# quarter sawn lumber on a band saw mill



## rg05

This is probably a dumb question, but can you quarter saw lumber on a bandsaw mill? How do you go about doing it?


----------



## buroak

Yes You can. Saw your cant first. then come down about 1/3 the distance and make a cut. remove and turn the cant 1/4 turn. Next cut in half, then turn both cants back 1/4 turn and start sawing as normal. Return 1st slab to the saw and saw as normal. Any board's taken while sawing the cant are plane sawn. the rest have a grain angle that will pass as 1/4 sawn


----------



## GeorgeC

"Saw your cant first."

I know that you wrote that correctly, but at 5 am it sure made me look twice and then laugh.

G


----------



## [email protected]

Here is a link to one of the many sites with pics. 
http://www.scottbanbury.com/qsawmethod2.pdf


----------



## Rick C.

RG,
Thanks for posting this.I knew it could be done but would like to see how.
Does anyone know of any videos on how to? The link showed where to make the cuts but when you have a heavy log on the mill it must be easier said than done.
just looked at google and didn't find what I was looking for so I got on bing images and on quarter sawing videos found some tutorials. They are photos not videos but seemed helpful.


----------



## rg05

did those tutorials help out much Rick?


----------



## Rick C.

RG,
yeah it did some .I'd still like to see it in motion, ya know, how one guy cuts, moves and sets up a 30" log.


----------



## TexasTimbers

rg, 

There are quite a few different qtr. sawing methods. I thought I had made a quartersaw thread here but can't find it. If a fellow needs to get as much true quartersawn out of a log as he can, which is what I usually have to do when sawing a log for luthiers, there is a lot of waste. 

The method buroak describes is meant to produce as little waste from the log as possible. His method makes slabs (which are marketable) and has very little waste from the cant. But it doesn't make much true. quartersawn wood. It does produce more rift and flat sawn lumber though than firewood. 

I use one of two methods depending on the diameter, length, and taper in the log. You want to avoid logs with much taper in them for qtr sawing but sometimes that's the log with the stuff in it on the order book. 

There is no right or wrong way to qtr saw, there is only the method best suited to fill the need. If you need as much qtr. sawn lumber from the log as you can get because that is the only log for it that you have, and don't mind a lot of waste (there's always the woodstove in winter) then I'll post some pics on how to do that if that's what you're after. 

I just wanted you to be aware since you seem new at this, that there are many ways to skin a cat and qtr a log. It was a while before I learned that, once I saw the first qtr saw tutorial I figured "there - now I know how to qtr saw." Little did I know!

And one thing I would add, many sawyers will not qtyr a log less than ~16" I try to stay in the ~20+" range.


----------



## buroak

TT I milled 4 30" dia. red oak logs summer of 09 using the method I described. the only plane sawn boards were created in sawing the cant's. They came in at about 24" square. Came down 8" and made first slab then turned the remaining peice 1/4 turn and cut in half at 12". This netted me 3 cant's to saw. 2 were 16"high and 12" wide and 1 was 24" high by 8" wide. from ther we cut everything at 4/4. When I cleaned and stickered the boards they had some very nice ray,s visable. I'm not a big fan of oak but I can't wait to build something with these. One note you have to keep the slab's from the cant's seperate because they are the plane sawn boards.


----------



## TexasTimbers

bur,

There are formal and informal definitions of quarter sawn boards. Technically boards that have 60° radials or better are called quarter sawn, but I was trying to paint a picture for rg, I wasn't saying your method is bad or good, and if you are saying it is the only, or the best, you are wrong IMO. 

For example, if you try to sell back and side sets to some of the world class luthiers I sell to and they are anything less than near-perfect 90° radials good luck. Most amateur luthiers don't care because they don't think in terms of their work lasting for generations, they aren't getting $25,000 for a single guitar either. And they do not have "that ear" that some luthiers do who can hear nuances so subtle from one set to the next that you and I would say they are just being obsessive compulsive. 

Plain sawn and rift sawn boards are as essential to our business as near-perfect quarter sawn boards but everything has its place. Just like your method for quarter sawing (which I have and do use) has its place but it is certainly not the best method for every log, it's not even the "best" quarter sawing method even if there were such an animal. There are too many variables to say one qtr method is better than another.


----------



## TexasTimbers

buroak said:


> One note you have to keep the slab's from the cant's seperate because they are the plane sawn boards.


:laughing: I just noticed that snide remark. You are cracking me up bur. Since we are jabbing each other a little (all in fun) let me jab you a bit back in the spirit of turn-about is fair play. 



buroak said:


> cant's


No apostrophe in that word brother. In sawmilling when you knock the slabs off of a log you have a "cant". If you knock the slabs off of more than one log you have one or more "cants". A cant can't posses anything so it can't have an apostrophe. Several cants can't posses anything either so cants collectively, can't be said to in plural form "not" posses things i.e. "cant's". Know what I mean Verne? 



buroak said:


> . . . because they are the plane sawn boards.


My friend, here's where our confusion has occurred. I didn't know you were milling planes. If you had just told me that from the get-go this would have turned my cerebral light bulb on and I could have said "Hey bur! Lemme see a picture of that there plane you sawed in half geeeeee whiz!" 

In sawmilling, technically speaking anything with radials less than 30° is said to be plain sawn. But you knew all this already you sly dog, you're leading me on. If you ask me to do two things that I can't do, is it cool for me to say "No I cant's." to answer both requests at the same time? Yes, it's cool but it ain't kee-rect. :wacko:


----------



## rg05

Thanks a lot for the info. I got a video on quarter sawing and it was showing the different ways to do it which made more sense. TT, you are correct that I'm very new at this so all the information I can get would be greatly appreciated when it comes to any kind of sawmilling. In fact, I don't even have a mill yet. I work in a hardwood mill in the Northwest and for the last year or so have been wanting to get my owna nd start milling. I'm just trying to figure out if it would be very profitable in my area and what kind of milling should I be focusing on. So thanks again for the info from all you guys.


----------



## buroak

Thanks for the corrections TT I cant top that. Or did I just do so. Anyway outside of the obvious that it cant roll are there any interesting story,s about why it is refered to as a CANT


----------



## Colt W. Knight

I can attest to the fact of picky luthiers. I have a lot of trouble finding wood for my guitars because terminology varies among tradesmen, and everyones definition of "close enough" differs. 

I wish I had local sawyer who would cut up a log into nearly 90 degree quartersawn pieces.


----------



## NC Cherokee

*Quarter sawing 101*

I am new to this great site and am learning lots from all of you professionals. I am somewhat confused about the best and most simple way to quarter saw on my Wood-Mizer LD 40. Could someone make it very simple for this new kid on the block? 
Thanks for your help and time.


----------



## qbilder

I use a few methods, depending on the purpose. For getting the most lumber out of a log, I use a method an Amish sawyer showed me. You cut the log into quarters, then with each quarter you tilt it up so the angled cut faces are facing out, then mill boards until the quarter is gone. This method produces a mix of quarter & rift, and is great for diverse grain oak flooring & such.

Another method is what I call the traditional method. You cut the log into quarters then with each quarter you mill a board off of one cut face, then flip & mill a board from the other cut face. You do this back & forth flipping between cuts until the quarter is gone. This produces a high amount of quarter & a little rift, pretty much what you see in quarter sawn oak furniture.

The other method is cutting the log above the pith at the point where the boards will be changing from quarter to rift, then saw boards on down until again the boards are changing from quarter to rift. This gives you very nice, perfect quarter sawn boards that will need the pith area cut away, which means splitting the boards. You are left with two log halves that you can flip vertical, sandwiched together, and repeat the same cuts as before. This method leaves you with all perfect quarter sawn lumber, but you have 4 wedge shaped slabs left over that may or may not be worth your time further cutting. If not then it's a lot of waste but it's the price you pay for perfect quartered lumber. Since I mostly cut hard maple for pool cue shaft blanks, this method works well because I can continue cutting the wedges down to 1" wide boards & still be useful. 

Each method is useful depending on the intended purpose. I usually use the last method because it gets me the most QS maple for 1"x1" turning squares. I use the first method if i'm milling oak & it just general purpose QS wood. I rarely if ever use what I call the "traditional" method.


----------



## Tom the Sawyer

NC Cherokee,

qbilder gave a good overview of the options. I have never tried the first one, the second one worked well but is labor intensive and I've been pretty successful with his third method...when I get someone who wants to maximize their quarter sawn lumber. It does help to have a large log to begin with.


----------



## Tom the Sawyer

NC Cherokee,

qbilder gave a good overview of the options. I have never tried the first one, the second one worked well but is labor intensive and I've been pretty successful with his third method...when I get someone who wants to maximize their quarter sawn lumber. It does help to have a large log to begin with.










You can also remove the top slab, saw through the middle, turn B 90 degrees and put A next to it, and then saw down from the top.


----------



## HomeBody

I found this diagram in a 1938 gunsmithing book. Notice how the logs are oriented in the diagram for a circle saw instead of a bandsaw. 

When the author says 1/4 sawn walnut is not good for gunstocks, he is referring to the military standards from the 30's. By 1944, the US gov't would take any walnut they could get. Gary


----------

