# about to give up on bookshelf staining



## justinharvey (May 9, 2010)

I've built a set of red oak bookshelves and am now at a point where I need to finish them. I've practiced/experimented with a handful of different products/techniques with little luck. I can't seem to hide the grain well or get the color right. I've tried a variety of sanding sealers, dye stains, pigmented stains, etc (list below) in various combinations. In the process I've been a bit overwhelmed by all the options for finishing. In the past I've refinished doors/trim with products right off the shelf of HD or Lowe's and not had any problems. Not sure why matching the finish I want is so different.

Here are some pics of the finish I want. Some are in sunlight, some are artificial light. What I'm hoping for is some guidance on a system I can follow. The trail and error process is just using up all my time and supplies. I've painted cars and houses in the past so spraying is certainly an option. I have an airless sprayer (Graco) and a traditional compressor/cup. Part of my frustration is in all the supplies I've wasted in trial and error spraying.... which is probably not even necessary for the finish I want.

If possible, I'd like to leverage some of the existing products I have from this and other projects... but if they're not going to work... then I'll use them on other projects.


Sherwin Williams - Wood Classics waterborne poly varnish, satin clear
Minwax - Fast Drying Poly - clear semi gloss
Sherwin Williams - Wood Classics - Oil Stain - Classic Cherry
Benwood - Wood Conditioner
Wood-Kote Dye Stain - Brown & Red
Sherwin Williams - Sher-wood Universal Dye Concentrate - Bordeaux
Sherwin Williams - Sher-wood Universal Dye Concentrate - Brown
Minwax water-based wood stain - decorator tint formula
Sherwin Williams - Wood Classics - Sanding sealer - clear
Gemini - Gem Glo - 709 Executive Cherry
Mohawk - E-Z Vinyl Sealer
Mohawk - DuraCoat Pre-Catalyzed Lacquer - Satin
Mohawk - Wiping wood stain - Dark Red Mahogony


Many thanks in advance.

JH


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## Rick Mosher (Feb 26, 2009)

All of the pictures are of cherry (except maybe #2), so are you trying to make oak look like cherry? Is the grain of the oak staining too dark?


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## ash123 (Mar 14, 2010)

The only way I "match" a finish is if I can paint it all the same color.

I can't even match the stuff I did 5 years ago. I can't tell what your samples are, but it looks like you are going for a plastic looking finish on top of a surface stain. Guess, I'd fill the grain, glue size, lay down a nice red NGR, go over it with a dark mahogany stain, seal, sand and finish coat. Tint the finish coat to hide the tones and grain to taste. 

If it was me, I'd throw the samples in the garbage and spray on a nice lacquer based wiping stain, seal, sand, and top with SW pre-cat bright rubbed lacquer.


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## buroak (Mar 25, 2010)

I question why you would build using red oak and then want to hide the grain. Also agree your samples look more like cherry than oak and you will never make oak look like cherry. My stain of choice is minwax oil base applied with a foam brush and wiped with cotton cloth. my finish of choice is deft laquer 3 coats min. 220 sand inbetween (and wipe the dust off) 0000 steel wool then good wax.


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## justinharvey (May 9, 2010)

Rick Mosher said:


> All of the pictures are of cherry (except maybe #2), so are you trying to make oak look like cherry? Is the grain of the oak staining too dark?


They're all the same sample piece. Yes, trying to make oak look like cherry, and yes, the grain is staining way too dark.

Thanks,


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## justinharvey (May 9, 2010)

ash123 said:


> The only way I "match" a finish is if I can paint it all the same color.
> 
> I can't even match the stuff I did 5 years ago. I can't tell what your samples are, but it looks like you are going for a plastic looking finish on top of a surface stain. Guess, I'd fill the grain, glue size, lay down a nice red NGR, go over it with a dark mahogany stain, seal, sand and finish coat. Tint the finish coat to hide the tones and grain to taste.
> 
> If it was me, I'd throw the samples in the garbage and spray on a nice lacquer based wiping stain, seal, sand, and top with SW pre-cat bright rubbed lacquer.


 
I don't necessarily need an exact match... just close. 

What do you prefer for filling grain?
When you say "tint the finish coat", what do you prefer for finishing coat?


Thanks,


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

Here's what I would try. First use a paste wood filler like this. Once you have filled the grain use an alcohol (methanol) based NGR (non-grain-raising) dye. You should try this on samples and you might start with a red Mahogany. There are many colors to pick from, and you could experiment with mix concentrations. If the color comes out right, I would go with a satin waterbased polyurethane, sprayed on.

You also have the option to spray a blush mist on the subject piece after one or two finish coats have been applied. That will "tone in" the color concentration to minimize grain differentiation.


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## ash123 (Mar 14, 2010)

justinharvey said:


> I don't necessarily need an exact match... just close.
> 
> What do you prefer for filling grain?
> When you say "tint the finish coat", what do you prefer for finishing coat?
> ...


I haven't filled grain in 30 years. When I did, I used a paste made from ground up glass. It was a pain in the a$$. 

For top coats I spray Sherwin Williams pre-cat bright rubbed lacquer.

When I tint the top coats I tint the finish with NGR stains. Final coat is clear.


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## justinharvey (May 9, 2010)

cabinetman said:


> Here's what I would try. First use a paste wood filler like this. Once you have filled the grain use an alcohol (methanol) based NGR (non-grain-raising) dye. You should try this on samples and you might start with a red Mahogany. There are many colors to pick from, and you could experiment with mix concentrations. If the color comes out right, I would go with a satin waterbased polyurethane, sprayed on.
> 
> You also have the option to spray a blush mist on the subject piece after one or two finish coats have been applied. That will "tone in" the color concentration to minimize grain differentiation.


 
I had considered a wood filler but thought a sanding sealer would accomplish the same thing. I understand what' you're saying about a blush mist... but will need to read up on that a bit. thanks for the help.


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