# Who all has worked with ash?



## sausagefingers (Oct 1, 2008)

Just finished paneling a couple's great room in ash, and basically was noticing how ash plywood varies SOOO much from one piece to another. Some looks identical to oak, while others are more like a really nice flamed piece of birch, and some are some weird combination with a crazy, almost marbled or zebra look. All the solid we used pretty much looked like white oak. All I'm worried about now is if the customer likes the variation in the paneling with the different grains we had to use. I'll post some picks later...


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## [email protected] (Jan 10, 2009)

Never worked with Ash ply ,only solid ash which looks almost exactly like oak.Enough to fool my wife anyway.Years ago I built a deacons bench with ash that turned out quite nice,and no one knows it isn't oak.Show us some pics of the ash ply bet its pretty


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## sausagefingers (Oct 1, 2008)

Yeah we actually used oak PM6 for the paneling with ash ply and face frame. Our customer couldn't tell a difference.


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## Just Bill (Dec 29, 2008)

Currently restoring a 36 Plymouth woody, all the solid wood is ash. Does look like white oak, but there is a big difference. It seems ash is considerably more rot resistent, which is why it was used on those old wood cars. If finishes beautifully, does not seem to warp, but easy to work, as hardwoods go.


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## sausagefingers (Oct 1, 2008)

Just Bill said:


> Currently restoring a 36 Plymouth woody, all the solid wood is ash. Does look like white oak, but there is a big difference. It seems ash is considerably more rot resistent, which is why it was used on those old wood cars. If finishes beautifully, does not seem to warp, but easy to work, as hardwoods go.


Yeah I noticed that it was pretty easy to work with. I assumed it would mill like oak, but it's noticeable easier than oak.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

If you order, or pick out "numbered and sequenced" sheets, the "A" face will be almost look alikes as the numbers sequence. The veneers are collected and laminated sequentially from the end of one sheet to the start of the next sheet. It may cost more, but the difference in price makes for a very uniform look.


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## sausagefingers (Oct 1, 2008)

cabinetman said:


> If you order, or pick out "numbered and sequenced" sheets, the "A" face will be almost look alikes as the numbers sequence. The veneers are collected and laminated sequentially from the end of one sheet to the start of the next sheet. It may cost more, but the difference in price makes for a very uniform look.


The lumber yard we used had to special order all of it in except for 2 sheets of 1/4", but those were a few years old and pretty nasty, so we we never got to see any of it before it was delivered. I guess next time we'll see if they can order numbered and sequenced material. We matched each wall we did with similar sheets so each wall is uniform.


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## Boardman (Sep 9, 2007)

Ash does look similar to red oak in the general grain pattern, but it can vary a whole lot on each board when the area was near a knot. I think ash ply is usually selected out to present a fairly uniform look, kinda like they do with hickory. Stuff kinda stinks when its planed.


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## firehawkmph (Apr 26, 2008)

Nothin' like a nice piece of ash.:laughing: I used it to redo my laundry room and adjacent bathroom. Made a couple of vanities out of it and all the woodwork. There was quite a bit of variety in the wood grain, which is what I really liked about it. I almost hate looking at red oak anymore just because it has been so overused. 
Mike Hawkins


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## sawduststeve (Jan 11, 2009)

Hey Firehawk that is a real nice piece of handy work there!!! I planed some ash boards for my cousin and burned out the feed motor on my 25" planer. He gave me $50 dollars to plane the boards which I thought was a real good deal until the next time I went to use my planer and found the drive motor gone! Can you buy ash boards? I have never seen a lumber yard around here carry anything like that!


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## firehawkmph (Apr 26, 2008)

Steve,
Around here ash is fairly common. Most lumber suppliers carry it. Rough sawn and dried, I paid 1.50/bd. ft. for it through a small solo operation. This fellow buys wood fresh sawn and dries it in his own kiln setup. From there he sells it or will plane it for a fee, or make molding also.
Mike Hawkins


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## knotscott (Nov 8, 2007)

Ash can vary a lot in color and grain detail, but it's not hard to find beautiful examples of it. The contrast of the grain is similar to oak, but IMO, the nicer examples of ash are much prettier than the nicer examples of red oak (QSWO excluded). It's very nice wood to work with...stable, machines well, stains well, and is a reasonably light hardwood.

Never worked with any ash ply.


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## mdlbldrmatt135 (Dec 6, 2006)

Great for steam bending as well.


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## peejmeister (Feb 4, 2009)

I don't mean to throw a wet blanket on the nice ash discussion, but thought I'd post my experience. Our builder used solid ash and ash plywood for the wood trim in our family room. Apparently the solid stock they used was infested with powderpost beetles. Annually they chew their way out of the wood and make tiny, fine sawdust piles all over the wood. From what I've read, ash is more susceptible to them than other hardwoods. At least here in Texas, I'm going to stay away from ash and replace the delectables in my family room with oak, as folks have noted, it matches nicely.


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## BORKBOB (Feb 9, 2009)

I built some laundry room cabinets for my daughter using ash. I bought 100 bd. ft. just to have it, and I really enjoyed working with it. The 1/4" ply I used for the panels was pretty tame.


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## sawduststeve (Jan 11, 2009)

Here in Montana you probably pay close $1.50 a BD. ft. for pine any kind of hardwood goes for over two. Most of the Oak I buy goes for around 4.00 and walnut is like 7.00. Anytime anybody wants to come west with a load of hardwood come look me up maybe we can work a deal


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## Dean Miller (Jan 29, 2009)

I just finished a workbench out of ash. Cousin bought it back east for stickers for a heavy load he was hauling. Variable grains and colors makes a pretty bench.


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## Juniperlampguy (Nov 11, 2007)

The only experience I have had with ash was about 35 years ago.

I was a freshman in high school, and since I did not have the required money for my own project in woodshop, my shop teacher decided to have me help him build his own gun rack out of ash. 

I did not know how to set up the planer, and shoved one of those beautiful wide pieces of wood into it. I planed about the first foot of that 1" board down to about 3/8" before I got the power shut off.:bangin::wallbash:
Can't remember If I got kicked out of that class or I voluntarily transferred somewhere else, but that was the end of that project for me.


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## toddj99 (Jan 1, 2008)

here's a sewing table with a little ash in it as the frame and legs. wife wanted a quick, simple sewing table so i used a portion of 3/4" maple ply i bought at a yardsale that had a few dings and scratches for $10 then used some ash i had laying around. as you can tell, i cheated on the drawers. they can be taken out if necessary and changed but, like i said, wife wanted something quick.


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## scribbles (Mar 2, 2009)

I have always liked ash, and have done a few solid 3/4tg NG floors, and cabinet sets in it and they turned out really well. But they were in rustic cabins, so the variance in color was designed.


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## the miz (Feb 24, 2009)

sausagefingers said:


> Just finished paneling a couple's great room in ash, and basically was noticing how ash plywood varies SOOO much from one piece to another. Some looks identical to oak, while others are more like a really nice flamed piece of birch, and some are some weird combination with a crazy, almost marbled or zebra look. All the solid we used pretty much looked like white oak. All I'm worried about now is if the customer likes the variation in the paneling with the different grains we had to use. I'll post some picks later...



Ash and oak are in the same genus(family) which is why the grains look so much alike. The difference is in the amount of tannins in the wood. Ash has almost no tannin which is why it maintains its color when clear coating where oak will turn pink or brown (depending on the species). This is due to the solvent reacting with the tannins (acids) in the wood. Ash veneer is made from all parts of the tree so you get a lot of variation in pattern. You need to find quartersawn or riftsawn (more expensive) veneer ply to get consistency in pattern. What you probably have is plain sliced.


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## the miz (Feb 24, 2009)

peejmeister said:


> I don't mean to throw a wet blanket on the nice ash discussion, but thought I'd post my experience. Our builder used solid ash and ash plywood for the wood trim in our family room. Apparently the solid stock they used was infested with powderpost beetles. Annually they chew their way out of the wood and make tiny, fine sawdust piles all over the wood. From what I've read, ash is more susceptible to them than other hardwoods. At least here in Texas, I'm going to stay away from ash and replace the delectables in my family room with oak, as folks have noted, it matches nicely.



Pity, ash is becoming a little more scarce now that we have emerald ash borer infestation in the US. It seems bugs like ash because of the lack of tannins in the wood.


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## sausagefingers (Oct 1, 2008)

the miz said:


> Ash and oak are in the same genus(family) which is why the grains look so much alike. The difference is in the amount of tannins in the wood. Ash has almost no tannin which is why it maintains its color when clear coating where oak will turn pink or brown (depending on the species). This is due to the solvent reacting with the tannins (acids) in the wood. Ash veneer is made from all parts of the tree so you get a lot of variation in pattern. You need to find quartersawn or riftsawn (more expensive) veneer ply to get consistency in pattern. What you probably have is plain sliced.


Wow thanks that explains a lot. If I remember I'll take some pics tomorrow now that we're done with that room. Turned out really nice, and supposedly the "designer" wants to have this house featured in some design magazine.


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## phinds (Mar 25, 2009)

*genus and family*



the miz said:


> *Ash and oak are in the same genus(family)* which is why the grains look so much alike. The difference is in the amount of tannins in the wood. Ash has almost no tannin which is why it maintains its color when clear coating where oak will turn pink or brown (depending on the species). This is due to the solvent reacting with the tannins (acids) in the wood. Ash veneer is made from all parts of the tree so you get a lot of variation in pattern. You need to find quartersawn or riftsawn (more expensive) veneer ply to get consistency in pattern. What you probably have is plain sliced.


*Ash and oak are in the same genus(family)* 

Don't mean to rain on your parade, but that statement is nonsensical on two levels. First, genera are a subset of family; the two are not the same thing at all. Second, ash and oak are not only NOT in the same genera, they aren't even in the same family. The fact that their grain is often very similar is not due to any botanical relationship other than that they are both wood.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Who knew?*

Wood identification from WoodMagazine.com
http://www.woodmagazine.com/materials-guide/lumber/wood-species-1/ash/
Botanically a member of the olive family, ash grows throughout the northern Hemisphere and numbers nearly 60 species. In North America, there are 18 species of ash. However, only a few provide commercial hardwood timber.
Foremost among them is white ash (_Fraxinus americana_), which grows from Nova Scotia and Maine west to Minnesota and south to Texas and Florida. Green ash (_Fraxinus lanceolata_) and red ash (_Fraxinus pennsylvanica_), both smaller trees than white ash, duplicate its range and are sold under its name. Black ash (_Fraxinus *****_), the Indians' basket tree, is marketed as brown ash. It likes northern climes.
Oregon ash (_Fraxinus latifolia_), grows on the Pacific Northwest coast from Washington through northern California. Equal in size to white ash, Oregon ash stands as one of the few commercial hardwoods in its region.
You can spot ash by the telltale gray bark with deep fissures in a diamond pattern. White ash, with its oval crown, may rise to 120' in the wild. Other ash species normally approach 60' to 80' tall.
Ash yields straight, close-grained wood that often displays a wavy figure. Its color ranges from creamy white to tan, but brown ash, as its name implies, is distinctly darker and brown in color. For the most interesting grain and figure, brown ash gets the nod.
Dry white ash weighs about 42 pounds per cubic foot. Brown ash is slightly lighter in weight.

From Wood Web:
http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/_Wood_species.html
There was a good article about oaks in Sawmill and Woodlot Management magazine recently. The book I wrote, Drying Oak Lumber (Forestry Dept, U of Wisc-Madison, 608-262-9975), has a section about them. 
There are 80 species of oak in North America. Here are the main ones: 
Red Oak Group 
Black oak Quercus velutina 
Blackjack oak Q. marilandica 
Cherrybark oak Q. falcata 
Laurel oak Q. laurifolia 
Northern pin oak Q. ellipsoidalis 
Northern red oak Q. rubra 
Nuttall oak Q. nuttallii 
Pin oak Q. palustris 
Scarlet oak Q. coccinea 
Shumard oak Q. shumardii 
Southern red oak Q. falcata 
Water oak Q. ***** 
Willow oak Q. phellos 
White Oak Group 
Bur oak Q. macrocarpa 
Chestnut oak Q. primus 
Chinkapin oak Q. muehlenbergii 
Overcup oak Q. lyrata 
Post oak Q. stellata 
Swamp chestnut oak Q. michanxii 
Swamp white oak Q. bicolor 
White oak Q. alba 
_Gene Wengert, forum technical advisor_


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## the miz (Feb 24, 2009)

woodnthings said:


> Wood identification from WoodMagazine.com
> http://www.woodmagazine.com/materials-guide/lumber/wood-species-1/ash/
> Botanically a member of the olive family, ash grows throughout the northern Hemisphere and numbers nearly 60 species. In North America, there are 18 species of ash. However, only a few provide commercial hardwood timber.
> Foremost among them is white ash (_Fraxinus americana_), which grows from Nova Scotia and Maine west to Minnesota and south to Texas and Florida. Green ash (_Fraxinus lanceolata_) and red ash (_Fraxinus pennsylvanica_), both smaller trees than white ash, duplicate its range and are sold under its name. Black ash (_Fraxinus *****_), the Indians' basket tree, is marketed as brown ash. It likes northern climes.
> ...



Thanks for clearing that up!:yes:


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## Nomes (Mar 21, 2009)

Old days most snow skies were made of ash.
Put it in hot water for a day and it bends. It's been a long time since I used ash I think I would pre nail it Grate looking the color goes from almost white to a nice dark color, part of the beauty of it is the color change.


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