loop. Do you recommend another website?


You might try these folks. They had a section just for electrical wiring of old equipment but I can't seem to find it tonight. http://www.owwm.org/viewforum.php?f=1


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## Tman1 (Jan 14, 2013)

A couple more questions after looking at the pictures. First, it looks like the red and black wires go into the same terminal. Is this correct? 

Second, can you tell me the rating on the capacitor?

Finally, if you could give me the resistances between the different motor wires (including the capacitor terminals), I could probably figure out the correct connections.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

Tman1, I'll see if I can get you the requested info. by tonight.
Thanks for the help.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

Here are three more pics. i hope you understand it cause i sure don't.


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## Alchymist (Jan 2, 2011)

Quite possible the two leads (yellow and white) are for the start winding, brought out so rotation could be changed, or perhaps select 120/240 volt running. Do either of the yellow or white leads show any connection (ohmmeter wise) to the centrifugal switch?


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## Tman1 (Jan 14, 2013)

I agree that this appears to be either a dual voltage or dual rotation motor. My guess is that two of the terminals on the switch are for turning the motor on and two are just posts for making connections. But, it would take resistance measurements to figure out which wires are which. Unless, you can tell a difference in the winding diameters and which windings are connected to which wires. I might be able to figure it out that way. But, I can't do that from a picture.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

Tman1- how do I test for resistance the way you say?


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## Tman1 (Jan 14, 2013)

Get a multimeter and set it for resistance (ohms). Touch one probe to one of the capacitor wire terminals and the other probe to each of the other wire terminals, in turn. Record the measurement for each wire. As long as you get a measurement for each wire (and none of them have a capital M), I should be able to figure out the connections. If there are any wires not connected to that leg of the capacitor, check against the other capacitor wire. Between the two capacitor wires, you should probably get a measurement to each of the other wires. If not, measure the resistance between the wires that are not connected to a capacitor wire. Be sure to tell me which capacitor wire is used for the measurements.

If I can't figure it out from there, I will ask for resistance measurements between specific wires. But, I probably won't need that.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

Tman1- I must be doing something wrong. I've tried it every way to Sunday and can't get anything to register. Capital M on every wire. 
I held the red lead to the capacitor first and tried every wire. The. Switched to the black lead on the capacitor and tried every wire with the same results. The meter just goes crazy. Numbers jumping all over the place. Never settles in on a reading. I'm sure the capacitor is good it was working fine until I tried to switch it off and the original switch fell apart. If you look back in the photos you will see a shot where the original switch box was turned around and you see only 4 screws where all the wires were affixed. The problem is I can't find another switch like that one and I want to know what kind of switch do I need and how to apply the wires to the new switch without burning up the motor or my shop.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

Tman1- I must be doing something wrong. I've tried it every way to Sunday and can't get anything to register. Capital M on every wire. 
I held the red lead to the capacitor first and tried every wire. Then switched to the black lead on the capacitor and tried every wire with the same results. The meter just goes crazy. Numbers jumping all over the place. Never settles in on a reading. I'm sure the capacitor is good it was working fine until I tried to switch it off and the original switch fell apart. If you look back in the photos you will see a shot where the original switch box was turned around and you see only 4 screws where all the wires were affixed. The problem is I can't find another switch like that one and I want to know what kind of switch do I need and how to apply the wires to the new switch without burning up the motor or my shop.


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## Tman1 (Jan 14, 2013)

Try placing both probe tips against each other and verify that the result is close to zero. If it isn't, check to make sure the leads are plugged in correctly. If the result is close to 0, with no capital M, then try touching the probe tip to two different spots on the same terminal to verify good contact between the probe tips and the terminals. If the result is still close to zero, test between every terminal and tell me which wires you get a measurement for and what that measurement is.

It might help to disconnect the capacitor to make sure it isn't affecting the measurements. But, it shouldn't change anything.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

I can help you if you can determine which wires go to:

the centrifugal switch (2) inside motor

start windings (2) smaller gauge, higher resistance

run windings (2) heavier wire, lower resistance

capacitor (2) outside motor

use schematic below


a series circuit will be made of the centrifugal switch, start windings, and capacitor, and ultimately connect to the output of the switch. the run windings will connect in parallel with that circuit.

the new switch will have the black (hot) and red (neut) on one end, and the two circuits connected to the other end.


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## Dixiereb31 (Nov 23, 2009)

TimPa, thanks but that just confused me even more. 

Tman1, I thought you WANTED the capacitor to be connected. That's the way I did it. One lead on the capacitor the other on each wire.
Now your saying REMOVE the capacitor? Is that correct?
Put both leads on one wire to see if the meter registers close to zero.

Ideally what should I be reading?


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## Tman1 (Jan 14, 2013)

Whether the capacitor is in the circuit shouldn't really matter. If you try to measure across it, you will get something like Mega ohms of resistance. Across the windings you will probably get somewhere between 5 and 50 ohms, defending on the winding design for the motor and which part of the winding you are measuring across. 

If you can't get any low measurements measurement across a single terminal (should be almost 0), then your meter,probes or setup is bad. If you get a reading close to 0 across a single terminal, but cannot get a low reading between at least 2 sets of 2 different terminals, then you probably have an open somewhere in the motor. In either of these conditions, I won't be able to help you remotely. 

If you can get some resistance measurements, I can help you. Or, as TimPa is suggesting, you should be able to see 2 different wire sizes in the motor windings. If you can tell us what color wires are connected to the different size windings, we may be able to help you.


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## TimPa (Jan 27, 2010)

Dondi12 said:


> TimPa, thanks but that just confused me even more.


 sorry about that.

can you identify the two wires that go to the:

centrifugal switch?

capacitor?

run winding (heavier gauge wire)?

start winding (lighter gauge wire)?

if so, then I can help you hook them up.


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## REWALTER (Jul 10, 2018)

*Info on the 8" Buffalo Grinder Push Pull switch*

As a followup for others: The Buffalo 8" grinder, model B-8CB is a dual-voltage grinder with a starter capacitor and it has 6 wires connected to a 4 contact switch. The "Jet BGS8-076" grinder switch that is used by the Buffalo b-8cb, Galaxy, Duracraft and TestRite grinders is no longer available. The good news is that there is a replacement switch from another manufacturer: "3030-9001 push pull switch for RDX grinders" from Wholesale Tool is a direct replacement. It has the same 4-screw contacts on the back and the same push-pull diamond pattern front plate. For those with a broken grinder- here are pictures of my buffalo with a broken switch. The pics show the wiring diagram for 110 and 220, and the proper wire connections for the 4 contacts.


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## schoolahardknocks52 (Jul 21, 2018)

REWALTER said:


> As a followup for others: The Buffalo 8" grinder, model B-8CB is a dual-voltage grinder with a starter capacitor and it has 6 wires connected to a 4 contact switch. The "Jet BGS8-076" grinder switch that is used by the Buffalo b-8cb, Galaxy, Duracraft and TestRite grinders is no longer available. The good news is that there is a replacement switch from another manufacturer: "3030-9001 push pull switch for RDX grinders" from Wholesale Tool is a direct replacement. It has the same 4-screw contacts on the back and the same push-pull diamond pattern front plate. For those with a broken grinder- here are pictures of my buffalo with a broken switch. The pics show the wiring diagram for 110 and 220, and the proper wire connections for the 4 contacts.


Awesome I think you just solved my problem. I need a switch for a similar 'Elephant' brand Industrial rated Electric Bench Grinder Model 255-7 
1/2 hp
3450 rpms
1 phase
It is like brand new with a busted switch. Looks like someone set it down on something not realizing the bottom was open and the switch got destroyed. There are 6 wires, but where yours is yellow & white, mine is yellow & gray with a black & red *all 4 of these come from motor*, then I have a black & red plus a green ground coming directly from a push/pull switch.

I'm new to this forum and found your answer and pics in a search. This thread was a dream because Dondi12 asked the same question and had the same wiring. 
Most of these replies were awesome... just above my head on electrical knowledge.

REWALTER: Do you think there may be some type of universal switch that I could purchase for mine? I've looked all over for parts for this thing and the ONLY one I have found was used and for sale in Africa. ...REALLY!

Any suggestions welcome!


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## REWALTER (Jul 10, 2018)

schoolahardknocks52- Well ordering a used one from South Africa sounds expensive and complicated!
A lot of those grey\green\orange Elephant grinders use the same switch design as the Buffalo's.
I am not overly electrically-minded either- but you could technically use any 110\240 rated switch and just wire up one set of wires to switch and the other set just permanently wire together. However- If you do that you still have to make a box\figure out how to mount it which is a pain.

So if you have a push\pull switch 6 wire grinder (which it sounds like you do) then that RDX 3030-9001 switch from WholesaleTools should fit perfectly. http://www.wttool.com/
One note: I have found that their website is not good at properly pricing shipping on small single items, so i would call and order it over the phone and tell them to ship it the cheapest way possible. (otherwise their site wants to charge 12 bucks in shipping on a $20 switch)

Also - on the buffalo's the green ground wire connects up to the underside of the chassis to a screw.


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## OldDon (Feb 19, 2018)

This thread is a good example of NEVER remove wires from a switch (or motor or or or ....) without recording their locations first. Take photos if possible too. 



Having said that I hope the new switch solves the OP's problem.


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## schoolahardknocks52 (Jul 21, 2018)

I got this grinder for free and the switch on mine was busted already and there are a few pieces missing that were thrown away. I'm anal, I put tape and writing on EVERYTHING. Been there and Not Done That lol

Looks like REWALTER has me straightened out. I will try and post a few pics so others will have them to go by ...in a few more years 
THANKS OldDon!


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## schoolahardknocks52 (Jul 21, 2018)

REWALTER THANK YOU!
I will still try and post some pics for future reference to the next person with this problem. You've been wonderful help man.
And nope... I wasn't planning on ordering one from SA. It was just the only one I had seen anywhere on the internet and I googled the heck out of it. That 110/220 hook up sounds good and I may try it first. I can rig up a box or mount no problem.
Think I'll try the cheap route first and then check out that tool link that you sent me. THANK YOU SIR.
I understand how some are on shipping, it's get the price confirmed over the phone, write down the time, take a name, request an email confirmation after order...cyob 
And the green wire is just as you said, screwed to the base. You purty smart there. THANKS AGAIN REWALTER!


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## Mycrossover (May 18, 2018)

Looking at your motor drawing I would guess that the extra terminals on the motor were just tie points for a double pole single throw switch, that cuts power to both sides of the line the red and black are the run windings and The wire going to the cap is one end of the centrifugal switch and start winding that are in series inside the motor. The other wire coming out of the hole is the other end of the centrifugal switch and start winding. If you put a meter on those two wires you should only see a few ohms throught the switch and start winding. The red and black should read higher. Put the power cord wires on one side of the double pole switch and put the red and black on the other. Put the white and yellow on the same terminals. Polarity does not matter. Don't forget to ground the green power cord wire to the shell of the machine.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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