# Dustless Shop - Does anyone shoot for one?



## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

There’s a Doctor in San Diego California name Tyme who is an advocate for Dustless Work Environments after spending decades treating patients with respiratory illnesses. He’s also a long-time Woodworker with an amazing shop… full of Laguna and Festool goodies.

Take a tour of a magical, dustless shop, Part I – 



Take a tour of a magical, dustless shop, Part II – 




Big $$$ – but DUSTLESS.

I’m shooting for DUSTLESS on a lower budget.

Is anyone else shooting for a Completely Dustless Shop?

-- Drew - NE Ohio


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

No. 

George


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Not me. I started working professionally in woodworking in 1973 and have been in it ever since. My first job was catching teak and mahogany coming out of a planer with not even a paper mask. I did that for I don't know how many months. I worked for about fifteen years before I worked for any shop that had dust control. It was mainly to remove chips instead of airborne dust. There was as much of airborne dust there as any shop. I didn't put any dust control in my own shop until last year. I had purchased a table saw that required it and was a lot of trouble to remove the dust so the dust collector was bought for that saw. For me dust control is a broom and shovel and I don't have any respiratory problems. I did work for a shop once that used a lot of MDF which I found irritating. There I wore a paint respirator when cutting or sanding.


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## Jig_saw (May 17, 2015)

No, dustless shop is a luxury for most woodworkers. I sometimes wear a surgical mask when operating the router and sander on exotic hardwoods.


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## Mort (Jan 4, 2014)

Dust control is definitely at the top of my spec list in any tool I'm buying now. I have bad lungs (2nd hand smoke when I was very young) and the dust bothers my breathing. 

Plus it's a lot easier to clean up a mess that you didn't make in the first place.


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## pweller (Mar 10, 2014)

I suspect the reason why that guy's shop is dust-free is because it is also wood-free!

I see a whole lot of emphasis on the tools, and no mention whatsoever as to what he makes. That alone makes me suspicious. If someone knows/cares enough to post some photos of his work (not his tools), I might change my mind...


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## tvman44 (Dec 8, 2011)

The only way I can think of to have a "dust free shop" is to never do anything in there except clean. 0


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

Why on earth would you want a wood shop with no sawdust? That's like a mechanics shop with no grease...


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## Ecurb (Mar 1, 2016)

that's really a great shop and the guy seems so cool. I think he's cry if he had to work in my shop. As for dust, I'm so far away from being able to control it, at this point I would just like to get a good mask.


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## BWSmith (Aug 24, 2010)

We ran 650'of Cherry through a cpl shapers a week or so ago.What chips/dust that wasn't picked up by the system could fit in a coffee mug.Even I was impressed.


We have standing agreement with friends with shops,when someone first walks in.They do an immediate assessment of the dust.It has been working pretty well because of the objectivity.


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## Brian(J) (Feb 22, 2016)

Like an earlier contributor, I and my friends spent a lot of years working in dusty shops and none of us have any issues, so I decided that for me going to extraordinary lengths to capture the last 2% just wasn't worth it.
There was a very interesting article:

https://woodgears.ca/dust/dylos.html

in which it's claimed that with even a cheap dust collector you get cleaner air in your shop than outside air. In any case, I weekly put on a mask, spin up the air comp, and blow up the dust from the entire shop while running the dust collector. It amazes me how quickly the air clears, and how little dust remains when I repeat the process a little while later.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

I was never one for "total dust free", however, I was very big on almost dust free. I would sweep after every change in operation, that is, after table saw use, joiner or planer use and even the drill press as well as hand planing. This would occur at least twice a day, probably under 10 minutes a pop. This also included putting up ALL of my tools even though I knew I would need them again in a few minutes. I like to start every new operation with a clean shop. Every night before shut down, I would turn on the exhaust fans and use leaf blower to 'blow down'. When I had bigger shops, the employees would do it sometimes with 3 leaf blowers at the same time. 
Customers were more impressed with a clean and orderly shop than one that looked like a typical woodworking shop. The time lost in the clean-up and put-up operations was way less than working in a mess and always searching for tools and parts. Also another perk is that if I needed to spray some lacquer on something relatively small, the air was clean enough to do it on my work bench if I wanted to. Even coffee tables can be considered relatively small.


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## unclefester (Aug 23, 2013)

Shop is absolutely amazing 
On a small scale I use Festools for the dust collection. As Mort said- much easier to clean up what's not there.
I'm working on better chip and dust collection for the table saw next.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*In spite of all I do....*

I still get settled dust around on tables and horizontal surfaces. I run a Jet 1100 1 1/2 HP DC with a cannister, actual 2 of them, one for the tables and small joiner, the other for the planers and drum sanders. I also hook the Rigid shop vacs to the RAS and to any hand held sanders. I have a JET ASF 1000 3 speed overhead air filtration unit I run when sanding. Even with all that, there is some dust.

I don't know if "dust free" is possible without a monster DC unit, like 5 HP or more and continuous air filtration. :frown2:

http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f7/dust-collection-woodnthings-shop-part-1-a-20273/


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## WarnerConstInc. (Nov 25, 2008)

No, not really.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

Garage Shop? Freestanding?

I wouldn't worry about it either.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

I just get tired of cleaning up... not that worried about the health issue.

I love the smell of Oak and Walnut and Maple... the woods that I use most.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

I look forward to having less to clean.

I had a system set up on the floor... basically moving 4" hose around and having it attached to some machines.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

I would guess that I had about a 75% dust collection rate before... with the Jet Air Cleaners getting half of what was left.

I'm shooting for 99% this time.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

Interesting...

I have a few cheap instruments from China... like a laser temperature gauge (good for testing electronic components)... a Luxmeter (Lumens) to test lighting in the shop... and a few others...

But I never considered an air quality meter. 

I would just like to have less to clean up.

Plus... I'm divorced... and have ladies visit who don't understand why there is so much dust in the house.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

Sounds great!

I'd settle for that... maybe... still shooting for Dustless.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

I've finished the Dust Collection Enclosures for the Miter Saws... Radial Arm saw next (because it's similar)... then Table Saw... then slowly progress to every tool that makes dust.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*OK< but ...*

Not every tool makes dust. Some machines make chips which are completely different....:surprise2:


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

I have 2 Jet 1100 CFM Dust Collectors... 2 Jet Air Cleaners... (one for each room in a 750 sq ft basement shop)... and cyclones. I also have a small cyclone on a wall-mounted shop vac for CLEANING the shop.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

Dr Drew

If you have q garage shop, you can conquer most of your problems with a big floor fan or an old attic exhaust fan on a frame. then blow down with either a leaf blower or a shop vac on blow. If that will create an outside dust problem, aim the exhaust at a home made filter stand. The idea is to never let it accumulate.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Spo, with all that ....*



DrDrew said:


> I have 2 Jet 1100 CFM Dust Collectors... 2 Jet Air Cleaners... (one for each room in a 750 sq ft basement shop)... and cyclones. I also have a small cyclone on a wall-mounted shop vac for CLEANING the shop.


What is your dust dilemma? Do it work or do it not work?
Sounds very similar to what I have and it still doesn't get all the dust. Are you shooting for dust free then? I think you would need constant air filtration on a large scale AND point of generation dust collection. Sanders, bandsaws and to some extent the table saw, depending on the material being cut, are the worst dust generators.

Tables saws are the most difficult to capture the dust because usually they just have an open box/cabinet under the spinning blade. The better ones have a blade shroud housing, I think Saw Stop possibly? I have experimented with "over the blade" tablesaw dust collection with fairly good results, but sometimes it's in the way. So, it may be used, or may not be.

I have 2 drum sanders a single 12" and a dual 24" and they will make more dust than you can imagine. So, I connect the shortest 4" hose I can directly from the Jet 1100 cannister with fairly good results. I'm trying, but it still ain't perfect. :frown2:


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## TerryQ (Apr 8, 2014)

Tony B said:


> I was never one for "total dust free", however, I was very big on almost dust free. I would sweep after every change in operation, that is, after table saw use, joiner or planer use and even the drill press as well as hand planing. This would occur at least twice a day, probably under 10 minutes a pop. This also included putting up ALL of my tools even though I knew I would need them again in a few minutes. I like to start every new operation with a clean shop. Every night before shut down, I would turn on the exhaust fans and use leaf blower to 'blow down'. When I had bigger shops, the employees would do it sometimes with 3 leaf blowers at the same time. Customers were more impressed with a clean and orderly shop than one that looked like a typical woodworking shop. The time lost in the clean-up and put-up operations was way less than working in a mess and always searching for tools and parts. Also another perk is that if I needed to spray some lacquer on something relatively small, the air was clean enough to do it on my work bench if I wanted to. Even coffee tables can be considered relatively small.


I do the same. Have a bad foot/ankle and stepping on a bunch of scraps underfoot is down right painful.


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## Jig_saw (May 17, 2015)

If somebody does not like sawdust, they should not be in woodworking at all.


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## Mort (Jan 4, 2014)

Jig_saw said:


> If somebody does not like sawdust, they should not be in woodworking at all.


I don't know about that. I don't like grease and oil all over my hands but I still work on my own truck.


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## sanchez (Feb 18, 2010)

Mort said:


> Jig_saw said:
> 
> 
> > If somebody does not like sawdust, they should not be in woodworking at all.
> ...


It was only a matter of time till somebody posted that. It usually shows up in dust collection threads.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*me either*



Jig_saw said:


> If somebody does not like sawdust, they should not be in woodworking at all.



Quoting Mort:
_I don't know about that. I don't like grease and oil all over my hands but I still work on my own truck. _

If you don't "like" sawdust, what ever that means....?
You mean cleaning it up, breathing it in, the smell of it ...what? Like has nothing to do with it. It's a necessary part of woodworking and not the healthiest thing for you especially exotic hardwoods. If collecting and containing sawdust is not a necessary part of woodworking, there are a whole lot of dust collection systems being sold as a ruse.


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## Jig_saw (May 17, 2015)

Sawdust is an essential product of woodworking. It is unavoidable, no matter how clean your workshop is. One has to live with it. If you hate the smell of sawdust, perhaps woodworking is not for you. 


Similarly if you hate getting your hands messed up with grease and oil, perhaps garage work is not for you. If you hate getting your head underwater, perhaps diving is not for you. If you hate the smell of manure, perhaps cattle farming is not for you. If you are scared of heights, perhaps mountaineering is not for you. And so on.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> I still get settled dust around on tables and horizontal surfaces. I run a Jet 1100 1 1/2 HP DC with a cannister, actual 2 of them, one for the tables and small joiner, the other for the planers and drum sanders. I also hook the Rigid shop vacs to the RAS and to any hand held sanders. I have a JET ASF 1000 3 speed overhead air filtration unit I run when sanding. Even with all that, there is some dust.
> 
> I don't know if "dust free" is possible without a monster DC unit, like 5 HP or more and continuous air filtration. :frown2:
> 
> http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f7/dust-collection-woodnthings-shop-part-1-a-20273/



I think that the main culprit for dust getting away is dust port and dust collection enclosure design at the machines. That's where I'm concentrating my efforts.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> Quoting Mort:
> _I don't know about that. I don't like grease and oil all over my hands but I still work on my own truck. _
> 
> If you don't "like" sawdust, what ever that means....?
> You mean cleaning it up, breathing it in, the smell of it ...what? Like has nothing to do with it. It's a necessary part of woodworking and not the healthiest thing for you especially exotic hardwoods. If collecting and containing sawdust is not a necessary part of woodworking, there are a whole lot of dust collection systems being sold as a ruse.




I love the smell of sawdust... just not the cleaning.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

Tony B said:


> Dr Drew
> 
> If you have q garage shop, you can conquer most of your problems with a big floor fan or an old attic exhaust fan on a frame. then blow down with either a leaf blower or a shop vac on blow. If that will create an outside dust problem, aim the exhaust at a home made filter stand. The idea is to never let it accumulate.




I have a 750 sq ft Basement Shop... but I've sealed the areas that can get to the furnace area and about eliminated the dust in the house.

It's the shop cleaning that's my focus now... with better dust collection enclosure designs.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

unclefester said:


> Shop is absolutely amazing
> On a small scale I use Festools for the dust collection. As Mort said- much easier to clean up what's not there.
> I'm working on better chip and dust collection for the table saw next.




I have a design for my Table Saw that does NOT include a boom arm... working on it next.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> Not every tool makes dust. Some machines make chips which are completely different....:surprise2:




A better port and Dust Collection Enclosure at EVERY machine is possible.

I'm going for the saws first... then the jointer and planer.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> What is your dust dilemma? Do it work or do it not work?
> Sounds very similar to what I have and it still doesn't get all the dust. Are you shooting for dust free then? I think you would need constant air filtration on a large scale AND point of generation dust collection. Sanders, bandsaws and to some extent the table saw, depending on the material being cut, are the worst dust generators.
> 
> Tables saws are the most difficult to capture the dust because usually they just have an open box/cabinet under the spinning blade. The better ones have a blade shroud housing, I think Saw Stop possibly? I have experimented with "over the blade" tablesaw dust collection with fairly good results, but sometimes it's in the way. So, it may be used, or may not be.
> ...



I'm expanding my shop to a second room for Assembly and Finishing... so the Dust Collection system was de-installed until I get done. There will be a lot of machine moving when the room is finished.

I agree... sealing an enclosure in the cabinet of my table saw will be a challenge... but I have some ideas.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

TerryQ said:


> I do the same. Have a bad foot/ankle and stepping on a bunch of scraps underfoot is down right painful.




That's a great practice for a commercial shop... cleaning often.

I tend to do a few projects before cleaning... but I also plan to change that to cleaning after every job.


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## NE Ohio Woodworkers (Mar 15, 2016)

Jig_saw said:


> If somebody does not like sawdust, they should not be in woodworking at all.



If someone has nothing better to say... they should not be in forums at all...

... but I guess it's just another reply for you to pad your stats.

I've been woodworking for 35 years... as a hobby. I'm an Engineering Project Manager who works on whatever continent I'm in the mood for. 
I get rid of idiots who have nothing better to say.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*totally agree!*



DrDrew said:


> I think that the main culprit for dust getting away is dust port and dust collection enclosure design at the machines. That's where I'm concentrating my efforts.


And that's about the last feature of a whole lot of machines were made until recently. Probably the light went on in some design engineer's head and they realized dust collection was important. About 20 years ago I purchased a 12 " 5 HP Powerrmatic table saw, about as good as you could get back then. It has a 4" port at the bottom of the cabinet and that was it. Duh. I made a sheet metal dust capture shroud right at the bottom of the blade with a 4" outlet soldered on. It works a whole lot better now.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

A clean orderly shop, especially a commercial shop, is a joy to work in. It is also more productive. 
I used to have this guy working for me and could work in knee high dust, chips and styrofoam coffee cups. Didn't bother him one bit. 
I finally fired him. He seemed to work fairly efficient because everyone would have to clean around him, and look for where he put tools last. The problem was that everyone else was losing time because of his mess and disorderlyness. I hated to fire him because he was a fairly good woodworker but he was costing me money and everyone else was frustrated by him. 
Regardless, it's your shop and you keep it the way you want it.


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## Jig_saw (May 17, 2015)

epicfail48 said:


> Why on earth would you want a wood shop with no sawdust? That's like a mechanics shop with no grease...



I completely agree!:grin:


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

epicfail48 said:


> Why on earth would you want a wood shop with no sawdust? .......


We all have different goals. My goal as both an amateur and professional woodworker was to produce a product. 
Sawdust is a* by-product* and so I treat it as such. It is going to be produced whether I like it or not and will eventually be disposed of.There are lots of useful applications for sawdust and I have used some of them. But back to woodworking, sawdust all over the shop is not my goal. 

I can produce something of wood either for a profit, for a gift or for my own personal use. Neither myself nor my recipriants have ever found a need to display sawdust. But if that is what you want, go for it.


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## Ged313 (Mar 15, 2016)

I think that keeping dust out of the workshop is a good goal to aim for.
But this is difficult. So if you are able to work next to a door and blow the dust out when you are working this will help.


I think that having a good dust mask that is comfortable is a good precaution such as this one:



http://bestscrollsaws.com/comfy-mask-elastic-strap-dust-mask-for-scroll-saw-woodworkinggardening/


Hope this helps.


Ged


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## jilly55 (Mar 19, 2016)

I have been working with wood for about ten years now, although I have not improved much.:crying2: About 8 weeks ago, I was turning some old spalted maple from many years ago. I am now having some allergy issues that I have never before had. I don't think it is the spalting, but the very fine sawdust produced by the crumbling punky parts of the wood. I wore a mask(mostly)and used the dust collector and an air filter. I think if I clean the shop more thoroughly, it will help?
Regardless, I won't stop visiting the shop, but I don't enjoy the sneezing, coughing, watery eyes:frown2:
I vote for at least attempting to keep dust to a minimum.


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## BWSmith (Aug 24, 2010)

Google,Global Finishing Solutions.You're looking for their curtain walls and deviders.

Without spending money and effort on total machine enclosures...then you want some kind of curtain wall?

In an abstract sense,imagine a nice edge sander parked in front of a Binks style,open face booth.What's not picked up by say,a custom rolled adj. dust port/hood(see below)...would be pulled in the very predictable direction of the booth.

Yes,we all could utilize a Binks booth,but space and wallets get in the way.Enter the world of sliding curtain walls.May be as close as swiping your moms drapery hangar thing.Or commercial track?

*Adj port design allows us to open/close the inlet size to make a final "tune" on the DC system.It's necessary because of varying speeds and feeds on that cutter or tooling.Which is why total machinery enclosures are the norm these days.Think of the idea like a portable welding curtain,where we have to work next to the weldor.


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

A dust free environment is technically achievable with the limiting factor being the cost. For most, it is extremely limiting. 
Given that, there is still lots you *can* do to get to a really high level of dust free, like maybe 95% or better, with very little effort. 
There are many good suggestions above and here is another one. Just make a skirting around your table saw base and make a 'drawer' to slide underneath it. Nothing fancy, just slide it on the floor. Even with the pegboard sides, and open rear, the amount of sawdust and chips collected is astounding. Also, being contained, the dust collected in the drawer is less prone to being blown around. 
When I say 95% dust free is relatively achievable without much effort, you will still have to blow down every day. 
If for example you cut some boards up, glued and nailed them or whatever, and your shop has been maintained pretty clean, you will be able to spray lacquer or conversion varnish with no dust will be in your finish.


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## Ged313 (Mar 15, 2016)

Tony,


I like your idea of skirting around your desk - that's what I like about this forum - people share so many good ideas here!


I have a dust collector that collects most of the dust, and I have found an air filtration system sucks the small particles of dust
out of the workshop for me.


Best Regards
Ged


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## peteroo (Dec 1, 2016)

Hi Thyme
my name is Peter and I am from Australia. I have been a natural health enthusiast for 56 years. I am planning a dustless woodworking workshop of about 50 square metres. An important aspect to the new shop will be the central dust extraction room. In this room the dust extractors are positioned around the internal walls to serve height adjustable workbenches for my festo rail saw (Britains "The Woodworker and Woodturner" magazine feature in about November 2012), my height adjustable router table , Triton table saw and any heavy equipment I will buy requiring volume dust extraction instead of pressure extraction. The central room will be about 2.5Mx3M.

This central room will house the dust extractors. It will also house a machine to suck dust through the central room air openings and purify it before it is released into the outside air through sound deadening equipment. This theoretically will in turn allow fresh air to come into the building through it's external wall's sound deadening vents. THE OBJECT HERE IS TO GET AIR WHICH HAS NOT PASSED THROUGH A MACHINE AND SO WILL BE AS ELECTRICALLY BALLANCED AS POSSIBLE. This means that even the exhaust air from the vacs and dust collectors doesn't go into the workshop and up my nose. A predominately negative charge in the air, which I hope to come in from the external walls, from what I can gather, is like being at the seaside or a waterfall and so very relaxing. When air passes over metal, concrete or glass it depletes the air of negative air ions from what I have heard.

Do you know of anyone who has attempted this type of setup? If so may I ask you to give them my email address?

Thanking you in anticipation
regards
Peter Natoli


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## dumbclub (Nov 6, 2016)

I'm a big advocate of minimizing airborne dust in the shop. Residual dust that settles on horizontal surfaces will rain down later even when you aren't producing new dust, so I've tried to reduce the amount of horizontal surfaces in my shop.

I've put everything I can behind closed cabinet doors and drawers. 
Vertical lumber and sheetgoods storage helps, but better yet, store it it in a separate room. 
Flush mounted, drop-in ceiling lighting has big advantages. 
A smooth easily sweepable floor paint is great.
Unfortunately, horizontal runs of dust collection piping are hard to avoid.


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## Pineknot_86 (Feb 19, 2016)

Dust free? Depends on how much $$$ you have to spend on a DC and filtration system. I use a Shop Vac where possible. I wear a dust mask or a respirator. The only thing is my glasses don't fit right so I get headaches because of the glasses. Just learn to hold your breath for long periods of time.
I recall an engineer in the LA area telling about a law passed by California legislators. Doors were to be sealed on three sides to prevent polluted air from entering the building. The fourth area was to be left open for ventilation. Go figure!


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## Highwheel1 (Jan 18, 2017)

I originally started with a shop that was about 25 X 30 feet. This was with a 2 hp bag type dust collector that I would carry the hose over to the particular tool I was using. Along with the bag vac I also had an air filter hanging from the ceiling. Later, I doubled the size of the shop, got a 5hp Oneida Dust Gorilla, fixed ducting to all stationary tools, and also use a down draft table for sanding. 


Needless to say, the difference is amazing and I believe worth the cost. Not only is the new shop a joy to work in because of the extra space, working in a neat and clean shop is sooo much nicer. Having said that, I still use a vacuum for the floor - a lot. You cannot catch every chip, piece of flying debris, and general dust at its source in any shop no matter how many controls you have. A miter saw will negate that every time. I do believe it is the unattainable goal to aim for even though you know you will never reach it. Its certainly better for your lungs, provides a better working environment, and at least gives the appearance of a better run shop.


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

Uhmm..definitely the most important thing to me is cleanliness..right after having a nice, soft concrete floor padded with sawdust....
Actually all the sawdust on the floor does help with leg and foot fatigue.. 








On the other hand it doesn't do much for the rest of the floors in the house.. It tends to track inside as well.


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## Chad Holst (Mar 11, 2014)

I'm blown away. Punn intended. Yes, clean up is easier with dust collection and yes clean air to breath is important. By itself this seems like enough reason to have a high quality Air cleaning system. But..I'm a wood worker, and that means I care about my final product. I need the air clean so when I am finishing I don't have to deal with dust in my final product. I'd like to see a high gloss finish come out of a shop that had an inch of dust on the floor and on every tool you walk by. 
Keeping the air clean helps your tools, your lungs your clean up time...but it also makes a better product. IMO


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## Bellarosecabinets (Jan 28, 2017)

Saw dust means you are working a 100% clean shop is a shop that does very little wood work.
No system will ever get all the dust in the shop.


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## dumbclub (Nov 6, 2016)

Bellarosecabinets said:


> Saw dust means you are working a 100% clean shop is a shop that does very little wood work.


What does that mean?
Maybe you should try that again.


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## Jim Frye (Aug 24, 2016)

Since I have a basement shop, my goal is to keep the sawdust inside the shop, but I try to minimize the stuff inside the room. Lots of sweeping and vacuuming between set ups. Every few years, I would crank the ambient air filter to high and blow everything in the shop with the air compressor. There is a non-woven door mat at the shop door and carpet scrap at the foot of the basement stairs to catch shoe borne sawdust.


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## Bellarosecabinets (Jan 28, 2017)

I'm a big advocate of minimizing airborne dust in the shop. Residual dust that settles on horizontal surfaces will rain down later even when you aren't producing new dust, so I've tried to reduce the amount of horizontal surfaces in my shop.

I've put everything I can behind closed cabinet doors and drawers. 
Vertical lumber and sheetgoods storage helps, but better yet, store it it in a separate room. 
Flush mounted, drop-in ceiling lighting has big advantages. 
A smooth easily sweepable floor paint is great.
Unfortunately, horizontal runs of dust collection piping are hard to avoid.
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If my shop looked like this then there is a $300,000 cabinet job that didn't get done. Clean and organized is a great goal but dust free is a shop that doesn't get used. There is nothing better than dust everywhere, and a beautiful custom curved copper and wood hood that is a work of art in the middle of all that dust. Saw Dust = A Great Day Of Hard Work. I'm sorry but the goal of dust free doesn't make sense to me. Like it or not, that is my two cents.


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## Bellarosecabinets (Jan 28, 2017)

like this picutre


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## Pirate (Jul 23, 2009)

I sweep my detached shop so much, it takes a long time.
Finding the broom from the last sweep, takes even longer!


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## Pineknot_86 (Feb 19, 2016)

I wear a quality dust mask in the shop. I have a respirator but my glasses don't fit properly, giving me a headache. A dustless shop is like having no traffic accidents in Atlanta at rush hour. To sum it up in two words- Im Possible.


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## dumbclub (Nov 6, 2016)

Sorry I haven't been back to this thread in a while, but I see that some guys don't think it's possible to be productive and have a clean shop at the same time.

I think it comes down to our individual temperament and routine. I can't work in chaos, some can. I also believe that a clean shop is a safe shop. 

There's also the volume factor. I don't do $300,000 cabinet jobs that would require a frenetic pace. However, I'm always working on more than one $10-20k piece of one-of-a-kind furniture at the same time that requires an orderly workspace that helps me stay organized throughout the process. 

Everybody does it differently.


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## allpurpose (Mar 24, 2016)

I worked for years in the auto body biz breathing in bondo, fiberglass and paint with no noticeable problems so I'm not overly concerned with sawdust, but having a clean shop wouldn't break my heart..


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## Bellarosecabinets (Jan 28, 2017)

There is no shop that is used on a daily basis that is Dustless. Once again reducing dust is a good goal but Doctor in San Diego does not use that shop to build really anything just too much money. I have never been in a shop that is that clean and some of them have 3 and 4 million dollar dust collection systems. That clean is a shop that is not used.


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## Bellarosecabinets (Jan 28, 2017)

dumbclub said:


> Sorry I haven't been back to this thread in a while, but I see that some guys don't think it's possible to be productive and have a clean shop at the same time.
> 
> I think it comes down to our individual temperament and routine. I can't work in chaos, some can. I also believe that a clean shop is a safe shop.
> 
> ...



Dumbclub You do some amazing wood working. The time to keep a shop so clean is crazy to me. I would rather make another work of art then clean every spec of dust out of my shop. That is just me but it's how I think.:smile3:


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## Bellarosecabinets (Jan 28, 2017)

Ok, I really not sure if I'm fully explaining my self. So I work for an airbag company you know those things that explode in your face if you get into a car accident. My company is the largest airbag manufacturer in the world and we work with all car manufacturers. Even the bankrupt Tesla motors I know it going to be sad to see them go. But GM wanted to go from 95% reliability that the airbag will proform in the specification to a 98% reliability. This sounds like that we only get 95% of the airbags to work. That is not it at all we are 99.99% sure that the airbag will provide protection for the occupants. But for the airbag to meet all print requirements we are only 95% sure. To go from 95% to 98% requires 20X more airbags tested. That is over 3300 tested a week to get a 3% gain at cost millions of dollars.

This is the same problem for dust collection you can collect 90% of the dust and only have 10% not be pickup by the system. At a lot more cost you can get 95% where does less dust and more cost equal best for the woodworker. I would rather own a new machine to do more wood working then a more expensive dust collection system. To get to 100% takes more time cleaning and less time wood working and for me, there is nothing more important than more wood working. Nothing!!!!


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## Carl10 (Feb 3, 2017)

Astounding! This is a great and beneficial topic (or could be) and it quickly turned into a bash fest to a woodworker (and yes he is a woodworker, contrary to many previous ignorant comments). This started out as someone asking if anyone else is striving for a dustless shop, I assume to see what ideas people were using for that end. Instead, (this is the astounding part) people started bashing the idea this guy is trying to achieve, making huge assumptions, exaggerations and some plain lies.

I had seen the videos of Tyme a few years ago (the are several years old) and immediately thought that miter saw dust collection setup is a great idea. Using a vinyl curtain over the dust collection box behind the saw allowed light to come forward but did what most miter saw collectors don't do and that is seal up that huge gaping hole that the dust collection cone creates. Without the seal your are trying to filter a massive amount of space. This idea forces the air right by the blade and into the collector. I mention just this one simple example as I I saw a low cost version of this used by Jay Bates. He is a good example of a wood worker who was ignorant about dust collection until, for health reasons, became aware. He upgraded his system, and incorporated a similar closed miter saw cone, but he simply made a wood cover (instead of a expensive thick clear vinyl cover).

My point is dust collection is very objective with the equipment available today. However many woodworkers do not want to hear the reality of dust until it is too late. You know the comments like "I have been doing X for 30 years and I don't have any problems". That just sounds the same as "I have been smoking for 30 years and I don't have any problems". When you are aware of what dust CAN do to you both statements sound just as ridiculous. Because most wood workers don't have the equipment and lab testing is inconsistent there are a lot of highly subjective comments about a very objective situation. You have heard the comment "well I have X DC and it works just fine". Since just 'fine' is subjective it is like saying I use filtered cigarettes so its OK! Or I like, " I use Y and I get plenty of suction" when the laws of physics can tell you that Y equipment can't produce enough suction to be plenty.

If you made it this far in my ramble, then I hope going forward everyone can post about ideas they have found that have helped reduce dust in the shop. 

For the record:

Tyme never stated this is what my shop looks before during and after I work on my machines (Truly dustless). I believe his passion for a dustless working environment came from other woodworkers he came across with respiratory issues.

Bellarosecabinets: I think you are comparing apples to watermelons with the airbag analogy. Testing more units is a statistical necessity to prove the reliability of a design versus what the capability of one dust collector. True they both spend more money for better results but for different reasons. The point should be what can you do and NOT spend a lot of money.

As my first contribution to low cost low dust workshops I suggest Rob Cosman's bandsaw dust collection idea. Its effective and can be accomplished with a vacuum. 



.

Hope this helps.

Carl


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## ducbsa (Jul 6, 2014)

I have a 4" line going to the lower housing of my http://www.grizzly.com/products/14-Extreme-Series-Bandsaw/G0555X , but I'm going to see if there is room for this setup.


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## Chris Curl (Jan 1, 2013)

My approach for a dustless shop is to not make dust in the first place. No machines = no dust. If I need to run the table saw, I take it out onto the driveway. Plenty of shavings and chips, but no dust.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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