# Workshop Heat



## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

I know a lot of you guys are up north and have to deal with bitter cold temperatures. Here in Texas we only have a few weeks or maybe a month of cold weather. So during this time I would like to put some heat in my shop. 
What do you guys use for an economical, safe heat?


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## Corndog (Apr 26, 2007)

In my dinky little space I set up two halogen work space lights on a tripod. Boy Howdy do those things throw off heat!!!!:yes:


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## daryl in nanoose (Feb 18, 2007)

I use a construction heater hooked up to a thermostat.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Yea, I did that in my work trailer with four halogen lights mounted on the walls, but my workshop is 900 sq.ft. so I need something that puts out some serious heat.


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## Corndog (Apr 26, 2007)

Take a "0" off of that and that's what I got!!!:laughing:


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## mdlbldrmatt135 (Dec 6, 2006)

I have a little Propane Powered Torpedo heater........ But I still need to get the roof of the Garage / Shop Insulated....... the walls are...

I've used about 1/2 a bottle so far... over 2 to 3 days (any glue ups go in the house...........


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Corndog said:


> Take a "0" off of that and that's what I got!!!:laughing:


 
The shop was one of the conditions when my wife and I had our new house built three years ago. I was tired of trying to work out of a 
10 X 12 80yr old shop that was also used for storage.
We built it as a family project about 100 ft away from the house.:thumbsup:


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

Wood stove. I burn hardwood sawmill scrap. I also throw my boo-boos in there...some days I can heat my shop with just screw ups :laughing:.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

mdlbldrmatt135 said:


> I have a little Propane Powered Torpedo heater........ But I still need to get the roof of the Garage / Shop Insulated....... the walls are...
> 
> I've used about 1/2 a bottle so far... over 2 to 3 days (any glue ups go in the house...........


That is why I need to heat the shop, wife won't let me bring glue ups in the house. She says thats why I a shop.:no:


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Daren said:


> Wood stove. I burn hardwood sawmill scrap. I also throw my boo-boos in there...some days I can heat my shop with just screw ups :laughing:.


 
Daren

I have one of those wood stoves like I saw in one of your pics that I purchased at an auction. Is it possible to vent it without paying a buttload for the double walled vent pipe?


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

woodman42 said:


> Is it possible to vent it without paying a buttload for the double walled vent pipe?


No :furious:. I paid as much for the pipe as I did the stove . But I don't worry about fire now, gotta have the good pipe. I like heating with wood. I can keep that shop 75 during the coldest days. But the glues and stuff are in the basement during the winter, I have to drag them in and out. My stove is small (not enough room for anything else) and won't hold a fire all night. It is cool out there in the morning. I too have a torpedo heater. I kick it on for a few minutes while I stoke a fire, then heat with wood the rest of the day. A small (grill size) bottle of propane lasts all winter. I have more wood than I can burn, I give it away and just keep enough to get me through each winter.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Damn, I was afraid you would say that.


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

Hi Woodman

For occasional use I would definitely go with Daren on the woodstove. I also love heating with wood. It makes the place smell good, and you use up all your scraps. Make sure your dust collection is good, or you risk an exolsion/fire. One word of caution: Before you go and make a big investment into a wood stove, and the necessary piping ask your insurance company what their position is on coverage for your shop with wood heat in place. I wanted to put wood heat in my shop, but the insurance company was completely thumbs down on the whole idea. They won't even discuss an external wood heat source. So, that leaves me using electric heaters for a small area of my shop, and no heat in the rest.[The cost would simply be prohibitive] My heating season is about six months long. If your insurance company goes thumbs down on the wood heat then I would suggest a 220 volt electric heater with thermost control and fans. As you are probably only going to need it for a few weeks each year the cost for operation won't be too bad, and if you have the 220 volt in place the installation shouldn't be too bad either.

Let us know what your carrier's reaction is. I am looking around to see if I can find one that is a little more reasonable.

Good Luck

Gerry


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Well your right about the insurance, I guess I will have to look at some of those radients heaters to mount on the walls.
Boy those insurance guys just ain't no fun.


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## skymaster (Oct 30, 2006)

http://www.greenhousemegastore.com/products.asp?dept=1056
Check out modine heaters. This outfit seems cheapest out there
Jack.
I use this type of heater but I have it running off a hot water loop from my house steam boiler :}:}:}:}


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## Ken Johnson (Nov 8, 2007)

Woodman,

I have a 12' x 16' shop with insulated walls and an uninsulated 10' barb style roof. I purchased two 5100BTU electric thermal heaters that mount on the ceiling with brackets. They really kick some serious heat and don't do any noticable damage to my electric bill. They are very safe too since there is no flame. I get a bit nervous in a dusty woodshop when there is an open flame. 

If you want information on these let me know and I will post it when I get home.:thumbsup:


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

skymaster said:


> http://www.greenhousemegastore.com/products.asp?dept=1056
> Check out modine heaters. This outfit seems cheapest out there
> Jack.
> I use this type of heater but I have it running off a hot water loop from my house steam boiler :}:}:}:}


 
:yes: That is pretty cheap, only problem is we don't use boilers down here.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Ken Johnson said:


> Woodman,
> 
> I have a 12' x 16' shop with insulated walls and an uninsulated 10' barb style roof. I purchased two 5100BTU electric thermal heaters that mount on the ceiling with brackets. They really kick some serious heat and don't do any noticable damage to my electric bill. They are very safe too since there is no flame. I get a bit nervous in a dusty woodshop when there is an open flame.
> 
> If you want information on these let me know and I will post it when I get home.:thumbsup:


 
Thanks Ken. Electric looks like the way I'm gonna have to go.:yes:


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## nywoodwizard (Oct 31, 2006)

Electric rates are to dam expensive here on L.I. I prefer to use the portable kero heaters with a thermostat. I have absolutly no wall space for anything else so it works well for me.


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

woodman42 said:


> Well your right about the insurance, I guess I will have to look at some of those radients heaters to mount on the walls.
> Boy those insurance guys just ain't no fun.


I totally agree. They sure do take the fun out of it.

Gerry:thumbdown: :furious:


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## Rex Bloem (Oct 6, 2007)

MY wood shop is roughly 24x30 with 12' ceiling. I purchased a furance that was a take out from an installer. It a 90%er and vents out theside of the building. For intake air I blocked off the vents in the front panel and cut a 6" hole for a pipe that runs up into the attic above the shop. This way I didn't have to worry about sucking dust into the burn chamber. I got the furance for $300.00 plus had to add some for installation. I also had an A coil some sometime in the future I will add AC.


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## skymaster (Oct 30, 2006)

Woodman; Modine heaters also are made with a self-contained "furnace" inside ie gas,propane etc, hand em, pipe em fire em up with a T stat
work great


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## timp (Oct 26, 2007)

I just bought a "Mr Heater" propane shop heater from Northern Tool. It's hanging on the ceiling, the vent is installed, and the gas line runs out the side of the building. Now I just have to wait till the gas company delivers the 100# propane bottle. Today's high was 25 degrees, so I can't wait till I can actually use this heater!

It's turning out to be a rather expensive item though. $560 for the heater (with vent kit and thermostat), $260 or so for the propane and install, $40 for building permit, and another $50 or so in sundry parts (wire, lag bolts, gas lines, etc). I hope my wife doesn't add up the bills!

I plan to paint/finish/glue in the cellar and that's where everything liquid is stored for the winter.

Tim


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## KC7CN (Aug 21, 2007)

woodman42 said:


> I know a lot of you guys are up north and have to deal with bitter cold temperatures. Here in Texas we only have a few weeks or maybe a month of cold weather. So during this time I would like to put some heat in my shop.
> What do you guys use for an economical, safe heat?


You didn't say how big your shop is, that would help determine what you need!

In any case, I have a Lakewood 798/240 "Fan Forced" Portable Heater. It is commercial quality and runs on a 220V- 20A circuit. I live in central Washington, and it gets pretty chilly here; down in the low 20's during the coldest part of the year. My shop/garage is 672 SF and well insulated (about the size of a three-car garage). What I like about this heater, is that it does not smell, moves a lot of air, and made well enough to leave unattended. And the price is right! The nice thing about being portable, is that it sits on the floor - the best location for a heat source, and can be unplugged and put away when not in use.

I do supplement this heater with additional heaters (electric, propane and, Kerosene) to get the shop heated up when the temperature is real cold.


Here's a link to ACE Hardware. (no affiliation)
http://www.acehardwareoutlet.com/(osb4td551ebtyi451fdrzefc)/ProductDetails.aspx?SKU=69493

-Don


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

KC7CN said:


> You didn't say how big your shop is, that would help determine what you need!
> 
> 600 sq.ft. . I looked at some radiant heaters but they don't say how many sq.ft. it will heat. :thumbdown:


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## mdlbldrmatt135 (Dec 6, 2006)

http://www.tombling.com/heaters/heatloss.htm

That should help you calculate it... (granted it's more for a house)


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## joesdad (Nov 1, 2007)

I use a kerosene torpedo heater set outside and blown in for about five minutes every 35-40 min. when it's 40 or below. Otherwise a quick shot every hour just to get the chill off. Insulated walls,floor and ceiling make all the difference.


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## solidwoods (Apr 26, 2007)

N. Central Tn.
Taylor woodfired hot water heater runs 2 kiln (10kbf), 1600sq' shop. 1200sq' showroom, 3000sq' 1890 2 story.
Questions?
jim


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

solidwoods said:


> N. Central Tn.
> Taylor woodfired hot water heater runs 2 kiln (10kbf), 1600sq' shop. 1200sq' showroom, 3000sq' 1890 2 story.
> Questions?
> jim


:blink: Sorry, I am not very educated on hot water heaters for heat.


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## solidwoods (Apr 26, 2007)

The commercial made home units of the top mfrs. are $10k (for the burner unit) and above.

If you use allot of heat per month it can be lucrative (10k bf of lumber dried per month @ .20bf , cost is heater, wood, $10. elec.) 
If you are a home based business you heat the business and the home.
If you have an easy source of wood the concept is even cheaper.

You can DIY. a clone or design your own.

They have no steam pressure, the water is pumped by a small circulation pump so the feed/rtn lines are almost no pressure.
Getting the heat off the water is either:
1. Radiation (radiators/PEX tubing in the floor, baseboard radiators).
2. Heat exchanger placed in your existing hot air system.
3. Anything that holds water:yes: I heat my shop (1600sq') with a salvaged air conditioner condenser unit. Water goes through the 250' of 5 lines of 3/8" copper tube, compressor is removed, the units fan pulls the heat off the unit just like it was designed to do or run it fan off and its a radiator.


You can also get a heat exchanger for your hot water heater which heats the water so you don't use the electric. My wife is a Dog Groomer (home based buis. also) so we heat the hot water for the bathing. Soon to add the dog drying (she presently uses 3 heaters @1500watt each).

You don't have to split the wood, it doesn't have to be dry, it burns my saw dust, sawmill slabs, shop scraps, all the way to my junk mail.

It has a fan on the door of the fire box that comes on when the water temp gets low. The air from the fan will burn a hole right through a fresh cut log.

The worst fuel for it is dry wood like brush, shop scraps, dry log slabs.
The dry wood try's to burn too fast and isn't getting enough air for that qty. of combustion = smoke (smoke is unburnt fuel,, spark it and it will explode)
That was an earfull, hopefully its $ for you.
jim


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

solidwoods said:


> N. Central Tn.
> Taylor woodfired hot water heater runs 2 kiln (10kbf), 1600sq' shop. 1200sq' showroom, 3000sq' 1890 2 story.
> Questions?
> jim


Hi Solid woods

Do you have a link for the taylor woodfired water heaters?

Thanks

Gerry:smile:


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

solidwoods said:


> N. Central Tn.
> Taylor woodfired hot water heater runs 2 kiln (10kbf), 1600sq' shop. 1200sq' showroom, 3000sq' 1890 2 story.
> Questions?
> jim


If/when I ever build a new shop it would be radiant in floor heat. A simple domestic water heater, a circ. pump and a thermostat (well and the Pex tubing) is all it would take for a 3 car garage. I am working in an existing structure right now, so I just burn wood since I have so much sawmill waste.

I am a licensed plumber and trained boiler tech. I have put 1000 mile of that Pex in the slab. I used to have my own plumbing/heating/welding shop (I actually had a scan of some of my old business cards handy, so I attached them)...then I got bit by the wood bug. I closed the plumbing shop and went another direction. I did the heat in one guys shop with radiant in floor. The main shop was 65'x75' (16' ceiling) and an office on another thermo 16'x24' (8' ceiling) a little propane boiler about the size of a 2 drawer filing cabinet took care of the whole thing.


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## Ken Johnson (Nov 8, 2007)

Daren,

I have to ask the question. What is the significance of the Egyptian pyramid on your business card??????:blink:


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

Ken Johnson said:


> Daren,
> 
> I have to ask the question. What is the significance of the Egyptian pyramid on your business card??????:blink:


3 things. I think they were an amazing achievement, I also joked as a business man I would like to get a job that size "time and material $" and lastly they were cheap cards (like 1000 for $9.99) and their graphic selection was limited. It was either a pyramid or bunny rabbits :laughing:.


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## Joe Lyddon (Mar 13, 2007)

timp said:


> I just bought a "Mr Heater" propane shop heater from Northern Tool. It's hanging on the ceiling, the vent is installed, and the gas line runs out the side of the building. Now I just have to wait till the gas company delivers the 100# propane bottle. Today's high was 25 degrees, so I can't wait till I can actually use this heater!
> 
> It's turning out to be a rather expensive item though. $560 for the heater (with vent kit and thermostat), $260 or so for the propane and install, $40 for building permit, and another $50 or so in sundry parts (wire, lag bolts, gas lines, etc). I hope my wife doesn't add up the bills!
> 
> ...



*Welcome... to posting...* :blink:


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## woodman51jfk (Dec 10, 2007)

hi 42, this is 51jfk, just up the road in Kempner...........we have been in a 3000 sq ft insulated metal building & two propane torpedos would take of the chill after running for an hour or so every morning. Now we're in an uninsulated steel building with a separate finishing room......the finish room gets a small propane heater & the main shop gets a kerosene salamander. Glues stains & finished live in an insulated closet, where we leave a 100w incandescent safety bulb burning on really cold night.....like tonight is turning out to be.........80 yesterday & now it's 34.......sheesh


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## Corndog (Apr 26, 2007)

Daren said:


> 3 things. I think they were an amazing achievement, I also joked as a business man I would like to get a job that size "time and material $" and lastly they were cheap cards (like 1000 for $9.99) and their graphic selection was limited. It was either a pyramid or bunny rabbits :laughing:.


What you got against bunnies???


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## Daren (Oct 14, 2006)

Corndog said:


> What you got against bunnies???


Nothing, I had one for supper (what a coincidence, or maybe not,had bunny on my mind...and shirt). Fried with rabbit gravy, mashed potatoes, corn and biscuits/with honey. Yummy.


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## Corndog (Apr 26, 2007)

It's a woodwork related animal after all....a "rabbet".:shifty: 





...sorry.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

woodman51jfk said:


> hi 42, this is 51jfk, just up the road in Kempner...........we have been in a 3000 sq ft insulated metal building & two propane torpedos would take of the chill after running for an hour or so every morning. Now we're in an uninsulated steel building with a separate finishing room......the finish room gets a small propane heater & the main shop gets a kerosene salamander. Glues stains & finished live in an insulated closet, where we leave a 100w incandescent safety bulb burning on really cold night.....like tonight is turning out to be.........80 yesterday & now it's 34.......sheesh


:thumbsup: Howdy neighbor. Been to Kempner before. I grew up in Harker Heights. Yes the weather is one thing we can't count on here, thats why I,m looking for a economical heat source for my shop. Its wood frame an has about 500 sq ft of work space, my office is 100 sq ft and has a thru the wall air conditioner with a heater. I am considering a propane heater because we don't have natural gas available out here in the sticks.


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

woodman42 said:


> :thumbsup: Howdy neighbor. Been to Kempner before. I grew up in Harker Heights. Yes the weather is one thing we can't count on here, thats why I,m looking for a economical heat source for my shop. Its wood frame an has about 500 sq ft of work space, my office is 100 sq ft and has a thru the wall air conditioner with a heater. I am considering a propane heater because we don't have natural gas available out here in the sticks.











Here is the one I am considering. Opinions?


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## KC7CN (Aug 21, 2007)

*Additional Information*

Here's the link to a web page I found - Quote:"The heater shop - BTU Calculator makes it easy to calculate the size of heater needed. All heating requirements can be solved by mathematics when you know the various parameters. The watts to BTU converter is also on this page". http://www.heatershop.com/btu_calculator.htm

And here's link to a calculator from the Pellet Fuels Institute for Comparing Fuel Costs. http://www.pelletheat.org/3/residential/compareFuel.cfm

As I stated earlier, my shop is a well insulated 24'x28' garage/shop. According to the calculator I need 15,040 BTU (4406 Watts) for a 20 degree rise in temperature. My electric heater is 4000 - little under sized for those real cold mornings! I have a variety of supplemental heaters; propane, Kerosene, and 1500W electric to do the job.

There was a time when Kerosene was an economical choice for heat, but that doesn't seem the case now. $4.57/gallon where I live.

Hope this help!

-Don


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

KC7CN said:


> Here's the link to a web page I found - Quote:"The heater shop - BTU Calculator makes it easy to calculate the size of heater needed. All heating requirements can be solved by mathematics when you know the various parameters. The watts to BTU converter is also on this page". http://www.heatershop.com/btu_calculator.htm
> 
> And here's link to a calculator from the Pellet Fuels Institute for Comparing Fuel Costs. http://www.pelletheat.org/3/residential/compareFuel.cfm
> 
> ...


 Wow. My shop needs 55800 BTU's. Cool link Don thank you.
I think the heater I pictured above should do the job. 
I wanted to use the wood stove that I already have, but most don't think its a good idea in a woodshop with all the dust and all.
I wonder if it would really be that bad since we don't really use heat that much here. Yea its a risk but heck look at the risk we take everyday in our shops. Just a thought.


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## Gerry KIERNAN (Apr 20, 2007)

Thanks for the links Don. It was really interesting to compare costs for my pellet stoves versus the electric heaters.

Gerry


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## 0rch1d (Dec 13, 2007)

thanks great!


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## woodman42 (Aug 6, 2007)

Thanks guys for all the advice, thats why I love it here.


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## Joe Lyddon (Mar 13, 2007)

KC7CN said:


> Here's the link to a web page I found - Quote:"The heater shop - BTU Calculator makes it easy to calculate the size of heater needed. All heating requirements can be solved by mathematics when you know the various parameters. The watts to BTU converter is also on this page". http://www.heatershop.com/btu_calculator.htm
> 
> And here's link to a calculator from the Pellet Fuels Institute for Comparing Fuel Costs. http://www.pelletheat.org/3/residential/compareFuel.cfm
> 
> ...


I just ordered the following heater, primarily to heat an avocado tree to stop any freezing from happening...

After seeing this, I wonder how it would work in a small shop area, about 1/2 of a double garage?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000W8W6Z2

It's a kerosene heater... 10,000 BTU... omni coverage (circular)... looks like a Coleman camping lantern... heats for 12 hrs. on a tank.

Can I get double useage from it?


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## Joe Lyddon (Mar 13, 2007)

0rch1d said:


> thanks great!



*Welcome Aboard!*


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## Buffalo Bilious (Aug 20, 2007)

Joe Lyddon said:


> I just ordered the following heater, primarily to heat an avocado tree to stop any freezing from happening...
> 
> After seeing this, I wonder how it would work in a small shop area, about 1/2 of a double garage?
> 
> ...


I dunno, Joe... I just bought the Reddy Heater kerosene 55K BTU torpedo to try to get my garage/workshop livable. 

My garage is about 18x20 (call it a skinny two-car garage), completely uninsulated, open roof/rafters, cement slab.

I let it burn for about 45 minutes and it'll get the temp up to about 55-60 degrees in the garage with an outside Michigan temp of around 25F. Which isn't too shabby, considering that 90% of the heat is leaking right out the roof.

10K wouldn't cut the mustard, at least in my case...

That said, I'd really enjoy having the responsibility of having to keep an avocado tree warm, and I would guard that thing with my life. Pick your guacamole right off the branch.... That, my friend, would be heaven. All I'd need at that point would be a Tequila tree right next to it. LOL


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## Joe Lyddon (Mar 13, 2007)

Buffalo Bilious said:


> I dunno, Joe... I just bought the Reddy Heater kerosene 55K BTU torpedo to try to get my garage/workshop livable.
> 
> My garage is about 18x20 (call it a skinny two-car garage), completely uninsulated, open roof/rafters, cement slab.
> 
> ...


Ahh yes, it get C O L D where you are!

Here, it may dip to 32 and doesn't too much harm most of the time (to avocado tree)... We have not had avocados in two years due to freezing temps!! The new growth for buds are forming right now... for next spring... if they freeze, no fruit PERIOD... damn shame... One night can do it... The last time we got fruit, we got over 300 of the jewels, breaking records... doubt if that ever happens again.

It was nice...

I have tarps out there right now, ready to try to cover a 12' x 12' tree... Pinkertons...


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## Buffalo Bilious (Aug 20, 2007)

Joe Lyddon said:


> Ahh yes, it get C O L D where you are!



Yes it does... we just got 12 inches of snow today. Major emergency, at least if you listen to the dipwads on the local TV stations. :glare:

The drifts on my back deck are about 30 inches high. Pretty cool, actually, it's about time we got some decent snow around here.

No problemo, time to fire up the snowmobile, put the helmet on and blow the cobwebs outta my head!

(still, it'd be killer to have an avocado tree. Tell ya the truth, I didn't know the things grew on a tree... woulda' guessed they lived on a vine or something)

"California "Dreaming"... a good tune to listen to today.


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## Joe Lyddon (Mar 13, 2007)

Buffalo Bilious said:


> Yes it does... we just got 12 inches of snow today. Major emergency, at least if you listen to the dipwads on the local TV stations. :glare:
> 
> The drifts on my back deck are about 30 inches high. Pretty cool, actually, it's about time we got some decent snow around here.
> 
> ...



It sounds like that heater will take the chill off and get it into a more comfortable range...

Would the Kerosene being burned in the garage cause any problems other than I should have good ventilation?


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## Buffalo Bilious (Aug 20, 2007)

Outside is no prob. Inside, you need to keep an eye on it... 

Personally, I wouldn't let one burn overnight in my house while I'm sleeping.. but on the other hand, I've stayed nice and warm at deer-camp with a kerosene heater blazing away.... 

However, it wasn't my joint and I had a window right next to me to jump out of if I needed to... :laughing:

Play it by ear, but if the area you're heating is attached to your house, I'd recommend caution. As long as you buy good clean kerosene (K-1) you should be good, smell-wise, it really isn't that bad. Avoid the vanilla/pine/hollyberry "smell good" additives that you see at the Big Boxes... they hurt more than they help, believe me... :glare:


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## Joe Lyddon (Mar 13, 2007)

Thank you... It's good that I'll be able to use it for more than an Avocado tree! :laughing: 

I wouldn't think of running one inside overnight... that would be asking for trouble... too dangerous.


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