# Hand Plane Help



## BrosephMansby (Jul 15, 2017)

I have been trying to incorporate more hand plane use in my work and bought some old hand planes. I wanted a quick way to flatten wide 12 in boards and thought learning how to use a hand plane would be a good way to do this.

I bought a Stanley #6 at a local flea market for $40. I spent about two weekends flattening the sole of the plane. I used sand paper on top of my table saw and flattened the bottom until there was no gaps in front of the mouth.

I cleaned and oiled everything and started using it. While planing a board I noticed the corners of the iron were digging into the board. I thought maybe the edges needed to be cambered but just checked the flatness of the sole with a straight edge instead. The straight edge from left to right was rocking back and forth and the sole was not flat and was high in the middle causing the edges of the iron to dig in. I check another hand plane I had flattened previously and it had the same hump in the middle.

So I obviously cannot flatten the sole of the plane with sand paper on my table saw. Is there any where I can take it to in NJ to have the sole flattened? Or maybe another method I could try? The bottom is pretty rounded over. Would a sharpening service know how or be capable of flattening the sole? Any help would be greatly appreciated guys. I really don't want to spend $200 on a new plane.


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

Well, ive got a new surface grinder ive been needing test cases for... If you feel like paying shipping both ways, i can always slap it on the grinder with the planes of mine ive been meaning to true up.

Before that, check your straight edge to make sure its straight. Youd be surprised how many straight edges are crooked, and id suspect that before id suspect your table saw top being out of flat AND both planes being the same kind of out of flat. All that said though, if the edged of your iron are sharp corners, theyre going to dig in, just the nature of the beast. Thats the reason every plane sharpening manual recommends rounding over the corners


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## PPBART (Oct 7, 2011)

BrosephMansby said:


> ...So I obviously cannot flatten the sole of the plane with sand paper on my table saw...


Did you try to flatten the sole with the plane completely assembled? Flattening the sole with the frog/blade/chip breaker/cap removed can result in the sole going out-of-flat when those are reinstalled.


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## gmercer_48083 (Apr 9, 2016)

I flattened the sole of my #4 hand plane on my benchtop belt sander, starting with 80 grit to flatten using a sharpie to mark the sole and check my progress. Ending with 120 grit. Your plane is about 18" long, it would take a while. You might consider Epic's offer if you do not have a belt sander.


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## BrosephMansby (Jul 15, 2017)

The straight edge is high quality solid square only about 3 inches long. I dont know the brand name but its very precise. 

My father was a machinist and he is going to try to use the surface grinder at his work to flatten it. The only problem is getting the plane to sit level. 

If that doesn't work I will definately send my plane over to you to flatten, epicfail. Have you done it before? When you say round over the edges do you mean just a slight camber? I did put a slight camber on the iron but was still digging in pretty bad on each corner.


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## BrosephMansby (Jul 15, 2017)

PPBART said:


> BrosephMansby said:
> 
> 
> > ...So I obviously cannot flatten the sole of the plane with sand paper on my table saw...
> ...


No, the frog, blade, and chip breaker were taken out. I don't see why having those in or out would matter.


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## epicfail48 (Mar 27, 2014)

BrosephMansby said:


> The straight edge is high quality solid square only about 3 inches long. I dont know the brand name but its very precise.
> 
> My father was a machinist and he is going to try to use the surface grinder at his work to flatten it. The only problem is getting the plane to sit level.
> 
> If that doesn't work I will definately send my plane over to you to flatten, epicfail. Have you done it before? When you say round over the edges do you mean just a slight camber? I did put a slight camber on the iron but was still digging in pretty bad on each corner.


Not quite a camber, that usually means a curve across the entire face of the blade. What you really want to do is leave most of the blade straight, but roll the edges so theres no sharp corners. Picture going from |_| to more of a U with a flat bottom, if that makes sense.

Cant say that ive used the surface grinder to flatten one of my planes yet, but i have screwed around with the fixturing on a milling machine for the same purpose, and have messed around with flattening plane soles a lot more than i care to think about.... Refinishing, making, what have you. Ive got a lot of screwing around under my belt, luckily. Offer stands, if you trust the random stranger off the internet :grin:


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## 35015 (Nov 24, 2012)

BrosephMansby said:


> ...My father was a machinist and he is going to try to use the surface grinder at his work to flatten it. The only problem is getting the plane to sit level...


He should be able to true it to it's sides well enough for the "hand work" it is intended for...



BrosephMansby said:


> ... I did put a slight camber on the iron but was still digging in pretty bad on each corner...


Without seeing the actual plane and blade it is hard to really give good advise to your intended goal?

With our Japanese wood bodied planes only the edges are knocked off and the camber along the entire edge is virtually unnoticeable for some of them. Most of the others and the metal bodied planes it all depends on the wood, and the desired effect wished for. Most often it is a true "rondel" camber the entire width of the blade. It's not as robust as our scrub planes, but its enough that on the Smoothing planes and even some of the Jacks/Fore planes the camber is full width of the blade and it will leave the standard tradtional undulations found in vintage furniture, wall paneling and doors...

Note, any good machine shop/Machinist should be able to true the bottom for you at a reasonable cost. Our sharpening service does do such work for about $40 per plane the last time I had it done, as we tend to do it ourselves and/or not worry too much if it is all perfectly flat...All depends on the plane and the application...


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*I do a fair amount of metal work*

I have 2 South bend lathes and a Grizzly milling machine, welders and cut off saws. I am not a machinist! I use a 6" X 48" vertical belt sander as a grinder about 97% of the time. It will remove metal quickly or leave a smooth surface depending on the belts grit from 50, 60, 100, or 120. I have used it to flatten the soles of planes I got off Ebay. I then check them on a reference surface that is factory surface ground like a jointer bed, planer bed or table saw table. I check for color as I grind and for flatness when I'm satisfied it's close to flat. It works for me, no fancy surface grinding and way faster than sandpaper on a glass plate. "Flat" is relative, as is straight ... in woodworking.... :vs_cool:


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## gmercer_48083 (Apr 9, 2016)

woodnthings said:


> I have 2 South bend lathes and a Grizzly milling machine, welders and cut off saws. I am not a machinist! I use a 6" X 48" vertical belt sander as a grinder about 97% of the time. It will remove metal quickly or leave a smooth surface depending on the belts grit from 50, 60, 100, or 120. I have used it to flatten the soles of planes I got off Ebay. I then check them on a reference surface that is factory surface ground like a jointer bed, planer bed or table saw table. I check for color as I grind and for flatness when I'm satisfied it's close to flat. It works for me, no fancy surface grinding and way faster than sandpaper on a glass plate. "Flat" is relative, as is straight ... in woodworking.... :vs_cool:


I agree with this method, sanding works great, and you can see the progress easily by marking lines across the sole. As far as making the sides at a right angle to the base...that would only be needed if you intend to use it on a shooting board. A #6 plane is probably a little large and heavy to use on a shooting board.


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## Larry42 (Jan 10, 2014)

If you use a 6x48 sander to surface the plane be careful not to get it hot while doing it. Heat expansion will cause the CI plane body to move. The sides of the plane don't need to be perfect to use on a shooting board. You can adjust the blade to get close enough. Just be sure to alternate face up to down when gluing.


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## tbruce (Jan 13, 2019)

Steel is surprisingly flexible, and yeah, having the frog, chip-breaker and iron out of it can throw it off.


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## Red5hft (Dec 20, 2018)

*If time isn't money...*

If you are still willing to invest time in your planes, I suggest you go back to the sandpaper on table-saw method, but...with your planes assembled and blades retracted safely. I cannot say if this will make the difference, but eliminating variables is the path to success. Then examine your technique. Are you positioning your body and hands in such a way to ensure even pressure and stroke? Depending upon the roundness of the soles, work up from 80-100 grit to 120-180 grit. That is smooth enough for a functional finish. You can polish as much as you want from there. Be patient. The closer you get to flat, the slower it goes as you are removing metal from a larger, flatter area to bring the remaining into true. Stay with the coarser grit until you have consistent contact on the entire sole you want flat.


I refurbish antique hand planes as a passion. Unfortunately, my obsession leads me to flatten the entire sole to .0015, then polish up through 320 grit then on to ultra fine polish up through a red rouge for a mirror finish. It's just what I enjoy. I have a Ryobi bench sander that runs 4x36" belts on a graphite bed I have hand lapped to .0015 flatness for smaller planes. For larger planes, #6, 7 and 8, I still hand lap. If you are wondering, these planes run amazing. There is virtually no friction between the plane and the wood even without any kind of lubricant once you polish to this level. This is not a practical thing to do, though. It is just my hobby. Stick with a more practical finish of 120-180 grit.



If you use any type of power tool to flatten the plane, you have to be extremely mindful of heat buildup. 20 degrees of heat will localize in the thinner area of the plane and cause errors in your flattening. Not usually a problem when lapping by hand, unless you are using 40 grit range and moving VERY fast for a long period.


Enjoy the time you invest in restoring your historic tools as they will serve you well for a lifetime.


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## gmercer_48083 (Apr 9, 2016)

Red, Wow, Quite the reflection...a real show piece. Thanks for the post.


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## gmercer_48083 (Apr 9, 2016)

BrosephMansby, Just wondering if/what you did to correct the problem.


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## BrosephMansby (Jul 15, 2017)

gmercer_48083 said:


> BrosephMansby, Just wondering if/what you did to correct the problem.


Thanks for asking Gmercer. I did put the plane aside for a while and just recently came back to it. I tried flattening on the table saw again with no luck and while going through my fathers basement found out he had a 12x18" peice of granite he had gotten from the machine shop he works at. I had no idea he had this! I bought some 80 grit sandpaper with adhesive backing and as soon as I began flattening the bottom of the plane I could tell the granite was much more flat than my table saw. I drew lines in marker on the bottom of the plane and could tell that there was a giant hollow in the middle of the plane from where there were still marker lines.

After sanding the bottom there is a part on the back of the plane that is rounded over. I will post a pic of it. I decided just to leave it as it would take all day to flatten it out. After sandind the bottom up to 180 grit I put some wax on it and tried it out. 

I was still getting some machine lines on both sides while planing the face of a board. I retracted the blade alot and started taking thinner cuts, rounded the corners of the blade, and closed the throat up some. It is planing the long grain really flat on the boards but I am still getting slight machine marks on the face grain that you can feel with your fingers and just barely see. It probably is good enough to get a board flat but I really like to have my tools working perfectly. I am going to try rounding the corners more and see if I can close the throat a little bit more.

Also, I just learned this technique to flatten boards wider than my jointer
When I run boards wider than my six in jointer I just plane flat the rest of the board that didnt get cut by the jointer. Then I just run the board with flat side down though my 12" planer. This works grea!. I am thinking about getting a 10 in jointer and then for 11.25" wide boards I can just hand plane the 1.25" strip thats left over.

Thanks guys for your help. This is definately not easy to do on your own without any guidance. 

I realize I told you guys the plane is a #6 but it is actually a #5.


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## Chris Curl (Jan 1, 2013)

BrosephMansby said:


> ... going through my fathers basement found out he had a 12x18" piece of granite ...


I just saw this thread and was going to suggest exactly what you did. I go to estate sales, and one time, I came across some small granite cut-offs and grabbed them. Now I use them for all my flattening and sharpening tasks.


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## gmercer_48083 (Apr 9, 2016)

Another tip I learned from Paul Sellers, was to file (round) slightly to remove the hard edge the toe and heel of the sole to keep the sole's ends from damaging your wood as you use your plane. 

A radius at each side edge of your iron will help prevent track lines...When you sharpen your iron on a stone/diamond/strop, Put downward pressure using your fingers at the edges for a few strokes...first at one edge then the other, to create the radius. You will find this helps to remove the track marks.

Another tip learned from Paul Sellers is his rag in a can. Mine is a recycled short mushroom can with an old cotton tube sock (rolled up) stuffed into the can so it protruded about 1/2". Using about 1/4 of a can of 3in1 oil, saturate the sock overnight. when using your plane you drag the sole of your plane across the rag in a can to lube the sole. The oil doesn't interfere/ transfer to your wood...but improves performance to your plane/handsaws. It also stops chatter.


If you are not familiar with Paul Sellers...Google him. He has hundreds of youtube videos, and teaches hand tool woodworking.


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## Tool Agnostic (Aug 13, 2017)

Finding a nice piece of flat granite: 

I have a nice piece of scrap granite, large enough to flatten a #7 plane. Around here, there are many retail stores who sell granite countertops, tile, etc. There are also huge granite/marble yards which are full of large flat slabs of granite and other countertop materials.

Don't waste your time at the retail shops. Even if they have what you want, they will ask a high price for it. 

Go straight to the granite/marble yards. Ask very politely and be specific (and realistic) about the size you need. For them, the scrap pieces of granite cost money to throw away, but their time and trouble costs more. They would rather dispose it than deal with you. It helps if you remind them that you or a family member bought their granite in the past, or can drop the name of a contractor who buys from them. You can tell them that the named contractor did your family's kitchen counters from their granite a few years ago, for example. Hopefully it is the truth. 

I asked for a piece of granite that was minimum 24 inches long by 5 inches across. I wanted to flatten a #7 plane and other planes. One of the local yards gave me a rough rectangular piece about 30 inches long by 9 inches across, 2 cm thick. They looked through a scrap pile and picked the one that best fit my needs. Obviously the pattern doesn't matter. 

If you ask nicely, the worst that can happen is they say no.

Another source is your own kitchen remodel. If you are getting a kitchen countertop, or have a friend who is getting their kitchen remodeled, ask for the scrap that remains after they fabricate the countertops. The contractor normally collects only the counters, and leaves the scraps behind at the fabricator's shop. If you ask, they can collect the scrap and bring it with the countertop(s). 

Be careful once you get the granite. Even small pieces of granite are heavy.


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## WeebyWoodWorker (Jun 11, 2017)

I've got an old slab of granite from when my counters were replaced. works great for a flat surface to sharpen and flatten things. 



-T


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