# Oneida and the Mini Gorilla



## Northwoods Woodcraft (Dec 5, 2012)

Hi Folks...

I'm new to the forum. I'm getting back into woodworking after moving and setting up a shop in the new place. 

I'm in the market for a new Dust Collector and I've been reading a great deal. In fact, based on reviews of quick turn around and excellecnt customer service, I've placed an order with Oenida for their Mini-Gorilla. It's a 110 cyclone system with 650 CFM. The mobile base and steel drum were extra but we're talking over $1,000 to get this to my house.

My first surprise after ordering was the lack of communication with Oneida. I emailed them to get an idea of when it would arrive. I was quickly told that it would be 3-4 weeks before they could get to it. 

I have sent two subsequent emails looking for advise on what I could do with my shop vac in the mean time and even asked if they would provide a discount on their Dust Deputy, since I was spending so much money and had to wait 2-3 weeks longer than I had expected.

No responses whatsoever. I guess other folks got licky with Customer Service, or I got unlucky, or... things have changed at Oenida.

At this point, I've started looking again. By the time I added all the extras, I'm buying a 1.4hp 650 CFM machine for over a grand and there's a Tempest Cyclone out there with 3hp and 1400 CFM (curves not bad either) for not much more. 

Did I answer my own question? It appears I have time to cancel my order with Oenida. What has been your experience with Oneida or PSI? What would experienced folks recommend? My shop isn't that large, but I have everything.

Best Regards,

Pete


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## toolguy1000 (Oct 4, 2012)

Northwoods Woodcraft said:


> .......Did I answer my own question? ............


sounds like it. if they don't respond to you before they have your money, what do think their performance will be once they have it? and 650 CFM for ~$1000? there doesn't appear to be too much value there. you'd almost be better off finding something like a delta 50-850 or similar larger single stage collector on CL, fit a canister filter to it and fabricate a pre-separator with a thien baffle. you could do that for about half the cost of the oneida. the 3hp unit you mentioned sounds good as it also has greater air flow than the oneida.


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## rrbrown (Feb 15, 2009)

Never delt with them but no response is kind of bad. Considering its Christmas time it may be a little more understandable but still 1000.00 for 650 com is not good IMO..

Not ure about the other one you mentioned either.

Cyclones are generally expensive but hey are usually larger systems.

I will look at the Oneida later but I don't remember being impressed when I looked last.


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## Dave Paine (May 30, 2012)

I have no experience with Oneida. I have purchased from PSI, but that was my first dust collector, a long time ago perhaps 15+ years. Time goes by so fast.

A colleague at my old company was looking for his "retirement" cyclone and I was surprised he selected the PSI unit over Oneida. He stated the performance/ curve was better.

PSI is outside Philadelphia so only about an hour drive so my colleague drove down to pick up his unit.


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## Northwoods Woodcraft (Dec 5, 2012)

Thanks guys!

Turns out that I did answer my own question. Sometimes one simply needs a sounding board to think things through. Everything looked so good (except the CFM rating) with Oenida when I did the original research. 

I just cancelled my order via email. I told them that I was disappointed with the slow turn around time and lack of communication. I got an email immediately... the guy said he was just returning my email from yesterday. He offered to throw in a Dust Deputy for free if I didn't cancel. LOL... funny how customer service goes up when you want to cancel an order! Reminds me of DirecTv.

Anyway, I'm now free to find something else. I'm sold on a cyclone... PSI looks like the company to beat.

Best Regards,

Pete


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*more info on Onieda*

http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/search.php?searchid=1185925

I use Jet and Grizzly myself. OK, but still a mess to clean the cannister filters. :thumbdown: A Thein separator or cyclone would help with that. Regardless, what I have learned is use 6" duct to maximize airflow with which ever system you choose.


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## Fred Hargis (Apr 28, 2012)

I've had an Oneida SDG for 6 years, and absolutely hate it. The design is so poor most of the fine dust (big deal when you use a drum sander a lot) winds up in the filter, meaning I have to clean it about twice per drum full of dust. But early on I had a slew of other problems as well. Eventually, Oneda picked up on a thread where I was complaining, and the founder (Bill Witter?) got in touch with me. I gathered a whole lot of info for him, sent it to him, and never heard another word. You will do your self nothing but a favor if you move on.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*Buying from Penn State?*

Check this out:
 *DECEMBER Dust Collection SPECIAL*
The best value in dust collection is now the cleanest. SAVE $125 and receive FREE ductwork plans on any S-series Tempest Cyclone purchase by 12/31/12 – phone orders only – use code WSNNAN 16.

800-377- 7297 www.pennstateind.com


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## JoeNY (May 8, 2012)

The cheapest Penn State that has a 6" port and more than 650 cfm is the 2.5 hp Tempest S for $1095 and that doesn't include the $150-230 shipping charge (depending upon where to).


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## Northwoods Woodcraft (Dec 5, 2012)

Thanks again!

It looks like I'm homing in on the 2.5HP TEMPEST "S" Series Cyclone Dust Collector with 14" Aluminum Impeller. I sent them an email last night to check availability. 

I'm growing concerned about collecting on some of the tools that create a lot of fine dust... like the random orbital, spindle sander, belt and disk sander, chop saw, router table, that have 2 1/2" dust ports (or smaller). I've read that you don't want to close down one of these big collectors with tools like these. 

Am I only solving 1/3 of my problem? Do I need to buy a really good shop vac to collect from those tools? Boy this is costing me money.

Pete


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## Fred Hargis (Apr 28, 2012)

Good dust collection needs several tools, and a good shop vac is one of them. On those tools where it is possible, make your own dust ports that accept larger connections. Sometimes this is as simple as cutting a larger hole into something and installing a flange, sometimes it means a complete rebuild. In the pic below, my DS port could not be altered for a 6" hose, so I made the funky looking (but very effective) hood you see. For those tools that can't be altered, like my OSS, using a shop vac is probably a better approach when you're stuck with a 2 1/2" port.


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

*it will cost you some money*



Northwoods Woodcraft said:


> Thanks again!
> 
> Am I only solving 1/3 of my problem? Do I need to buy a really good shop vac to collect from those tools? Boy this is costing me money.
> 
> Pete


To do it right you'll need 3 types of dust collection:
1. A high volume DC unit either mobile or piped to each large tool.
2. Several shop vacs, low volume/high pressure to attach directly to smaller tool ports.
3. A overhead air filtration unit that will get all the fine dust the other units miss.

Sanders are the worst dust makers and the hardest to capture the dust from in my experience. Router tables and hand held routers and sanders are difficult also. A fiar amount get spit up off the table saw blade.....
Here's how I do it: http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f7/dust-collection-woodnthings-shop-part-1-a-20273/


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## Northwoods Woodcraft (Dec 5, 2012)

VERY nice (and attractive) hood on the drum sander! I just made one for my Carvewright carving machine. 

I guess I should get a HEPA filter for my shop vac.

Maybe opening a separate blast gate while operating a tool with smaller port would help on the larger DC.

P


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## Northwoods Woodcraft (Dec 5, 2012)

I like the overhead table saw ideas. I have yet to solve that problem. Aftermarket solutions are WAY too expensive. I DO have a shop vac (RIDGID) but it's not that great, and I've had a Jet 1000B air filter for many years. The big DC is last step.

I thought I'd be okay with the mobile Mini Gorilla, but the more I think about it, I might have gotten lazy making quick cuts and fail to move the hose. I may as well do it right and make all the connections to a central system.

I have my wife repeating "It IS about your health, honey"... so money isn't a real problem at this point. 

P


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## Marv (Nov 30, 2008)

Northwoods Woodcraft said:


> I like the overhead table saw ideas. I have yet to solve that problem. Aftermarket solutions are WAY too expensive. I DO have a shop vac (RIDGID) but it's not that great, and I've had a Jet 1000B air filter for many years. The big DC is last step.
> 
> I thought I'd be okay with the mobile Mini Gorilla, but the more I think about it, I might have gotten lazy making quick cuts and fail to move the hose. I may as well do it right and make all the connections to a central system.
> 
> ...


 Custom hoods etc will greatly benefit you as mentioned no matter which dust collector you get. Also, plumbing the sytem with blast gates as well as using a remote turn on will keep you from making that "one quick cut" when you don't feel like moving the hose which ends up shooting dust all over! I work with MDF quite frequently and here's my solution for catching dust off the top of the saw blade (I'm working on more effective hoods for some of my other heavy dust producers as well).
http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f2/shop-built-table-saw-overarm-dust-collection-hood-45394/


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## Fred Hargis (Apr 28, 2012)

Northwoods Woodcraft said:


> VERY nice (and attractive) hood on the drum sander! I just made one for my Carvewright carving machine.
> 
> I guess I should get a HEPA filter for my shop vac.
> 
> ...


:laughing::laughing::laughing: That DS hood has been called a lot of things, I don't recall "attractive" ever being one of them. I'm very much a "function over form" guy....and it shows.


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## Northwoods Woodcraft (Dec 5, 2012)

After a lot of deliberation and not so good vibes from PSI, I've decided on a Clear Vue system. I decided this for several reasons. Their email responses were instant. They even encouraged me to use them as a resource for questions even if I chose one of their competitor's systems.

They encourage small home shop customers to use (properly-grounded) PVC duct work. The 5hp motor and impeller will move enough air through the PVC for my needs. This will save me a bundle on duct work and fittings.

Thanks again for everyone's responses...

Pete


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## GeorgeC (Jul 30, 2008)

Northwoods Woodcraft said:


> Hi Folks...
> 
> I'm new to the forum. I'm getting back into woodworking after moving and setting up a shop in the new place.
> 
> ...


Did you answer your own question? I am not even sure what your question originally was.

George


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## Fred Hargis (Apr 28, 2012)

Northwoods Woodcraft said:


> After a lot of deliberation and not so good vibes from PSI, I've decided on a Clear Vue system. I decided this for several reasons. Their email responses were instant. They even encouraged me to use them as a resource for questions even if I chose one of their competitor's systems.
> 
> They encourage small home shop customers to use (properly-grounded) PVC duct work. The 5hp motor and impeller will move enough air through the PVC for my needs. This will save me a bundle on duct work and fittings.
> 
> ...


CV is my first choice if I ever get to the point of replacing my much-hated Oneida. You will be quite happy with it. About the most common complaint is that the CV is a little noisier than others, because of the polycarbonate I suppose. In my case I'm always wearing ear plugs anyway. But I will point out that grounding PVC only guarantees one thing: your life will be hell when you makes changes in the future (and you will make changes). DAHIKT


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## Northwoods Woodcraft (Dec 5, 2012)

Fred Hargis said:


> CV is my first choice if I ever get to the point of replacing my much-hated Oneida. You will be quite happy with it. About the most common complaint is that the CV is a little noisier than others, because of the polycarbonate I suppose. In my case I'm always wearing ear plugs anyway. But I will point out that grounding PVC only guarantees one thing: your life will be hell when you makes changes in the future (and you will make changes). DAHIKT


I read that many don't bother with grounding. There's no need unless it's causing shocks.

P


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## JoeNY (May 8, 2012)

Northwoods Woodcraft said:


> I read that many don't bother with grounding. There's no need unless it's causing shocks.P


I have been running pvc for over 20 years. Admittedly it is pretty humid where I am, but have no issues with static electricity, and it is not grounded.


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## 65BAJA (May 27, 2012)

Grounding the outside of PVC is useless anyway. You could run a wire throught the inside if you want to do it right but with 4" or less PVC it's just a non issue. 6" or 8" maybe but not 4".


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