# cleaning table saw top - mineral spirits vs wd40 and sandpaper vs steel wool



## tito5 (Apr 5, 2011)

So I was trying to clean my new (new to me) table saw. the top is in good condition, jsut needs some TLC. it has some surface rust from sitting in uninsulated shed for years. the problem areas I am having problems with are what appear to be water marks left by pop cans. they are really dark (almost black). 

here is what I have tried so far, mineral spirits with p400 sandpaper and a 3m pad that is supposed to be like grade 3 steel wool. this cleans most of the table pretty good, but does not seem to touch the dark spots. 

I know people use both mineral spirits and wd40 to clean, what is the difference between the two? Also what grade of paper would you start with, and go up to? 
also the table has painted side panels, and chrome bars that the fence rides on, other than wax what should / can I do to these to get them in top working order? 
here is a pic, not a very good pic, I will try to post a better one tonight.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

That much rust I would use my orbital sander with 220 grit paper and then follow by hand with finer silicon carbide paper. Then I would wax it with Johnson Paste Wax. The chrome rail can be removed and sanded as well. The chrome is hard enough the sander should only cut the rust. I think to finish with 400 grit paper would be good enough. 


Mineral spirits is a solvent intended to thin oil based paints and varnishes. The WD in WD-40 stands for water displacement. It is a thin oil which was formulated to repel water from metal and prevent corrosion. The WD-40 would only help to keep the rust from getting worse. The mineral spirits would only remove something like pine sap if you had a board ooze some. 

As far as the paint it doesn't look bad in the picture. If you are wanting to restore it you can sand and scuff it up, prime it and paint it with an oil based enamel if you have access to spray equipment. If not I would leave well enough alone.


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## Gene Howe (Feb 28, 2009)

I've heard good things about Evaporust. Never tried it though.
A thorough waxing after the rust removal is a good thing. Johnson's paste is a good one.


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## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

It sounds like you have really gotten the rust off. Those black marks in my experience are nearly impossible to remove unless you remove a layer of the table itself. They should be purely cosmetic though and you could consider them badges of honor that your machine has been through and come out still cutting. :yes:

If you really want to keep trying on them you might try Boeshield's Rust Free which is a type of acid (boric?) It's great but I think probably unnecessary here (and keep it away from paint). Evaporust is great for soaking rusty nuts, bolts, plane bodies etc. Not very practical for a top like this. Once you are done give it a good wipe down with denatured alcohol to remove oil and residue and coat it with paste wax, Boeshield T-9, TopCote or whatever suits your fancy (just not car wax)l


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## bob sacamano (Jan 24, 2012)

tito5 said:


> . the problem areas I am having problems with are what appear to be water marks left by pop cans. they are really dark (almost black).


 
a pop can ???????? after safety the biggest rule in my shop is no beverages even on the workbench - let alone a power tool !

steve got it right when he said 220 r.o.s. followed by patse wax

and no more pop cans in the shop ! lol


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## tito5 (Apr 5, 2011)

bob sacamano said:


> a pop can ???????? after safety the biggest rule in my shop is no beverages even on the workbench - let alone a power tool !
> 
> lol


Well, like I said, I got it used for $50, at that price I couldn't say no. I had to laugh at myself when I saw those pop can marks on it......I have read a few threads on people (how to put this nicely) venting about pop cans being left on their cast iron table tops. 
I do have some Johnson's paste wax waiting to go on it as soon as I get it looking like I want. I have a day or two to to clean it up, as I had to order a blade for it. Going to try one of those orsund(sp) blades that everyone is talking about.


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## Sleeper (Mar 24, 2009)

tito5 said:


> Well, like I said, I got it used for $50, at that price I couldn't say no. I had to laugh at myself when I saw those pop can marks on it.........


Mine is from coffee cup. I wish I could get it out because it bugs me every time I see it.


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## johnnie52 (Feb 16, 2009)

When I got my saw, the top was very rusty. Don't everyone jump on me at once, but I used a 4" hand held grinder with one of the cup style wire brushes to remove the rust, then mineral oil and a regular kitchen scrubbie to remove what the grinder didn't get.

The top is mostly a dark gray almost black now, but its smooth and upkeep is simple. I've been using T-9 on it, but have decided to give Top Kote a try. Mine sits on a screened in carport all year covered by a tarp when not in use and the rust has not returned.


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## schnitz (Sep 5, 2009)

Believe it or not, I use baby powder on my saw. It doesn't do much for dark stains (Character marks..), but it sure seems to work on keeping the rusting to a minimum, and it also helps as a dry lubricant. Ahh, the tricks of the old timers....:laughing:


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

Okay if you want to remove almost any stain in cast iron tops muriatic acid will. After you remove the acid it will rust in a mater of hours if you don't coat the surface with something. It leaves the surface so "pure" and completely free of anything that might repel water it will rust over night. I use it on anything that has been rusting for long periods of time. 

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## Steve Neul (Sep 2, 2011)

Al B Thayer said:


> Okay if you want to remove almost any stain in cast iron tops muriatic acid will. After you remove the acid it will rust in a mater of hours if you don't coat the surface with something. It leaves the surface so "pure" and completely free of anything that might repel water it will rust over night. I use it on anything that has been rusting for long periods of time.
> 
> Al
> 
> Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


After you use muriatic acid try using vinegar to neutralize the acid and rinse with water and dry. I've used muriatic acid several time to cut the rust from the inside of gas tanks. I would leave the gas tanks open for a couple of days to dry real good before using a fuel tank liner and they didn't rust back.


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## del schisler (Nov 5, 2009)

tito5 said:


> So I was trying to clean my new (new to me) table saw. the top is in good condition, jsut needs some TLC. it has some surface rust from sitting in uninsulated shed for years. the problem areas I am having problems with are what appear to be water marks left by pop cans. they are really dark (almost black).
> 
> here is what I have tried so far, mineral spirits with p400 sandpaper and a 3m pad that is supposed to be like grade 3 steel wool. this cleans most of the table pretty good, but does not seem to touch the dark spots.
> 
> ...


get this and be done with it. This will make the top look like new with out all the scrubbing ect. this is the combo rust off and than t9 http://boeshield.com/


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## Boss O' The Shop (Mar 21, 2012)

del schisler said:


> get this and be done with it. This will make the top look like new with out all the scrubbing ect. this is the combo rust off and than t9 http://boeshield.com/


If you want to see an example of Rust Free in action, I posted a few photos on my blog:

http://oldtoolsnew.blogspot.com/2012/03/product-that-delivers.html

It does work well...just wear some gloves and have some ventilation!


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## Sleeper (Mar 24, 2009)

So Tito, i hope you post photos the finished product what ever method you use.:yes:


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## tito5 (Apr 5, 2011)

Sleeper said:


> So Tito, i hope you post photos the finished product what ever method you use.:yes:


I will, I went and got some more sandpaper yesterday, have enough grits, so if those don't get the black out I am going to call it good. I will post a pic when I am done. hopefully tomorrow night but not sure, my quiet week of nothing to do has turned into nonstop evenings. 
I got aluminum oxide, silicon carbie and emory sheets.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

tito5 said:


> I will, I went and got some more sandpaper yesterday, have enough grits, so if those don't get the black out I am going to call it good. I will post a pic when I am done. hopefully tomorrow night but not sure, my quiet week of nothing to do has turned into nonstop evenings.
> I got aluminum oxide, silicon carbie and emory sheets.


Sounds like a lot of work. The acid will do it in about 20 seconds and you don't have to take out the sanding marks. 

Just sayin

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## tito5 (Apr 5, 2011)

so how do you apply the acid. I am all for working smarter not harder, but to be honest, the stuff scares me. I know everyone has recommended boeshield t-9, but could I use something like this?
http://menards.com/main/paint/clean.../sunnyside-muriatic-acid/p-1479905-c-8156.htm


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## MissionIsMyMission (Apr 3, 2012)

I found this from a previous forum post...
I've also used Naval Jelly for heavy rust with good results. Nasty Stuff but works well.

When I got my used saw it had a very nice "rust patina" to the saw top. I tired the usual WD40 and scratch pad trick, but I decided that I wasn't going to live long enough to finish the project.
So, I grabbed a sample bottle of Lemon Simple Green that I had, put a 180 grit sanding disk on my orbital sander and tried that. I was amazed on how fast the rust came off the top.
I then switched to a 220 grit and then hand polished it with 400 wet/dry paper.
If you try this route be sure to remove all traces of Simple Green from your metal by washing the tool top and then apply some kind of protective wax. Simple Green is a mild corrosive and will continue to work on the metal if it is not completely removed.
Before 
After


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## del schisler (Nov 5, 2009)

tito5 said:


> so how do you apply the acid. I am all for working smarter not harder, but to be honest, the stuff scares me. I know everyone has recommended boeshield t-9, but could I use something like this?
> http://menards.com/main/paint/clean.../sunnyside-muriatic-acid/p-1479905-c-8156.htm


I wouldn't use that why don't you just get the rust off than after that use t9 T9 isn't the strong stuff rust off is. This was made by boeing air craft and i am sure it is not that bad i use all the time . Only t9 and i live in florida and have not had any rust on jointer band saw table saw dirll press and leath and miter saw. you can use this on any tool's that have rust on them and it will make them look like new. sound like you are making a job out of this. this can be done in probly 1/2 hour or how fast you work than you are done. i don't use sand paper on any of my bed's dont have to .


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## tito5 (Apr 5, 2011)

I don't want to order the t-9 and wait for it to be delivered.


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## Shop Dad (May 3, 2011)

It's the Boeshield Rust Free that you would want to use. T-9 is a lubricant/protectorant to use after the rust is off. Rust Free has Phosphoric acid (I just checked the label) so, like the recommendation of muratic acid, if you can find it in the hardware store that might do the trick. If you do use one of the acid treatments be sure to clean it off with denatured alcohol which will not leave a residue. Protect it right afterward so rust doesn't have a chance to come back.


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## preacherman (Nov 29, 2011)

I got a new to me Ridgid 3650 a while back that had set in a shed like yours. I cleaned mine with liquid wrench and a green scotch brite pad. It took a while scrubbing but it looks much better. After cleaning I applied a coat of wax. Here is a before and after pic:


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## Icutone2 (Nov 4, 2011)

I also just got a new to me saw. A craftsman 12" 220v model 113-299130 the blade elevation knob is broke and the top looks as bad as your saws.:blink: Was thinking about using the acid cleaning thing.
I will post pics of before when i get back home.
Lee


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

tito5 said:


> so how do you apply the acid. I am all for working smarter not harder, but to be honest, the stuff scares me. I know everyone has recommended boeshield t-9, but could I use something like this?
> http://menards.com/main/paint/cleaners-removers-solvents/paint-stain-cleaners/water-based/sunnyside-muriatic-acid/p-1479905-c-8156.htm


I spread it with whatever I have. A brush a sponge. Mix up a 50 50 solution and have a bucket of water ready to sponge on to clean it off with. Sometimes I just use a rag.

If you have ever had trouble getting your hands clean from a dirty job. Just pour a little acid on them and rub you hands together quickly and rinse off under the tap. They come out cleaner than ever. under the nails too. But it will burn a cut like a mother.

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## Pirate (Jul 23, 2009)

If using Muriatic acid, be sure not to breath it. It's nasty, like, take your breath away nasty.


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## Al B Thayer (Dec 10, 2011)

Pirate said:


> If using Muriatic acid, be sure not to breath it. It's nasty, like, take your breath away nasty.


I think it would cure the common cold.

Al

Friends don't let friends use stamped metal tools sold at clothing stores.


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## tito5 (Apr 5, 2011)

ok guys I have pics up in another thread of my saw and the progress I have made on it. over in the projects section. 
http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f13/my-new-me-table-saw-37831/#post326389


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## Rev. A (Jan 29, 2021)

tito5 said:


> So I was trying to clean my new (new to me) table saw. the top is in good condition, jsut needs some TLC. it has some surface rust from sitting in uninsulated shed for years. the problem areas I am having problems with are what appear to be water marks left by pop cans. they are really dark (almost black).
> 
> here is what I have tried so far, mineral spirits with p400 sandpaper and a 3m pad that is supposed to be like grade 3 steel wool. this cleans most of the table pretty good, but does not seem to touch the dark spots.
> 
> ...


WD40 will work, PB blaster if it's stubborn. *DON'T USE SANDPAPER OR PADS* if you want to be sure the table stays perfectly flat. Use a good sharp sharpening stone like you would use for a chisel. 
Have fun, the transformation is always cool to see. remember to keep the surface waxed to prevent rust.


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## Brian T. (Dec 19, 2012)

I really hope that in the past NINE years, the OP cleaned off his saw.
The top was never flat and will never be flat. Any test for Newton's Rings will prove that.
There's a dozen formulations under the brand name of WD-40 in this day and time.
Not like in the beginning. What do you need to do?
I use silicon carbide ,wet and dry sandpapers up to 1,500 grit on my carving tools OK by me.
1500 ought to make a saw table look neglected and pristine and unused, ready for the next beer can.


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## Rev. A (Jan 29, 2021)

Brian T. said:


> I really hope that in the past NINE years, the OP cleaned off his saw.
> The top was never flat and will never be flat. Any test for Newton's Rings will prove that.
> There's a dozen formulations under the brand name of WD-40 in this day and time.
> Not like in the beginning. What do you need to do?
> ...


I write from my machinist background, perfect flatness is essential on a precision milling machine. Since retiring I've been applying that lifetime of acquired knowledge to woodworking - some things are overkill I guess.


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## SchraubenMeister (Apr 19, 2021)

Jet kerosene + sandpaper + WD40


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## woodnthings (Jan 24, 2009)

I have had to remove some serious rust spots from my favorite table saw where a roof leak has gone unnoticed for a few days. I used PB blaster, and some wet/dry paper in 180 grit, maybe 150 ..... I donno? But, after scrubbing vigoursly, and using a ROS sander to blend it on, it all came out except for a slight stain which I can live with.


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## Brian T. (Dec 19, 2012)

Wood species have different coefficients of expansion in the radial, tangential and transverse directions.
For dead stuff, it moves. A saw top which is a very good approximation of "flat" is adequate.


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## SchraubenMeister (Apr 19, 2021)

Try to reduce rust with phosphoric acid.


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## Rev. A (Jan 29, 2021)

SchraubenMeister said:


> Jet kerosene + sandpaper + WD40


That brings back an old memory. Back in the 1970s we would coat aluminum with a mixture of kerosene and Kool 
Tool before finish turning on the lathe to get a mirror finish. Pretty amazing.


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## SchraubenMeister (Apr 19, 2021)

Rev. A said:


> That brings back an old memory. Back in the 1970s we would coat aluminum with a mixture of kerosene and Kool
> Tool before finish turning on the lathe to get a mirror finish. Pretty amazing.


Old skool methods still work today


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## woodshed (Feb 11, 2020)

Brian T. said:


> Any test for Newton's Rings will prove that.


How are you make table saw testing for Newton's Rings? What if table is grey and not reflecting?


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