# Veneer Sanding and Staining



## yaemish (Aug 15, 2010)

I would like to refinish my wood cabinets and am running into some trouble. The cabinets are in excellent shape and are made from what appears to be a quality plywood with a veneer. I would like to go to a dark chocolate with the stain.

I experimented with General Finishes Expresso water based stain and a very watered down Trans Tint black dye. I got the idea from this image below. When I did it, I could not see any grain and don't know what type of veneer I have that is causing the problem. My results just looked black (I used the same mixture that was used to stain the image below. This photo is the someone elses work but is close the the results that I want to get.









These are two shots of my current cabinets. I'm worried that I will sand the veneer right out and maybe that is why my results didn't show much grain. Should I maybe use some sort of chemical strip? Any advice will be appreciated. I just purchased General Finishes Java and plan to give that stain a try.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

I would use a stripper to get to the wood. If it's a hardwood plywood with a veneer face, or if it has been veneered, you stand the chance of sanding through the veneer.


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## frankie B (Aug 15, 2010)

well your cab's don't look like oak. they look like birch.you will not get they same affect ,and if you want that oak look what i would do is A]maybe paint the cabinets
a dark chocolate and just get a 4 by 8 oak veneer plywood and just re cut the doors and maybe stain the doors first and try to get a computer match
at a pro paint store this will get you a nice affect,,,,


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## Tony B (Jul 30, 2008)

*Frankie is right*

Red oak - the first pic - is used for this effect because red oak has a dramatic grain and open pores. The wood you used looks like birch which is relatively grainless and smooth. Because of this feature, birch is normally used for painting. 
Again, using Franks solution, paint the carcase and re-make the doors from red oak or at least re-face the doors with red oak.


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

frankie B said:


> well your cab's don't look like oak. they look like birch.you will not get they same affect ,and if you want that oak look what i would do is A]maybe paint the cabinets
> a dark chocolate and just get a 4 by 8 oak veneer plywood and just re cut the doors and maybe stain the doors first and try to get a computer match
> at a pro paint store this will get you a nice affect,,,,



I took the OP's post to mean that it was the effect of seeing the grain and having it black. I didn't take it to mean that he wanted the grain to look like the Oak, but rather, do to the Birch cabinets so its grain showed and it's black.


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## yaemish (Aug 15, 2010)

Correct, I don't want it to look like a different kind of wood. I just want to see some grain through whatever stain I use. Will that be possible with the veneer?


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## yaemish (Aug 15, 2010)

I am having a problem. No matter what I do, it is coming out blotchy. I have tried to sand with 120 followed by 220. I have also used a stripper and made sure that all the Shellac was off, it still had some shimmer in the wood though. Still blotchy. Any suggestions? I am using a General Finishes water based stain.


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## FiveOneSix (Sep 26, 2009)

*new bigginings...*

at this point i think its time to just re-face! fresh start. you'll know the wood is bare of any finish and you can get OAK...woohoo!
paint the carcase, stain and clear the new oak doors...it'll look "gangsta" haha but seriously...it'll look sweet!!!


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## yaemish (Aug 15, 2010)

I found that the wood is called "flamed birch". I guess the only way to get some results would be a dye?


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## woodworkking (Sep 4, 2010)

When you try to go that dark over a finish you will inevitably hide all the grain, to get a deep color like that on a light wood you need to hit the raw wood with the dye to get a base color, stain it to pop the grain, and then tone it to give it more depth and even it out if needed.


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## FiveOneSix (Sep 26, 2009)

*well.......*

so what happened? did you attempt anything yet?


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## FiveOneSix (Sep 26, 2009)

*helllooooo...*

anything? inquiring minds wanna know!!! :yes:

-Jason
(FiveOneSix)


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## yaemish (Aug 15, 2010)

Sorry, I missed this. Yep. I did the whole thing. After a lot of research on here I started taking the doors off and testing techniques on the inside of the cabinets. I found it was very difficult to get the birch to take stain evenly, especially on different pieces.

The trick was, I had to remove as much of the finish as possible using a stripper. Then once I had the finish removed, I used my random orbital on it, I think I finished with 220 by hand.

I used a trans-tint dye and General Finished Espresso water based and I followed all of it up with a few coats of General Finished Polyacrilic Satin. I probably isn't as nice as it could have been with new doors but I was my first try at a big project. I'll throw some photos up when I get home.


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## AnselmFraser (Oct 7, 2010)

Finishing is very tricky especialy when it starts to go wrong.Do not sand through the veneer,remove the finish,colour the wood and put on one coat of shellac.Then use the finish of your choice.With veneer though the more you go wrong the more likely you are to sand through!


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## yaemish (Aug 15, 2010)

Well the flash makes them look a little shiny and shows the imperfections. I actually finished them with a satin poly and I am happy with the results. I'm not happy with the tile work of the previous owner. I plan on changing the counter tops as well as the tile.


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## FiveOneSix (Sep 26, 2009)

*still waiting on some pie...*

i don't see any imperfections...i see wood being "WOOD"! looks real good my man! be proud :thumbsup: .
also, i don't hate the tile. the thing i like about it (but others may not) is the HUGE contrast of the tile/counter and the cabinets. i'm a huge fan of colors and contrast.
but all in all the cabs look SWEET! :yes:


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## cabinetman (Jul 5, 2007)

The color looks very good. I think it goes with the tile too.












 









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