# final sanding grit



## tylerbjh (Jan 30, 2010)

I'm reading these forums and it seems like a lot of people are sanding too 220 grit. What kind of wood is this for. I generally finish oak which I only sand to 150 which is perfect for me. On the other hand when I'm finishing maple I only sand to 120. Am I doing things "wrong".

ps The wood I am finishing has been presanded before I am sanding basically just to reopen the pores and remove any marks from greasy hands and what not..


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## phinds (Mar 25, 2009)

Although to some extent it is a matter of personal preference and what wood and what use and what you plan to finish it with, 150 is pretty rough for most anything.

I absolutely guarantee you that if you stop at 150 grit with some hard exotics, and then take another piece and go to 600 you will be astounded at the difference.

Really hard wood with closed pores will take a glass-like polish with high grit and show definite scratch marks with anything as low as 150. For oak, I'd say that, yeah, 150's generally OK.

Paul


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## Burt Waddell (Jan 6, 2010)

With most domestic woods and a lacquer top coat, 150 to 180 grit is adequate. I think 120 on maple would be a bit rough.


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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

I purely depends on the finish you are going to apply. If you plan on using a film finish, lacquer, poly, tongue oil etc you should stop around 150-180. The finish itself is what will feel smooth.

If you are applying an oil or a wax you need to go higher, 400, 600 or as high as 1000. The wood is what you feel with these finishes, not the finish itself.


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## tylerbjh (Jan 30, 2010)

Thanks for those replies, some good information for me. I've never used oil or wax to finish wood, funny thing though after reading these forums I've decided to try it on some scrap peices of wood just for fun.

Burt you say 120 is a bit rough for maple.. if I go any higher, even too 150 I find the stain doesn't penetrate as evenly, which actually is another post I was going to make but I might as well ask here. What is your process for staining/finishing maple with penetrating stain + lacquer. I'm required to lift the grain by wetting it down by my company, although I personally feel this is an unneeded step and don't see much difference if I skip it.

Phinds and Leo G, wow I really never even knew that people sanded to 600 yet alone 1000 grit before applying a finish. I use these grits to scuff sand inbetween coats. I'm so glad I joined these forums, I want to learn as much as possible about all aspects of finishing and not just of what I do on a daily basis.

Finishing from natural products intrigues me and will be my project for tmrw.

So I'm assuming if I'm sanding up to 1000 grit, I have to sand with all the intermediate grits from lets say 150 all the way up to 1000.. so that would be 150, 180, 220, 400, 600 then 1000 right? Or is their more or less that are required.

Oh one other question.. if finishing with shellac + wax would I still sand to this high of a grit. keep in mind the only wood I have readily available is oak.. 

Thanks a lot for the replies.


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## JW_in_Indy (Mar 20, 2009)

On red oak, I always stop at #150. Here is some base and window casing that I'm doing for my family room right now. It has been sanded with #120, vacuumed, wipped with mineral spirits, sanded with #150, vacuumed and wipped again with mineral spirits, flooded with a professional grade Sher-Wood BAC wiping stain until it flashed off.... and then wipped down really good with mineral spirits once again removing all excess stain.

This is but a single coat of stain with no sealer or finish yet.

The base....








and the casing....









However, if doing anything with Poplar, Pine or Birch, I always go farther with my sanding. Usually at least #180, but normally #220. The softer the wood, the farther I take my sanding. I usually reserve the #320 and #400 grits for between finish coats. I rarely use anything finer than #400 grit. Prior to my final finish coats, I generally use a synthetic 3M sanding pad. Depending on my final finish and lustre goals, I will even do a scuff after the final finish with a fine 3M pad and then buff it out.

It just all depends. There is no "right" answer really.


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## JW_in_Indy (Mar 20, 2009)

> What is your process for staining/finishing maple with penetrating stain + lacquer. I'm required to lift the grain by wetting it down by my company, although I personally feel this is an unneeded step and don't see much difference if I skip it.


On something like Maple, I've always found that dye stains which are sprayed, rather then penetrating pigmented stains work FAR better. The dye stays more on the surface and colors the entire surface of the wood rather than relying on the pores grabbing the pigment. Even a high quality gel stain is better for Maple than a penetrating stain IMHO. Of course, what works for me may be totally wrong for you. The best practice is to test, test and test some more on scrap and find a solution that is best for you.


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## tylerbjh (Jan 30, 2010)

Very nice, if you didn't tell me I probably would have thought their was one coat of satin on it. I'll have to get a camera and post a picture of one of my railings next week.

I'm afraid I'm starting to get into some bad habits do to what I'm finishing. I finish a large rail in 3 hours start to finish(prep, stain, spray, sand, spray, touch up) I'm skipping a lot of steps that I know I should be taking such as sanding with multiple grits, wiping down with mineral spirits, lettings thing dry the appropriate time. I guess its the industry though, I need to start doing some finer finishing to develop good habits.

I'm not saying my quality isn't good.. just wish I was paid for and given the time to make it the best it could be.. if only I could prefinish my railing parts :wallbash:

Anyway very nice work


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## Leo G (Oct 16, 2006)

tylerbjh said:


> Oh one other question.. if finishing with shellac + wax would I still sand to this high of a grit. keep in mind the only wood I have readily available is oak..
> 
> Thanks a lot for the replies.


Shellac is a film finish. You could sand to 150 and apply the shellac, scuff sand and do another coat, then wax. The film finish will provide the smoothness you require for a nice feeling finish.


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## JW_in_Indy (Mar 20, 2009)

tylerbjh said:


> Very nice, if you didn't tell me I probably would have thought their was one coat of satin on it. I'll have to get a camera and post a picture of one of my railings next week.
> 
> I'm afraid I'm starting to get into some bad habits do to what I'm finishing. I finish a large rail in 3 hours start to finish(prep, stain, spray, sand, spray, touch up) I'm skipping a lot of steps that I know I should be taking such as sanding with multiple grits, wiping down with mineral spirits, lettings thing dry the appropriate time. I guess its the industry though, I need to start doing some finer finishing to develop good habits.
> 
> ...


Thanks.... Honest, no finish at all yet. Only a single coat of stain. The difference though, is that I am doing this for myself in my own home, on my time. So I can afford to be anal (which I am) and do all of the steps to get a superb final result. I wish my camera could show how smooooth everything is on this trim only sanding down to #150. I also prefer how red oak absorbs the stain at #150 versus even #180. It's minor.... but I can tell a difference. IMHO, you don't get as deep of contrast between the dark open pores of the grain and the lighter closed pore area on red oak if you sand to #180. And most definitely not if you take it to #220. But again, that's been my personal experience. Others may find things are different for them.


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## tylerbjh (Jan 30, 2010)

I completely agree with that, when I first got started in the industry I was sanding to 180 as per my bosses request. The stain didn't absorb nearly as well or come out anywhere near as rich as it does when I sand with 150. Also this is just my opinion and only goes for work. I don't have enough experience working with other species to talk about them.

I did do one walnut job one time, I sanded it to 150, I wish I would have went to a higher grit with it, but I never had to go back so I assume they were happy with it.


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